2011 + 7

I have never seen a European country with as much contempt for electronic payment at retail than Germany.

Germany is pretty weird in that regard.
We're pretty skeptical of surveillance.
People here love cash above all.

I don't think i've had to wait more than 3-5secs for the chip readers to go through.

I only use my debit card as a last resort. I don't like giving up a card number that is directly tied to my bank account. Credit cards are the next layer which is like using proxy, and Google/Apple pay is like using a VPN.

>high: credit
>low: debit

GEE I WONDER WHO COULD BE BEHIND THIS POST

If you're not an idiot and pay your bill in full each month (what the industry refers to as "deadbeats"), you pay no interest charges or other extra fees on top of your purchase amount, but get benefits and cashback that you wouldn't on debit, all while having stronger consumer protections under the law.

I deal in cash or bitcoin. I don't like my name tied to my transactions and I have no debt to speak of. My car is paid for, and my mom is buying me a house so my brother with down syndrome always has a place to live with family.

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>my mom is buying me a house
hello NEET

I don't live with my mom as she's in an entirely different state. I am self sufficient, I just don't have to worry about housing in my future.

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You have 2 minutes to tell me what's wrong with cheques and how old you are.

>all of the info printed on the check is enough information to print a fake check
>if people draft fake checks, the transactions are reversible; however, the bank can take 10+ business days to investigate it before they need to provisionally credit you (20+ business days if the account is relatively new) and you're fighting over your money in the meantime, and dispute procedures are much weaker under the Electronic Funds Transfer Act than the Fair Credit Billing Act for fraudulent charges
>slow during checkout
>often requires giving a merchant more information, like your drivers license, to finish
>not instantaneous authorization like credit/debit
i could go on

don't think i'd want that deal, but good on you for taking him in

>credit above debit

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see

yeah, I got you are a poorfag jew lover

your brother with down syndrome shouldve been aborted, but hey, good for you for being there for him. I wouldnt want saddled with that responsibility.

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>credit cards

good goy

>swipe up to launch....

absolutely disgusting

I don't have gapps so that's out of the equation for me. My card is contactless though.

it's all fun and games until someone clones your debit card or drafts fake ACH transactions

>b-b-but muh chip is uncloneable
cl.cam.ac.uk/~rja14/Papers/unattack.pdf
>EMV, also known as"\Chip and PIN", is the leading system for card payments world-wide
>[...]
>We have discovered that some EMV implementers have merely used counters, timestamps or home-grown algorithms to supply this number. This exposes them to a \pre-play" attack which is indistinguishable from card cloning from the standpoint of the logs available to the card-issuing bank, and can be carried out even if it is impossible to clone a card physically (in the sense of extracting the key material and loading it into another card). Card cloning is the very type of fraud that EMV was supposed to prevent.
>[...]
>We found flaws in widely-used ATMs from the largest manufacturers. We can now explain at least some of the increasing number of frauds in which victims are refused refunds by banks which claim that EMV cards cannot be cloned and that a customer involved in a dispute must therefore be mistaken or complicit. Pre-play attacks may also be carried out by malware in an ATM or POS terminal, or by a man-in-the-middle between the terminal and the acquirer. We explore the design and implementation mistakes that enabled the flaw to evade detection until now: shortcomings of the EMV specification, of the EMV kernel certification process, of implementation testing, formal analysis, or monitoring customer complaints.

Remember, if you can pay for something in one tap, you don't need to enter in your PIN.

>something hundreds of millions of people use daily without incident is actually incredibly insecure you goys.

Thanks, dr. Shekelberg.

scmagazine.com/evolved-prilex-malware-lets-cybercriminals-clone-chip-and-pin-cards/article/751749/

you're the one with the "banks/jews are trying to screw you" narrative, so why wouldn't the fact that a technology that banks present as secure actually be insecure but the banks blame cardholders for fraud anyways be any surprise to you?

credit/debit they both use EMV, but under credit there's no PIN so the bank doesn't have a pretense that you were complicit in the transaction

I signed up for it cause I have a pretty strong personal ethical code and have loyalty to a fault to those in my inner circle. I never wanted any of this, but life is full of dice rolls of shit you never asked for. My biggest hurdle is finding a woman that understands what my ultimate responsibility in life will be, and be willing to go along the journey with me.

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Screwing people is the entire business model behind credit cards.
Credit card companies make countless billions without contributing anything to the economy.

Meanwhile banks make hardly anything on debit cards, if anything at all.

You're spreading FUD about debit cards, which is a known Jew trick.
But if there was any real issue why is nobody complaining?

It's brainless Americans

>Screwing people is the entire business model behind credit cards.
ingenious insight, except it depends on idiots carrying balances to make money. if you just charge shit and pay the bill in full each month like a responsible adult, then you get the cashback + benefits + consumer protections while not paying anything more.

>Meanwhile banks make hardly anything on debit cards, if anything at all.

on debit purchases processed as PIN, the largest banks in the US make 22 cents plus one half of one percent (0.5%) of the transaction. on debit transactions processed as credit, banks make 2-4% as they do on credit cards.

for financial institutions that hold less than $10 billion in assets (most internet banks and credit unions), they make 1-3% each swipe on debit transactions processed as PIN. they are not subject to the durbin interchange (swipe fee) cap as Bank of America, Chase, Wells Fargo, Citi, etc. are if they have under $10B in deposits

>You're spreading FUD about debit cards
nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/unauthorized-credit-debit-card-charges-29654.html
US law is incontrovertible on this and if you deny such then you have your head in the sand
EMV has structural weaknesses but under credit the bank is fighting for their money back, not you fighting for the money in your bank account back

>it depends on idiots carrying balances to make money.

They mostly screw over shopkeepers, by overcharging them for their "service".

>more FUD
Again: show me the millions of outraged people....

European here, btw, my grandfather gassed your kind which is why our banks don't have such laws anyways.

>all these idiots crying about MUH EBIL CREDIT CARDs because they are literally too stupid to know how to control their own spending
kek

For me it's Samsung Pay except for drive throughs and gas pumping

BTW just got this email from Taco Bell - is this a scam trying to phish my Taco Bell password?

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>They mostly screw over shopkeepers, by overcharging them for their "service".
i pointed out that PIN based debit is different, which is why most banks in the US point towards a minimum number of debits swiped as credit as a way to avoid account fees - because the profit margins per swipe are similar.

the entire credit cards benefits reward scheme is driven by the fact that debit interchange is down (many stores are blocking debit processed as credit) and higher rewards on credit. many credit cards like the barclays bank deleware Uber card offer rewards in excess of the interchange they receive (visa interchange is 1.5-2.5% at best; uber's restaurant/bar cashback is 4% on the card)

also, retailers decrying the scheme as vampiric mainly do so because they receive an invoice detailing the exact cut off the top, while neglecting to consider the costs of handling other forms of payment. especially for how insecure cash is, it's easy for people to manipulate/steal from the till, and it's less secure while in transport. hiring an armored truck isn't cheap either

>ever trusting big corpo to process your transaction data securely

>Manager at a whataburger
>Old guy orders the usual, swiped credit card, done in 4 seconds.
>Next
>Tall asian man with smart watch, ear piece, glasses with a stud on the side of them
>Orders
>"Total is $8.70"
>He pulls out his phone
>Finger print scans to unlock
>Swipes back and forth a bit
>Finds banking app
>Starts hovering it over random places on the machine
>"Sir the sensor is around here, it doesnt work for everyone I warn you"
>Angles it for another 15 seconds no luck
>"Do you have a card you could use?"
>No
>He gives up and I just promo the meal

I cant wait until corporate rolls out the chip sensors and we get to wait 30 seconds on random customers for not fully inserting or just having a slow bank.

Enjoy being tracked.

>ERROR
>maybe you swiped too fast
>ERROR
>you only scanned the corner. you have to hold it flat
>ERROR
>thats too slow to register now
>ERROR
>did you insert the card all the way when you swiped?
Chip is much better. Customer just inserts it like a key and it immediately works. No giving them advice on the swipe for five minutes and holding up the queue. We only use it as a backup when the bank declines the card and requests an alternate reading technique. Australian PINless NFC cards are the best, though. Just tap and go.

i've had one of my chip cards replaced three times, the chips go bad, it's fucking absurd

the watches often don't work because the antennas are too small, watches are a meme. phones have large enough NFC antennas (and MST for the samsung devices) to work reliably

pre paid debit cards > everything else.

gift cards are non-reloadable, a total pain, and carry initialization fees

prepaid debit cards are basically bank accounts requiring registration with social security number and all of the negatives of banking checking accounts with none of the benefits

wrong. pre paid debits dont have overdraft so you only load them with enough money to make a purchase and if someone steals the number they dont get jack shit.

Jewgle Pay allows me to simply unlock my phone and tap the sensor. No fumbling with any apps or trying to get anything else to work.

What's you next excuse, user?

overdrafting has been opt-in for many years on checking accounts. you have to opt into the ability to overdraft, versus having transactions declined.

consumerfinance.gov/about-us/blog/understanding-overdraft-opt-choice/

Letting our government know everything you buy instead of using anonymous cash.

>Debit card in low tier
how to spot amerifats

Protected by banks.

not meaningfully. did you read the paper in the post you quoted, or where explicit card cloning is possible?

the "cryptography" and "security" buzzwords of chip cards are used by banks to "prove" that you were party to a transaction, on debit they can claim that this is proved by something you have (card with chip) plus something you know (debit PIN) therefore you must be complicit in the charge, whereas credit they can only prove the card was present and must take extraordinary measures to prove you were actually there (like video footage of you making the charge). this is why debit is being increasingly targeted for fraud

>Error swiped too fast
Never happened. Sometimes people swipe too slow but the faster the better.
Just from personal experience Ive been to a walmart and had my chip take 20-30 seconds to authenticate before letting me remove it.

The excuse is the time. A card on average takes 4 seconds. Every time someone pulls out their phone it may only take 2 seconds on the "waiting for server response" however the time it takes for them to find the sensor and get it to beep is far longer than 4 seconds.

These times sound minimal unless you're the 60 year old grump waiting in line watching it happen.

Well I use it but only for transit and everything but it's useless outside Tokyo.

>Ever need to unlock your phone
I don't even need to turn on my phone.

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>take out phone
>unlock as I move it towards the contactless terminal
>takes 10 seconds and I don't have to fiddlefuck with my wallet and card
Where do you live that NFC is so shitty?

>he thinks his bank isn't a big corpo on its own
>he doesn't know that most banks still run on ancient software that handles financial transactions

>still using your phone/debit card/cash to pay for things
>he doesn't use a Kerv

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Hi Jordan

>canadian tire money
>is canadian
>t r i g g e r e d

>>takes 10 seconds
>calls other places shit.

It should take 2 seconds max.

>arguing about literal seconds
Are you riddled with ADHD?

The difference between 2 seconds and 10 seconds is the difference between paying in a smooth flow in between packing your bag or standing around aimlessly losing your spaghetti while customers queue up.

>no troll tabs
>carelessly including real name in screencap
Jow Forums is dead

>being so third world that you don't have contactless cards yet
Of course we have them, the banks just reserve for the super-special top-tier credit card goys.

>I don't even need to turn on my phone.
so basically an RFID card inside your phone case

wow, so advanced

>everyone advocating debit over credit
is this because you're all poor and have such shit credit that you can't get a good card with cash back?

Fuck off, Satan. Cash is fine.

>>advocating credit over debit

Pay with debit, merchant gets hacked, card is compromised and fraudulent charges are made.
>Bank: Sucks to be you.

Pay with credit, merchant gets hacked, card is compromised and fraudulent charges are made.
>Bank: Fill out this form and we'll remove the charges.

Using a debit card at POS is advanced stupid. *When* you get hacked your money is gone.

this

I get fake charges every 3 months, then my card gets blocked and the bank takes 2 months to send me a new card

sadly, I can't just cancel my card since I have several purchases with 12 months without interest.

The credit jew is quite usurious in my country.

or not everyone is american and going into debt isn't advocated everywhere
like why would you intentionally get into debt if you can actually afford stuff?

>credit card is high tier
>debit card is low tier

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>no gold
check out this goy

you do know that if you pay off your credit card bill within the grace period (at least 3 weeks), you pay 0 interest? whats wrong with taking on interest free debt that you know you can pay back?

>pay with debit
>merchant gets hacked
>follow same procedure as credit card because it's a credit card without the usury

>living in Hungary
>use PayPass visa errywhere
>every single rundown pub and corner shop has it
>never fiddle around with change
>also getting 300/100 internet for less than 10bux

Feels good to live in a cyberpunk utopia. Could use more neon though.

Some people must have incredibly shitty banks if they won't give them their money back after an obvious hack.

>Bank: Sucks to be you.
>Me: I'll see you in court.

Does resetting your phone after the Oreo update help? I noticed it slowing down a bit lately but I was reluctant to lose all my pics and stuff.

Paypass is Mastercard not Visa.

>yea so if you need any data on my customers' individual purchases, just ask
>i have detailed purchase history for millions of people who use our NFC payment system every day for little to no benefit
>they "trust" us
>dumb fucks

I have a Debit card with PayPass. Shits cash, no fees, fast as payment. I'm also not so shit that I spend what I cam actually afford. The only improvement I can see are the nfc rings you can get. Westpac in Australia offer it and I'm seriously considering switching banks for it.

NFC rings seem dumb. As my phone Apple Pay, Samsung Pay or Google Pay allow me to collect loyalty card rewards.

>implying

I have a CIB bank visa card just for PayPass, because they had a good offer for multiple accounts.

Paypass is Mastercard not Visa.

>keeps repeating his shit

Okay.

Visa NFC is called Paywave.

You can use a debit card with Google/Apple pay.

Why would your merchant store any info of your card? Do Americans still don't use chip'n'pin? It's time to advance

Paypass is generalized here,

I'm glad Target finally added gift cards to the Wallet in their app/account. Now it's just like Amazon and Walmart. Of course you're limited to four cards per transaction.

Who buys things in person? You're the luddites.

Amerifat detected.

Implying paint by smartphone is faster than contactless card payments. Which the rest of the world has had for years

I've heard many Wendy's haven't trained their staff for mobile pay app.

>Being a humongous manchild that cannot wait 20 fucking seconds (at the very most) for a person to quickly take out his or her wallet and pay.
How do you even survive being on a line?
Also, how the glorious fuck do you even dare put credit over debit? Are you broke, bro? Or are you dumb enough to live in a country where they don't advocate the use of debit over credit, and give you "bonuses" for being on debt?

>using a smartbotnet
>trusting a smartbotnet enough to pay with it

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