Assuming that God or some Cosmic Order exists, suicide is bad because you are apparently put on this Earth in order to live out a life the best you can. Cutting it short would be breaching your spiritual contract, nullifying any benefits you would have if you lived out as nobly and morally as you could. Thus, your soul would, in the case of God(s) be barred from paradise and condemned indefinitely to a realm of torture, rape, trauma, and excruciating pain. In the case of cosmic order, your soul would be subject to subsequent lives conveniently designed or formed to goad you into killing yourself, again and again and again indefinitely
But, what if there is no God or Cosmic Order?
Then what is the everlasting consequence for suicide?
Stephen Hawking(believes not in cosmic order, nor God) has said that "the Universe exists because we exist." Therefore, if we were to all die right now, this universe will fade away as there would be no one to observe it.
Life is finite anyway, and everyone will eventually experience death, reducing all life firmos to zero, leaving everything behind anyway. The most successful billionaire and the most impoverished wino on the street are at least equal and united in death. Which would mean that life is only worth living when it is good, and only when it will be good, or if it is at least good for others who will be good for others. And if that is so, then what is the point of a living a life where you can not be happy, and you have to lie to yourself that you are happy in order to be "happy." What is the point of living a life where you produce a net negative for the rest of the world just by existing, and through existence it is impossible to use your talents and abilities to produce a net positive, because your talents and abilities are not what people need?
Oh my God are you clinically retarded though >what's the everlasting consequence of suicide GEE I DUNNO, MAYBE IT'S BEING FUCKEN DEAD.
We are going to die anyway though, and in the end, if there is no God or Cosmic Order, then it is purely inconsequential. If you what you thought was your "soul" or your "consciousness" was really just your brain activity, then every thing you enjoyed, and the feeling thereof, will go away. You end just like you began. You don't really remember anything before you were born, so you'll likely not know anything or remember anything after you die.
Some people lived fulfilled lives and die rather peacefully. Others suffer, but they live lives that are universally seen as full of courage and nobility.
For instance, Stephen Hawking, the man I quoted was a brilliant scientist who contributed immensely to our understanding of physics and gave the most accurate representation of the physical activity of a black hole to current date. He may have been crippled by illness and confined to a wheel chair, but his brilliant mind was useful to people.
Junko Furuta, was a Japanese schoolgirl, who was in a position of life where suicide would have been the more humane option. She was kidnapped by 4 evil youths, who claimed familial ties to the Yakuza. They raped and beat her every day, subjecting her to unspeakable agonizing torture. She did not commit suicide, like so many other Japanese men and women in less agonizing instances. She stayed alive because she did not want the Yakuza to murder her family because she was that loyal, noble, and good. To me, her life has meaning in that it shows the value of compassion in a world that forsakes it. Junko's fortitude almost rivals that of Jesus Christ.
Unlike Stephen Hawking, who had something to give to the world with intellectual pursuits, or Junk Furuta, who had something to give to the world through her endurance and courage, I have no meaning in my life.
Now compare those lives with someone like let's say CWC or Andrew Dobson. What's their life meaning besides making you laugh or infuriating you?
>Assuming that God or some Cosmic Order exists, suicide is bad because you are apparently put on this Earth in order to live out a life the best you can.
I don't understand how that could possibly make sense to anyone. This is just religious thing. What if God wanted me to commit suicide ? Do you understand God ? How ? Is he human ?
>Assuming that God or some Cosmic Order exists, suicide is bad No, that's the Semitic conception of suicide from the Torah. YHWY the Jew god does not exist. Suicide is not always wrong; in fact, not only is it permissible, but it is sometimes your moral obligation to commit suicide. Say you hold military secrets and the enemy is about to capture you, endangering the lives of your Race. If you do not commit suicide you are a coward and violated your oath to protect your nation.
Assume you have the capacity to enjoy experiences within human life (very unlikely that you don't). Death is guranteed eventually, after which you can no longer enjoy experiences that, as far as we know, are unique to human existence. If you kill yourself, you gurantee the loss of these potential experiences at a point of your choosing. If you do not kill yourself, your death is not guaranteed at the point you could have comitted suicide, and thus there is no guranteed significant loss that with suicide would come as part of the package.
What keeps people living, and what makes life worth living is not some abstract notion of "pleasure" or "happiness" but rather the close relationships one has with others, especially those that have a sense of responsibility or dependence (eg, mother-son, lovers, god, etc). There are also weaker relationships that also tie one to the world, such as those with ones pets, or ones employer, or ones nation or race or what have you.
You seem depressed and are rationlizong suicide, probably due to being depressed. In your post you speak of being a net negative to the world, which is a symptom of deprssion (feeling like a burden, in most cases delusionally). The workd is not better off with you having lethally jarmed yourself turning inti a corpse.
My advice is just to stop thinking about the worth of life in terms of pleasure and suffering, but rather in terms of meaningful relationships to others. Depressed people have few if any. Happy people have many.
Yet you wouldn’t know that, well, because you’re d e a d.
>your soul would be subject to subsequent lives conveniently designed or formed to goad you into killing yourself, again and again and again indefinitely Resistance against injustice is the right choice, no matter the costs.
If some cosmic order exists and if it made a world with so much suffering; and if the said order punishes you for going against their wishes; it's even more important to give them the finger. Why the fuck would I want benefits by bowing down to some abomination?
>life is only worth living when it is good This mostly depends on your outlook. There are tons of rich fucks who practically look for ways to be negative about their life and tons of poorfags who are happy with every breath.
>point of a living a life where you can not be happy, and you have to lie to yourself that you are happy in order to be "happy." You either are or aren't. Imagined happiness is still happiness. You overthink the fuck out of this dumb shit.
>through existence it is impossible to use your talents and abilities to produce a net positive, because your talents and abilities are not what people need? How the fuck would you know?
>through existence it is impossible to use your talents and abilities to produce a net positive, because your talents and abilities are not what people need?
>How the fuck would you know?
Let's say you are fine arts artist. who doesn't know how to sell obscurantist bullshit.
Now hard mode:
Let's say you went into your fine arts major because you thought it was a professional art education and your coddling parents thought it was better than actual animation degree, and neither of you had the right answer which was a trade skill to learn so you could afford a house and other things after your parent die.
Legendary mode: You are now a low rate hentai fetish artist on DA, hiding your private life from the world because you know people would hunt you down and eat you alive.
If the results of your effort provide subjective value from your perspective, the process of having created them becomes its own reward.
A well adjusted hentai fetishes artist owns what he is internally. His work provides value to someone (at least himself) from his own perspective. There are people who will judge him for creating what he creates, but why should he care when his work creates value and their criticism creates none?
In either scenario you contribute a net positive with your talents simply by creating something. Extra points for getting it out, even if it's DA or /aco/
>a trade skill to learn so you could afford a house and other things after your parent die. You can always do that or fall for the webdev/coder meme; but it's all a bonus. Just because your talent doesn't pay the rent doesn't meant it's not beneficial for society overall.
The real you doesn't die it is eternal. The original I aka God is what you are part of. What dies is the ego your sense of self.
>Junko's fortitude almost rivals that of Jesus Christ. Yes. In some capacity we can all be like Christ. Even the animals we eat are like Christ. We suffer for the sins we commit to each other.
Also user you say you didn't exist before you were born how can you know? If that is the case then it is possible to transition from non existence to existence. But does that even make any sense? Then when you die the same could repeat itself. Or maybe the truth is that you always existed in some way. The real you not what you think you are.
You say the soul is damned to eternity in Hell one sentence and the very next day you’ll be revived over and over until you stop killing yourself proofread your shit next time retard
You don't need cosmic order or any weird hindu art for you to understand that dying AFFECTS OTHER PEOPLE TOO.
not even just surface level durr your family will has sad. everyone is part of the organism here. theory of relativity and all that bullshit. your death has consequence to reality whether you exist in it or not.
Only way to make this irrelevant is to believe you are the only PC and everyone else are NPCs. In that case, please never buy an AR-15.
"the Universe exists because we exist."
Does that include all life forms?
You make life what it is. If you hate your life, do something positive. Even if that means being kind and helpful to people on Jow Forums, that is still something worthwhile.
If you're a miserable human and make life miserable for others, you will be unhappy forever if you don't change.
Where is the picture from?
Oh fuck off with the nihilistic bullshit. We don’t even know a fraction of the universe.
Nobody knows what happens and can’t known so shut the fuck up faggots
That life is finite means that it is infinitely valuable.
even if you don't objectively believe in a literal metaphysical existence post-mortem, thats not the only useful case against suicide.
and your definition of happiness seems... underdeveloped.
since this is Jow Forums and not philosophy, why don't you make this about you and ask a question specific to your situation?
what a fucking basic ass outlook. "you make life what it is". Reminds me of the end of Life of Brain where all the Crucified dudes start singing "look on the bright side of life". Life sucks. It's unfair. How does "doing something positive" bring a loved one back to life, mend a wound, heal the sick, undo an injustice? It doesn't. You're essentially arguing "do something to get our mind off it". And then when OP is successful in his hobbies and his life and still feels the undenianle emptiness that is the universe, what then?
Life is cruel and random. Not everyone is born with the same opprutunities. Life is not what you make it, you are what life makes you.
You aren't actually right though user. You are shaped by your circumstances and relationship but you also shape the outside world as well. You are an actor in the play you can effect the world too. It is true that you don't control everything that doesn't mean you can't do anything though.
But hey, according to Stephen Hawking, you are the only PC, and everyone else is indeed an NPC. Because the universe only exists because you exist. When you die, the rest of the universe dies with you as well as the rest of the world.
Sure, existentially speaking, the ones around you are their own PCs and they would feel the pain and grief from your suicide, but you wouldn't feel their pain and grief because you wouldn't feel anything because you cease to exist. Like I said, you end in the same state of consciousness as before you began.
Yes, suicide a permanent solution to a temporary problem, and that temporary problem is life itself.
Again, the only reason I don't commit suicide is because of God, or Cosmic Order. But if it wasn't for my superstitious belief in an afterlife, why, I totally off myself if I was an atheist.
I made those two distinctions in the original post. Get some better reading comprehension there.
I would suggest downloading Elevate on you ios or playing some nintendo Brain Age.
If God exists. Suicide could damn your soul to hell.
If the Hindu and Zen Buddhists are correct, then the Cosmic Order will arrange a much more harsh and unforgiving world if you suicide. With each world being worse than the last until you don't commit suicide. And since you don'y remember past experiences you are likely to end up killing yourself indefinately, which makes this fate kind of equivalent to hell.
Why do you supposed nihilists always need other people to validate you? Why is it never enough to just believe what you believe without everyone thinking you're right or something?
Better than that if you're so jazzed for suicide then why are you so eager to be stopped?
You have such a profound concept of self and yet absolutely no inkling of understanding other. kys selfish bastard, world frankly could benefit to shake off a few loser brainlets.
If you want to be scientific and start talking Hawking, what he said is true---but also consider that humans can only see a limited spectrum of the universe. Take light for example---we can only see the spectrum of white light, but there are many wavelengths of light outside of the spectrum. Who is the one who can see ALL wavelengths? For sure, they are God. So, knowing there might be some one who can see the WHOLE reality and not just a snippet of reality like we can, you should respect such a being.
Hawking is a retarded science fiction author who sounds real smart, so no surprises there.
This. Worrying about hypothetical supernatural nonexistent entities that determine your fate in an afterlife is a waste of time. Death is not an illusion. We are not all secretly immortal. There isn't any nonmaterial spiritual stuff that makes you who you are. Your mind is an emergent phenomena of the neurolgical functioning of the brain. It isn't just temporarily hosting you mind. Your brain and your mind are interdependent. When you die the brain stops functioning and your mind is lost. It doesn't go somewhere. It stops existing.
That being said, suicide isn't the answer to your problems. Don't do it user. Seek help.