This isn't a political or events thread, just a hypothetical scenario: in a land invasion of Iran by the USA...

This isn't a political or events thread, just a hypothetical scenario: in a land invasion of Iran by the USA, who would fare better? The American or Iranian armed forces?

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Iraq 2 with more losses. That is their AA and ground forces would likely put up a better fight than Iraq but still lose, then we have the same situation where the US military is reused as a police force as they we’re in Iraq and Afghanistan amd we take tens of losses each month until we leave and another ISIS takes the US installed goverment’s place

You must be too young to remember both gulf wars. Iran would get it’s conventional forces’ shit pushed in within 100 days. After that the politicians and media will encourage unwinable ROE.

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USA would absolutely crush Iran, but it would cost them in terms of blood, treasure, and have certain political ramifications. it would also take a lot longer than most people imagine. remember when we went into Iraq in 2003 and thought we'd be out of there in under a year? It's 2019 and we are still there.

the (((defense industry))) and (((banks)))

How does modern technology for the USA factor in? The USA has advanced in technology at a faster pace than Iran has since the gulf war.

Yes, for example the air/sea offensive would be completely decided within a few hours.

Iranians would wreck the shit out of niggerspics.

>How does modern technology for the USA factor in?

a lot, just as it always has. It's the whole reason that the USA will crush Iran. the USA can blown up half of Iran in an afternoon if it wanted to using cruise missiles. remember when the USA hit Syria recently? the missiles passed right through the anti-air defenses as if they weren't even there. nobody in the world can shoot down as many cruise missiles as the USA can launch at Iran, probably not even the USA.

Air and Sea would be over in a week tops, the land war would drag on for several months because Iranian territory is fucking aids. The occupation would suck ass though, literally GWOT 2.0

Will the U.S Navy finally have a battle since world war 2? I know we would win but I want to see the Big Navy realize they are too retarded and underequiped when fighting something that isn't canoe third worlders

>That is their AA and ground forces would likely put up a better fight than Iraq but still lose
This deserves expansion, because Iran isn't run by a single lunatic dictator. They've had a couple decades to look at how the US thinks invasion and occupation work.

They were the ones supplying IED components to Iraqi insurgents. They have criminal/terrorist networks that cover Europe and the Americas. Gonna be great for moral when an airliner full of US troops at the end of deployment gets blown up.

The geography is entirely different and what most people would describe as 'extremely defensible'. They'd bleed the US in the initial invasion and keep doing it just as hard for the entire occupation. Relatively, they would fare better, because the US can't stand the sort of casualties and covert actions that would occur.

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>retarded and underequipped to fight Iran
What? We pushed the Iranian navy's shit in in the 80s and their shit hasn't gotten better since then

Big Navy is too big for their retardation to matter in the near future unless we fight aliums.

It seems like the Iranian armed forces have gotten worse since the Iraq-Iran War and Operation Praying Mantis.
They have neither the quality or quantity to repel an American invasion. At worst they could cause some casualties in a battle at sea, before quickly being shutdown by the USN.
The only real worry would be how the Iranian people respond in the aftermath of the major fighting. The common person may not be the biggest fan of the Islamist rule, but they would also be highly opposed to a foreign occupation and so there could be insurgencies. At least Iran, unlike Iraq, has a Republic government that isn't just an extension of a supreme leader.

I know we would push their shit in but since then the navy has had a bloated ego that hasn't been challenged and would make interesting war entertainment

Theres zero reason to believe we'd fair worse than we did back then today. Hell, maybe we'll do better and not oopsie an airliner this time

>in a land invasion of Iran by the USA
HOW? Do you have a fucking map? Where the fuck would US invade Iran from?!?!

Staging in Iraq or SA.

Iraq or Afghanistan

This is a good explanation.

Iraq, Afghanistan, Persian Gulf, Gulf of Oman

btw, look at a fucking map. how the fuck do you invade Afghanistan? and yet, we did. lmfao faggot european piece of nigger shit.

>Staging in Iraq or SA.
Iraq is overrun by Iranians you dumb fuck! And KSA does not share a border with Iran.
>Afghanistan
>Afghanistan
Talebs and Iranian sympathizers control all that border region.

Not really. US tech on the whole is quite above Iran, one being a great power and the other being a secondary power. However, Iran has advanced far more rapidly by comparison. They were considered a fairly backward nation that couldn't beat Iraq (whose army was outdated even by 80s standards) but their threat came from being the USSR's closest non-Pact ally, similar to North Korea and China. Nowadays however Iran has a very modernized, professional military with modernized import armor, domestic tanks of decent quality, and the largest missile defense and rocket battery systems of any non-Security Council power.

The US was fighting an extremely outdated army back then that was still using original T-55 tanks and T-72s that were never upgraded and were crappy Chinese knockoffs to begin with, with a mostly conscript army and no air power. I'm not saying Iran would necessarily win but it'd be far more difficult than fighting Iraq. That's also assuming the US gets a coalition together. On its own it'd be even more difficult to establish a foothold and conduct a punitive occupation.

The tech divide between Iran and the USA is much, much smaller than between Iraq and the Coalition was. It's more equivalent to, say, the USA vs NVA. They're on par if not stronger than India and Pakistan, two other prominent secondary powers.

They also still are Russia's closest military ally and are supported considerably by China.

>oh hey the US wants to invade
>let's just put arms caches FUCKING EVERYWHERE
>conventional forces delay long enough to embed IRGC officers in every single community in the country

Tadah, you now have well-equipped partisans everywhere in a mountainous country. Bonus points if they turn out to have a chemical weapons program.

They've got a lot of coast line and we've got an entire branch who's shtick is amphibious invasions

>Persian Gulf, Gulf of Oman
do you know the meaning of "gulf"? do you understand how many ships it would need to invade and how easily they could be taken out with missiles, subs, boats etc?

This thread is CHOCK FULL of some of the dumbest shit I've ever read on Jow Forums.

Do YOU have a fucking map is the better question. How about one of those two shit holes we've been bombing from almost 20 years now. Just a guess though.

>I'm not saying Iran would necessarily win but it'd be far more difficult than fighting Iraq

well of course, I wouldn't disagree with that at all. especially when you consider the state of Iraq's military in 2003 - they basically just gave up the second they saw us coming, whereas Iran will probably fight for every inch.

>how easily they could be taken out by boats, missiles, subs?
Based on Praying Mantis, not easily.

Amphibious assault.

and never won and are suing for peace with the Taliban.

You tards think you're going to stage in sympathetic countries and invade into mountains against people who have been watching the US fight insurgency for 20 years? If the neocons get their way, I'll weep for our soldiers.

what are you even trying to say here? that it's impossible for the US to move troops and supplies into Iran from a boat? that doesn't make any sense. we have boats, we have landing craft, we have helicopters. it would be trivial to move things from the water to the land. read a book and please do not bother the adults while they are talking.

No, you're just an idiot.

calling me names without providing any plan just shows how butthurt and stupid you are.
if you're gonna reply, at least provide a land path to Iran from US bases in the region.
dude, amphibian invasion would easily cost 50,000 US lives. and even then, it'd be a turkey shoot when they landed since they wouldn't have much of armor.

>and never won and are suing for peace with the Taliban.

sure, but the question was "how do you, logistically, invade?" not "how do you win the war"

keep up with the discussion actually being had here rather than inventing things to disagree with. you and I do not disagree at all, you've just misread what I wrote because you wanted to argue with somebody.

31 years is a long ass time.

>amphibian invasion would easily cost 50,000 US lives

haha what the fuck. even D-Day only cost us seven thousand.

do you even understand WHEN amphibious assaults are carried out? jesus fuck... go download one of the army FM manuals.

The way the IRGC operates, they would probably begin executing Iranians for refusing to fight. Which would in turn lead to guerillas fighting against the IRGC if they cracked down too hard.

How hard do you think crayon eaters will cum just thinking about this

This. Iran inherited the USSR's partisanal defense doctrines. Basically, in the advent of invasion by any foreign power the USSR's chief focus was to arm its population and conduct guerrilla wars against the invader. "People's Front" I believe is what they called the tactic. China and North Korea adopted it too, but the USSR was the master of it, having several hundred thousand irregular but highly-trained units that would be inserted in an invasion among the local populace, arm them, and launch attacks from all sides on the enemy in guerrilla fashion. Iran may not be a communist state but they adopted that tactic wholesale. Unconventional warfare is a considerably influential concept in their military structure.

Kill yourself
>in b4 hurt durrr mossad and Joo
Kill yourself again

MIC shills, war mongers, and corporate sluts, get fucked.
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kid, you're boring me. you don't offer anything to actually talk about, you just sling insults. stop replying to my posts, I'm not interested. I am having a great time replying to the other posters right now.

A lot and then they'll actually have to do it through beaches covered in mines.

yes, 7k but Germany was outstretched. Iranians are not. it would be so bad that draft would be immediately implemented.

>beaches

it's not WW2 anymore, we have these things called helicopters. they fly over the beaches. lol

Only because it was about a million troops sailing from a friendly major power a few hours to invade a coastline whose guards were outnumbered over 100-1 because 99% of their army was off in the bumfuck east fighting endless tides of Soviets.

Not only is there no real proper area for the US to stage an invasion with proper support and infrastructure, but Iran would be able to concentrate all of its power on the coast, which is already heavily fortified.

Maybe, I don't really know. Or maybe Iranians would have an issue being occupied by shitheads who have been trying to starve them out for nearly half a century.

I hope the Army cucks them out of it like d-day, the memes would be unreal

>Germany was outstretched. Iranians are not.

I hope you don't think I'm being rude here but I want to point out that there are a lot more differences than this between D-Day and an amphib assault on Iran

if we had on D-day the tech we have today, the bodycount would have been zero.

you even write like a plebbitard. go back to playing vidya games, kiddo.

>amphbious assault of thousands of troops.... without months of preparations
hahahah... jesus fuck that's hilarious.

this thread is filled with gaymers who can't even think of a viable invasion plan.

Look what a few jihadis with stinger missiles did to Soviet helicopters that NATO deemed vastly superior to what we had at the time.

Now imagine a professional army of jihadis with stinger missiles, SAMs, and the largest air defense network outside of the UN Security Council.

>but Iran would be able to concentrate all of its power on the coast, which is already heavily fortified.

so what? we can bomb that stuff.

do you remember desert storm? we bombed Iraq for like a month beforehand and obliterated 75% of their army from the air. we can do the same thing to Iran. it's not difficult to do this in 2019.

>without months of preparations

the only person who said this is you

I can personally envision three months of bombing and preparation before we even enter the gulf

Fuck you, I wanna try out the new Amphibious Combat Vehicles

Iraq had barely any air power and its armed forces were ~20 years out of date, having been obsolete even in the late 70s/early 80s.

Iran meanwhile has a huge AA defense grid and a modern airforce.

we can bomb their air defenses into bits. there are countermeasures against manpads. and once we make the initial penetrations we can mop up and continue to bring in more stuff by air. this is all textbook, boring, run of the mill stuff. Iran does not possess magic weapons that can stop us from doing these things. the best they have are upgraded versions of stuff we learned to deal with 60 years ago.

>calling me names

I wut m8?

>shows how butthurt and stupid you are.

You might want to get your reply buttons straight before calling other people stupid and butthurt, you retarded eurotrash redguard.

>if you're gonna reply, at least provide a land path to Iran from US bases in the region.

You mean like any of the ones in Iraq or Afghanistan that have already been pointed out to you multiple times already?

From the few people knowledgeable about the country that I've spoken to, Iran is very complex. The world as a whole knows the Islamist government but the actual nation (the republic's government) is fairly moderate and enjoys democracy. I don't think either side trying to force a war would appeal to many Iranians. They wouldn't want to be invaded by the US (and dogmatically, by Israel or Saudi Arabia) but they also wouldn't want to be forced to fight under threat of death from their "own" side.

good thing Iran has no idea what your tactics are.

>a modern airforce
hahahahaha what the fuck are you smoking F-4s are not modern

God that would feel fucking terrible

do you honestly believe that the IRIAF can defeat the USAF in the air and prevent the USA from establishing air dominance of Iran? how would they even do that? the USAF can launch bombing attacks from CONUS.

And you do not possess magic weapons that defeat insurgency. You'd think neocucks would have learned this after over a half century, but nope, they're still fucking morons.

>Gonna be great for moral when an airliner full of US troops at the end of deployment gets blown up.

Americans aren’t Europeans. They think of their soldiers as heroes and idols and would start lynching Muslims in the streets if something of that nature were to happen. It wouldn’t work in the Iranians favor as the public would turn a blind eye and encourage reprisals on the Iranian population for example.

>most casualties from the war are marines an hero'ing
fucking fund it

>50k lives
You’re either retarded or just a deluded Muslim.

To play devils advocate they could just maintain combat air patrols 24/7 to prevent decapitation stiles like what happened in Iraq. Their AA is likely better and more modern.

i'm kind of surprised they let him do this segment

>And you do not possess magic weapons that defeat insurgency.

I have not once in this entire thread said that we can magically defeat an insurgency. the only thing I have ever commented on is how the USA could invade Iran to begin with. if you go back and read my posts, you will see that this is true. you are arguing with something I never said, and would not ever say, because I do not believe that it is possible for the USA to defeat an Iranian insurgency in the same way that it was not possible for the USA to defeat an Iraqi or Afghani insurgency. if you want to argue about this with someone, I suggest that you locate a poster who disagrees with you about this point, because I don't.

>modern Air Force
LMAO

I want to know what the navy would do with Iran's small missile boats. These fuckers literally swarm ships while shooting missiles like a suicide mission

I never said the IRIAF can beat the USAF, but on the home front supported by their huge AA complement against what limited deployment the USN can manage in an assault, I think they could bloody us enough to stall us out or cause serious war unpopularity at home.

You keep acting like the war happens in a vaccuum where the US does something and Iran does literally nothing to stop it. You think they didn't closely watch our last two invasions of Iraq? You think they haven't come up with ways to deal with us and exploit our weaknesses?

>[Screaming red-faced Marine with tears in his eyes.jpg]
I NEED this to happen now.

If they maintained CAPs, the CAPs would just be shot down.

Google Operation Praying Mantis to find out what we did the last time

I'm not an expert on Iran's air force but I seriously doubt that they could actually keep enough aircraft in the air to make that happen even before you start counting up the potential losses they'll suffer from F22's blasting them out of the sky and B2/B52's obliterating them with cruise missiles on the ground. Iran is a very small place, we can see their entire airspace and look at/hit all of their airbases. they simply would not survive in a real fight with the USAF.

Reminder that the Pentagon ran a wargame simulation of an invasion of Iran several years ago. We got horrifically mauled in every outcome until we implemented handicap scripts for our side.

Holy shit imagine a Okinawa 2 electric boogaloo in the fucking gulf

>an event 30 years ago is a good indication of what would happen now
Let's tell Germany to roll a bunch of tanks into France.

>iran is a very small place
>
>

We got horrifically mauled because Van Riper kept breaking the laws of physics

You better not be referring to the Millennium Challenge.

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It’s still a better stand up fight then the clown show that was the Iraqi air force. I’m sure the US Navy and Air Force can swat everything down but it would be an uglier fight with air patrols needing destruction before strategic bombers can come in.

>I think they could bloody us enough to stall us out or cause serious war unpopularity at home

I think that's a complete fantasy. Iran doesn't have the hardware to make that into a reality. and, the war is already unpopular

>You keep acting like the war happens in a vaccuum

no, I don't. you're just reading my posts in bad faith and making me out to hold opinions that I don't actually have. instead of doing that, why don't you try asking me pointed questions about my views so we can locate the median point between our perspectives? or do you just not give a shit, and you just want to fight on the internet? I obviously want to talk about this, it's why I am here...it's why I am replying to your posts.

Your distinction between invasion and occupation is false and all you have to cling to to avoid feeling like an idiot.

>the war is already unpopular

meant to type: *the war is already unpopular and it hasn't even begun

>asked what would happen to small boats attacking USN ships
>give him a real world example of what happened the last time small boats attacked USN ships
What did you want me to do? Make up shit? 30 years ago a bunch of now outdated destroyers fought little boats and stomped them to death, and theres little reason to believe that an engagement today would have a different outcome

Where's it unpopular, user? Do you think it would get more popular in the States? Do you think it would get less popular in Iran?

>Your distinction between invasion and occupation is false

uh, no, it is not. I was responding to who said

>HOW? Do you have a fucking map? Where the fuck would US invade Iran from?!?!

that's literally all that's happening here. your constant attempt to turn this into a wrestling match between your ideas about insurgencies and the fictional strawman you imagine me to be is tiresome. I don't know how many times in this thread I need to post it, but: I agree with you. the USA cannot defeat an Iranian insurgency. but it is completely possible to invade Iran. that's literally all I've ever been saying.

An outnumbering force of US destroyers fought a small number of Iranian frigates and small boats. Big deal. We're not talking about that.

Iran is a big place...

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>Where's it unpopular, user?

literally everywhere except Russia and China, I imagine. Iranians don't want to get blown up, Europe doesn't want another refugee crisis, and Americans are fucking sick of throwing away their blood and treasure into the middle east. nobody gains anything by this war kicking off except the USA's enemies.

Yeah we're talking about an even bigger US force with more supporting carriers fighting a small number of frigates and small boats

The Iranians use conscripts, which historically get FUCKED against disciplined volunteer forces.
>US vs Imperial Japan
>Vietcong vs US Army
>Everyone vs Volksturm

Irregardless of their troop and training quality is this question.
>The fuck does Iran have for logistics
If the US made a point to capture Tehran, doesn't matter how the Iranians do, they will run out of ammo and vehicles. Even if their industry could keep up for losses, that won't last because of Airstrikes
>Use Iraq as an example
>If it holds or makes weapons. It fucking explodes
>If you have enough armor. It fucking explodes.
>Is that a supply depo. It fucking explodes.
>Large trench works of armor and men.
>We saw that shit on satellite.
>Abrams are parked at Max range.
>Stealth bombers and fighters are coming tonight through your radar coverage. Hope you got variable wave and EM based detection
Iran would need 1,000% Air Superiority and defense, with the ability to target stealth aircraft BEFORE they dent shit

Iran can only really try to hold out until the US gives up due to political pressure from allies and populace

The Iranian navy now is more different from its 80s self than the American navy is to its 80s self, as in one navy has remained somewhat static with upgrades and while another has been overhauled.

I agree with your post in the abstract, but, really? comparing the volksturm to the vietcong? get your head in the game, user.

>Vietcong vs US Army
You know we lost that war, right?
Iran also has far fewer conscripts than regulars.

>overhauled
oh no they're using DIFFERENT MODELS of little boats what ever shall we do in the face of such insurmountable odds