So, it is getting quite hot in my shithole, and I want an AC to cool me. Also I want this AC to be able to heat room nicely in winter season. (it gets 5-10 C outside). Should I fall for inverter meme, or get an On-Off? Looks like kosher factor is different, while chooch factor is the same, same BTUs. Just a little higher consumption for classical ones. Can I install it myself? I can rent some tools live vac. pump and gauge. Original lines are already terminated (but without refrigerant). Also there is no laws about this, so I can release entire tank of R410a into atmosphere (but it is too expensive to release tho). What do you use to get your room cold in summer, and warm in winter?
But what about on-off? Compressor efficiency is nearly identical, and according to datasheet, it can same 3 kW consuming just 1 kW. Inverter just allows compressor to spin slower, thus being more efficient at lower power...
Michael Lee
On-offs are usually limited by -5° as Heater. Some chinks fucks up inverter control unit maling it work just in 3 speed modes linked to fan speed. Inverters also can be very power noisy, can cause noize in your speakers.
Henry Diaz
>On-offs are usually limited by -5° as Heater. Well, that is pretty good, since 0° happens quite rarely here. >Some chinks fucks up inverter control unit maling it work just in 3 speed modes linked to fan speed. Well, they definitely didn't got the point. Ideally there should be some sort of PID . >Inverters also can be very power noisy, can cause noize in your speakers. Depends on inverter I guess. Sure, chinks chinked, thus it will not meet FCC and will produce shit into power lines. Elevators do use inverters (or should I call them VVFD) and they don't produce much junk, since they use quality stuff.
Easton Reyes
Move out of fucking Ausfailia, winter is here for everyone else.
The more you use the AC the more inverters save you money, if you barely use them it'll take years for inverters to make up the cost difference.
Inverters are quieter without the start stop noise and don't take high amps to start. (My original Teco 2.8kW took 30amps to start up, had to upgrade the 20~25Amp breakers while my current Hitachi takes 3.4amps to start up.) Some people like to have a larger units than they need causing the compressor to stop and go every 10mins which can be annoying when you're trying to sleep in a small room. Inverters are able to maintain temps within 1 C of your settings. While non inverters stop and cannot be started again within a certain amount of time, resulting in a larger temperature swing.
An good inverter unit will reach the temperature set in around the 1st hour, drop to power saving mode which can be as low as 200W or less for a 2.8kW unit and stay there for the remainder of usage.
Power noise is an non issue if your wiring isn't shit because ACs will be on their own breaker loop.
I run a Hitachi Twin Air Flow DC Inverter window unit rated for 2.8kW with a turbo mode of 3.4kW and it's got a lower noise profile than my 14" fan or ceiling fan at medium or higher speeds.
>Inverters are quieter without the start stop noise and don't take high amps to start. Correct. But I have pretty small room, and pretty low temperatures at summer (+30°C in worst case scenario). 9000 BTU (2.5 kW) unit should be enough, and it consumes just 700-1000W, with relatively shy currents of 5-6A (I have 220V). Noise is not an issue, since it is not an apartment, but a third world brick-cardboard house. >Some people like to have a larger units than they need causing the compressor to stop and go every 10mins which can be annoying when you're trying to sleep in a small room. Well, that is interesting. I didn't though about this. I guess it is pretty bad for compressor as well. >Inverters are able to maintain temps within 1 C of your settings. That is not important. I just want to have below 20°C in summer, and above 15 °C in winter. >Power noise is an non issue if your wiring isn't shit because ACs will be on their own breaker loop. Not in my case, I will just plug it in socket, or wire to existing 16A socket. I don't want to add an additional line. But as far as I know, that is not an issue, as long as inverter is build correctly, with correct capacity of caps, and correct coils.
I don't know what I want to get. Originally I thought getting On-off Samsung aircon. But then I though of getting inverter Samsung, that is slightly more expensive. Then I realized that inverters don't like approximate amount of refrigerant in system (that will be the case, since I want to install everything by myself).
Thomas Nguyen
TFROST aka BingDian which is a Taiwanese company that is the OEM for alot of AC makers (Carrefour, Bluesky, Fujimaru, etc), they make cheap Inverter units starting in the 2.0kW range.
Using BD 220V AC units as an example, A 2.2kW fixed speed takes 19Amps to start up and maintains 3.1A+ with an EER of 11.09. That's 677W at best. A comparable inverter 2.2kW rated (0.8~2.7kW range) unit takes 4A to start 4.25A in turbo mode with a typical full tilt consumption of 647W (780W @ 2.7kw turbo) which drops down to 430W or less as it enters power saving mode. As you go into higher capacities, the difference gap starts getting larger.
Hitachis can go even lower as they are full DC Inverters, DC fan and DC scroll type compressor while cheaper Inverter units are DC compressor only.
You're going to have a harder time pushing sub 20C with ambients of 30C+ with a dinky unit. A fixed speed will run at full tilt all the time struggling to drop 10C while an over sized fixed speed will be turning on and off constantly. If you oversize an inverter unit it'll just always run in power saving mode.
Split AC units have always been finicky about refrigerant and installation, even piping length and diameter will affect power consumption and cooling capacity.
/diy/ is occasionally informative on the subject: - when its not full ofliteral Down Unders moaning about the Impending Heat. In November. >so move already. dumb emu botherers
Ayden Hernandez
>A 2.2kW fixed speed takes 19Amps to start up and maintains 3.1A+ with an EER of 11.09. That's 677W at best. It is pretty OK for on-off system. C16 breaker is fine with 19A surges, and consumption is OK. But I don't think it will consume 3A. It will consume more, since basic compressor has pretty poor power factor. It will be more like 6-8A and power of 600-1000W (depending on efficiency of compressor). >A comparable inverter 2.2kW rated (0.8~2.7kW range) unit takes 4A to start 4.25A in turbo mode with a typical full tilt consumption of 647W (780W @ 2.7kw turbo) which drops down to 430W or less as it enters power saving mode. Inverters are cool. I worked with e-bikes a lot, their controllers are basically an inverter. They do pretty good job of limiting initial current, and they adjust power with minimal losses. >As you go into higher capacities, the difference gap starts getting larger. I don't think so. Overall power draw figures should be quite similar, maybe slightly higher for conventional unit, since starting compressor is not the most efficient thing. >You're going to have a harder time pushing sub 20C with ambients of 30C+ with a dinky unit. According to calculation, 9000 BTU unit is an overkill for 16 m^2 room even with dropping 10 degrees. But it is the lowest capacity they sell. So, it will go on and off with 50% duty-cycle. >Split AC units have always been finicky about refrigerant and installation, even piping length and diameter will affect power consumption and cooling capacity. This is why I want the simplest. In worst case you can replace compressor and electronics with some sort of arduino with couple of relays, while in inverter system you're fucked. I think I can pump refrigerant to specific pressure required, but I don't want to do it. I want to install lines, vacuum them, and open valves. I don't want to dick around with scales and manual. >so move already. dumb emu botherers I'm not an emu fucker, but sopa eater.
Eli Gomez
>According to calculation, 9000 BTU unit is an overkill for 16 m^2 room even with dropping 10 degrees. But it is the lowest capacity they sell. So, it will go on and off with 50% duty-cycle. Or I can open the door and cool other 16 m^2 room, but only for 9 degrees, that is not bad actually.
Anyway, my jew is not sure what to get. On-off and pay for electrical more, or inverter and pay more for installation (since I don't feel comfortable filling system).
David Diaz
Box up some of that heat and send it here. It's fucking COLD.
Tyler Cruz
I wish I could.
Caleb Flores
Send me some cold beforehand.
Thomas Lopez
Depends on your situation. Phase change heating is nowhere near as effective as gas but can work out if your gas is expensive.
Elijah Russell
Who makes the best inverters in domestic aircons now? years ago it was Mitsu / Hitachi (they both use Mitsubishi heavy industries) but it looks like MHI models are actually cheaper
Josiah Garcia
> 5-10 C outside in winter where do you live, hell?
Brayden Stewart
The problem is that you don't really need a gas heater at +5 or +10 deg. c in winter with proper isolation. But it is too cold, so heat would be nice. Latin shithole.
Jack Cox
>is getting quite hot the fuck? the world is getting colder in this time of the year
Isaiah Hill
Get a bigger AC with an inverter for your room and you can reduce electrocity consumption
Christopher Morgan
Huehuelands and aussies have summer/spring now. Problem is I don't want to spend much. I just want to try if AC will work for me. If it will work - good, I will get a bigger AC for other rooms. Maybe even a multisplit.
Jace Powell
Inverter always, in Europe all new AC must be Inverter, they are way more efficient and less noisy.
Nolan Wright
> they are way more efficient Marketing bullshit. We're speaking about 5% or so increase in kosher factor >and less noisy. In theory - yes
Gavin Jackson
And yeah, you use R32, not even R410a
Blake Collins
Lol, this shit is flammable. Your government literally wants you to be fucked by southen friends and burned and gassed alive by failed AC.
Connor Edwards
Fucking retard. Inflammable doesn't mean it's going to blow up in your face with the concentration this low in a room even after the 100% leakage.
Landon Rogers
Once an r610a leaked from fridge. I shitted my pants when it flashed. And fridge has less freon
Dylan Rogers
How power noise reduced by breaker? Are you jelly?
Liam Wood
don't buy an "smart" AC with botnet for christ sake
I got a 3/4 ton mini-split for my room during the summer, I've saved a bit on my utilities since I don't have to keep the ac on just to keep my room cool. I used to have 3 fans in my room and it was very loud, my mini-split is much quieter and efficient. Only bad thing was that I had to sacrifice an outlet in my room to dedicate power for it.
Jayden Reed
Of course, WiFi is useless meme. Not bad, you know.
Brayden Jenkins
>so I can release entire tank of R410a into atmosphere why the fuck would you do that? you got money to burn?
inverter helps if you run it at it's middle capacity. otherwise just get a normal one but with r32 gas. the gas is more efficient. the ac will turn itself off when it reaches the target temp.
if you really want to save electricity. get a minibar fridge. open the door. place it outside your window and put a fan infront of it. make sure the minibar is out of direct sunlight.
Elijah Roberts
>why the fuck would you do that? I won't, but I might fuck up >you got money to burn? No, freon is expensive > r32 gas Not avalible in my shithole.
Ryan Brooks
I have a window unit that I take out when really really cold (I still haven't taken mine out and it's almost November but I haven't used it in awhile since cold) Kind of a bitch to put in and out and sorta wish I had one of those portable ones where I can just stick the hose in the window. Has a remote too.
Nathaniel Gray
build a pipeline
Liam Powell
And fill it with refrigerant?
Christian Ortiz
it could work
Gabriel Hernandez
Yeah, but efficiency?
Camden Cruz
daikin makes r32 split ac.
freon is being phased out. so they're probably not in stock and that's why the price is higher.
read the manual?
Matthew Cooper
There are no R32 ACs in my shithole, like at all. Hell, only recently they stopped selling R22 ones. You can't even get R32 refrigerant here
Camden Brown
>freon is being phased out. Not really. Shitholes like India, Brazil still use R22.
Aiden Bell
You have to factor in whether or not you're in direct sunlight throughout the day as there is the greenhouse effect like a car on a hot summer day, bricks, steel, concrete, and other building materials retain heat from the sun.
You're also not factoring power efficiency differences between traditional compressors, scroll type and other compressors.
If you don't want to do any thing just get a Inverter Window unit, put it into an AC window, put in a good seal, plug it in and it's "installed"
Talking about completely different mains, 110v and 220v
David Diaz
>You have to factor in whether or not you're in direct sunlight throughout the day as there is the greenhouse effect like a car on a hot summer day, bricks, steel, concrete, and other building materials retain heat from the sun. OK. I have a sunny side, but with blinds temp goes quite slowly up. >You're also not factoring power efficiency differences between traditional compressors, scroll type and other compressors. They are same more-less. 20% difference at best case I believe. >If you don't want to do any thing just get a Inverter Window unit, put it into an AC window, put in a good seal, plug it in and it's "installed" Window construction doesn't allow window units, so I'm looking forward split. >Talking about completely different mains, 110v and 220v Same live wire tho, you still might have some noise. But quality stuff doesn't introduce much.
