I always see people on /sci/ claiming that computer science is really easy to self teach...

I work with a lot of PhD Data Scientist guys. They all __think__ they can write code because they can throw together a Python script. I have to re-write everything they do before it goes into production.

should i just kill myself if i study CS in shitty third-world school? I try hard, i am fluent in english and i read a lot of technical literature. I learn mostly in home tho, when i am finished with bachelor i would like to get specialisation - machine learning maybe or 3d graphics in better school. Its kinda hard to get internship being in shitty school desu. I am learning java, i am bad in C, i am able to write Max function in assembly but i have hard time with Min function (echo $? always gives 0, and negative values in array gives strange value)

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>I always see people on /sci/ claiming that computer science is really easy to self teach.
People on here are constantly complaining about "calculus is hard" and "why do I need math? I study CS to program not for math".
That is /sci/'s reaction to that.

>they claim the entire subject of computer science is baby tier and not worth studying academically. How true is this?
CS is as hard as you want it to be.
It just so happens that many CS students have no interest in CS as a science, you will find these people in any Jow Forums thread about CS "why do I need this math???" and such.

>Astronomy in god tier
There's absolutely no reason to study astronomy in undergrad instead of physics.

>Statistics
lmfao, as important that is to ML.. still lmfao

Here's what I think.

If you're one of those lucky fags to recognize the importance of CS in science at an early age, then you're extremely lucky.
I liked tinkering with technical stuff when I was young but I never once heard of programming/CS until uni.

If I did, I would have studied it from around ~10 y/o, then you'd get the equivalent of a CS degree or better. After then I would have chosen Physics with some Applied Maths or Electronics/Electrical Engineering. But of course that didn't happen so I had no choice but to study programming intensively.

I view CS more as a means rather than an end. Advancing CS is way more difficult than making progress in other sciences unless you know Quantum Mechanics enough to advance Quantum computers.

I disagree with /sci/ to some extent. It's really easy if you've been programming since a kid, but not that easy if you do it later.

Even if you go to college to learn you end up teaching it at all to yourself anyway.

Swap Philosophy and Medicine and you're golden.

>Swap Philosophy and Medicine
YIKES

>most doctors: indians
>most philosophers: white
Face it, kid: your profession is shit done by street shitters.

Where the fuck do you live that you accept Indian """"""""""""""""""""""""""""""""doctors""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""?!?!?

>your profession
I am doing math.
Just objectively speaking one has pretty much guaranteed jobs the other is McDonald tier.
Not that I dislike Philosophy...

That happens in America.

>the absolute state of American healthcare

Anything is easy in restrospect with time and dedication. It’s pretty easy to dismiss anything in life.

If you've been studying programming before going into uni then you've got quite a good incentive NOT to go into CS.
Most of the CS grads I know are code monkeys, if you want to make something really exciting I think it'd be better to major at something else while being really good programming.

Might be better to go for Physics or Math or Comp Engineering.

>McDonald tier
So you admit that the bar is set much, much higher for philosophy? Glad to hear you admit so.

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>So you admit that the bar is set much, much higher for philosophy? Glad to hear you admit so.
Can't you read?

Electrical Enginigger here, they are correct.

Jesus Christ look at this insufferable faggot over here purposefully misinterpreting things so that everyone following his conversation knows he has no real arguments or defense of his points

>medicine
>god-tier
It's literally brainlet-tier.

Philosophy is a discipline for academics
No one studies philosophy expecting to land a corporate job and make six figures, they aim for a PhD and professorship.

alt-med doesn't count as medicine, pleb.

I can read. You can't write.

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You sound frustrated.

>no enviromnental science
shit chart faggot

>geology
Actually cesspool tier.

>I always see people on /sci/ claiming that computer science is really easy to self teach
Because it is.
>They don't claim programming is easy to learn,
Because it takes time to get used to telling retarded computers what exactly to do in bare basic steps leaving nothing unstated. People are too used to telling others what to do and have them to fill in the gaps of your instructions with common sense. It's easy once you get adjusted to thinking the right way.
>they claim the entire subject of computer science is baby tier and not worth studying academically
Because it is.

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>someone who never bother to learn to code more than what they immediately needed sucks
>therefore its impossible to self teach CS

Holy non sequitur, batman!

I've worked in high-performance and high-throughput scientific computing for 2.5 years now and let me tell you something: those fucking nitwits don't have a single clue as to what computer science means and how deep it goes. They *MIGHT* have heard of a linked list. That's it.

So they're 100% full of shit. I've seen their code, it's garbage, it's hacky, half the time we have to fix it for them. And fuck, god forbid they try to parallelize with OpenMP or MPI. Half the time on that front they don't even realize how unfit their programs are for it.

No, what /sci/ is referring to by self teaching is reading Sipser over the course of a couple of days and learning TCS. It's easy for anyone who has had a good proofs course.

>but proving undecidability of the acceptance or halting problems by diagonalization is like so crazy
>all my classmates and I were so totally lost by the end
>w-we can't all be brainlets, /sci/ is memeing!

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Yes, which means that for most people it is an absolutely awful degree.

Apparently not.

Learning to code =/= learning cs

Learning CS is easy.

>CS is up there with theoretical physics or pure math
This bait only works on /sci/

Not him.
>Learning to code =/= learning cs
Yes
>Learning CS is easy.
No
Any Idiot can learn to code.

>>Learning CS is easy.
>No

I am so sorry to hear of your learning disability.

>I am so sorry to hear of your learning disability.
I am studying mathematics, "learning CS" gets infinitely hard the more complex the things get you are studying.

>Any Idiot can learn to code.
If he ~wants to~. Otherwise you get this and this from people trying to get away with the bare minimum to function and can't be ass'ed to do more.

And ironically few of them know how to program

There's nothing infinitely hard in undergrad CS.

>If he ~wants to~.
Yes, exactly.
Not everyone who wants to can be come a Top tier mathematician.

>Otherwise you get this and this from people trying to get away with the bare minimum to function and can't be ass'ed to do more.
And since other people clean up their mess after them, I can't say they are dumber for it.

>in undergrad CS
Who talked about undergrad CS?

If you're disciplined enough, everything is easy to self teach. While not hard, it will still of course take time due to the sheer amount of stuff there is to learn, even if you're a genius.

That said, CS is no easier to self teach than Math, Physics or Chemistry.
Nowadays, with the massive current amount of resources available, you can very well learn the equivalent of any major (and more) by yourself if you put in enough work.

Just use proper study methods (retrieval-based learning, spaced repetition) and you're set.
Also, never listen to /sci/, it's just a bunch of edgy kids who are still in the "muh uni muh major muh iq" phase.

Self teach cs = learning undergrad / first year grad cs yourself
Become a self taught researcher = reading cs research papers and publishing

There's little reason to become a self taught researcher unless you're already a math or engineering postdoc.

OP, Jow Forums (not even just /sci/) is packed with undergrads who want to tell you why their particular major is the best and filled with only the smartest/most creative/most pragmatic/highest-paid/whatever people; it's a phase we all go through, and then most people stop giving a shit about it the second they get their degree

>Self teach cs = learning undergrad / first year grad cs yourself
You can self teach anything...
I am self teaching some advanced mathematics.

Yeah but you won't spend an hour reading a single page like if you read a dense math book.

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Sometimes I really want to switch to math from CS, just to see if it's really harder, because I can't imagine it.

There's so much shit in CS and if you have deadlines and assignment defence every week, all hell breaks lose quickly.

Honestly, a big chuck of CS should just be taught in high school if you're in a STEM track or magnet school.

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>that picture

>no sex ed
>no foreign languages
>no language classes in general
>no phys ed
yep sounds american alright

>They're idiots? CS is up there with theoretical physics or pure math.
Kek never change Jow Forums

they actually never bothered to learn programming to the point they needed

>sex ed

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The people who make those arguments went to shit schools that have classes with names like 'Java' or 'Advanced Java Information Systems' or some other useless unacademic shit.

>>no foreign languages

Why bother? Everyone speaks American already.

All american cs programs suck, including yours.

>>no foreign languages
"Wanna learn Spanish? No? Well too bad, time to learn Spanish!"

לא נכון, לא כולם מדברים בשפה הזאת

Com sci shouldn't be called a science only reason it is is quantum computing

Uni should have a tech faculty for programing and computer art and software design (and then a game design club not subjects )

Ok user, please tell us what's the most complex thing you implemented from you cs knowledge and how much time did it took to gather that knowledge from 0.

As a former /sci/ poster, I know why they're saying that. It's because CS is not really a science in the true meaning of the word.

It doesn't have its own realm or methods of study, it relies on other sciences to have an actual scientific body of knowledge.
Without physics and maths, CS would basically not even exist as a field of study. There would be no actual knowledge to teach.
And CS topics are basically just applied physics and applied maths, nothing else. It's general science applied to one particular piece of technology, computers.

In a similar vein, there could be something called Clock Science or Cooking Science. And you'd need a degree to be a clockmaker or a professional cook, right. Same shit with computer "science".
It's an artificial label that was created because universities needed to make money selling a degree and employers needed to require a degree from potential employees.

Programming is overrated as fuck, though, that's why almost everyone can do it. I know people who didn't even graduate from highschool and they work as programmers in Silicon Valley, getting paid like 10 thousand bucks per month after taxes. And they're like 19-20 years old. While other autists get in heavy debt trying to get that CS degree and cram lots of "low level programming" because they think that's really respectable and gives them better chances at getting a job and eventually barely get an internship doing tedious SQL and Java shit for a couple of thousand bucks per month.

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>Uni should have a tech faculty for programing and computer art and software design
Why?
These things are on the level of Trade school, the point of a University is not to give you some skill set for an employer.

>you implemented

What clown college did you go to were all the cs courses were coding?

You really "just" need a physics PhD to do research with quantum computers though

Wish someone would have told me this 7 years ago

>Yeah mate, you could. Then why don't you? Because you can't.
This business major has
scotthyoung.com/blog/myprojects/mit-challenge-2/

>negative values in array gives strange value

Because they're in 2's complement

>he thinks implement solely refers to writing code
Thank you, that's all I needed to know.

>money gud
>history, music, dinosaurs and philosophy no bring money, they bad
>numbers gud
>human stuff bad

Now I'm not telling you to pursue that field first thing out of college, but all great political men were well-versed in history and human-centric knowledge.

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Theoritical physics, maybe, since it's meme tier. But definitely not experimental physics or any type of math. Except maybe (((statistics))); If you even consider it to be maths.

Why do you need to go to college to read history or philosophy books?

I understand your position, and I agree that everyone should at least recognize the fundamental role of philosophy and literature in the development of human knowledge, but that doesn't mean going to college to study them is a good idea.

The whole point of college, in the end, is getting a degree, which will open doors that would be closed otherwise. Period.
Making connections, networking, and yes, even learning itself all come second.
Nearly everything you can learn in college can also be learned outside of college on your own, and with the insane amount of resources currently available, it is now easier than ever. This of course applies to philosophy and literature as well. You have every relevant literary work available right at your fingertips, right now.

And since STEM degrees usually give you more opportunities than humanities degrees, getting a STEM degree is simply a better deal. No one is preventing you from learning anything in your free time.

>The whole point of college, in the end, is getting a degree
shit Americans say

It is though. I'm asian.

Well, tell me what it is, then.

>Anything is easy in restrospect with time and dedication
it makes a good quote

so is a bachelor's in cs enough or should one go for a phd, or finance cs

holy fuck off back to red dit, redditor.

I know how you feel, currently on the last semester of a 3rd world country Bachelor of Technology Electronics degree. I'll probably have to off myself after 30 when I'm homeless.

All math and science is just applied philosophy. That's why /lit/ is the most intelligent board.

And philosophy is applied linguistics. We could go on and it still wouldn't change anything.

>Anything is easy in restrospect with time and dedication. It’s pretty easy to dismiss anything in life.
Yeah but some things are comparatively easy as fuck like middle school or cs.

This.

>Yes, which means that for most people it is an absolutely awful degree.

Degrees aren't job training.

what the fuck kinda answer is this ? All the interviews at tech companies are geared towards post grad CS. Where do you think this magical place you can easily get hired to with a degree in physics is at ? You call them code monkeys but they are some of the best compensated people in the country with a greater degree of career mobility then most industries.

>implying nobody can read textbooks by themselves

And CS majors write the worst code I have ever seen.

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yeah cause all you have to say is "i read textbooks" and magically you get through HR filters and breeze through interviews. You have to do a lot of study before a job interview and thats when you already learned everything. Getting an irrelevant degree is just going to set you back that much longer in your career.