Having systemd forced on me is really uncomfortable but I'm not technical enough to get rid of it...

>Having systemd forced on me is really uncomfortable but I'm not technical enough to get rid of it, or use a more advanced distro that doesn't have it.

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forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-p-7580606.html
youtube.com/watch?v=o_AIw9bGogo
freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/MinimalBuilds/
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It isn't forced on you.

It is.

No it isn't. Your incompetence has no bearing on it.

Systemd is entirely bad. I forget about systemd when i use suckless tools, it helps me forget about the systemd bloat.

But i do understand what you are saying. You either use an advanced distro like gentoo or use a kinda technical distro like void with runit.

So download FreeBSD. It's free.

>have to give up an entire OS because of a program forced upon you by a shitty company and nigger distro maintainers
this is good to you?

it is, you sort of HAVE to use logind or poetering's udev (by design)

You can install Void Linux. Runit is great. Devuan is also a thing.

Also, you can... *cough* install Gentoo. Dead serious on that one, you can get it working with Runit on there too.

One last thing to add, they're not easy, but FreeBSD isn't what I'd call easy too. And True OS has server-ized itself.

>you can get it working with Runit on there too
But OpenRC is better.

what
said. hard dependencies to udev and logind is killing alternatives. if it wasn't for gentoo's eudev literally every single distro would be foced to use systemd if they wanted to have any of the major desktop enviornments packaged.
KDE lets you compile the dependency out so distros like slackware can use plasma (for now).
It's fucking bullshit. my init system doesn't need to be more complicated than a few shell scripts, it doesn't and and shouldnt need to manage logging in and managing my fucking drives and hardware after booting too.

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gentoo is hard to run on slow machines. I had to ditch it after I needed to install audacity on a whim to record something for a lecture and it took a fucking hour to compile.
void is trash with a broken acpi handling. they don't even have proper multilib what the fuck, SLACKWARE figured it out.

Wait, one more thing to add. You can use MX Linux, which is miles easier to use than the rest and uses sysvinit.

IMO I'd go systemd-free if the new init ends up being decent in its own right. Sysvinit is crap a well and was bloated when it came out, while runit is modern and has many of the good elements that systemd has, without the irreplacableness and inportability.

also on an unrelated note, I have this "persons" asshole saved on my pc and I'm not happy about it.
mx is absolute trash. I would rather use a mature distro like slackware if you're going to go that route.

I'm sick and tired of this shit.
YOU CANT JUST RIP DEBIAN OR ARCH REPOS, REMOVE SYSTEMD AND CALL IT A DAY JESUS CHRIST.
They both compile in systemdicks as hard deps and your shit WILL end up broken.
Also apt is trash when used in an "official" capacity, imagine using it on top of shitty hacked together repos.
devuan is shit for the same reason too.

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>if it wasn't for gentoo's eudev
reminder that lenart literally told them to start using systemd

>persons
that was rms's term wasn't it

Yeah, Gentoo isn't the best for everyone. I was about to say you could use an appimage for Audicity, but, crap, there is none, just source code. In many cases there is a downloadable executable you could use. Also, if I remember right, doesn't Gentoo also have binaries you can download, depending on the package and settings you set up? I could be horribly wrong about that.

As for Void, how is ACPI broken? It relates to shutdown and rebooting and all that, all seems to work. It responds to the power button too. I haven't even had problems with it during the short time I used it on my gaming laptop, and it was crap with the distro (blame Nvidia). Might want to test again though. Also multilib works, just add the multilib repo and the nonfree multilib one if needed. It's how you can install Steam on there.

How? It's basically a service supervisor on top of crusty sysvinit.

this rustles my jimmies

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Be honest with you, logind and udev have their purposes and aren't bad... when as separate libraries. Eudev, as you mentioned, and elogind allow us to use other inits. The problem was logind being so tied to systemd initally, requiring a fucking fork to make it into more of a library.

only for a few packages like libreoffice and firefox.
There are overlays with binaries but again it's mostly for browsers.
Also keeping all my useflags in check lest I have to recompile my entire system was a pain, and I always end up running an outdated system because I rarely have more than one machine on me (grad school) and emerging @world means I would be sans computer for over a day sometimes.
Gentoo is amazing when you have a very strong computer or a binhost/distcc server, it's just not practical for someone like me with an old laptop as a main machine.
I'm back on arch now but I'm going to move to hyperbola soon. This machine doesn't have a wifi whitelist so I can use a librekernel and I like the idea of a stable artix. The few packages that I need to be bleeding edge I can just compile myself or easily get off the AUR.

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I guess Jow Forums hates MX Linux, eh?

That said, might be right. MX Linux is using Debian repos jammed with newer packages and a system lacking systemd. Not a good idea. I mean, who knows, I use KDE Neon as my primary laptop OS and it's been stable, and it smells like a dirty hack when you have the newest KDE shit slapped on top of Ubuntu 18.04, which normally has its own older versions of KDE libraries. Neon already breaks the LXQt packaged in the Ubuntu repositories and anything compiled for those older Qt and KDE libs that aren't well handled by default with how they do things, like a PPA for 18.04 with Qt software. They might have some method for getting Qt programs in the Ubuntu repositories generally working though, for example, qBittorrent from the Ubuntu repository, despite being compiled for the default 5.9 Qt, does work though, funnily enough. That said, there might be a difference between a toolkit and a DE... and an init system, when it comes to breakages.

One thing to say though, Devuan is not the same as MX Linux in terms of just ripping out Debian repos and removing systemd. Devuan involves recompiled Debian packages that are built in mind of a lack of systemd. Otherwise there would be no point in Devuan. Apt might not be your favorite, but then you wouldn't be using anything Debian-based if you wanted to avoid Apt anyways.

If you're not technical enough to get rid of systemd, or use a systemd-less distro, then it shouldn't have any impact on how you use the OS and you're only regurgitating opinions you've read from another technical users who actually have reasons to hate systemd. Kill yourself for not having an actual opinion.

>How? It's basically a service supervisor on top of crusty sysvinit.
At least it actually works.

Proof? If that's what he said, he sounds like he's entitled for every distro to just use systemd. I mean, he did create Pulseaudio (which I feel is somewhat underappreciated, it's stable now and I can play a game with music playing in the background and hear both at the same time for once), and systemd has some good ideas underneath its pile of mistakes, but not everyone should be shoved to using systemd.

Same as runit.

That said, OpenRC indeed is good, it just isn't what I'd call a replacement, more like a stopgap nature by extending sysvinit. Runit is what happens when such a service supervisor becomes an init system, and is able to break away from the System V legacy of old Linux inits.

>Same as runit.
lol

A bit of self-correction; I meant acting entitled.

>if you're not strong enough to fight off the black dude raping your ass you should just take it and shut up. bigot.
runit is not good enough to replace sysv

>waahh I dislike this init run script help me they're raping me :'(
lol

>Proof?
their mailing lists

How in the heck does runit not work? I used Void Linux on an older laptop of mine (Dell Latitude E6430), and Void Linux, let alone runit, were pretty damn stable when using it as a desktop. Services added nicely, stopped nicely, rebooted nicely, blah blah blah.

forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-p-7580606.html

void isn't actually that difficult, i recommend you try it in a virtual machine. everything you need to know to start out can be found in the void wiki. the installation itself is pretty easy, it's an ncurses based installer so it's not quite a graphical interface, but it's very intuitive and still lets you customize stuff. after the installation itself there is plenty of stuff to figure out but in the end you are rewarded with a very simple, very unique and systemd-free system. i thought void was a meme before i actually tried and used it and now i don't want to use anything else, nothing really comes close.

Besides, adding on, I like the parallel booting of services in runit, the minimalism, and the fact that adding a service (funnily enough systemd is similar in this regard) is done via symlinking,

i have never had runit NOT reboot
systemd? way too often way way waaaaaaay too often, it was supposed to an init - it can't even do that

i could use it but i remember the founder went missing and also reading a post of his(?) was really bitchy/negative something about how ungrateful it was that he spend a year making the pkg manager or smth

can you stop shilling this shit?
void only works as a distro on some weebs le minumal 15 year old thinkpad.

besides void there was obarun [arch/openbox]

thon (contraction of 'that one') is more grammatical and follows established english language conventions

>obarun
i don't get why he didn't just maintain a custom repo instead of creating a site and forum which almost no one uses

Wait a minute, I think I remembered this Phoronix article the forum links to. Good thing Gentoo is a compiled distro and is hard to make it exclusively systemd. And that they really love OpenRC.

Does a Dell Latitude E6430 count as an "weebs le minumal 15 year old thinkpad?"

I also could probably got it working on my current Omen gaming laptop if it wasn't for the Nvidia Optimus being a pain in the ass to deal with, while Ubuntu (well, KDE Neon to be exact) worked quite well after installing the drivers. Be honest with you, that same problem applied to anything non-Ubuntu, even Solus was a pain to initally deal with until it suddenly fixed itself and the Nvidia drivers works fine.

That problem that I often have is that I getaround 40Hz when displaying anything, and stuff like games had awful performance. I tried whatever I could find, but nothing worked, and even the easy Solus (temporarily; it suddenly stopped after some time) suffered the same shit, as well as Devuan. Anything that wasn't Ubuntu seemed to have this problem.

Here's how it really works.
Redhat adopted systemd
the developers of other big distro's got talking to
the devs at redhat, and they were convinced and liked what they saw of systemd. Then along comes spottyfuck the fatass know-nothing from spottyfatfuck linux, a distro that he made by adding a new theme and some logos. Oh NO ! he cries systemd , I know nothing about that shit and its interfering with my ability to look like I know anything about this shit. BOOO he cries BOOOO DOWN WITH SYSTEMD. then a load of knownothings on dickwadchan start believing its bad too. They make up mantras like, systemd sucks because it's monolithic, then they argue and say things like it sucks because it replaces the init summat or other i dunno its all shit to me, but it sucks because someone told me it does.

and that, in a nutshell is what those who oppose systemd are

too bad openrc depends on sysv

>and they were convinced and liked what they saw of systemd.
which was they didn't have to maintain scripts anymore ie laziness

Because, as I said, it's a service supervisor. That's a big reason I like Runit, that's a full init system with service supervision.

Oh jeezass give it up for fucks sake - go an make your own distro you wank stain

Same here. I tried Slackware and Void but didn't have the time to get into compiling all the programs I need but which aren't in the "repositories"

that's the reason fgt the only reason, because as init systemd sucks MAJOR ass, and that's recent and not so recent observations. why does it suck so muck fgt - wasn't is supposed to be The init, how come it fails at what it was supposedly set out to be?

Systemd does have problems, and it being a set of components compiled against each other (like how logind needs a fork to be init agnostic) is its biggest one. It does get over-hated as many like to think of it as completely worthless (when it does have ideas the like of OpenRC and runit can take ques from, let alone crusty sysvinit), but it does have some problems it should fix up. And no, it isn't because I make a trashy distro or I look stupid with systemd, I'm no "spottyfuck the fatass know-nothing."

That's indeed a problem with a smaller distro anyways. Solus in a nutshell for me.

One thing one could use is Devuan though, since it's Debian based, it should work with most .deb packages one would install.

it reeks of amature shit
>constant problems with the dev team like nigs fucking disapearing and others stealing donations
>can't keep their forums up
>outdated and incomplete wiki
>runit is shit for "complicated" services like acpi and bumblebee
>shitty installer, either you go graphical or chroot, not both. Even fucking arch understands this
>can't package even simple shit like latex. When the retarded arch maintainers can do something and you can't, you know you have a problem.
If you want a binary distro with no systemd here are your real options
>bleeding edge
artix (it has problems too but not as much as void)
hyperbola (actually good)
>binary base with source packaging
slackware
salix
buildng your own gentoo stage4 + binhost
>source
gentoo
source mage

thats it. Everything else is hacked together trash that will die in the next 5 years or is just unsuitable for day to day use.
slackware has 3rd party repos that will build and package everything on slackbuilds.org for you. Problem is some packages will be outdated but for those specific ones you can just build them yourself.
devuan has hacked together repos that are pretty broken unless all you do on your computer is use xfeces with fireshit and nomascotoffice.

also with slackware, you can rest assured that any problem you have will be adressed by some boomer who has been using it since the 90's
the alien repo is filled with great alterative isos, kde plasma packaged for slackware, build scripts etc.

It actually doesn't. openrc-init can act as PID 1 just fine. I once wrote a custom sysvinit-9999 package that just installs a few symlinks and conversion scripts for it. No idea why Gentoo devs don't get rid of sysv at this point.

>artix
that's that manjaro openrc 'fork' isn't it

why didn't all these fucks just publish a unofficial runit repo reeeeeeeeeee

no they use the arch repos but have the IQ to recompile daemons and other packages to not use systemd as a dep. they still have problems but in general its a better approach than manHARO openrc and the trash the parabola offers.
hyperbola is the best approach to this, but it's linux-libre only unless you want to configure your own kernel. (which isn't too hard)

slackware is a great alternative, especially now that the money problems seem to be over and 15 is right around the corner. it seems hard at first but it's so simple it gives you complete control. its very hard to break a slackware install like you can with gentoo and debian.

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If you're not "technical enough" to get rid of it, you're also not "technical enough" to be impaired by it in any way.
Or rather, you're not "technical enough" to see and take advantage of the massive benefits it brings. Get out of here.
>B-But this angry neckboard on his blog... he... he said! "NOT UNUGGS! MONOLIFF! BLOOTED!!!!1111"

The tragedy of systemd

youtube.com/watch?v=o_AIw9bGogo

The only valid point against systemd is the code quality and bugs. Yes, systemd has bugs and yes they need to be addressed.
Every other point made by anti-systemdfags is nonsense FUD.

anti-systemdfags in a nutshell:
>muh unix philosophy
doesn't really apply here, the same reason why it doesn't apply to the linux kernel. do you want to pipe init into another program? do you want to pipe udev into another program? do you want to pipe login sessions into another program? do you want to pipe IPC into another program?
no.
you can also make the case that you could provide executables that allow you to pipe anything from the existing systemd implementation into another program, I wouldn't see why you would want to do that, other than for journald which _has_ support for piping.
>muh modularity
systemd is modular in the same sense that the linux kernel is modular. arguing that systemd isn't modular means you also agree that linux isn't modular:
freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/MinimalBuilds/
to give you one example: you can replace systemd-resolved with dnscrypt-proxy, systemd doesn't force you to use systemd-resolved.
>muh systemd has bugs
Yes it has, and as every other software they should get fixed.
It's only so apparent that systemd has bugs because it's one of the most crucial components of your system next to the kernel, as opposed to your favorite text editor or calculator.
>muh [insert website that tells you how to think and why systemd is bad, instead of critically thinking]
Think for yourself for one moment before mindlessly regurgitating what other people are saying.

>systemd doesn't force you to use systemd-resolved.
distros do
try to fuck with systemd and you'll break debian and fedora 100%.
arch sometimes with the right AUR openrc packages but even then pacman only has systemd hooks and will give you upgrade errors when you try to blacklist systemd.
fuck off you dumb nigger, this is about potterings shitty programs being forced down my throat.
next you're going to defend fireshit pulling in pulse.
the absolute fucking monkeys on this board

Stop having opinions on shit that you don't understand.

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