I understand that polymer will make it easier to lug around each day, but, I'm looking for a single all purpose gun I can use for everything from CCW to competition etc. I'm mostly looking at 9x19s but I'll consider anything that's in a common-ish caliber.
Pic kind of related - the k9 is steel and is more my thing but it's the size of a dictionary.
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Why not DA/SA?
Canik/TriStar P100
CZ Sku 99041 Steel P-01 if you can find one.
Sig
Sphinx SDP
Just got my Subcompact SDP back from the smith.
Sweet trigger job.
Yeah.
Sig DAO 22x series can be found cheap as fuck online.
DAO is better legally in my current state (tough for the prosecution to argue that you'd cocked a "hair trigger), but I prefer just learning a single trigger mechanism instead of the switch from DA/SA. I'm a former Wheely-gat guy so those are the best for me.
who is this lil techno cyberpunk cutiepie?
aren't they HUEG as fuck though? like Original Xbox big?
Still, I've heard good things about the DAK trigger.
Serbian Zastava CZ99 Sig clone would be interesting.
You want a steel frame DAO? Well that certainly limits your options. Your pic isn't a K9. The PM9 sized all-steel Kahr is the MK9.
yep, that's why I said pic partly related - becacuse the PM9 is mostly polymer with some metal rails on the inside.
and (like I said) the K9 is kind of mega-huge, not really concealable.
Mk9 is like pm9 but thicker, because it has a layer of steel under the grips as you have requested. Still single stack.
That is my newest EDC rotation gun.
Canik L-120 full size, CZ StainlessP-01, and the Sphinx SDP Subcompact.
Had it polished, and a 13 pound hammer spring put in it.
I needs a disconnector fitted to it and a pretravel screw installed but it is a really tight fit internally and not compatible with CZ parts.
Magazines will swap with a CZ and that is all.
Novak rear sight cut though from the factory.
she's a 100% qt pie. although a 13lb trigger, wow - what are you NYPD?
True, and that extra thiccness makes it tougher to CC. It's why I'm starting to gravitate to the S&W 55xx or 69xx models. I'd love to take a look at the Sigs reccoed too.
13 pound hammer spring in a CZ design is not the actual trigger weight.
Feels closer to a 7 pound DA trigger and a 3 pound SA.
My ECC rotation in one picture.
Canik L-120 alloy frame full size with Cajun Gunworks internals and a polishing job and LOK grips
Sphinx SDP subcompact with CGW spring, polishing job and Mecgar +2 baseplate for 15 rounds
CZ Stainless P-01 With CGW RRK and polishing job.
The CZ has the smoothest trigger of them all.
The Cajun Reach Reduction Kit made a huge difference. It uses a different disconnector.
Trigger on the SDP didn't turn out nearly as good.
It is lighter now but I can feel the decocker mechanism stacking up during the DA pull.
It wasn't discernable with the heavier trigger pull.
Canik and P-01 are safety models with just a firing pin block.
My Shadow, Tac Sport and !911 all have decent triggers.
Tac Sport is insanely light SA.
uh oh, that chromed out CZ could be in our sleezecore thread....
careful you don't start rocking a fake rolex and smoking menthols...
9x18 just say fuck it
Whoops that’s not doa I’m an idiot
>I've heard good things about the DAK trigger
If you're already shooting a DA then no other type of fire mechanism is going to throw you off. You're overestimating the learning curve. If you learned DA then you're also going to hate carrying with a safety so you might as ewll get a decent striker pistol. The HK LEM trigger is good, the DAK is notoriously awful. Imagine a DA/SA in reverse.
those aren't DAO right? Also, snappy, also not a ton of replacement parts, also not that great at distance shooting, also hard to find ammo in-stores vs. online.
Kind of actually the worst for what I was looking for, but, you did get the all-steel bit. That's true. Also, dick grips.
Wait, how the fuck do you do a DA/SA in reverse? It shoots a single good shot and then gets gritty and heavy? That's fucking sorcery.
Also, do they even make HK all steel DAOs? I've spent the morning researching smith 3rd gens.
Double posting because I suck cocks, but anything like the Smith 6946 - because actual Smith 69s are kind of hard to find now.
Picture related.
>snappy
Hardly, it's nothing compared to a micro-compact. Perfectly manageable.
>not a ton of replacement parts
You don't need a ton of replacement parts, the whole gun is ~27 parts. I hear Wolf makes replacement springs.
Other concerns are valid. Fixed barrel is fairly accurate, but Ive never taken it about 50 meters. Ammo can be found online for 20cpr
It is there near the top.
Factory sticker says Stainless, but it is factory Chrome plating actually over a matte stainless frame.
Fair, but, I just don't like having to rely on online stores for ammo. Replacement parts, fine (which just means I need to stock up a LOT beforehand), but, def not ammo.
Besides, if I wanted to go all metal- and Soviet I'd get a TOK and rock some screamingly hot rounds.
>That's fucking sorcery.
indeed it is. it's fucky so a lot of people have trouble learning it. I don't know if HK is making any steel pistols with LEM triggers, it was just a comparison to a similar system that works like it should. If I had to fill all the original criteria without the SA only rule I would just tell you to get a CZ75 Compact.
guns.com
As fun as tokarevs are, they're not the best option for carry, most just have shitty frame safeties that were added to comply with import restrictions, aren't drop safe, and ammo is going to be much harder to find than 9x18. I've never seen it in a physical store anywhere, but i can at least ovwr pay for 9x18 if i need to at some places.
Again, they're a great gun for the price, just not something I'd carry.
yeah, I mean, I'm not going to get one of those either, but, they just look so fucking cool. I'd even LARP by getting a lanyard ring and a lanyard to connect it to my belt too.
But, that's all academic/moot as I'm not goiing to get any of those.
Wow, what a clusterfuck. Yeah I agree with the departmental need for "no decocking" but also for bullets-on-target fast. The vid you sent showed someone clearly skilled strugglign with it. I will be nowhere near as good anytime soon, perhaps skipping the DAK trigger then.
As for hte HK stuff - it literally just looks like a glock with bigger grip-space. If I'm going full-tupperware, I might as well get a G26 or G19 and just get a commonality of parts/support that's unmatched.
Only shitty thing about this one is that it's in .40 Short N Weak
Kahrs suck in my experience becuase theyre so tiny, you can learn to shoot one the same way you can learn to shoot a .38 snubnose
if you have experience they arnet so bad, if youre new to guns yore making it harder for yourself. If youre set on DAO I recommend any full sized smith and wesson or Sig Sauer, the weight helps you balance the heavy trigger
True, but, if I gotta lug something around on a daily basis - I'm looking for G26 sized, not battleship sized. The 59XX lines seem awfully big, no?
Something the size of the M&P 9c (1.0) would be perfect.
>the k9 is steel and is more my thing but it's the size of a dictionary.
kahrs are known for being slim and small, if you think thats dictionary sized Ive got some bad news for you
>(tough for the prosecution to argue that you'd cocked a "hair trigger
stop listening to fudds, that hasnt ever gotten somebody convicted and if some shitheel lawyer tries to argue it he'll be laughed out of court. IIRC this rumor started because of a cop shooting a suspect and LEOs are notorious for fucking with service weapon trigger weights for legal reasons. Know your states self defense laws and dont act like billy the kid and you'll be fine with anything
>Still, I've heard good things about the DAK trigger.
youve been lied to, DAK is hands down (lel) the worst trigger ive ever shot. Its all the worst combinations of all actions types thrown into one and you'll probably have an accidental discharge if you dont train with it exclusively. My brother got a DAK sig p226 for literally 200 dollars, thought he scammed the poor bastard who sold it to him and then we shot it. He still cant sell the fucking thing, its like a cure in his gun cabinet
look at any DA/SA platform, most will have a DAO variant in some models. Also check out DAO revolvers. Have you shot or even carried before? I wouldnt recommend a Tiny DAO as youre first, you certainly could use it but there are better options
it is big, but DAO pistols arent as prevalent anymore so youre options are limited. There are compact sized single stack models like , but trust me, if youre set on DAO dont start small. You can work your way down to a Kahr or .38 snubnose if you want something easier to carry. And Kahrs arent even that big, back in the 90s before companies made all the sweet little specifically designated CCWs they were one of the only ones doing it, theyre known for being slim, concealable and easy to carry
I'm a wheelygat man born and bred, so I know my way around them. That's why I'm trying to stick to DAO because it's what I've been trained on.
I was told that the DAO looks better for the courts from a cop teaching our gun safety class. Hmmmmm. Seems fudd-lore-ish...
It's my first carry gun but not the first time I've shot handguns/semi-autos. I'm looking for something around the size of an M&P compact but that's Steel. Yes yes, heavier = harder to carry each day, but, I like the recoil reduction of a heavier firearm. Especially if it makes shooting my CCW piece enjoyable instead of "ugh".
you can adapt trigger weights on most pistols user. Get something like a glock 19/26 and ask them to make the trigger heavier for you if thats your thing.
I have tried so many Glocks user, and I just despise how they feel in my hand. It's kind of like eating something with a weird texture. You're just like ugh, and make a face. I know it's a small thing but if I'm going to lug this thing around and train on it - I want to be excited by it instead of annoyed/grossed out.
that is incredibly fudd-ish so disregard that. Make sure youre brushed up on your local self defense laws and dont act like a dumbass with your gun, worst case scenario if you have to use it repeat the following
>I felt my life was in danger so I shot to stop the threat. I would like to speak with my lawyer
and nothing else. Have you considered DA/SA? Have the first shot be a heavy DA as a safety and anything after that is rock and roll. If you dont like glocks, do you like other similar platofrms? I find the M@Ps to be more aesthetically pleasing then the glocks, theres also the sig p320, walthers, or HK VP9. All of which you can adjust the trigger to be heavier if you find the right gunsmith. Theres not many DAO platforms anymore to fill the niche youre looking for, theyre all going to be mostly huge or heard to find
it's not so much about the aesthetics, but, I liked the grip angle for the M&P - I just didn't like it.
And, what's fuddish - the idea that heavy guns absorb recoil better? That's just something I've experienced (albeit - that's an anecdote/not a measured experiment).
I have tried DA/SA but BOY did I not like it - I figured it could be learnable, but, that it would take a LONG time to learn how to use.
I didn't like the grip angle of the Glock - Not "I just didn't like it". Sorry.
what the cop said about a hair trigger asking your case harder in court to defend. Granted, a slimy lawyer might try to said something to that effect but just to draw up some points against you, you cant base a case on something that trivial alone.
>your honor, the clients gun was SUPER DUPER sensitive and thats why he shot the guy who was trying to stab his butt in a back alley for his wallet. Hes a loose canon your honor
just make sure if you have to shoot you are within your legal rights and only doing so if your life is in danger, then shut the fuck up and ask for a lawyer.
And a heavier gun will absorb recoil better. I believe the push within the past decade for ccw's and lighter service weapons have driven manufacturers to make smaller and smaller guns, and those type of guns are easier to shoot with softer triggers. Smaller guns are being made, and suddenly DAO and DA/SA for that matter are starting to become less prevalent. Coincidence? For example pic related, the dozens oif "new" gloci models that were released this past year or the sig p365, almost everything now is striker fired and designated for carrying. .38 snubnoses are exempt for this because of that same fudd mindset that revolvers are idiot proof and simple so theyre a great beginner gun, when in reality theyre very difficult to learn on. Still, I see some old boomer in a gun store push a airweight j frame on some poor bitch cause "the little lady needs a purse gun and cant handle anything else" Boomers like the one you talked to are making this hobby and life style more challenging every year
Seriously, my P-01with the Reach Reduction Kit is damn close to a fine tuned DA revolver pull. It is a very smooth 1/2" pull and a 1/8" reset to the SA. If you can't find a CZ 99941 steel P-01 or steel CZ75 Compact, look for a TriStar P100.
They can be had for less than $400 and have a 15 round magazine.
The T100 C100 are alloy frame .
A bunch of steel 941 FC Jericho surplus guns are on Gunbroker now. Those are full size grip but compact slide configurations.
Switching among my EDC guns makes sight radius differences very apparent. Sight picture has to be near perfect on the Subcompact at 15 yards to get hits on my 5 inch plate and it slows you down. 8 inch plates at 10 yards are still quickly acquired and hit with it if you keep a good firm grip.
Just realize the limitations of a small frame gun.
>I can use for everything from CCW to competition etc
>I'm looking for G26 sized, not battleship sized
>>I have tried so many Glocks user, and I just despise how they feel in my hand
youre trying to fill too many niches here,while also shooting down the only options were giving you, friendo. The best option for you would literally be a glock with a 10lb trigger, but if youre so against that the next thing I could possibly suggest would be a Kahr like in your pic. Trust me they arent huge, but you dont want to shoot competition with one. If you want a tiny DAO carry gun, then buy one, if you want a competition gun, a home defense gun and a range toy then you need to buy those separately
You know what, I think you're right. I was being too unreasonable re: size. I'll try to see if I can rent one of those K9s and see if they're about the right size. I guess I was being unreasonable.
I'll take a look into them, and thanks for the reccos - I'll see if I can rent a few and shoot 'em.
My apologies for being so rigid in my thinking, and thank you for the guidance.
CONCUR.
Get a carry gun and a fun gun.
Longer sight radius and full size grip makes faster shots at longer distances much easier.
For home protection go with a full size gun and give yourself that extra advantage.
On the street, taking a long distance shot could be an indicator that you had a chance to escape and weren't in mortal danger.
My personal comfort zone is ten yards if they have a handgun.
Further away and I am backing off to cover. If they have a rifle I am shooting just to supress and getting to hard cover. I can hit 12X20 steel at 25 yards consistently with any of my guns but that will not be a quick draw while moving.
>My personal comfort zone is ten yards if they have a handgun.
Dude, wut? I'm shooting at you in the middle of the street from a 1st down and change, and you aren't lighting me the fuck up?
>first angle projection
Absolutely disgusting
I rescind this. I'm probably not good enough to hit you at a full on lateral sprint at 10y.
Yet.
>Boomers like the one you talked to are making this hobby and life style more challenging every year
THIS, so much this. To make matters worse they think theyre helping but theyre too stubborn to admit they need to be moved out to pasture. Theres a boomer gun store in my town and the clerk is the most cantankerous old guy ever, all he pushes on people are revolvers and 1911s and maybe the glock 17. He knows fuck all about other pistols and shrugs when you ask about them. Thankfully his son is better and helped me get a walther p99 while his dad rolled his eyes and fiddled with a browning hi power. I cant understand how that place hasnt gone under
I've grabbed one of these and absolutely 100% didn't like the ergos. Fatter than the other single stacks but still had that "crank your hand" kind of angle to it from being an ultra CCW piece.
not at all a fan.
Smith and Wesson 6906 A L U M I N U M
Based Autoloaders
Try not to do TDA, but, I might have to give it a go.
>DAO is better legally in my current state (tough for the prosecution to argue that you'd cocked a "hair trigger)
Name a single court case in the entire history of the US where this causes the defendant to lose.
OP. I bought a kahr for the same reason with the same intent. Save yourself some money and dont. One gun can't do it all, especially one with a long trigger pull. I eventually sold it and got a g34 for competition and a g43 for ccw. Save yourself the trouble and do something similar. DAO and steel frames are considered obsolete for good reasons, parts are expensive and hard to find, and you will develop bad habits learning to shoot on one.