What CS industry-related fields are non-brainlet?

Nobody's going to pay you to sit on your ass and pontificate about abstract problems. On it's own, Computer Science is just an easy branch of maths.

Can you explain how web development has gotten hard?
I'm not involved with it but all I see is react/angular/vue for the frontend with something like node on the backend.

Not that user, but the average web developer nowadays must know a shut ron more technologies than the one from, let's say 90's-00's. Not to say that all web devs write good code, but you cannot be a brainlet and do actual web dev related coding.

>but the average web developer nowadays must know a shut ron more technologies than the one from, let's say 90's-00's
In the 90s web developer wasn't even a dedicated role and people would just learn enough HTML to get a simple site up.

Exactly

I get that but most web developers, even "full stack" ones, are just hooking up a frontend with a rest api on the backend. Most of the tougher things to implement like auth and such are handled by libraries. I'd imagine the only part that requires real skill is the design

have you participated in a big frontend project? something like Twitter or Medium website? Modern webapps are really really hard to develop and test these days especially in frontend which wasn't the case until a few years ago

pentesting :^)
Seriously though, I'm a malware analyst, its very enjoyable and pays well and has a great outlook, also being smart is REALLY rewarded
I unironically enjoy pentesting too though

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No, I mostly do desktop stuff. Your definitely right about sites like those, but I'd imagine that most web developers aren't working on projects that big.

webdev is actually pretty complex now...

github.com/kamranahmedse/developer-roadmap

And this says nothing about the software engineering skills and practices you should need to be a senior or lead developer...

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tell me which one of the following is brainlet tier:
neural networks
robotic vision
pattern recognition
digital signal processing
computer architecture

I can even get to more applied fields like SDR, but let's stick to the theoretical ones.

Why do you need me to tell you. If you can't spot the one that's brainlet tier, maybe your the brainlet.

Careful what you wish for

>computer architecture
do you think you can get job in computer architecture? kek even PhD.s from top tier universities cannot get a a computer architect job unless with a very solid record in publishing, this like wanting to be an astronaut

the roadmap is bullshit
After the army, mandatory service, I couldn't find a job related to my field, so while I was in my hometown I got asked to make some websites and webservices.
You only need to learn REST and code on top of wordpress, as if it's a CMV. Then you can pick up js/css/html in a few days and start doing top to bottom development.... and I don't mean buying themes and plugins and configuring them, but writing your own plus creating services.

>Why do you need me to tell you.
you claimed CS is brainlet tier, back up your claims.

let me see. I went to get a job in programming, and because they didn't want a code monkey(it was c/c++) the whole interview was about ABIs, embedded and ofc Architectures.
Do you know why? because they don't want python quality in coding. They wanted someone who knew about the platform the program was supposed to run.

> let me see. I went to get a job in programming, and because they didn't want a code monkey(it was c/c++) the whole interview was about ABIs, embedded and ofc Architectures.
Do you know why? because they don't want python quality in coding. They wanted someone who knew about the platform the program was supposed to run

That isn't computer architecture, they need a systems developer

Sure, if you want to be that guy that takes cash from computer illiterate people who just need a webpage for their side business.

But if you actually want to work as a dev in a large organisation building software and getting a salary, you'll need to skill up.

It's the difference between a painter who can paint some signage and a graphic designer who can create your whole corporate identity.

Doesn't matter, women and trannies will still get paid more than you do for retard level skill.

>That isn't computer architecture, they need a systems developer
systems developer is just fancy talk for software developer.
You can be a systems developer in a bank or something similar.

Have you ever worked on linux drivers development?

>Have you ever worked on linux drivers development?
I studied the linux kernel extensively for like a year a few years ago when I was a graduate student

the real question is: Have YOU?

I explicitly mentioned the opposite.
Most web devs, yeah those kids who think that a macbook will make them grand master developers, adopt every shit meme that comes out.
Then, after the median lifespan of those "frameworks" have passed... which is 9 months, then they jump to the next meme train that's popular on twitter.
>a graphic designer who can create your whole corporate identity
kek. If your "corporate identity" relies upon a hipster's macbook, then you are doing something wrong.

>I studied the linux kernel extensively for like a year a few years ago when I was a graduate student
that's not an answer to my question.

>the real question is: Have YOU?
have I what? study the kernel, which you did, or write kernel driver, which is what I asked?
I have written kernel drivers, because I used to design SDR tools on FPGAs with PCI-e.
I had also to write the kernel driver, up to the point were it dumps data to the user-mode component which then loads the data on the GNU Radio.
I'd like to show you my papers, but I'd doxx myself.
the fpga I worked on was the R7Lite with an AD9361
I used to help guys on several SDR threads with some namefag, but posting with a name ist verboten.

so, to sum up. A systems developer is college talk for software engineer.
If you don't use your CS skill on your job, you don't work on the field you studied.
Programming is like painting, or plumbing, house building.
You get better by the day, you get more experience the more old fag you are.
This doesn't make you CS or SE or even CE... you are just a worker.

>A systems developer is college talk for software engineer
A systems developer is college talk for software developer*
... I missed that spot.

why does every thread on this board end up in a dick waving contest? how many complexes do you guys have and what the fuck are you compensating for? you know that not being popular in high school is not the end of the world, no need to drag that shit into your adult life

I am not waving my dick.
I was asking rhetoric questions like >Have you ever worked on linux drivers development?
as an example where you need comp. arch to overcome many difficulties, only to face
>I studied the linux kernel extensively for like a year a few years ago when I was a graduate student
>the real question is: Have YOU?

People on Jow Forums have little to no preception on CS and many other fields. When you try to explain several things someone comes to you waving his achievements.

watch for yourself: "CS is brainlet tier"
Sorry guys, but creating band pass filters on fpgas was really hard for me. designing modules to convolute signals from different frequencies with verilog, in real time and feeding them to a god-dambed analog devices dma was hard for me.
I wish I had your CS skills to have my way easy on CS.

I think that the brainlet shit is just a meme. You fell for the bait man.

>You fell for the bait man
that's the regular response when you can't continue.
"It was a joke man, calm down"
"we were trolling you"
"you fell for the meme"
"It was just bait"
...but if you check one by one the claims here, you'll see that there are a lot of uneducated opinions.
like this...
>Web Development
web dev is not CS.
HCI is CS.
and if you check this retard's "roadmap"
you'll see nowhere any HCI.
You just see rendering then rendering then learn this framework, the the other framework then add 7 package managers beause, learn some tools.
Fuck, this thing is so ridiculous claim it as trolling.
This is plain stupid. If you want to troll, then you have to know about what you troll.
posting shit you don't understand and then saying it's trolling, you just make yourself look stupid.

last but not least, no graphic designer has ever studied HCI. Photoshop does not make you a graphic designer for interfaces.
Maybe you should pursue a career in painting lollies with black dicks.

It's the framework life. An enterprise frontend is usually react, react-redux, react-router-redux, Saga/thunk for async w redux, form libraries, some dumb library for requests like axios, etc. It's alot to get your head around and there aren't enough developers who can easily do all of the above. Gone are the simple front end days :(

that chart is retarded because it doesn't have "get a fucking book about the topic" written at the top

Webdev used to be HTML/CSS/JS.

Then we added in some decent back end systems, which spawned full stack web development.

Then we added in a ton of front-end frameworks that allow for a lot of flexibility.

Essentially, it's gone from only being babby's first webdev stack to developing entire applications on the platform that rival the complexity of flagship software.

In my experience, computer engineering is full of smart geniuses, although they most often fulfill the stereotype of being fat nerds. but still! they are very intelligent.
theoretical computer science is full of chads and normies, but it requires no effort or intelligence. they spend more time flying to foreign countries to attend conferences, than they spend actually doing research themselves..
the rest of computer science is losers who will never make more than 60k a year

Lmao are people memeing webdev is not hard

+1 for this since it seems like a pretty good guide, but mainly because they actually used the proper capitalization of Ajax.

>Webdev used to be HTML/CSS/JS.
>Then we added in some decent back end systems, which spawned full stack web development.
What? JavaScript didn't actually get adopted very much until later, since you couldn't rely on users having it supported or enabled in their browsers. With backend, you don't need to worry about support, so people have been writing mission-critical logic on the backend for a lot longer than on the frontend.

Ever wonder why there are all these technologies for doing stuff sans-JavaScript? E.g. cookies, forms, anchor links.

None of them is theoretical though.

underrated post

>On it's own, Computer Science is just an easy branch of maths.
How's your category theory, brainlet?

I never said theoretical.
I only said that SDR is "more applied"

Both ML and computer vision are meme words created by brainlet CStards who don't know that math is a thing. They are just statistics.

>They are just statistics.
Mostly yes. They're interesting for the scale that they work at, but the maths usually isn't very sophisticated and is tremendously misapplied.

There are some more interesting areas just off to the side. Can you solve simultaneous equation systems with billions of non-linear equations (hey, it's cut down from reality!) in them? Then the neural modelling side of CS is for you!

You beat me by 3 minutes. This stuff is graduate level mathematics and statistics, not CS.

>insert crossed out "science" and crossed out "computer" meme here

>Can you solve simultaneous equation systems with billions of non-linear equations (hey, it's cut down from reality!) in them? Then the neural modelling side of CS is for you!
What field/branch of computer science concerns itself with solving these kinds of problems, and why is CS better equipped for this stuff than math is?

you said theoretical

The problem with mathematics is that it's made for humans.

This is why we need computer science.

we have databases where queries are formulas derived from signal processing, data fields are processed data so that you can convolute the db data with the query and get the results.
I guess that's a meme for the brainlets who don't know math.
Or is this a meme for the brainlets who don't know databases?
hm...

>why is CS better equipped for this stuff than math is?
Scale.
Systems on that scale and complexity are hugely beyond normal Analysis (even one neuron is pretty complicated and non-linear) and there's a ton of interesting things that are only observable in networks of millions of neurons. It's way below the scale at which brain anatomists can get detail, yet hugely above the scale of isolated neurons. Simulations are required to even understand things enough to know how to make meso-scale models. Huge simulations, well beyond what even normal supercomputers can do easily.

none of this is pure theoretical nor pure applied. If you read the context and not the words individualy, you won't get confused.
I give an example bellow of how those fields applied is several cases.

pen-testing is on par with web dev.
just less often perceived as so.

hey, galois was a brainlet and couldn't figure out that GF(2) was the fucking base for Ethernet.
We could have had Ethernet in earl 1800s.

....
and because I don't want to continue giving out examples about "brainlets" and their achievements, each science studies the same principles from different perspective.
Neural networks take principles from biology.
SDR, takes fourier's and laplace's equations and manipulates electromagnetic waves.
Quantum mechanics take simple probability principles and describe the world around us.
It's plain ignorance to claim that some particular field in CS is for brainlets just because they use an easy principle from another field.

You people are over-inflating the difficulty of web development
>framework hell
This is a problem caused by you and only you. You don't need to know that many frameworks, plain and simple.
For people living in the React world, it's React. That's it.
Everything else is libraries and glue.

>full stack web development
this means literally nothing. Before, all you had was HTML and CSS. Everything else was driven by IBM WebSphere or Tomcat. You still had to know how to use a database.

What changed between now and then?
JavaScript became ubiquitous and non-shitty. That's it. There's no difference.

All of these ``technologies'' you claim to need to know are just libraries and glue. Boo fucking hoo.

95% of you are just glueing together libraries and databases. Living the hard knock life.

ML is definitely a brainlet filter. Very few people can convert a real life problem into models then solve it and convert the solution back into human language.

Name one important real life problem that gets solved with ML

>Name one important real life problem that gets solved with ML
Have you been living under a rock for the past decade?

I see you can't even name a single one

All depends on the scale you work at. Once you start getting into 'hyper-scale', with APIs doing 100k Rps, geo-redundancy, replication, eventual consistency, self-healing systems and all that bollocks, lots of interesting problems come up that simply don't show up when working at retard-scale on some hipster blog. I'm most happy with software I've designed when it detects it's own problems, fails over, recovers, logs about it and sends a few alerts, but other than that no-one notices a thing. I don't like 2am phone calls because something has fucked up. I'm normally in a drunken stupor at that point.

Name one person that can translate the inner workings of a trained model, built using a deep convolutional neural network into plain English.

protip: you can't
that person would be a legend in the field making shitloads of money in the new post-GDPR world.

The field is called interpretability by the way.

Tumor characterization. Took me 5sec on google. I'm not even that other user. Stop baiting.

arxiv.org/abs/1801.03230

>muh GDPR

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>he thinks that companies like Amazon aren't reeling from the inability to make product suggestion decisions based on personal data using automated decision making processes that can't be explained to an end-user

Like I care, I only go on Amazon if i need something specific.
People who let themselves get influenced by ads are brainlets

If all you want to do here is shitpost and shitfling by all means go ahead, but don't go around pretending you even understand the topic

>implying Amazon will have any problems to begin with
The data they use to make product recommendations is not able to identify a user and doesn't fall under GDPR...

>he thinks he doesn't get influenced by his environment

you can't even shake off the shit that gets thrown at you on this website, what makes you think that you are not influenced by ads? because you don't buy a product? I knew that geeks are shit tier socially, but you are fucking overestimating yourself

user, get ready to not code and work on work mostly on optimizing math equations in computer vision.

I'm a Comp Eng doing research into computer vision (specifically Binarized Neural Networks on FPGAs), and the only reason why I'm not doing that is because I'm working on neuron optimizations that compilers are too stupid to find, by writing fucking VHDL of all things.

Cryptography. No brainlets allowed. Also digital signal processing

That approach to generating machine vision is retarded. Its only ever going to give you what put it into it. You get the sigmoid of the data points within that area. Youre going to have to use that function to just make a new picture inside of the AI program. Which could be useful, but all youre going to get is a zoomed in picture of what youre current input is, and with this, youre only in 2D.

Today on my home insurer's website I interacted with a live person using their chat widget, and then was able to give the support person control of my tab (without having to click a browser alert!) to have her navigate *for me* to a new part of their website in order to add additional coverage. All while maintaining our chat convo from one page to another. All done using pure html5/js -- no third party extensions.

fuck if i know how they did that

this belongs on /x/

Dude, turbotax does it too, but theres has a browser alert. Fuckin wizardry. exp for how many fucking people all at the same time.

there was an on-page (not browser-level) modal dialogue but they obviously could have implemented without the dialogue if they had wanted to

>create a pile of shit
>based on a language developed in ten days
>spend your life digging through all the shit
>don't even know what normal programming is like
>most websites are bloated nonfunctional monstrosities
>b..but it's haaard!

this is why web development is a joke. i can't wait until the advertising bubble pops so that you dipshits can fuck off back to your barista jobs.

If they wrote a single page application, it's pretty trivial to control state without user interaction.
States are just variables, and the application will just reflect state.
It's super easy in something like React. Try it out sometime.

He is risen.

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Maintenance/janitorial staff at Google/Apple/Microsoft/etc.

There are worse places you could be cleaning toilets.

2012
>JQuery + some SQL backend + PHP/Java in VPN, some shitty mobile page
2018
> Vue/react + JSON API + Cloud backend(AWS,Azure),Mobile First site or/and App

web deb is harder than the senior level math courses I took in uni. Getting a modern JS toolchain set up right and understand how to architect a modern web app is harder than the quantum information theory course I took.

codelets will have you believe that looking at extremely simple toy problems using boring and easy proof techniques citing theorems they didn't come up with and using shitty unmaintainable shit written by codelets like R and Mathematica makes them superior when in reality it simply gives them a superiority complex and a chip on their shoulder so fucking big it could contain my node_modules folder.

Building distributed systems required in modern web infrastructure is fucking brutal and requires an understanding of many moving parts at many abstraction levels. There are so many fucking codelets on this board and /sci/ who haven't accepted that their Ph.D or MSc degree from a shitty state school in some """"hard""" STEM field with no industry to support it won't get them a tenure track job at any school and won't get their foot in the door at the most basic of companies, because these companies aren't looking for fucking codelets. When will they learn.

that sounds fucking cool

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Both ML and CV are flooded right now though. You and every other Joe are doing the same. Non brainlet would be doing research as a professor. Web dev is great because there are jobs everywhere it's insane. That and being the "SQL" guy.

Cool bro. Oh hey btw Ashley from UX wants the new GDPR footer width increased. Chop chop.

ML and CV sound sexy, but they really aren't (unless you are in cutting-edge research maybe, I wouldn't know). I did that kind of shit for 2 years and desu I find the webdev work (backend architecure stuff) much more challenging. At least you get a high-level overview of your product, and help shape it, instead of blindly crunching numbers.
In the end it's all gluing algorithms and libraries together.