I like the idea of the P90. But i dislike it's production cost and complexity

>complexity
You want to know how I know you've never held a P90?

It operates on the most simple of principles, the magazines are stupid simple and reliable, and its hammer pack is a smaller AUG pack for all intents and purposes.

>making the gun so long for so little barrel length
Why? Why not just flip the magazine around? You don't even have to bullpup it. Just... why?

Its an MP40-style action, so the receiver is going to be that size regardless to accommodate bolt movement. Evidently Hill liked rifle ergos, so that was the logical setup he went with. Given this was the same decade as the Uzi, perhaps these decisions are what led to it being a failure.

Its not complex, its just niche and doesn't have economies of scale or enough interest to make it worth making cheaper. If they had the same demand as glocks do, the price would come far down.
The most complex part about them is the magazine - with its dummy cartridge/roller follower things and the feedramp. Everything else is simple as can be.
Shame .22TCM is tapered, I'd love a conversion kit for the PS90

I bought a KelTec RDB to fall for the bullpup meme. Down ejects like P90 but uses 5.56. Nothing special but I genuinely enjoy it. I got the RDB-C fwiw.

280 rounds instead of 50

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typo 180 rounds

>complexity
What complexity? The P90 is actually retard simple.

Have you ever drank piss?

maybe something with a similar round or the same round that MP7 uses. MP7 was a reply to FN's P90 And it has the same idea behind it and is used in same situations so if you can get the H&K 97 (civilian MP7) then I would go for it. It's a pretty nice weapon to have in a car. If you don't care about penetration then I would go for the AM180 or something similar, it's fun and cheap to shoot. If you manage to get your hands on an automatic variant then you have 100 times the fun.

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I just got the RFB yesterday

>inb4 mp7

Literally everything FN offered in the PDW competition was better
in pretty much every way. The P90 was more accurate, more control
lable, had a higher rate of fire, had a vastly larger magazine
in a smaller package, was much simpler, and fired a harder-
hitting round.

And the Five-Seven? Oh, well, one of the requirements was to have
a companion handgun alongside the SMG, and the stupid clueless
fucks at H&K not only didn't have one developed, but twenty years
later and... nope, still no 4.6mm handgun. So FN offered a
handgun and H&K said "here's a stick, the only limit is your
imagination! Pew pew!"

Then those miserable shits and abject failures of the defense
industry decided to sabotage every NATO member by throwing a
tantrum because they weren't going to win and vetoed the adoption
of the 5.7mm round... probably largely because they're an
irrelevant gun company these days that produces nothing anybody
wants.

Should've kicked them out of NATO for that one.

No really what is their most recent successful gun they sold
worldwide? The HK416. Guess how much of the HK416 they actually
developed? Fucking zero. Obviously it's clearly an M4 knockoff,
but they didn't even make the piston system, goddamn Armalite
did. Good job H&K, you can't even make your own guns anymore.
No wonder the German government had to give them a $30 million
grant to keep them afloat. Oh hey and good job scamming several
countries with a gun that literally fucking melts.

>a ~1.5k gun is completely out of his grasp
Like user you have the rest of your life to save for it.

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For what it is, I'd argue there really isn't a better gun in the PDW market at this exact moment that beats the P90.

It's small, very controllable, accurate, comfortable, and while reloading it takes a little getting used to, it's not at all bad.

The cost is the only real deterrent, and even that isn't outlandish. From $1200-1500, which is comparable to getting a new gaming computer. If gaming is your hobby, you'd justify spending the money. So if guns are your hobby, you can justify spending the money.

My advice though, see if you can find a range that has one to rent, and try it out.

I was very fortunate to find one at a gun show, and was able to fingerfuck the shit out of it, dispelling almost all of my misconceptions about it. Then, I found out the booth was a range that was fairly close to me, so I went out and was able to rent and shoot it. It was fantastic.

I think that the p90 in full auto would be exactly how you described it, if it was legal. The cartridge really neuters it in semi auto, to the point where a 9mm """pistol""" with a brace like a Rattler or mp5 clone would be better for civvie use. You dont have the body armor piercing capability without special rounds, but I dont think that is a realistic threat imo.

The mp7 is better. Smaller, easier to carry non-unicorn mags, easier reloading, can be carried in a leg holster, doesn't need a pistol because it was meant for antiterrorist/antiruskie stuff and anywhere you can carry a pistol as big as the 5.7 you can carry a full on MP7

>didn't develope the 416
Yes they did. The concepts weren't original but every modern Western service rifle is a direct descendant of some Armalite pattern gun, or a combination of Armalite ideas.
>G36 melt meme
It was never meant to sustain the rate of fire it underwent. It began to have wondering zero issues when the M16 would have blown a gas tube.

>non-unicorn mags
The Mp7 mags are just as proprietary.
>anywhere you can carry a pistol as big as the 5.7
The Mp7 with the stock folded is literally twice the length as the five seven, thicker and 3 times heavier. It is by no means a pistol nor can it be used like one. It is what it is, a PDW.

H&K develiped a 4,6mm30 pistol alongside the MP7 (called the UCP), but it was agreed that it wasn't needed as long as you have an MP7.

Why use a rather short-range semi-auto weapon when you can have a small SMG with nearly AR-performance? The 4,6mm x 30 overpenetration doesn't have the manstop capabilities of bigger or slower ammo as it simply travels through the target so you NEED a high RoF.

Awesome! I'm thinking of getting one of those too one day since I'm enjoying the RDB-C so much. The RFB reminds me of the FS2000 which is another bullpup I think is cool af. One of the things the FS2000 has over both is the toilet seat chamber check. Having to flip the RDB upside down to check isn't the best and it's hard to see in low light because it's so recessed.

complexity??
its stupid simple in operation.

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>just as proprietary
But they fit into standard subgun mag pouches and aren't two feet long/ wider than rifle mags. Try carrying a p90 mag on your belt or chest rig sometime, it sucks.

>bigger than a pistol
Yes it is, but there is literally nowhere you can OC a 5.7 where you cant OC an MP7.

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Dont get me wrong, the P90 is a fantastic gun, but it is still fundamentally a longarm, and a weird one at that. The MP7 bridges the gap between submachinegun and sidearm, making it vastly more useful than either. Like the VZ63, but better.

Production cost is a viable criticism of any relatively uncommon gun but that's not got to do with the fundamental complexity of the P90, it's actually a very mechanically simple gun. For a gun with a somewhat exotic mag and feed system and in a somewhat less common round it's actually quite affordable at $1200.

Based yeahposter

Buy a Glock 20 (10mm) and put it inside an MCK.

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Yep...

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Get back to work, Tim.

CZ scorpion micro

HERA CBR? Similar ergonomics to a p90 or f2000, but the reliability of an ar-15, and cheaper mags and ammo.

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CQR sorry

kek

>p90
>complex
Do you even know what a p90 is

same fag. but based announcer of based yeah poster

My coworkers father won a p90 just by purchasing a 10$ raffle ticket. Maybe you'll get lucky someday eh?

I don't... what?
how the fuck is the forward magazine supposed to feed into the chamber?

There is nothing wrong with the p90 you asshat. If it were any cheaper, it'd be garbage, if it were any simpler, it'd be semi-auto.

It's a spare you mong

pic related
>5.8x21 chinese has similar balistics to 5.7mm
>high cap (helical mag)
>bullpup (feeds behind trigger)
>polymer
kinda like a p90, probably cheaper but not as well performing since chinese guns designed after the 80s are notoriously imprecise.

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>chinesium calico knockoff
no thanks.

Why aren't there more magazines that use this style of feedinig? I have never heard the P90 called unreliable, the mechanism clearly works.
A mag this style in 5.56mm seems like a cool idea.

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>Explaining what a bullpup is on Jow Forums

Do you really have to unmount the forward grip just to open up the weapon? If so that is fucking retarded.

Spare mag works as a handy grip as well.

and what happens when you remove the mag so you can use it?

Then you just grip it like a traditional rifle grip with your hand cupping under it. Or you could swap the empty mag to the grip position if time allowed.

Or you could just not bother with the plastic piece of garbage and use the god damn gun the way it was designed.

>When you don't understand the difference between two and three points of contact
Triangles stronk

enjoy your barbie accessories, you weekend warrior. maybe your husband can pick you up some matching bra and panties.

imagine having only one brain cell

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its a double barrel ffs

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oh also forgot, it feeds from BOTH a helical magazine on top AND a stick mag in the grip (from the type 92 pistol)

pretty cool

>width of the gun
>given how intricate the mechanism is, some parts might needs to be made thicker to support more pressure from a hotter round, which might not be practical (weight, size, etc)

Having a sto...excuse me, "wrist brace", on a gun makes a massive difference in accuracy. I shoot better groups with my wrist braced CZ scorpion at 25 yards than I shoot with my 9mm pistol at 10 yards.

what gun??

nevermind im a fuckin idiot

>production cost and complexity.
it costs like $1200 and is completely plastic you retard. you probably still don't understand how it's possible for a spork to be both two different things at the same time

someone say cheaper?

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I'm going to use that insult frequently

If your gaming computer is only 1500, you need a better summer job.

It isn't that expensive.

I built a $500 gaming pc to solely play cracked games and shitpost. Works great. My main machine was 2k and it gathers dust.

Play better games.

I love this rant

"They're for prison guards! Great for raining hell on mobs of unarmored, thinly clothed targets!"