/mg/ - Software and Hardware Minimalism General

You can use the Arch Build System if you want to be autistic about package splitting and USE flags. So those two points are just memes.

They are, even the most bloated ones are, because most common widget tool-kits are simply horrible unless it's pure Tcl/Tk.

What's that?

In other words: what graphical web browsers, that were not derivatives of Chromium/Firefox, have you tried, and what was your experience with them?

netsurf is the best i can think of but its js support needs a lot of work and it needs the ability to call external programs

Had to dive for a while.
>pastebin.com/yKhgKt8r

Exactly, add to calling external programs and js having vi like bindings and you have the perfect browser.

alpine is cancer

no u

What about netrunner? Is it vaporware?

wait, I don't get it, simplicity, small footprint and minimalism are completely different things that not necessarily go hand by hand. Also dependencies are important, I don't get this minimalism trend.

You mean the browser that had a general in here some time ago?

Why not just use qutebrowser?

Stop shilling nigga, that thing has qt and python in it.

Archposting is equal to shitposting.

can you explain this for me? they having the all use flag means they gonna be split to multiple uses for another applications,right? idon't understand why arch is not considered minimal too, if you costumize the entire installation process! i never useit but they say is minimal in their site front page KISS and shit!

>want JS support, Youtube support, Graphical interface and scripting
>but also wants it to all magically come from an ncurses browser comprised of a single C file

So use elinks and stop asking.

It's just a big meme, friend. They just don't want people using the most popular minimal distro. That's what it comes down to; popularity.

Can we get NixOS netinst added to the list? It provides a unique., easily reproducible package system. It uses systemd, but so does fucking Debian

I just copied the pasted the text from last thread.
Debian should be deleted IMO.

This.

>Debian should be deleted IMO.
Well you can take out SystemD and make it minimal IMO. NixOS and other OSes can do it? Because if they can they should be added.

systemd.
Agreed. Put Devuan back in.

Arch can do it

You mean you want to add Artix and Devuan?

>Arch
But I didn't ask about Arch. . .

Could be nice, and honorable mention to those OS that can be converted to minimal without SystemD like Debian.

This infographic is bloated.
13 different distros to choose from is too much. Most of them can accomplish the same thing.
There's no point in using anything besides Gentoo anyway.

Are functional langs, haskal in particular, considered minimal? I could see arguments for either desu.

Debian is also systemd and allowed in the list

That was original OP who did that, uwu

>There's no point in using anything besides Gentoo anyway.
not having to fuck with the source would be one

Haskell is not minimal per se, but it's great for writing small and extensible software
See xmonad and xmonad-contrib

I understand SystemD as bloat but glibc is about the same performance-wise as MUSL in my experience, I couldn't install firefox from source due to a hardcoded glibc dep. MUSL hipsters go away

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LFS
FreeDOS
Plan9
Crux
Source Mage
GuixSD
Void
-FreeBSD
-OpenBSD
+*BSD
Gentoo
Alpine
-debian
+Devuan
+Artix

etalabs.net/compare_libcs.html

Well, call me when I can run Firefox Nightly or Waterfox using MUSL. Until then I'll keep using void glibc

I second this idea.

First of all this is a minor issue, so there isn't a big difference.
And on a side note, on Alpine Linux there is Firefox ESR patched for musl.
Then again I found it slow and am using chromium instead.

Tiny Core or Alpine?

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I hope that QtWebEngine or WebKitGTK browsers like Falkon and Midori adopt WebExtensions. That way, we'd have telemetry and spying-free browsers that are quite a bit more /minimal/ than Firefox and Chrome and support our usual adblockers and privacy extensions like umatrix.

Reminder that the reason Firefox ESR needed to be patched for Alpine is because of Glibc's non-standards-compliant extensions.

None of them. Get a debian netinstall, gentoo or arch. OP is a retard.

>debian,arch
systemd
>gentoo
time-waste, but ok if you have time
I only tried Alpine Linux. Here's some thoughts about it:
First of all, use the Vanilla version, without any grsec snakeoil in the kernel. Otherwise gdb won't work.
The core install (without ssh and ntp) is about 50 packages
Of those you can remove acct (GNU accounting utilities) and dosfstools (you can still mount FAT32 and NTFS without them)
Then you will probably need X, that comes at a cost of ~50 packages and is done by simply excuting /sbin/setup-xorg-base
Then you will probably, besides a text browser, need firefox/chromium. Both are ~50 packages.
If you're developing graphical applications, then all the X headers and dev-tools will be ~50 more packages
mpv and youtube-dl will be ~20 packages
if you want some custom alpine packages, the alpine-sdk will be ~30 more packages
Then there will be lots of tiny extras (dwm, st, nano, man, scrot, cloc, feh, links, sic...) that will together amount of ~100 small packages
All in all it's about 300 packages for my particular use (developing a suckless cowboy 3D game engine)

>developing a suckless cowboy 3D game engine
Link?

It's so early in development that it's not even separated from the game I use as a testbed
streamable.com/d3s0u
github.com/Mark-Weston/run
I'm currently rewriting it, integrating the lessons I learned from the last rewrite

Yeah it's pretty minimal
There's a complete game engine written in pure C but I never tried it:
github.com/orangeduck/Corange

I know it.
It's abandoned.

those are called features kid, and they are good unlike musl garbage.

What's the best minimal software to access my android files?
What's your opinion on jmtpfs, go-mtpfs and simple-mtpfs?

Searching a good replacement for IrfanView (In WinCucks is the best for me) and stepped up on NoMacs. Seems pretty great although I will have to get used to. Someone tried it before?

I've looked around by myself. Here's my conclusion:
>jmtpfs is not updated since Dec 2014
>go-mtpfs had a minor change 2 months ago, but it's basically not updated since May 2015
>simple-mtpfs last biggest change is from Apr 2016
>mtpfs doesn't look as well made as the other alternatives

I choose ADB. It's less practical, but whatever.
If someone wants to try something I'd say to take a look at android-file-transfer. It's definitely up to date, it has a GUI (pro or cons? it's up to you) and it looks like a reasonable well made piece of software.
An MTP client is more minimal than ADB, but I chose the most powerful tool instead.

Oh, and... happy easter everyone!

No, they're called
EMBRACE
EXTEND
EXTINGUISH

luakit best mg browser

No, it's called bad programming practices, EEE makes no sense for free software

Hold on your horses, not being worthwhile features is one thing, but accusing of EEE is too much. Can you politely ask the developers of glib and musl to come to an agreement?

EEE, or a form of it, can be applied. I think is called the golden handcuff or something like that, but the idea is create a dependence on certain software so you cannot replace it.

>still have a nonfunctional resolver
>accusing glibc of EEE
kek

I've been testing lately this pasta but I realized that AlsaMixer doesn't change the volume anymore. I guess alsamixer and amixer goes through pulseaudio and since I have not puleaudio can't control shit. How do you change volume without PulseAudio? Tried google a while and didn't come with anything. Thank you guys.

What distro are you using? Make sure pulseaudio is removed entirely or you won't have audio.

I do have audio. I'm using Void, and used the pasta recently. So everything works flawless until the moment I want to low the master volume, which I can tweak, but the real output doesn't change.

Interesting, so your audio works but not the volume control. I remember it was something about having the sound card right on alsaequal, but you say you are using alsamixer which can't remember if it worked at all. Try alsaequal on the terminal.

alsamixer/amixer on Void works for me. I never installed Pulseaudio though.

>I never installed Pulseaudio though.
The curious thing is that I purged Pulseaudio long time ago, but I had .asoundrc in my home for a while to (allegedly) make Firefox have sound with the external card. When I purged I did xbps-purge -FfRvy so if I should had purged in other way I didn't.

I thought Alsaequal was only for AUR, when I checked the GitHub seems like the .asoundrc file is needed aswell. This means my issue comes from removing my old .asoundrc file?

>Alsaequal was only for AUR
Eh, I dont know man, I dont think alsaequal is that bleeding edge to deserve being in a github even. Maybe try removing the .asoundrc or whatever the guide says and you are golden.

Here the github just in case you're curious
>github.com/raedwulf/alsaequal

Also
>Maybe try removing the .asoundrc or whatever the guide says and you are golden.
Yeah, that's the 1st thing I did and afterwards I have no volume control. Maybe I will recover it and mess around with it, since I think my issues are coming from there.

So I messed around with the .asoundrc file, and seems like the following configuration is the origin of firefox and mpv or whatever other output software not being able to share the external card. Yet, I still have no master volume through AlsaMixer/Amixer.
pcm.!default {
type plug
slave.pcm "dmixer"
}

pcm.dmixer {
type dmix
ipc_key 2014
slave {
pcm "hw:DGX,0"
period_time 0
period_size 1024
buffer_size 4096
rate 96000
}
bindings {
0 0
1 1
}
}

ctl.dmixer {
type hw
card 1
}

pcm.rate_converter "speexrate_best"

The external card is 0 DGX and Intel one is 1.

anons... Why you waste unused RAM..?

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Folks, I want to use a tiling windows manager, but I have two major problems. First, it will be very hard to get use to it; second, no one else will be able to use my computer
Is there a way to use my actual DE and a tilling at the same time? I would like to have Xfce in tty7 and the tilling in tty6

Hello anons, maybe this is a question for /sqt/ but I'll try my luck.

I wanna try these minimal distros but I don't tend to use VM, what's the best one for windows as of today? Virtualbox or VMWare?
Thanks.

I am trying tla (the GNU arch version control), is way more minimal on my system, 941 of size installed, compared to the 21946 of size from git. Is also low on dependencies and written in C.

Can you guys compare on your distros?

StumpWM

Welp, just in case someone was still curious, my last advances since I'm not trying for a while.
Messed up around the .asound conf, seems like I was be able to use my card in certain times, but only under the Digital Device (I have speakers hooked up through optical so it shouldn't be like that)
Then through losf I tested when was sharing sound and when it doesn't, and seems like by design it won't share but turn the sound through programs.
Honestly, I think I'm more lost than before. My main targets were:
>Using the external card (DGX Xonar)
>Sharing sound through programs
>Choosing default volume
>Choosing default quality
I have to be missing something important because not only I didn't get all my targets but I never get them together. Sorry for this blog post but I thought I have to inform the anons who helped me. Cheers bros.

Thanks for the update, I am legit curious. Maybe check /proc/asound/modules and see which card you want in the asound.conf and put the minimum, my old configuration was
pcm.!default {
type plug
card 1
}

ctl.!default {
type hw
card 1
}

timer.!default {
type hw
card 1
}
But I got lucky with just alsa-base.conf and and deleting asound.conf from my home directory and from /etc.

you could try using subdevices
like 1:1 or 1:2 whichever works

Anyone using only Wayland? Thinking about dumping xorg bloat since most of my daily use programs are already ported. Also that sway wm is currently in the midsts of a 2 week havkathon, hopefully it doesn’t end up shit. Is sway bloated to begin with though?

>Hipster minimal
>ReeeeBSD
replace that shit with Dragonfly OP. FreeBSD is just as bloated as Linux now, and even their CoC is bloated. DragonflyBSD forked off before all that shit took over.

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test

i'm trying to use fbi as an external image viewer in w3m but it won't load urls. it seems that with links, it'd download the image prior to viewing. is there a clever way to achieve this with w3m?

>EEE makes no sense for free software
>t. Poettering

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>not being on the /mini/mal team

I ride for motherfucking mini
mini gang life or death imma be in my minishit ain't nobody can stop this shit we on our way we all gonna make it.

you could just write a script that wgets the image and then runs fbi

Yeah, use links.

test

Did it work?

what extension should I use for loading user js in palemoon?

adding Hyperbola would be the best compromise imo:
hyperbola.info/
>pacman + arch/aur repos + debian stability + security + privacy

how can i scale and position mpv when vo=drm?
i want it to not take up the full screen

I saw a thread the other day, they say it has libressl by default. Pretty cool distro, I might install it tomorrow.

OK so why there isn't a gaming only open source multiplatform linux based operating system.
Only reason Windows is doing No.1 in Dow Jones is because of gaming.

Didn't they fork grsecurity?

Is there an easy way to make LaTeX do this as easily as groff does?
ITEM This is a test of the indented paragraph
with a set space between an assigned
first word (or set of words) which will
be spaced from the body of text.

Which is made by just doing this:
.IP "ITEM" 20
This is a test of the indented paragraph with a set
space between an assigned first word (or set of words)
which will be spaced from the body of text.

I know there's defined lists which can be done in Pandoc Markdown easily enough, but I can't work out how to make LaTeX render them like how these indented paragraphs work on groff.

Page 10 mates.