Lets talk Territorial air space and waters

OR
its a show put on by the USA to put on an attempt to drive up oil prices so that the sauds can sell more barrels at a lower price

Iran announced shooting down the drone, and they're obviously the ones who planted those mines on the ships.

Never forget
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655

But we can laugh at the reports that they were torpedoes though right. Thats what the media was reporting for like 2 days until they change their tune and removed their heads from their asses.

Iran claims that this thing was in their airspace.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655
>In 1996, the governments of the United States and Iran reached a settlement at the International Court of Justice which included the statement "...the United States recognized the aerial incident of 3 July 1988 as a terrible human tragedy and expressed deep regret over the loss of lives caused by the incident..."[13] As part of the settlement, even though the U.S. government did not admit legal liability or formally apologize to Iran, it still agreed to pay US$61.8 million on an ex gratia basis, amounting to $213,103.45 per passenger, in compensation to the families of the Iranian victims.
Seems like a reasonable enough response. It was pretty clearly a legitimate mistake.

>the U.S. government did not admit legal liability or formally apologize to Iran

It was US error.
>tomcats come from there!
>fire on the comparatively slow moving aircraft that's climbing in the civilian flight corridor using the right channels

does anyone know what was used to shoot the drone down?

Actually higher price per barrel benefits the US because it makes shale oil financially viable. Which America has an absolute metric fuckton of.

If you think they were torps, you need to look at the pictures of the impact points and the mark from the one that failed to detonate properly (which was recovered by the Iranians on video). That's clearly a mine.

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>>fire on the comparatively slow moving aircraft that's climbing in the civilian flight corridor using the right channels
This of course could never been done by a military machine trying to look like a civilian one, right? Thinking for 2 seconds is too inconvenient.

It was clearly a fuck up, but I think it also came right after an incident where the Iraqis fired an AShM at a US frigate using a Gulfstream.

>Thinking for 2 seconds is too inconvenient.
Just like checking the civilian air comm channels the US had everyone change to just before?

An indirect apology and paying the victims is more than rus did for their shootdown(s, plural over the years) vlad

The navy had an automated defense system active and crew were jittery after an AshM attack happened recently. it was a fuckup but its not like it happened completely out of the blew

They were also engaging with Iranian gun boats at the time. The US was at fault, but it's pretty obvious that no one on board wanted to shoot down a civilian aircraft for shits and giggles.

>W-w-whut about russha??!
Thank you for your comment, half a cheeseburger has been deposited into your account.

Considering the fact that 3 Russians and a Ukranian were just formally charged the other day in the most recent incident, it's fairly topical.

>The U.S. government issued notes of regret for the loss of human lives, but never formally apologized or acknowledged wrongdoing
That certainly sounds like an apology.
>paid for victims more than Russia blah
Look Hillary, the UN was clamoring to call what happened in Ukraine a war crime.
The US did it and paid a little over $200,000 a passenger.
Project all you want, was still a US fuck up and in Iranian territory.

>en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran_Air_Flight_655
I bet everyone on the ship had a good laugh when the SAM had a confirmed hit

Probably, since they assumed it was an enemy aircraft.

Vodka chugging whataboutists always clamor that anything less than a formal apology doesn't count. Related, it's fucking /always/ vladavisti who bring up the Iran Air shootdown first, which is then parroted by r*ddit tankies.

>Let's just ignore the independent accounts.

>anything less than a formal apology doesn't count
Which is always ironic coming from a country like Russia.

Russians being characteristically retarded doesn't excuse us

This is what Jow Forums has come to.
>russia
>but russia
>no apology is an apology
>russia
>reddit!

True. However, that whole incident was clearly a mistake, and citing it isn't particularly relevant to the current situation.

Are things kicking off?

Nope. Trump sees it as an accident apparently.

Not yet, at least. Wouldn't be surprised if the US will wait till there's more international support before moving. The Germans and the Brits have finally accepted that the Iranians are at fault, and it looks like India is sending its own naval forces to protect their shipping.

It's an interesting way of giving them a path to deescalate, but I doubt that he really believes that. He's not that dumb.

I guess i should say...i don't know what to think because I can't trust ANY media platforms that are in bed with the parties of interest.

Skepticism is a valid position right now.

Fuck no. It might have been before Iran started openly attacking US assets.

Well, I made a folder for Bolton's mustache last night and I've already got a dozen different versions

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Well, at the end of the day, at least Merkel, May, and Trump are all on board with the idea that Iran is responsible. Considering how little oil importers have to gain from a war in the region, the fact that they're convinced makes me suspect that there's something to it. On top of that, the US has presented evidence that Iran was responsible, while the Iranians have done nothing but claim it was a false flag with nothing to back it up.

(((Iran))) right? Like those "limpet mines." Fuck getting into ANOTHER war.

>I made a folder for Bolton's mustache last night
A man after my own heart.

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>Like those "limpet mines."
Exactly. So, Iran acting aggressively and attacking things.

Bombs away!

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No but if Iran keeps plinking drones in international waters it might.

Yes Iran. The Iran that just said they shot down a drone.

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Short of a direct attack by Iran on U.S. military personnel or civilians with more than a couple dozen causalities there is no political capital/will in Washington for a war against Iran. If there was there is certainly not enough for a regime change. If anything it would look like Iraq 1 not OIF or OEF.
That being said with the recent announcement that Iran is going to start low grade uranium enrichment again the old multi-lateral sanctions will likely return.
(((They))) are likely not behind this. Internally Israel is too much of a mess and a new war in the Middle East would be a detriment to all the majors political actors as it would bring a lot of uncomfortable political issues to a head.

Except the struck Japanese boat's crew says that's bullshit. Germany is just sucking US off.

>If anything it would look like Iraq 1 not OIF or OEF
This. Not that it'll end well in the long term, but most people pushing for intervention seem to primarily want to destroy Iran's capability to make war, not dismantle the state.

>Germany is just sucking US off.
Yeah, because they're so well known for supporting the US in its many foreign wars. Also, the only info from the Japanese crew is that one of them thought they saw a projectile. Meanwhile, there's video of the Iranians removing a mine, and the damage done to the tankers is pretty consistent with America's version of events.

her globalist masters subjected her to the german anthem to great effect youtube.com/watch?v=URUqqNdGXNo

>not dismantle the state
Not Mr Mustache at least.
theintercept.com/2018/03/23/heres-john-bolton-promising-regime-change-iran-end-2018/

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twitter.com/AmichaiStein1/status/1141762136869392385

>Meanwhile, there's video of the Iranians removing a mine,

You mean those same Iranians which claim bullshit on the US assessment are also happily filming themselves setting bombs off for fun and jiggles?
You should really call up your local Marine recruiter, you'd fit right in.

>Deustchland Uber Alles
Huh, for some reason, I assumed they'd changed anthems after the whole incident in the 40's.

>You mean those same Iranians which claim bullshit on the US assessment
Yeah, they have a history of lying.

kek, looks like Trump can't pretend it was a mistake at this point. Hopefully, this is enough to get the US to respond in kind.

Bolton has been on about a regime change since 2013 but he lacks the political capital and influence to get a regime change going short of another 9/11. Everyone, especially the military, would stonewall the fuck out a regime change. There is also the fact that even with another 9/11 a regime change style war would lose Trump 2020.
Terrible idea.

Here we go lads, it's happening for real this time

Iran said they shot it down though?

Why should the US allow Iran to get away with attacking civillian shipping and shooting down its air assets?

Yeah, but the "muh false flag" crowd are intent on believing Iran dindu nuffin.

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>Here's us shooting it down over international waters
Are they ACTUALLY retarded?

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This is the really big thing here. This course of action is making the US look weak and indecisive. I understand why Trump doesn't want to get involved, but over his entire presidency so far he's given other nations a free pass to do whatever they like.

Say what you will about US interventionist behaviour, at least that set them up as a strong nation willing to fight. Right now I don't know what the US is. I certainly don't know what the point of their bloated military is.

It took you this long to realise?

Please give us Kosovo 2.0, I want our F-22s to get a chance to flex their dicks.

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The Japanese crew said they saw something flying towards the ship before the explosion, so that suggests a missile or rocket.
Other tankers that were attacked seemed to be hit by mines, as well as the video of an undetonated one being removed.
Now this drone shootdown.

All a part of the trend of Iran trying to control the Strait or Hormuz and show in a few ways that their past threats were not just words.
It's not some false-flag by the US or plot by Israel, it's Iranians doing what they said they would because the Revolutionary Guard is feeling pressured and trying to assert itself. Which if things do keep escalating then it will end with Operation Praying Mantis II.

the modern german anthem only uses the 3rd verse, which doesn't include any of the national pride or territorial claims (sadly) but rather talks of brotherhood and peace. russia also kept their very beautiful anthem after the fall of the soviet union, but doesn't use any lyrics at all

They cannot be blamed for defending their airspace you dumb mutt.

The Houthis are going hard against Saudi Arabia right now too. Shit's getting spicy.

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The IRGC is likely trying to posture as much as possible without going far enough to invite a justifiable response from the US. Had they been able to successfully obscure their hand in the tanker attacks, it might've worked, but with the Germans admitting that they believe Iran is responsible, their main way of preventing war has disappeared. If they keep acting like this, the US is going to have to respond.

Yeah it would be nice to see them shot down in great numbers and americans crying like little pussies over it.

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A) its not our shipping B) escalation in the region will likely decrease our security over the long term C) refocusing on the Middle East and low intensity warfare allows more time for near-peer competitors to close the gap and challenge us in more important regions D) this is an excellent time to test deescalation tactics and (this is going to be a huge buzzword) asymmetric threat reduction tactics that do not involve military forces in preparation for use against near peer competitors.

>drone shot down
>drone
>shot
>down
Presumably with a weapon

They hit a civilian airport with a Scud the other day. I'd imagine the Houthis are wanting to drag Iran more deeply into this, thinking it'll lead to them getting more support against the Saudis.

>its not our shipping
True, but Japan is effectively a US protectorate when it comes to attacks by foreign militaries.

Yeah I get the feeling they're being opportunist, but still it's important given everything else.

Could also be that they WERE hit by a houthi atgm or something if the mines didnt go off. In the 80s they had mines not go boom

>John Kerry visits iran
>Iran immediately starts shit
Gosh it’s almost like dems are trying to influence an upcoming election

>Japan is effectively a US protectorate

The oil industry in general is a US protectorate

The thing is, both sides agree on shooting down a spy drone. Which is all fine and all if it gets into your airspace.
The thing is simple. US, hoping third time's the charm, claims the drone was not in Iranian air-space. Iran claims it was.

Using some elementary logic, a fucking spy drone does not randomly fly over the middle of nowhere. It's not a migratory bird, despite what the futty pics may imply, it's something that's supposed to violate someone's airspace and get out before anyone notices. Iran says they've noticed it, US doesn't even bother saying what the fucking spy drone was doing, just that Iran is full of shit, apparently.

It's absolutely fucking embarassing. Just claim they have some wunderbar weapon hidden in there and you need to attack them to save the world. Not like the army ever needed a reason to attack someone. What's UN gonna do?

That's what happens when you're the primary global naval power. Maintaining freedom of navigation for international trade is like 90% of the US Navy's job.

Doesn't Iran claim 25 miles against the international standard of 15 or 20? I know there are parts of the straights where both Oman and Iran claim to have aeronautical jurisdiction.

>it's something that's supposed to violate someone's airspace and get out before anyone notices
No it's not. Have you even seen what a Global Hawk looks like? It's not designed as a low-observable or survivable platform. Their general MO is to fly in international airspace and use their high powered sensors to track targets from there.

Honestly bizarre. Haven't seen any medfags give opinions, I wonder what she was doing the tuna for.

Iran claims a lot of things. That doesn't make them legitimate.

The lines Deutschland Uber Alles is in the first stanza, you arent allowed to sing that stanza after the whole "incident in the 40s"

Only really when it comes to the Pacific. Japan's relationship with Europe and the Middle East is not really important to us. This would be very different if it was an Indonesian attack on Japanese ships.
But the how in maintaining freedom of navigation is what is important here.
You can claim all you want but everyone respects the international norms.

*whom

Yeah, and that twitter video Clearly shows it in international airspace.

Without knowing *exactly* where the shootdown happened this is all a Jeb sized mess.

I don’t think you understand the role of ISR drones

You DO realize RQs and MQs have the radar signatures of mid-size airplanes, right? Nothing about them is stealth. And they aren't and were never intended to operate IN hostile airspace. They preform their operations scraping borders. In Iran's case, they are perfectly capable of covering in-land targets well into Iran's coast still over open ocean.

Who's ready for Bolton's Folly?

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