.357 Sig

Chase Powell
Chase Powell

almost 2019
not carrying a 357, God's gift to mankind

What is your excuse Jow Forums? Sure 9mm is adequate, I guess... 45 is big and won wars, no arguing there. But dat 357 smokes both out of the water in power, penetration through barriers and reliability. Recoil is less than a 40 short and weak, while having the same capacity and much more power.

Hell even 10mm loads usually come in with less power than the good 357 shit. And don't get me started on the recoil of that thing. Yikes. Would not want to have to sling a couple fast rounds into a charging Tyrone with that thing.

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All urls found in this thread:

youtu.be/P3lKNo2GbXo
youtu.be/ughIFOrIP_w
chuckhawks.com/handgun_recoil_table.htm
larrywillis.com/bullet-energy.html

Noah Rodriguez
Noah Rodriguez

Any caliber not 9mm or .45 are meme calibers

Elijah Kelly
Elijah Kelly

I'd rather shoot 10mm

Logan Richardson
Logan Richardson

yfw it doesnt matter what you shoot when it comes to handguns

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Mason Hernandez
Mason Hernandez

now, what we need is this: 327 ACP

22 round flush-fit mags
more energy than a 45
more velocity than 9mm
sufficient mass to do work, unlike 5.7

Xavier Wood
Xavier Wood

10x25 dillon you dumb faggot. .357 sig is the .40 S&W of necked handgun ammo.

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Bentley Reyes
Bentley Reyes

10mm usually comes with less power than good 357
10mm has more recoil
Nigger, do you even understand physics? how can a round have more power, but less recoil? That makes zero fucking sense.

Ayden Perry
Ayden Perry

This is actually an option I've been looking into because Fuck it why not.

Cameron Allen
Cameron Allen

Avatar posting is a bannable offense.

Luke Martin
Luke Martin

10x25 dillon
read the numbers
poor imitation of muh 327
feels good to be a gangster

Angel Ward
Angel Ward

10x25 dillon
No such thing.

Nigger, do you even understand physics? Do you?
Kinetic energy is ½mv2; recoil is just mv (ignoring the momentum of propellant gas).
A half-mass bullet travelling 50% faster has 12% more energy, but 25% less recoil.

Cooper Russell
Cooper Russell

When one body exerts a force on a second body, the second body simultaneously exerts a force equal in magnitude and opposite in direction on the first body.

Literally the 3rd law of physics. You arent going to magically going to have a more powerful projectile out of the same handgun that magically has less recoil.

Recoil is kinetic energy. it doesnt follow some different equation. Fucking retard.

Nicholas Collins
Nicholas Collins

After years of terminal ballistics research as a hobby i've realized this is more or less right. Until somebody comes out with a 7.2x22mm round or something like that offering mild expansion and reliably a bit over 2000fps allowing for meaningful wounding from TSC with acceptable recoil the best calibers for the non recoil adverse are going to be .357 sig and .45 acp. The former offers the best available post barrier performance, energy/velocity on target, while allowing for plentiful capacity, controllable recoil, and even usage of meme rounds with well over 2000FPS velocity. The latter makes the most sense for situations where post barrier performance and capacity aren't crucial concerns(aka almost all civilian CCW use) due to its massive expansion with adequate penetration. 9mms only real place is for those larping about capacity(realistically a non issue for civilians) and those who simply cant handle the recoil of more potent calibers.
357 sig at 1319fps
That isn't even an honest comparison. Also:
dying gel "wound tracks" like gel actually depicts real world wound volumes
9x25D is TBQH shit with ANY loading i've seen chrono'd when you take barrel length into account. Were talking like a 50fps gain over .357 sig with same manufacturer and weight loadings for dealing with its numerous drawbacks.

Ryder Williams
Ryder Williams

What is your excuse Jow Forums?
I'm not retarded or trying to justify a purchase to random jerkoffs on 4chin.

Adam Ross
Adam Ross

Another thread, OP?

Grayson Ross
Grayson Ross

"ah yes, here we have the keyboard ballistics expert in it's natural environment."

Julian White
Julian White

gel test
because we only shoot blocks of gel
This is why the FBI got BTFO'd in Miami.

Adrian Nelson
Adrian Nelson

They're called sidearms for a reason user.

Jason Flores
Jason Flores

be patrician, shoot Underwood Xtreme Defender in 10mm, just as the Lord intended
be manlet, shoot .357 SIG which is just 9mm +P, but with Sig’s name attached to it

Lmaoing at you.

Matthew Bennett
Matthew Bennett

After years of terminal ballistics research as a hobby i've realized this is more or less right. Until somebody comes out with a 7.2x22mm round or something like that offering mild expansion and reliably a bit over 2000fps allowing for meaningful wounding from TSC with acceptable recoil the best calibers for the non recoil adverse are going to be .357 sig and .45 acp

You. I like you.

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Jaxson Brown
Jaxson Brown

When one body exerts a force on a second body, the second body simultaneously exerts a force equal in magnitude and opposite in direction on the first body.
Right on. Same force. And work is force times distance, right?
That force (let's say 1200 pounds for convenience) is applied to the bullet accelerating it through a distance of, say, 4 inches; the work done to, and thus the kinetic energy gained by, the bullet is:
(1200 pounds)(4 inches) = 400 ft*lb
Meanwhile, the slide and barrel are accelerated in the opposite direction by the same 1200lb, but due to their greater mass, move a shorter distance, about 0.1". The work done on, and thus the energy gained by, the slide and barrel, is:
(1200 pounds)(0.1 inch) = 10 ft*lb

TL;DR: Recoil is momentum, not kinetic energy, and you're the fucking retard.

Jacob Cruz
Jacob Cruz

Feel free to start arguing at any time. Im conversant in everything from fackler or GKR to dimaio or courtney & courtney with a whole lot inbetween, i've literally got folders of actual ballistics studies and journals i've managed to scrounge up over the years to base my opinions on.
1700fps from a 6" bbl
super mcmanly
2100fps out of a 4" bbl
manlet
Oh and inb4 you try to act like the extra 90ftlbs somehow makes up for that when you're talking about a cavitating bullet design that's much more so reliant on velocity than anything else. FYI out of a same length barrel the .357sig would be hitting about 2300fps with slightly more energy than the 10mm.

Logan Peterson
Logan Peterson

the manlet just makes up numbers with no source to appease his (((Cohen))) masters

Beautiful.

Aiden Taylor
Aiden Taylor

Reaction images have been part of board culture since the beginning, faggot. So has spotty rule enforcement.

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Carter Peterson
Carter Peterson

357 sig
not 357 mag

Joseph Bennett
Joseph Bennett

I concealed carry a 12 gauge

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Jayden Mitchell
Jayden Mitchell

pretty much the same thing these days, familia

Hudson Price
Hudson Price

Mah nigga.

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Carter Wilson
Carter Wilson

use the same source as the person you;re responding to(underwood)
"you're just making things up with no sources!"
Pottery

Camden Adams
Camden Adams

almost 2019
not open carrying a .51 Gyrojet
It's almost like you don't think rocket launchers are cool

Wyatt Green
Wyatt Green

ki·net·ic en·er·gy
/kəˈnedik ˈenərjē/
nounPhysics
noun: kinetic energy; plural noun: kinetic energies

energy that a body possesses by virtue of being in motion.

Both the bullet and firearm have momentum and kinetic energy you retard. Im not disputing that. What im saying is that its impossible for a projectile to have more energy and create less recoil.

Youre so dense.

Ryder Davis
Ryder Davis

Not him, but fuck you.

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Ayden Ward
Ayden Ward

So like .32 naa? Neat.

Robert Rivera
Robert Rivera

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Lucas Richardson
Lucas Richardson

What im saying is that its impossible for a projectile to have more energy and create less recoil.
And that's wrong, and I showed you why it's wrong, but you can't understand it because you're an idiot.

For fuck's sake, if you can't handle the math, go fucking shoot a gun sometime. Shoot a 9mm with some 147gr and some Liberty or Lehigh meme bullets, and feel the difference in recoil.

Jeremiah Cooper
Jeremiah Cooper

still no sources other than noncontextual, noncredited screenshots
Here you go. I did the work for you. Enjoy your overpriced Jew round.
youtu.be/P3lKNo2GbXo
youtu.be/ughIFOrIP_w

Christian Thomas
Christian Thomas

oh look, I can make an apples-to-oranges comparison to make the round I don't like look bad
Yeah, you wanna see my comparison of 10mm FBI loads to XD .357sig? Of course you don't because that would be stupid.
Now take those hollow-points and stuff them up your nose.

And those screenshots from Underwood's website? Yeah, they're obviously from Underwood's website.

Samuel Howard
Samuel Howard

recoil hurts his babby wrists
”it’s a meme round!”

Every time.

Zachary Hughes
Zachary Hughes

You stupid ass faggot, they have LESS recoil than 147gr. You really are a noguns retard, aren't you?

Henry Miller
Henry Miller

mocking someone over recoil
I bet you don't even shoot slugs out of 12 gauge pistols, fag

Alexander Flores
Alexander Flores

Why would you intentionally slow down your followup shots by sometimes as much as a quarter second for a negligable gain in outbound damage?
You're gonna shoot the dude a bunch anyway, it's not like 7 rounds of 9mm is going to do significantly less damage than 7 rounds of whatever the fuck else.
inb4 "lol dudes have taken 15 rounds to the chest" etc
It's not actually a significant difference with handguns

Nolan Powell
Nolan Powell

Ive shot a lot of different ammo. And oddly enough, the rounds with more energy, recoiled harder. Who wouldve fucking guessed? My USP recoiled harder than my glock 19. Hmmm. I really wonder why. The 9mm projectile is moving faster but has a lighter round. With your autistic logic, my USP shouldnt have more recoil. Which is even stranger because the USP is objectively heavier, the slide moves objectively further, and the recoil spring is objectively better. Those 3 things should make it recoil even less. But for some fuck odd reason, this gun that is firing an objectively more energetic round consistently, with a 100% success rate, recoils harder than the glock 19.

Connor Mitchell
Connor Mitchell

because you’re most likely going to draw and just fucking rapid fire from no more that five feet away. If you’re in a situation where you have the time to assume proper stance and perform proper technique, then you have time to book it. CC is meant as an absolute last resort. Not as a first resort nor as an excuse to play hero.

Cooper Anderson
Cooper Anderson

you're just going to draw and rapid fire so get the less controllable round
Ok

William Adams
William Adams

What im saying is that its impossible for a projectile to have more energy and create less recoil.
Was it shooting a lighter bullet at higher velocity? No, of course not. It was shooting a heavier bullet at similar velocity, so of course it recoils more.
I suggested you compare heavy+slow vs. light+fast bullets in the same gun, but you're comparing heavy+slow in one gun vs. even heavier+slow in a different gun.
It's like you're deliberately choosing not to understand anything I say, almost as if you were pretending to be retarded.

Brody Price
Brody Price

If it's so good how come no one uses it?

Nicholas Rodriguez
Nicholas Rodriguez

if you have the 1 second it takes to use your sights you should just run bro!
you'll never have a threat inside your own home
or when you're cornered
or have to defend a loved one
or have to deal with a spree shooter
lol, you dont need to aim, just RUN BRO
Leave any time

Jace Gonzalez
Jace Gonzalez

Okay fine, shooting 147 grain +p out of my glock 19 always recoiled harder than 115 grain.

115 gr @1125 FPS always had softer recoil than the 147 grain round @1050 FPS.

One round is objectively lighter and faster than the other. One round is objectively less energetic than the other. One round had objectively less recoil than the other.

Those 3 statements have one thing in common.

pro tip
Theyre only applicable to one of the two cartridges I listed.

Julian Phillips
Julian Phillips

It's literally the fucking source you originally posted. another user even made screenshots. You really shouldn't be calling other people a jew RN.

Hunter White
Hunter White

literally a 9mm +P
only has the capacity of .40
bullet set back is a thing you need to watch for or else you kaboom

Aiden Gutierrez
Aiden Gutierrez

115gr plinking ammo
Way to cherry pick. Did you miss where I said Liberty or Lehigh? You know, light fast rounds that AREN'T underloaded junk? Ones that have MORE energy than 147gr, and yet recoil the same or less?

Elijah Wilson
Elijah Wilson

compare two different bullets one of which is lighter and faster than the other

NO NOT THOSE ONES REEEEEEEEE

Nicholas Martinez
Nicholas Martinez

That's it. I'm done. You know I said that clear back in , so you're just pretending you can't read now. Fuck you, you miserable faggot.

Aiden Smith
Aiden Smith

Sorry, fag. Details do matter. You don't get to just gloss over details when it's convenient to you.

Adam Moore
Adam Moore

I’m going to put more energy into this lighter object over the same distance as this heavy object but somehow the energy that is pushing back is going to be less.

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Dylan James
Dylan James

almost 2019

Yikes

Nolan Miller
Nolan Miller

this lighter projectile with more energy is somehow going to produce less recoil than this other projectile with less energy.

Luis Butler
Luis Butler

several LEAs including the secret service
If it's so good how come no one uses it?
wut?
literally a 9mm +P
9mm +p is aprx 124gr at 1200fps
.357 sig is aprx 125 grs at 1500fps
no
bullet set back is a thing you need to watch for or else you kaboom
Honestly never been a problem for me, i always eyeball my rounds before/after chambering and haven't really had set back issues with .357, .40, .45, or 9mm. but then i make it a point to only chamber a round a dozen or so times before cycling it out. Only notable "issue" i've had is .45 JHPs proclivity for getting noticeably more beat up than other calibers. Thinks its a combination of the large frontal area, feed angle, and maybe slightly softer materials for expansion at lower velocity.

Bentley Clark
Bentley Clark

how can a round have more power, but less recoil? That makes zero fucking sense.
But it's true.If it makes no sense to you, well, that says more about you than about physics.

Recoil table from chuckhawks.com/handgun_recoil_table.htm (truncated to .357 Magnum)
Energy calculator larrywillis.com/bullet-energy.html

Note the [email protected] load has more energy than [email protected] or [email protected], yet recoils considerably less.
Also note that [email protected] and [email protected] are within 1% muzzle energy, but [email protected] has 10% more recoil.

Q.E.D.

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Joshua Hernandez
Joshua Hernandez

No, not like that at all..
Hot 327 is pushing harder that 9x25 dillon
100 grains at 1700fps

Isaac Wright
Isaac Wright

There aren't many good carry options for .357 sig. If there was a metal frame double stack subcompact I'd carry it without a doubt.

Noah Edwards
Noah Edwards

After arguing for a long-ass time with retards on this board, it's nice to finally read a post of this quality and accuracy.

Ethan Kelly
Ethan Kelly

People who actually kill other people use 9s

You're larping too hard.

Wyatt Howard
Wyatt Howard

reddit spacing

Brayden Green
Brayden Green

Hasn't been a problem for me
anecdotes as a counter argument
Brainlet of the highest order.

Connor Miller
Connor Miller

You're new here if you don't remember that spacing has been around here since you were underage b&.

Meanwhile

I'm

Also

Right

And

You

Have

No

Argument

Go

Back

To

Weekendgunnit

Turbonigger

Jose Bailey
Jose Bailey

Whatever you say, kid

Jayden Myers
Jayden Myers

Being this new
Exposing it
ishiggydiggy

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Nicholas Murphy
Nicholas Murphy

implying

I even have a fancy holster.

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Gabriel Lewis
Gabriel Lewis

phoneposting
kys, kid

Gabriel Brown
Gabriel Brown

Post your carry gat

Angel Green
Angel Green

this, and it's always the glockfag boomers that are posting about 10mm and .357 sig

Eli Rodriguez
Eli Rodriguez

nigger do I look like a camera

Jaxson Gutierrez
Jaxson Gutierrez

39923169
Nogunz, ignored, no more (You)s for you.

Eli Parker
Eli Parker

I don't need to prove a damn thing to you, kiddo

David Carter
David Carter

10mm faggit

Nicholas Collins
Nicholas Collins

Did you mean 9?

Mason Nelson
Mason Nelson

.357 Sig
6.5x55/CM/Grendel, bur never .260 Rem or .264 Win Mag
Tikka rifles
PSA rifles
77gr TMKs
Not saying these are good or bad, just compiling a list of stuff Jow Forums seems to talk about more than other gun sites or forums.

I would have put .327 Fed Mag on there, but I don't think we have enough revolver anons.

James Barnes
James Barnes

Brainlet detected

Holy wew

Liberty 10mm 60 gr. Fucking railgun

How do you conceal that mag though? Will say though, that scene in Snatch when the pikeys unload with super short sawed offs was lit. Definitely concealable

Logan Morales
Logan Morales

Alright well I’m gonna go with the laws of motion that have been proven for over 3 centuries rather than some random retard with a .com.

Dylan Moore
Dylan Moore

Faster lighter bullets always recoil less than comparably loaded heavier and slower ones.

Joseph Fisher
Joseph Fisher

why not just shoot what you can afford and are comfortable shooting with

Ian Long
Ian Long

arguing about and carrying woman calibers shameful display

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Asher Garcia
Asher Garcia

10mm.
Less power. More recoil.
Pick one.

Cooper Carter
Cooper Carter

Hmm I wonder why. Could be the fact that lighter rounds tend to require less force to get them going faster than their heavier counterparts.

Colton Ross
Colton Ross

This.

Andrew Russell
Andrew Russell

I'm gonna go with the laws of motion
doesn't understand the laws of motion
Fuck off, retard.

Andrew Baker
Andrew Baker

.357 sig has widely available compressed loads that are more resistant to set back than 9, .40, .45 etc. For that matter you should check any rounds for set back anyways as all calibers are susceptible. Acting like setback is a critical flaw of .357 sig reeks of ignorance or attempting to make mountains out of mole hills to justify your pre existing bias.
People who actually kill other people use 9s
What? people who kill people use everything from .32 to 10mm including .357 sig. That's a complete non argument.

Gabriel Scott
Gabriel Scott

Necked handgun ammo is stupid.

Cooper Ward
Cooper Ward

Liberty 10mm 60 gr. Fucking railgun
this. 357SIG fags firmly but fairly btfo

Hudson Rogers
Hudson Rogers

The laws of motion strictly state that for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction.

So to propel a projectile in one direction with more energy, be it through velocity or weight, there is going to be more energy going in the opposite direction. More energy = more recoil.

Matthew Foster
Matthew Foster

What is your excuse Jow Forums?

pic

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Robert Long
Robert Long

People with the option to kill people with whatever they like overwhelmingly use 9s*

Better?

Kevin Gomez
Kevin Gomez

Because needle dicks who don't actually shoot need to feel special with snowflake calibers. And yes, I know you fags don't shoot, look at how they actually handle the recoil they brag about at Jow Forums meetups.
Loosing controlled grip on 45aarp while shooting
"lol wristlet" online
This is the same person
The fact is, handguns suck at energy delivery. The all do, till you get to serious magnum energy, or lower level magnums out of rifle length barrels
t. Michigander living south enough to have to take dear with a .357 lever gat
Handguns need to hit the CNS for a one shot drop most of the time. Dumping 300ft lbs or 480ft lbs of energy isn't typically going to matter half as much as a round that will reliably hit the spine through clothing and flesh, and if you carry as part of your job, light barricades. It's faggots arguing like faggots. Carry the round that you shoot best in the gun you shoot best, and preferably with enough ammunition where you can dump well aimed follow up shots.
Anything else is just talk from people who spend more time riding dragon dildos than shooting.

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Aaron Lewis
Aaron Lewis

Durr*

Hudson Mitchell
Hudson Mitchell

Newton's 3rd law applies to mass times velocity, my dude. KE is half the mass times velocity square. I can throw a 7kg bowling ball at .85 m/s for the same momentum (i.e. recoil) as throwing a .15kg baseball at 40m/s. But there's more energy required to get that baseball moving and to stop it, if you accept KE as a valid metric for effectiveness.

Isaiah Gray
Isaiah Gray

.45
THE meme caliber
muh two wrol wors
muh stoppan powa

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Sebastian Sanders
Sebastian Sanders

9millimeterlet cope
Sad.

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Joseph Russell
Joseph Russell

I carry a Colt Delta 10mm so...

Christian Gonzalez
Christian Gonzalez

Depending on barrel length 9x25 is about 150-225 fps faster than 357sig (125gr gold dots). 800ftlbs vs 600 ftlbs. Maybe you should go back to ballistics school.

Brandon White
Brandon White

Or i could just use hot-loaded 9mm in a not shit handgun

Mason Peterson
Mason Peterson

9x25 Dillon.

/thread

Jason Brown
Jason Brown

cope
Plebbit

Blake Lee
Blake Lee

So a .357 sig is better than 10mm?

Connor Sanchez
Connor Sanchez

Different user. I don't think a human lung will tell much difference between a 9mm 124gr or a 10mm 180gr bullet going 1300fps (velocities from my reloading manual, so Underwood bros, leave me be.) A hog might though, since the 180gr bullet has more mass and SD.

I'm damn sure a bear would notice the difference in a 10mm 200gr and a 147gr going 1200fps, again because 10mm just has better SD bullets for caliber, at the expense of a lot more recoil and powder.

Christopher Wright
Christopher Wright

9x25 still goes harder butacks capacity

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Colton Scott
Colton Scott

$32 for a box of 50
How do you fuckers afford to train with this shit? 4 boxes of this a month would kill me, let alone not being able to train on steel.

And I will need to train on this shit regularly because, assuming my barrel twist even stabalizes this, my POI past 10y is going to require a new FSP.

Eli Thompson
Eli Thompson

Oh, nevermind, box of 20, so $1.50 a pop. This shit is novelty ammo, guys. So much for putting in 200-300 rounds per month.

Justin Perez
Justin Perez

Attached: 9x25-Dillon-.jpg (1.41 MB, 2350x3426)

Charles James
Charles James

Yet another different user, but depending what you want out of a cartridge, possibly. For people who think velocity and/or kinetic energy is the most important parameter(s), the top two options are .357sig with 65gr XD (2100fps, 4" barrel), or 10mm with 60gr CD (2400fps, 5" barrel).
The 60gr Liberty round is even faster than .357sig, and looks great on paper. Personally, though, I don't trust a fragmenting hollowpoint like that to have good post-barrier performance, while the XP/XD bullets are well established as having incredibly effective post-barrier performance. I might change my mind if I see CD perform well in barrier tests, but youtubers all seem too busy shooting at body armor to do interesting tests.
So if you restrict yourself to cavitating/fluid dynamics type bullets, as I do for now, .357sig is as good as or better than 10mm, because 10mm's best option, the 115gr XD (1700fps, 5" barrel), is just too heavy for caliber. In the same length barrel, 10mm 115gr and .357sig 65gr are pretty much tied for energy (10mm has a slight advantage in normal pistol barrels, but .357sig gains more velocity per inch, and should pull ahead around 7-8"), and .357 obviously has much more velocity, which makes cavitating bullets that much more effective.

(9x25 is better yet, but for unclear reasons it's only a very little bit better -- it might make sense to upgrade a 10mm or .45 gun to 9x25, but I don't see the point of buying a new gun specifically for it.)

John Stewart
John Stewart

worrying about overstabilization in handgun rounds
Seriously, wtf?
Anyway, I do carry Underwood 65gr XD in my jacket gun. No, I don't "train like you fight" -- I ran a couple boxes through to confirm function and accuracy, but I just shoot 125gr .357sig or 147gr 9mm (both of which have equal or greater recoil, but less bang and less money) when I want to burn up a bunch of ammo. The POI difference in my gun isn't enough to matter at the ranges I can consistently make good hits; If it was, I'd just sight the .357sig slide for 65gr, and train with the 9mm when I care about accuracy.
Since I don't live in a city, I don't have to worry about gunning down mobs of nogs; training with exactly the same recoil so I can make perfect double-taps and transitions is a great hobby, but when you only take one shot, any difference in recoil really doesn't matter.
I'm quite happy with how the stuff puts down critters, which is after all the main reason I carry a gun.

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