Want to know how to fix the deserts while making liberals and the hippie vegans scream? Increase cattle presence by 400% on land that has been turned barren and it will regrow.
You provide food to millions of people in areas that currently can not grow food, you increase the fertility of the land meaning they can also start growing crops on that land as well as enjoying the increase in meat and to top it all off? More water.
If you fix the deserts and restore them to grasslands guess what happens? The water table returns to normal levels, amazing right?
Hey, what's up Lithuaniabro? Been posting this stuff quite a bit in your threads
Jason Lewis
What happens to the land if those cattle are killed and sold for their meat? I'll tell you what: they serve as nutrient extractors from the land. This kind of thing is meant to simulate the past environment where large herds were moved around by predators. Except back then, all the animals actually died on the land and returned the nutrients to the soil.
Austin Kelly
Nothin' much. Thanks for bumping my threads and fighting the good fight bro.
>watch videos by some jewish (((environmentalists))) >read articles by some jewish (((environmentalists))) you are dumdum as fuck, if you want to fight desertification you want to accumulate humus layer in the soil and increase retention, not just graze like a nigger
Evan Barnes
>you provide food to millions of people in areas that currently can not grow food is that supposed to be a good thing, famine exists for a reason
Julian Thompson
The nutrition for the soil comes from the poop and trampled grasses. If this were an issue, why is Savory's management method working so well wherever it's applied? Watch the videos.
Mason Flores
nigga there is no poop if there is desert in the first place
Noah Carter
Eco-Fascism is the only way
Jaxson Adams
Even deserts have plant life in the form of shrubs and sparse grasses. Please watch the videos.
Luke Morgan
sad that "eco-fascism" is the new buzzword meme ideology
Eli Bennett
There's nothing wrong with enriching the entire planet.
eco-fashizm IS the future but it requires killing low tier citizens and remaking them into humus
Carson Gomez
It's really called niggerification, niggers are killing off the wildlife in Africa and cutting all the trees down just like Haiti. They are idiots along with the chinesification of the world which contributes the same thing through niggerish destruction.
Both must be killed and exterminated, and their enablers the Jews, must be ground up and used as fertilizer.
Jack Lopez
>humus
vegan detected.
David Bell
>killing low tier citizens and remaking them into humus yeah i can get behind this
Luis Russell
>humus is only required for vegans you fool, perfectly established humus layer can help extablish climax forest ecosystems, help with water retention and gather a lot of CO2 your citizen category is now lower, keep on with it and you get into the soil
OP for once actually provides some pretty solid empirical evidence for once and you retards don't even check it out
>implying it's jewish Jews want you to eat bugs. These videos counter the whole climate change story of desertification.
Jaxson Moore
The bodies of the animals come from the soil. You're depleting the soil if you remove them from the system. It's just like with farming, except the cow is your crop.
>why is Savory's management method working so well My understanding is that studies of his methods are a lot less conclusive than is often claimed
Gabriel Reed
"Two Eurasian beavers (Castor fiber) were introduced to a wooded site, situated on a first ordertributary, draining from intensively managedgrassland. The site was monitored to understand impacts uponwater storage, flow regimes and water quality. Results indicated that beaver activity, primarily via the creation of 13 dams, has increased water storage within the site"
when you have anecesity there is always a way. there are some efforts from the chinese govrment to reclaim some of the goby desert with low tech. some sticks water and plants absicly and is seems to be working. not as fast asitis nedded but still. also there were some eforts in australia by useing grass and other native plants algon with dams, slowing the speed of the water in the soil. in jordan or palestine, cant remember wich there are some gardens lets say in the fucking dessert aswell, cant remember the exat technique but that an example.
Oliver James
Watch the videos dumbass, you have no idea what you're talking about.
Blake Moore
One important point that needs to be made is that the cattle grazing needs to be intense and rotational. What has screwed up the land to begin with was grazing some animals all the time not allowing the grass to recover.
Easton Rodriguez
never!
Easton Russell
You’re a dipshit because you fall for his bait. Why the fuck is everyone here a low IQ redditor who falls for the memeflag bait EVERY FUCKING TIME Just ignore it and it will go away. Focus on the topic of the thread not on some random memeflag shill
Ethan Roberts
I guess you don't like having more trees to hug.
Dylan Perez
What do you suggest be done?
Matthew Nguyen
Falling for bait bumps the thread UwU
Josiah Mitchell
do you think water just disappears when an animal drinks it?
Benjamin Lewis
I like but I actually know my shit and dont jump into memeecology
Eli Parker
It is from their shit leaf. The poop brings nutrients back into the soil. Like electrolytes and other things that plants crave.
Matthew Hall
Then surely you've rejuvenated more land then Peter Andrews.
Isaac Perry
He didnt mean the humus you eat. He meant the humus layer in soil.
Cameron Thomas
>My understanding is that studies of his methods are a lot less conclusive than is often claimed Did you not see the fucking pictures? How is that not conclusive enough? The ecologist said in the videos that all of the areas they tried this on were continuing to deteriorate regardless of rainfall and regardless of how much livestock was removed.
Joseph Ortiz
I think he was joking m8
Hudson Jackson
based desu.
Cooper Thompson
This.
Henry Allen
I'm not saying that Savory's wrong. I don't know enough about the topic myself, I just know there's a lot of criticism of his work. I also know that at least a portion of this criticism comes form vegetarians and vegans who have an ideological problem with his solution. So it's hard to tell where the truth lies without going quite deep into this stuff. I suspect there's also some resistance from parts of the meat industry (what will happen to meat prices if you increase the supply by several hundred percent?). My argument about the animals removing nutrients when they're slaughtered is true, but I also don't know if how relevant that really is. Could be that the positives far outweigh this. The point is, this is a more complicated topic than: "we've found this great new method that definitely works perfectly and now we'll all work together to fix the world's problems"
>What do you suggest be done? I'm too new to the topic to answer that.
Adrian Rivera
>Did you not see the fucking pictures? How is that not conclusive enough? I read somewhere that one of the trials he did happened to be during a time where the land received an increased amount of rainfall. I read that he had initial success but found it hard to replicate in subsequent studies. Dunno if that's true or not, but people are claiming it.
Asher Perry
The problem isn't the removal of nutrients. Deserts are not barren because they lack nitrogen, carbon, phosphorus or potassium, they are barren because they lack water. Any farmer or gardener worth their salt will tell you manure is better for the soil than chemical fertilizers. The manure acts like a sponge and holds onto moisture better than just soil alone.
Easton Sullivan
Haha, and this is the user that pushes those cic threads. What a faggot. > just read the in thread links and watch the prescribed videos.
Daniel Clark
You're not completely correct OP, but increasing cattle is definitely one step in the process of reversing desertification, This: is also a big issue.
Africa can't do this though because it's insanely expensive.
Wyatt Sanchez
Overgrazing ruins the topsoil fag. Lrn2ecology.
Luis Cox
Yeah, you're right actually. The limiting factor for plant growth in desertification is water, not nutrients.
Jason Howard
t. retard who didn't watch the videos
Mason Price
Go post more CiC bullshit you obese permavirgin shitposting retard. :-)
Xavier Cruz
Don't expect a reply to this. lmao
Xavier Moore
Rainfall amount isn't the issue. Desertification is occuring in places where plenty of rain falls during the wet season. The issue is that the rain is not being absorbed by the soil.
The land is not entirely barren. I don't think this technique works without already adequate rainfall and plant matter. The issue is that in spite of those two things already existing, desertification is progressing.
Brandon Jenkins
what the fuck is CiC
Andrew Brooks
To this end, the only thing that works is a nuclear accident or putting something on the land humans can't live near. Chernobyl is like a national park teeming with life now.
That's why you start off at a place that's not completely deserted and then work up from there. Look at:
Nolan Turner
>"Holistic management does not permit replication," said the document, which Savory had authored. "This point is critical to understanding the great difficulty reductionist scientists are experiencing trying to comprehend holistic planned grazing—because no two plans are ever the same even on the same property two years running." A stunning admission appeared a few lines lower: "Every study of holistic planned grazing that has been done has provided results that are rejected by range scientists because there was no replication!" >Experimental validation, of course, offers the best process for evaluating whether holistic management works. But Savory rejects that possibility. "You'll find the scientific method never discovers anything," he told a journalist for Range magazine, which profiled him in 1999. "Observant, creative people make discoveries. But the scientific method protects us from cranks like me."
Yeah, obviously civilization is fucking with things. Short of a massive depopulation event, we'll have to settle for other solutions.
Nathan Torres
>Chernobyl is like a national park teeming with life now. WTF I THOUGHT NUCLEAR ENERGY RUINS EVERYTHING FOREVER
Bentley Cooper
other solutions are gay, hence eco-fashism even if we gather all CO2 in form of wood that we put everywhere plastic and concrete is now, even if we reforest all areas that we can without hurting farm industry, we still have niggers and all our effort will be redundant
Cameron Lewis
>removing people restores nature Who would have thought?
Wyatt Reyes
I don't know if you think he's admitting his own method doesn't work or if you don't understand that he's critiquing the modern scientific cult religion. It's very similar to how v*ganoids are so quick to point to their corporate funded faulty health studies that have shoddily determined that animal foods will give you ass cancer and heart disease.
Jacob Russell
>he's critiquing the modern scientific cult religion If he's doing that, there's a 95% chance that he's scamming you. It's equivalent to saying "I don't have to prove my claims. People who require evidence are cultists" Not how it fucking works. If he can't prove his claims, they should rightly be dismissed.
Adam Scott
Well posted OP. Everything the vegans, and 'animal rights advocates' say, is a lie, full stop.
It's the vegan avocado and soya addicts who are destroying the earth not us.
>It's the vegan avocado and soya addicts who are destroying the earth not us. actually, its the niggers and, unironically mutts who need Mcdonalds biggest methane producers are mcburger cows who also need shitton of pastures and food, and this s why south american rainforests are being logged
Leo Jackson
So wrong leaf. I'm sorry. Animals who die in a state of nature go back to the soil, but only after being eaten by scavengers, as poop. So while the cows in the modern pasture are pooping, their rich poop goes back into the soil they graze, win win for the earth, and us. (it's not exactly bad for the cows, but they do end up on our plate, after a pleasant and healthy life)
And you know something you could plant in an area that all got burned down
Jayden Cooper
He has results, though. It's easy enough that even African niggers can do it.
Xavier Flores
Vegetarians and vegans are known to be liars who don't care about animals or the environment. their only interest is pretending they are cow saving superheroes and defending their retarded cult. (Well and hating normal people and fantasizing about killing us all)
>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serotiny lodgepole pine will work, ask your local forest service nursery for seedlings bonus effort points if you ask for micorysation
Wyatt Miller
>make vegans scream
where i have to sign?
Jace James
If you remove their meat, you're removing nutrients from the system. This isn't disputable. It's a basic physical fact.
Mason Peterson
>actually, its the niggers and, unironically mutts who need Mcdonalds
This is half true, but remember it's the libtard vegans who are pouring the africans into America and Europe, this will overpopulate and destroy both continents. Thanks liberals!
>biggest methane producers are mcburger cows This turns out to be a known proven statistical lie. > and this s why south american rainforests are being logged
Amazon rainforest being plowed over by Brazilians, to feed China. Nothing to do with Europe or the USA, we are outside this economy, but the vegans blame us for it, obviously.
>Vegetarians and vegans are known to be liars I know, which is why I'm pretty skeptical of the skepticism of him. Still, his methods should undergo rigorous scientific testing and then be applied on large scales if they work. The fact that he's talking against the scientific process and doesn't seek to provide verifiable evidence is a huge red flag.
Ian Lee
If you want to see real environmentalism (as opposed to the fake kind) in action, you need to check out these modern farmers. Richard Perkins has worked wonders on his farm ridiculously far north in Sweden. It's literally the opposite of Big Farma and it's the future we deserve but won't fucking get.
Liberals: >the west is destroying the environment, if everyone lived like people in the west, we'd all die Also Liberals: >let's import endless hordes from poor nations and improve their counties so they can have a western standard of living We already live in an idiocracy
Brandon Rodriguez
>This turns out to be a known proven statistical lie. one memeflag to the other, statistics is a jewish trick and I have no relationship with the vegans whatsoever, they are smelly and dumb and even if somehow USA is not at fault for mcburger induced environental damage you still have one of the biggest CO2 emissions on the planet liberals are retarded and anti-environment, whats new
Jeremiah Ortiz
This is sophistry, and just you proving you are an imbecile. Point ceded by me. Also you are aguing an appeal to perfection. Obviously it would be better if all humans left the area and we repopulate it with bears and wolves and caribou and deer, but that isn't going to happen because we live in an imperfect world. OPs plan would reforest desertified regions, and benefit mankind. Your 'complaints' are just retarded sophistry as I said, and meaningless.
But yeah the last buzzard doesn't get his meal in OPs plan, so take yourself to the desert and kill yourself and feed that goy.
>Increase cattle presence by 400% on land that has been turned barren and it will regrow. lolno, Cattle absolutely destroys the land. There's a reason as to why rotational grazing is a thing.
t.10th generation Australian cattle farmer.
Andrew Powell
the completion of agenda21 might disprove you, fiend. in fact, it's underway.
Liam Torres
>t. didn't watch the videos or read anything The point is to replicate herd movements. Obviously the current methods being used are destructive.
James Anderson
how dare you use personal knowledge established across generations against 1 meme scientist? it is bullshit and waste of time, you can get better results by skipping grazing altogether and planting shrubs -> smol requirement trees ->high requirement trees process would take aprox 2-3 generations but it wont need as much human oversight OR meme bullshit
Nathan Nguyen
>I am a professional farmer and I destroy the land my family owns so we go completely bankrupt.
Bro at least skim some of the links and you'll see they are talking about rotational grazing obviously not Haiti style deforestation.. Fuck me. If you are a real farmer you could explain tons of this info to us not just troll the thread.
that's another point lol, they may just kill us all and remove us from the land like the California camp fire.
>how dare you use personal knowledge established across generations against 1 meme scientist? Personal knowledge established across generations against millions of years of ecological evolution* >it is bullshit and waste of time, you can get better results by skipping grazing altogether and planting shrubs -> smol requirement trees ->high requirement trees process would take aprox 2-3 generations but it wont need as much human oversight OR meme bullshit This is not applicable to grassland environments whatsoever. The issue is the extinction of massive reduction of the great herds.
Aiden Barnes
>This is sophistry No it isn't you retard. I was just making a minor point that wasn't even meant to be a hard counter to the entire concept. My main problem is that the evidence for the effectiveness of this doesn't seem to be that solid, which is nothing more than a call to do more to prove the effectiveness of the method. Cause that's how you're going to get people to implement it. I also love how you think detrivores and decomposers don't play a role in nutrient cycles. Cause.. once the nutrients are in an animal, they just eaten by scavengers and never return to the soil. Fucking Dunning-Kruger retard.
>millions of years of ecological evolution* nice meme faggot >This is not applicable to grassland environments whatsoever this is wrong and you may or may not know it, but lets face it you are amateur who watched 1 meme youtube video and now suddenly believes he is expert environment manager and you know better than farmers >hurr great herds I dont give a fuck about great herds of bovine, sheep or people go die fagets and mother earth will fix itself really fast; you are crying about meme problem and produce meme answers and basically push environment protection discussion into some gay tracks how are you better than Macron who just wants shekels towards his "eco protection fund" ? you both fix nothing
I did watch the videos and read everything pertaining to Australia as that's the only area i'm even remotely qualified to comment on, and none of it had anything at all to do with increasing cattle presence by 400%, it had to do with water management which is an entirely separate issue and something that cattle grazing worsens.
So I have to ask, did YOU watch your own videos? >Obviously the current methods being used are destructive. And increasing cattle presence by 400% would only make it more so.
You want to rejuvenate deserts, you keep livestock off of it, you ensure it has nutrients and water, you plant shit and you leave it the fuck alone.
Please user, tell me more about how my family runs a sustainable cattle farm in the deserts of the driest continent on the planet, improves the land and has been doing so for over a hundred years with great success, i'd love to hear more.
Jacob Hernandez
how dare you post scientifiic data that clashes against scientific consensus of 2018 I bet you hate the trees
>You want to rejuvenate deserts, you keep livestock off of it, you ensure it has nutrients and water, you plant shit and you leave it the fuck alone. this is how I know this user knows his shit
