I’ve been learning programming, but I’ve reached the point that I need to specialise to move forward with my learning. Which career paths are the least soul crushing and most rewarding? My original plan was game dev, but I’ve already read too many horror stories about how terrible that path is, so I need a new route.
As an additional note, what is the best way to get started learning whatever path you advise?
Thanks.
web development
you should learn about data structures and system programming before you even think about specializing
if you dont know what you want to do, you're not experienced enough. Try different projects from different fields. I, for instance, see myself liking both embedded programming, graphics programming, sysadmin, and webdev. Thing is, you have to try them in order to really know if you like these paths.
I mean the real world work environment of these jobs, which is something I can’t learn from doing projects at home.
What's it like?
lemme hijack ur bitchass
3 years experience as 'full stack' webdev (lol) at one of uber/airbnb/square/stripe, working mostly in js, python, and go
what do to avoid coming ai apocalypse
That image lies. There is no programmer shortage and devs are not in any demand. It's a combination of HR retardation and sociopathic conartistry from company execs. Avoid the whole industry if you can.
Then how do I use my passion for programming to make money?
Same, OP. I need to pick one of the following specializations for my major
>Algorithms
>Machine learning
>Database shit
>Networking
>Embedded systems
>Visual computing
No clue which to pick.
When in doubt, choose whichever one is the least specialised
This
Not sure how it is in america, but aren't these specializations still very different depending on your college?
Dunno here in Germany I only have, what I would translate as, "media computer science", "software engineering", "cloud&internet" as specializations, which could be about everything.
Pick machine learning
Depends where you live and your interests. I kind of fell into reverse engineering and cyber security. I love it but it's not for everyone.
In the US, in my experience, a degree is a baseline to get past HR. As long as it is vaguely related to the job description (or sometimes not even related at all) it doesn't matter, if you have the skills and/or the drive to learn.
garbage honestly
I’m curious about the work environment. Which has the best work/life balance, pay, opportunities for advancement, etc. I know this is also variable, but are there any general trends?
make a startup
Pic looks really out of date or made by someone who has no clue.
It probably was made by some hr cunt so made by someone with literally no clue.
Be part of it
I'm currently specializing in web development but definitely want to switch paths later on, It's just that when I look at job openings around here 95% of programming ones are for web development.
Hey guys! This thread looks relevant, I wanted to ask a quick question.
I'm studying to take the Comptia A+. Aside from building a gaming PC and setting up routers I have no other technical experience. How did you guys learn? Are there any books that would help me in any way? Youtube series? I'm leaning towards IT security or administration. I'm taking the 901 and 902, and I realized that there is a new version coming out so I'll have to catch up on some information. I plan on lurking this board a few hours every day as well. Sorry if it's a noob question.
To add to this, I also plan to take the A+ security and networking certification exams after passing the core A+ exam.
Game design is not in demand. Development is, depending on specialization, but anyone who uses those titles interchangeably deserves to be shot
Gay
CompTIA is ok, but there are better certs to get depending on what you want to do.
>import
Psst nothing personnel, kid
How do I get into game development specifically, then? Master C++? I’m really hoping someone can point me in the right direction
>being a brainlet that only uses frameworks
If you act like that in the industry you won't last long kid.
I already told you dumb nigger you should learn about data structures and system programming. Game programming is a pretty involved field that takes a good deal of skill and experience.
>falling for the game dev meme
There's already enough faggots that churn out nigger tier games we don't need anymore
Game programming is a joke, they just use loads of frameworks and libraries. even your local pajeet can makes games.
I second this.
Spend a few weeks on really understanding it.
Do you recommend any books or websites? Or even videos? I’m not sure where to start.
>There is no programmer shortage and devs are not in any demand.
t. deemed "not culturally fit" to any company
You're lying. All decent devs I know (myself included) are being constantly bombarded by headhunters and other companies' HR departments.
Yeah my university alone. Our campus is just for IT 5000 people. 60-70% of those are gamedev. And another solid 20% webdev. Why study just to be unemployed when you are done?
Any data structures and algorithms book will do really.
You could just try this: coursera.org
Not only do gamedevs get exploited hard in the market, but it seems such a childish/low goal for adult to have anyway
>hahaa, I want my job to be fun
>I got it, I'll spend my days writing backend code for a game that some NPCs will play on the shitter for two weeks before moving onto the next and forgetting mine ever existed
If you go into "triple A" you will have to compete with literally ten thousands of other applicants and if you get the job you will get exploited, raped up the shitter and discarded because the current game didn't sell 20 Million copies in the first five minutes after release.
And if you go indie you might as well kill yourself cause now you compete against Triple A NPCs and ten thousands of other indie devs.
Not like Webdev is any better.
>low goal for adult to have anyway
how is that lower than programming some business software for something else
at least you're making something people actually like
Because for whatever reason most people on earth want to study useless shit that they're 'passionate' about
>coping for childish addictions
Isn't that self-explanatory?
>acquire the skill to build anything
>choose to build children's toys
>choose to build software to make other people richer
how is that a better option?
>building something that actually betters society
>building retarded games that lead people to piss away time
r/learnprogramming has a good faq/wiki. Check out /t/, i think there is a thread there with a ton of CS texts to download. Learn to search for things yourself and pick what's appropriate, if you have people spoonfeeding you all the time, you aren't going to get very far.
most application programmers aren't making society any better than video game programmers are
you're a cog in a machine making someone else rich
>being on the cutting edge of tech is not making society better
>but making pointless vapid games is just as good
you're taking the worst case of one and the best case of another
>you're a cog in a machine to make someone else rich
That applies to games too, retard. I know you think the average programmer is sitting in an Intel cubicle writing shit no-one will ever see, but that's not the case. A lot of us improve other people's lives, work and safety.
Modern games are fucking cancer built to addict you like slot machines.
There is no best case for games. You're contributing to cancer either way, you might as well sell weed or vape accessories for a living.
>Modern games are fucking cancer built to addict you like slot machines.
again, same argument applies to both, there's some good games, and then there's some mobile shit
just like there's some good tech jobs and alot of pointless ones
Yeah and movies are drugs too, better stop making them
Not him, but movies last around 2 hours. I had around 700 hours played on just ONE of my MMO characters before I deleted that shit.
The hell is system programming
Are you stupid or just ill-informed? They employ psychologists now in the game design so they'll get people to play again and again and again. The most famous example is the random loot system, it's the video game version of a slot machine.
Tv and movies do not gave that.
For AAA development you'll want to master C++ (up through C++14 at the least, probably 17, and maybe look into 20 if you're into core stuff), data structures, parallel programming, have a general understanding of how game engines work, and then choose from one of the following specializations: AI, Physics, Core, Platform, Audio, Graphics, Gameplay. Audio is the only specialization I have first hand experience with, so that's as far as I can explain on that front
Valve is the only company that have employed a psychologist to the best of my knowledge
again, not every game is an addictive piece of shit, I wouldn't be against the mobile game industry collapsing and never recovering
I agree that's a problem, but you're generalizing all games from a very specific sub market.
That's what idiots started to call real programming when web dev using super high level langs and a million frameworks became the norm
based boomer
It seems you think video game companies are Santa's workshops instead of money-grubbing, soulless monsters that they are. MMORPG's and mobile games are a multibillion dollar industry.
Yes, not all games are created intentionally to be addictive, but their net positive contribution to society is still near zero.
>It seems you think video game companies are Santa's workshops instead of money-grubbing, soulless monsters that they are
It's a spectrum
Entertainment and art is a contribution to society
Okay, so it seems clear to me (as I said in the original post) that game dev is probably a bad choice. So what is a good choice? What are solid options to look at?
Embedded or full stack, depending on your preferences. If you like to constantly expand your territory and/or get bored doing repetitive stuff, go with full stack. If you like electronics, delving deep into shit and like the idea of tinkering with real life stuff, go with embedded.
If you're a brain-chad, go study AI.
Thank you very much for the insight.
Should I lie on my resume?
Depends. Do you want to build a career or just get a job? If you lie on your resume, that'll be hanging over your head forever in case you try to make a career for yourself. All it takes is one envious/asshole coworker or a boss to snoop around and you're fucked.
lol
I just need a job right now. Besides, if my work proves consistent and profitable for a business, will they even care if I lied as long as I produce results?
>if my work proves consistent and profitable for a business, will they even care if I lied as long as I produce results?
They'll fire you immediately and you'll be unable to use that company as a reference in the future. It's not about profit, it's about trust and saving face.
Lol. What's the likelihood of getting caught though?
It seems you don't understand what it means in this business to be labeled a liar or an untrustworthy person.
Go ahead, try it, and end up as a sysadmin at some high school for the rest of your life.
Care to explain instead of lay insults, Dick?
Kind of generic. I was asking more for specifics about
>understand what it means in this business to be labeled a liar or an untrustworthy person
>in this business
Why does it matter in programming if I am trustworthy or not? I am sure someone will be reviewing my code, so it's not like I could slip anything by, even if I wanted to. It's also hard to lie with code.
Besides, what business throws away talent if it means losing competent, executable ideas?
this
Not lying at all. Devs who have been in the industry for a few years and know people in the industry get harassed by HR because the retarded HR faggots only care about poaching employees from other companies. There are near zero actual new hires going on.
Data science, make money, fun math
>If you lie on your resume, that'll be hanging over your head forever in case you try to make a career for yourself.
What kind of weird world do you live in where you think this is true? It's not like a resume you use today is going to be looked at 10 years from now.
what kind of lying are you talking about? is it a huge one like: you know nothing about programming, but you're saying you're an awesome programmer? or is it a little one like: you're saying you're very experienced with java, but you've actually only done a little bit with it?
>They'll fire you immediately...
You are living in some strange kind of novel there, kiddo. That's not at all how the real world works.
>this business
"this business" is actually highly varied and multi-faceted. there are all kinds of different ways to make a living as a programmer. The world of software dev is nothing like the insular world of, say, Hollywood, where if you fuck up then everyone knows. Hell, you could be the guy who caused some 100 million user data breach at a massive company and you'd still be able to find good work.
I can't stand the average web developer nor the average startup guy.
They're both insufferable morons; one's just sleazier than the other.
don't listen to that other guy. he's on crack or something. the software dev world is still the wild wild west. sure, lots of sjw bullshit and stiff whitecollar workplaces, but for every shithole like that, there are a 1000 scrappy fun places where they don't give a flying fuck about your background...they just want results. that's the beauty of this industry.
>t. boomer
Fuck off you old piece of shit. You are everything wrong with this industry. Get the fuck out of the way. Retire. Die. Anything. Just fucking disappear you senile sack of shit.
Closer to saying I have a degree but in reality never really finished.
Thanks. I need to look around and see if I can maybe telecommute or see if a job is local.
>lying about a degree
oh that’s kind of a big lie. They call schools to verify that shit. If they find you lied about that, your ass is grass.
>Closer to saying I have a degree but in reality never really finished.
I'm in the same boat as you, man. I finished 3 years. So, on my resume, instead of saying "BS in Computer Science", I say "Studied Computer Science at [UNIVERSITY] from 1990-1993". In my entire 25+ year career, I've only ever had one person ask me if I got my degree, and I told them no. Everyone else just kind of glazes over it and assumes that I got my degree.
How many years do you have under your belt? at university, and at programming in general.
I guess it is. Looks like the Educational-Industrial Complex is hard at work keeping those student loans rolling.
>According to the laws of several states, the cardinal sin of resume fraud is falsifying your educational record.
>Under the Texas Penal Code, for example, it is illegal to use, or even to just claim to hold, a postsecondary degree you know to be fraudulent, substandard, or fictitious in order to obtain employment.
What a load of crap.
At university, I have around 4. Programming, man, depends on which language. I've probably been programming in C for almost 10 years now.
>to get started learning whatever path
This is the problem of this industry. There is no transversal knowledge path in IT strong enough that can get you fed for a number of years. There are technologies that come and go, and that is why the industry is constantly hiring cheap grads with 2 years experience. They don't need anything else. The fact that no official titulation is needed further proofs this.
My advice: avoid. You will be OK for 2 years, or 5 years, and then you will have to start over in a completely new tech, but then you will be competing with younger, cheaper guys. The return/investment ratio for any computer related career is ridiculously low compared to whatever other discipline.
t. have 2 degrees in computer engineering in Europoor country, plus certs, and have been developing software for 11 years non stop, and not exactly webdev shit.
I can corroborate this. You will hear from people already in the industry that there's tons of demand, but it's really only for people who already have 3-5 years of experience. HR is really adamant about this silly "years of experience" metric (only the number really matters) and you will have a hard time breaking in.
It wasn't this hard a few years ago, so a lot of people who have been in the industry for say 3-5 years had a relatively easy time getting in, and get tons of good job offers now that they have a lot of experience, so their perspective is heavily skewed.
Another thing is that developers like to brag about getting tons of job offers all the time, when the vast majority are contract spam from Indian recruiting firms.
i think the 10 years of experience is going to overshadow the non-degree. hell, when i see job postings, a lot of them say experience: degree in cs or equivalent industry experience. you're probably fine with that. but def don't say that you got your degree. that's a pretty big lie and one that's easy for them to try to verify.
btw, i have a friend who didn't even graduate from high school and he's been a very successful software dev for the past 15 years.
so, play up your experience. downplay the piece of paper from university.
A soul sucking hell, but it pays the bills.
shouldve gotten a degree in management instead of doubling on Computer Engineering
Thanks, user. I really appreciate this advice.
There is no degree in management. There are business courses (pmo) that cost an arm and a leg, and they are not worth the effort because such positions don't come up frequently, and even then no course is required.
Managers are just psycopaths here. Their bosses demand them results, but give them no budget, so results always come at the expense of the subordinates. That requires a special type of person, one that I don't want to be. I just want to live off my skill.