It is wrong to eat animals, it is okay to eat plants part 2

Previous thread

Plants dont suffer, Animals can suffer.
Plants cannot feel pain, Animals can feel pain.
It is wrong to eat animals, it is okay to eat plants. And so on and so forth.

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Other urls found in this thread:

theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,,-83446,00.html
allthatsinteresting.com/plants-defense-mechanism
liveleak.com/view?t=asYTE_1522097431
tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2549
twitter.com/SFWRedditImages

Animals are yummy

>no plants are very alive but they respond to stimuli without thinking or feeling just like rubber bands
I know what you are trying to get at, but ditch the rubber band analogy. It sucks. A better analogy would be, surprise surprise, the body of an animal. For example, when our blood clots at a wound, it happens without the animal thinking or necessarily feeling. It is the result of a chain of chemical reactions and living cells communicating with one another.

They are, but they are even more yummy and nutritious if they are happy and healthy while they were alive.

If only this opinion was more popular on this board.

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you can say the same thing about plants when they're not being constantly sprayed with pesticides and other chemicals and take up huge lands for mass production

What is your stance on honey. Should honey be stolen from the bees for humans to use?

Prove plants don't suffer

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Organic plants aren't healthier than plants farmed the regular way according to the papers i have read. However the sprays could definitely be an issue for the surrounding environment.

Isn't that the whole plotline of The Bee Movie with Jerry Seinfeld?

Plants do feel pain, just not in the same way as animals.

You can't really. There is also difficulty in determining whether animals without self-awareness are able to experience suffering (as opposed to just nociception and responding to stimuli).
You could argue that plants can 'suffer' from damage in that they can expend a lot of extra resources in responding to that damage. Sometimes these responses can kill the plant if there are not enough resources available for the plant to recover.

Organic plants are definitely not healthier.
Chemical fertiliser is simply far better for all growth than cowshit etc.

I think it's fine if it's sustainable. The best think to do is start your own hives.

I don't care about insect rights though.

theguardian.com/notesandqueries/query/0,,-83446,00.html

I suffer if I don't eat animals. It's not like I gorge on them, but a high quality sausage a day keeps the doctor away. Eggs and dairy I consume a lot, but you don't need to kill the animal to get those. Locally grown and freely pasturing livestock is the best for health and environment, apart from prey of course. There is nothing you can do to change my mind.

I don't think it matters if it is sustainable or not. Honey bees are not endangered. Unless we are talking about sustainability for the benefit of the honey farmer, then yeah need to keep the queen alive at least if you dont want to waste everything.

Plants’ Response To Being Eaten Is Very Similar To Our Response To Pain, Researchers Prove
allthatsinteresting.com/plants-defense-mechanism

Plants are green and help with the CO2 problem
Animals generate CO2 and eat the helpful plants
Eat only meat - have ribs as garnish for the steak tonight

Male chicks in factory farms get ground up alive like because they are useless for eggs and meat. But at least their death is quick. The chickens in shitty factory farms have to live and suffer through shit conditions.
liveleak.com/view?t=asYTE_1522097431

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Why not eat both in a well balanced and nutritional diet?

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I think I could live on raw milk, kefir, cheese, butter and eggs

Carnivore and proud. Mmhmm, chicken. KFC later today, I think.

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Why not be a real carnivore and at least attempt to hunt for your meat and then butcher the animal yourself? The thrill of the hunt is great, the exercise is great, and feeling like a part of the wilderness while out there is good for the soul. Buying chicken from KFC does not make you in any way equivalent to a wolf.
Cruel factory farming is just a weird unnatural hellish darkness.
Pic related are wild rabbit pests i hunted and butchered myself. There are no foxes or other natural predators in my country that control the introduced rabbit population. So i behave as a predator and get wild meat. Protecting the native ecosystem and getting food from the wild at the same time. Meat is valuable and should be treated as such.

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> human beings still don't have a functioning cecum.
pic related.

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As a vegan, I've nothing against hunters. If I ever want to eat meat again, I know I will return to hunting. There's nothing wrong with predating on a wild animal that has a chance to survive you if it's clever enough. It's factory farming that subjects animals to entire lives of suffering that's wrong.

Of course you'd think that, and itmight work if you wanna die at 45

>Plants dont suffer, Animals can suffer.
>Plants cannot feel pain, Animals can feel pain.
>It is wrong to eat animals, it is okay to eat plants. And so on and so forth.
Wrongness of killing something is completely unrelated to suffering and of course you can easily kill something without it suffering.

The value of life has literally nothing to do with whether it suffers. Avoidance of suffering is not even the goal in life, the goal in life is evolutionary survival, live and reproduce.

All your emotions merely exist to help you survive.

So since they merely exist for that and we know they do, why on earth would you place that as the highest ideal? It's nothing. And also since you can kill things without them feeling a thing that would mean if you hold to your value of "suffering as the problem with killing" you would not be able to object to even humans being killed instantly.

Many cerebral structures, constituting the pain matrix, participate in nociception and in the expression and modulation of pain. They transmit and decode nociceptive information, generate, amplify or reduce the pain sensation, allow expression of defensive or distress behavior, and influence the affect. Among these brain structures, the amygdaloid complex, or amygdala, appears as a key component of the pain matrix

life is suffering

You don't have claws, you don't have teeth adequate for ripping a part from flesh from a living animal.

Pain and suffering are feelings. All feelings are merely mechanisms of survival. Just because I can identify the same mechanisms in animals but not in plants does not mean that plants also have the will to live, and doesn't mean a plant doesn't have certain responses when its will to live is inhibited. FRUITARIAN OR NOTHING

Faggot trying to harness the autism of Jow Forums against veganism.

How do you spice pork.......?

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>a chance to survive you if it's clever enough
The deer in the public land here are so clever. Even with the advantage of a gun, the deer usually outsmart me and i come home with nothing 90% of the time (maybe im just bad). They have incredibly good noses, good hearing, and even decent eyesight. Very challenging animal to stalk in thick forest, and they dont have any natural predators so they just breed profusely.

Pretty easy to hunt on farmland though.

Honestly i would feel bad about hunting in areas if they were a natural part of a healthy ecosystem, which in that case i would be competing with wolves or bears for the meat animals.

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Simple analogy to the meat vs plants dilemma:
Imagine you need one plant and one animal per day to stay healthy. For some reasons, people usually use two animals and no plants, so we have a problem because there are a lot of animals being killed, making the problem bigger.
Some day, the people stop using animals, but they need something to eat instead of animals; therefore, all animal units are changed by plant units, so we have people using two plants and no animals per day. Can't you see that it's not a solution, but another problem itself? Suddenly, people only uses plants, so we have too plants being planted, so we have the same problems about use of space (in therms of farms or crops) and the same problems about pollution (in therms of pesticides and insects dying for these poisons)
At these point, 100% domesticable farm animals will dissapear, while we have excessive use of crops, which it's something that also provokes deforestation.
No, I don't have a solution.

Yes.
GET HIM OUT OF HERE.

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>Plants dont suffer
Prove it. They have a nervous system too.

Lol, it’s the bulk of my diet and my bloodwork is perfect.

The solution is to stop giving aid to africa , the middle east, and mexico for a start. From what I understand white people are not growing rapidly in population, so for white people feeding them is not a problem. With the population of blacks rising exponentially, the problem of food comes into play. Get rid of the blacks ability to breed (stop giving them aid) and the problem becomes a lot easier to deal with.

No, they literally don't you absolute tard.

We have eyes in the front of our head moron

i have a big brain to make tools to cut the meat from their bones

Tell that to my wife. She scratches me hard during sex and she loves ripping flesh from bone when eating steaks and jerky and shit. And there is no point in wasting energy during development creating huge teeth and claws when we can kill animals and eat their flesh just fine without it. Evolution weeds out inefficient designs. Humans developing teeth and claws like a tiger is inefficient and does not improve our ability to eat meat.

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I'm ashamed to share a country with this faggot

I only eat animals. Plants are bad for you, fuck anyone who tells me what I should eat.

It's pretty accurate, however, the overpopulation problem it's just a myth. IMHO, a better option it's to stop giving aid to those countries BUT investing on these countries to get more industry and economy, instead, so we can have full healthy competence around the world, improving the chances to make life better in those countries, this means more chances of survival, therefore, no more 235434567 children per woman, because you can have your mind occupied in more simple problems, rather than extend your chances of survival by making so much fucking children marked by death at born.

Papers that totally aren't influenced by certain interests.

Grinders are the natural evolution when you have thumbs, brain, fire and cooking knowledge.

Overpopulation is a problem depending on what context it is in, and how much we value letting large areas natural ecosystems exist. High populations in small areas, like high density cities, are difficult to manage and are not good for the human soul. Smaller populations are comfier and make it easier to live in harmony with natural ecosystems around us.
If you only eat animals, you better also be eating lots of raw fat and organ meat, or else you will be vitamin deficient. Also keep in mind that the inuit eskimos have a slightly different physiology than regular people who have had ancestors that fed on both meat and plants for a long time.

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ATTENTION VEG FREAKS
>if you think that going vegetarian/vegan ""saves"" animals
You are WRONG
Millions and quite possibly billions of animals are slaughtered to stop them destroying veg crops etc.
These are insects, birds, rodents and other vermin.
Pesticides on the plants kill insects, the farmers cats and shotgun and poison kills the birds. Sometimes a farmer will bring out his dogs to slaughter the rats gleefully.
Face it - if you justify veg eating in spite of this, you are putting an aesthetic concern above a moral one. You are saying you won't kill chickens and cows but you will kill insects, birds and rats. You are reprehensible.
Give it up. Rejoin the human race. Eat meat.
Anyway lab-grown meat will be widespread in

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It is wrong to eat animals...

...without the proper seasonings and condiments

I want to feel the creature's pain when I eat it.
I can't fap while eating otherwise.

Huh, a chink in poland. Ni hao.

aparrently harvesting it doesnt actually harm the bees so its ok.
veganism would be fine as long as it didnt become some hippy religion, rather just a practical way to avoid harming animals.

not to mention the gorillions of acres of natural habitat destroyed and tilled into farmland or all of the agricultural runoff spilling into the seas and destroying habitats there
>i-it's okay to kill those animals though, they weren't in my zoobooks as a kid
the absolute STATE of vegfags

I strongly believe that improving chances of survival significantly reduces the need for overbreeding children. It can also fix the immigrant problem, but it's the long path.

Is this the thread on how to become malnourished?

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Hopefully it turns out well. I am pretty racist but i am happy for shitskins to exist in their own countries without overbreeding and ruining it for everyone else. Sadly we will all be dead in a few decades so we cant see what will happen long term. Feels bad man. It will be super interesting to see what happens to this planet in the upcoming centuries.

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Nope, native Pole.
I just know what I like.

Most threads on Jow Forums regarding diet are about how to become malnourished, either by spreading the fad of veganism, or spreading the fad about living on a diet exclusively of steaks from walmart.

>sadly we will all be dead in a few decades
I was thinking exactly the same while typing, lol. Also, check'd

That's the joke.
Thanks for explaining it, I guess?

Most welcome. I am autistic so be patient with me.

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Outstanding point. Vegfags are utter utter hypocrites.
Take the judgepill
>Whatever in creation exists without my knowledge exists without my consent
>Only nature can enslave man and only when the existence of each last entity is routed out and made to stand naked before him will he be properly suzerain of the earth
>The freedom of birds is an insult to me. I’d have them all in zoos.

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What vegans will often argue is that with meat, you need land to keep the animals AND land to grow crops in order to feed those animals (which has the problems of plant argicultre + the problems of animal agriculture). And then there is an argument that you need to feed shit tons of crops to a cow for it to produce a small amount of meat which is a waste of calories. What people who make these arguments forget about though is the existence of grass fed meat and the existence of wild meat.

>I am autistic so be patient with me.
All apologies.

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This should become a bird thread. Birds are politics because birds are actually government spy machines.

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This is my cockatiel using my knife sharpening sticks to send signals to the powers that be.

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Budgerigar machine communicating directly with the Bogdanoffs.

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The birds are not only good for spying and communicating, but they can pick up and store objects to bring back to its controller.

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Also, if the internet goes down, birdies are the backup.
tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2549

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>tools.ietf.org/html/rfc2549
very nice

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ok last bird be happy everyone and eat a healthy balanced diet.

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I don't care if they suffer, I don't mind if they die.

Life is a circle, with a beginning and an end. We humans are just smarter so we are on top on the food chain.

If we dissappeared tomorrow, animals would still kill each other for food or diversion.

Killing is moral.

Its not wrong at all. There is a certain order to things you see, and nature agrees with eating animals.

Why would it be wrong for an animal to eat another animal? Humans may be above beasts but we are not above nature.

We need to invent lab grown meat, its the only alternative that makes sense then veganism.

I squashed a fly and I reckon the chicken died just as fast. I think the problem qith people like you is that you are emotionally over invested in thinking about the deaths and pain and suffering of animals. If you only you put as much effort into the humans suffering around you.

I hunt pigs as you probably do also being an NZ'er. I dont eat them though. I just kill them for fun. In fact I dont know anyone in Australia who eats them. Basically everyweekend, thousands of Aussies are killing pigs just for fun. A handful are killing them for crop protection, but for the vast majority of us hunters, its just pure adreline filled slaughtering to sate a bloodlust.

But hey, you enjoy your rabbit. I hope you remembered to purge its bladder in time.

Yeah ive killed a few pigs and the backstraps were really good eating. The hunt is very thrilling, and then the food that comes from the animal is great as well. Pest animals are great source of meat because they have to be killed anyway. But ive heard many people dont like to eat wild pig because they believe the pigs taste like trash. And butchering/hauling the meat home can be a lot of work.
And yep, i purge the bladder of rabbits immediately after shooting, and then i immediately remove the guts.

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Consider the following: I don't care about your ethics

Checked.

i lied, i still have more birds to post while my sleeping pills kick in.
Thats okay fren.

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Life feeds on life you fucking waste of space.

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Plants have feelings too dick

Even my supposedly herbivorous birds eat meat when it is available to them. They fucking love meat and fish.

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>We need more heavily processed unnatural corporation made foods instead of just eating natural real food. For health!

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>bloodybirdy.jpg
Checked.

Humans are animals. Animals eat animals. We view this constantly. Humans developed the way they are because they ate cooked meat. If it was your way humans would not exist at all and the world would be ruled by chimps throwing poopoo at each other.

>Meat minus any nutritional value
Heck off

Both plants and animals are defenseless and innocent. The only moral option is to eat the guilty. Become a cannibal today.

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who gives a shit? if it's tasty and healthy, I eat it.

yeah that fucking bird is more bothersome than a fly when i am butchering or cleaning carcasses. Its more like a vulture than a cockatiel

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Plants can feel pain. Don’t be a retard. All living beings feel pain. If a being existed that couldn’t feel pain it would quickly go extinct.

Plants need to know when they are being eaten because they defend themselves from predators with toxins. Even playing a recording of a caterpillar munching on leaves causes nearby plants to start pumping toxins into their leaves.

Plants are loaded in antinutrients. Plants are alive and do not want to be eaten. They cannot run away so they fight back by poisoning the animals that eat them.

This is why you should avoid eating plants and why vegetables are actually not good for you at all. You are actually losing nutrients when you eat plants because the antinutrients in them leech nutrients from your body.

Many but not all fruits are safe to eat. Seeds, leaves and roots are all extremely bad for you.

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Animals literally eat each other alive. We better outlaw biological life.
I don't give a fuck about lesser animals.

Im all for eating meat, and even (very very fresh) raw meat and raw fat. However genuinely believing that all plants are bad for you and only leech nutrients from your body is whacked out cult shit. Same sort of cult misinformation that vegans or atkins dieters. You can believe what you want and eat what you want, but pretending to be an expert on nutrition is just lame dude.

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