C#

inb4 is not a protection spell.
t. webdev, because you probably are if you think it doesn't matter. if everyone was that much of a brainlet you'd be running a javascript kernel right now.

the only reason you would ever need performance is to make an OS or to program NASA satellites or whatever
Nobody uses C for actual innovative programming
>t. webdev

Pros:
- actually useful high level stuff
- easy to decompile and inject
Cons:
- microsoft
- easy to decompile and inject
- slow
- bad support for other operating systems

>cons: microsoft
why the fuck do you care? it's FOSS. that's what should matter.

This is why websites are bloated clunky pieces of shit. Your mentality and others that have it caused rhis.
>dw about efficiency or performance because modern hardware can take it
You should always be trying to make your stuff thr best it can be in everyway.

>it doesn't matter who the maintainer is
You don't honestly believe that, do you?

Is visual studio the only option for it?

People in Rimworld Discord say they manage to develop on Linux with monodevelop.

I wish more webdevs were into performance. Query optimisation, concurrency patterns, streaming response generation and embed specialised caches can be pretty fun.

if the maintainer is a huge company with infinite money then yeah that's great. fund that shit.

you can use the compiler like any other. if you mean for (smart) editor choice, vsc works great too.

Microsoft smothered projects with its EEE before. FOSS or not, Microsoft being behind anything is a huge downside and you can't just brush it off with "so what i don't care!".

Abstraction makes me want to kill myself unless it's Python tier where one heavy calculation is just one line. Most "high abstraction" languages are a mess of frameworks and brackets

Being backed by a big company is a huge UPside because it won't just die tommorow, you can depend on it. It's not simply open source - it's an open STANDARD. Even if you couldn't fork it nobody in principle could stop you from reimplementing it.

I'm not really able to have a conversation with you if you just ignore everything I say.

I'm only a second year student so I don't really know shit. I did c++ in my first year and c# in second. I find c# so much easier and faster to get shit done with. I understand why c++ can be better for some applications but c# is just so easy to use.

Meh I didnt like the layout but that might've just been me using whatever ide microsoft is using, personally I like python it's easy as fuck to putz around in and they constantly up keep it and it's not bare bones like C which is a downside if you want speed.

It is the best statically typed language. It doesn't really have any uses outside of enterprise at the moment and I doubt everything just works on Linux. Ultimately, I got sick of writing c# though. JavaScript is nicer and other languages are better for performance, compatibility, etc.

What are they going to EEE? Their own product? LMAO.

There is a JetBrains IDE for it as well. Rider.

The product that's going to choose to rely on C#.

Do you even know what EEE means? Please explain your reasoning how a C# project is affected by it but, let's say, a C++ project isn't. Hint: they both are affected.

MS has direct control over C#, not over C++.

So? Do you think the changes to the language are retroactively applied to the project or something?

/thread

> MS has direct control over C#, not over C++.
yes, so? What can they really do that fucks over C#?

Please remember that the dotnet core is FOSS.

so even if they fuck it over, you can fork it?

It's easily the best multipurpose language right now. Definitely give it a shot.

It's literally open source with a very permissive license. Anyone could take it and keep it going. Microsoft has a huge investment in it due to easy development in Azure products with integrations and documentation; they won't stop growing and maintaining the language for decades.

VS Code is FOSS and works on Linux, but you can use any editor you want. Look up "omnisharp".

It is a great general purpose programming language that is the middle between extreme power like C++ and extreme ease and comfy-ness like python.
You can use it for webshit (ASP core is the fastest and most featureful web framework), games (Unity and monogame which dominate platformer and indie development plus Urho and UE bindings), desktop programs (UWP, WPF, Avalonia plus Qt, gtk, nuklear bindings), mobile programs (Xamarin forms)
Although it is not as powerful as C++, it is not far away running on the fastest VM around with good FFI and pointer arithmetic support.
The tooling is also great and it is not IDE dependent like Java.

Fuck Pajeets that shit out C# assemblies that aren't cross-platform compatible.
It should be easy enough to write an assembly that patrician ObjectPascal users can employ, yet somehow these niggers (who work at a very large tech company) manage to completely fuck it up and make their shit unusable outside their own very specific framework.

This.

I mostly agree, the only thing I can dissagree on is the fact that it's "slow", really depends what you're doing. It's still faster than the pycuck

>it won't just die tommorow
Clearly you haven't been developing software for long.
Microsoft can and do kill shit off all the fucking time.

As opposed to hobbyist projects that live forever, right.

If you want to run it on the hardware you developed it on yes.
Try running 20+ year old software on machines today.

>MS will kill C#
just ask yourself, do you really believe this?
C# have never been in a better state than its is now, and it will get even better

After coming from C++ to C# 2 years ago i was never even felt using C++, its just disgusting.
It like you go from cheap headphones to something more expensive, its one way turn.

If you are a heavy user of stl s in c++, you will really like LINQ (select, aggregate, where, transform). Google the IEnumerable class and see for yourself.

I thought Jow Forums was a C/C++ board.... Where did all these MS shilling pajeets come from?

What if what you thought was wrong?

>Ah they are not using TRUE programming language, must be pajeets.

lmao @ your lives jobless losers

bump

Hey stupid webdev, you ever used Apache or Nginx? Guess what they're written in...

> no switch fallthrough by default
dropped

what the fuck is innovative programming, sounds boring

hardware only gets twice as good every few years, these guys get 2^1024 times slower in that time

I'm new to learning C#, do I really need to install visual studio or is VSC enough? I've been using the latter to learn some early stuff well but every single tutorial out there starts with this massive 5gb install.

If you can write C++ already, just learn it. It's much easier.

It's much nicer as a language, but you pay for it with runtime cost and memory usage.

Attached: forgiveness.jpg (500x236, 110K)

Tell that to silverlight

Microsoft stopped supporting Silverlight because literally no one was using it. This is not the case with .NET Core.

imagine being retarded enough to choose C# over Kotlin

kotlin was dead on arrival with the full java support autism and it won't ever have important/simple features available in C# because of the JVM limitations.
It is halfbaked from the ground up (e.g unsigned and coroutines) and it is no better than Java 8+
It is even barely used for android and has scala tier tooling

>kotlin was dead on arrival with
Uhm, is that why everyone is writing apps in Kotlin now?

> won't ever have important/simple features available in C#
You mean like first class functions which C# does not have? Or the lack of fucking libraries, which is even worse on .NET core?

>it is no better than Java 8+
top fucking kek

Worst part is now that quarkus.io/ got released, there is even less reason to use .NET core in backends than before.

>everyone is using kotlin
nice delusions
>C# has no first class functions
why lie on the internet? You can't even marshal functions to native on the JVM which is a simple task in C# and .NET
>top fucking kek
COPE. Kotlin bring nothing new nor does it do anything better than C# and Java.
>quarkus
solves a problem that doesn't exist in .net core as it runs well in containers.
Also, there is no full-stack web framework that has features or performance close to ASP Core.
Spring is close but its performance is x10 times slower and it is bloated as fuck.

>COPE. Kotlin bring nothing new nor does it do anything better than C# and Java.
Lmfao enjoy your async/await stone age programming. Coroutines are the best thing ever.
>solves a problem that doesn't exist in .net core as it runs well in containers.
Nice, you didn't understand the point of the project. JVM projects don't only run well on containers, they run better than .NET Core. Vertx is the best performing framework up to this day. With Quarkus containers will even launch faster with less memory footprint, thanks to graal.

Also Java virtually runs everywhere, where does C# run (apart from pajeetoverflow KEK). Java runs on Netflix, Google, Twitter etc..

async/await ARE coroutines you retard
>run better than .NET Core
and that is why you need quarkus kek
>Vertx
is not a full-stack web framework. It is just a wrapper for low level async IO lib with barely any abstractions to make it decent for building full websites.
>Java virtually runs everywhere
So does the CLR. You can also run C# on consoles and mac/iOS which Java has a hard time doing.
>Java runs on Netflix, Google...
It is the opposite you mong.
ASP is second to PHP in usage on the internet. All Java web frameworks combined get barely half that number.
And again you have nothing good to say about kotlin itself.

it's not like he'll end up unemployed from learning C#. Java is worth learning but not the only language you should know just cause it's the most popular. And in some areas it's even preferable to learn C#. He should learn both

>async/await ARE coroutines you retard
They have the same goal but they're not the same thing you fucking retard.
>and that is why you need quarkus kek
No, you don't NEED it. It makes something good even better.
>is not a full-stack web framework.
when the fuck did I say it was you fucking idiot? It's a 10x better performing framework than anything .NET Core has to offer.
>You can also run C# on consoles and mac/iOS which Java has a hard time doing.
lol what? Proof? Unlike C# Java even has proper GUI frameworks that run on all platforms, unlike Pajeetsoft. You'll have to use shit like Mono.
>It is the opposite you mong.
Source.
>ASP is second to PHP in usage on the internet.
#AHJAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH

Please, PLEASE leave this board immediately you bootcamp gimp. You know as much about programming as my grandma.

you're both brainlets

You can download the Visual Studio tools to compile on the CLI... but it’s not a first choice. You can probably use VSC to some degree.

Too much info to process it seems.
>same goal but not the same thing
You are not pretending to be retarded, right?
>x10 better performing
It better be for an async oriented micro framework being compared to a full-stack framework.
Comparing aples to apples, .NET Core wins every benchmark on The Benchmark Games vs the JVM.
ASP Core, which is a full-stack web framework has performance 10x times better than its Java counter-part(spring). You should search the difference between a full-stack and a micro framework.
>lol what? proof?
It runs where ever you compile it. It is not black magic as both VMs are written in C++.
>proper GUI frameworks
There is nothing proper about swing and bloated JavaFx. Java is not used for GUI on Linux and it is certainly is not used to create them on windows.
C# has Avalonia with reactiveUI and gtk/qt bindings which are way better than the GUI garbage that google got sued for.
>Source
Use your few braincells and think. Google and netflix are not platforms that Java runs on. It is these websites that use Java internally.
>#mental breakdown
COPE

Did it take you that long to google yourself an answer?

You keep giving me answers that don't even make sense and they sound googled which fits to the amount of time you need to respond.

>You are not pretending to be retarded, right?
ad hominem. nice answer
>better performance
You are comparing .NET Core to Spring instead of .NET TOP KEK. JVM Frameworks SHIT on .NET Core techempower.com/benchmarks/
>It runs where ever you compile it. It is not black magic as both VMs are written in C++.
That's no proof. I want a source.
>JavaFX bloated
JavaFX is the least bloated GUI framework after Qt. Nobody even uses Mono because you can't build proper GUIs with it.
>Google and netflix are not platforms that Java runs on.
Uhm, what? Netflix still runs on Java to this day. They even are responsible for several widely used libaries like RXJava. Again no source

stackshare.io/netflix/netflix
stackshare.io/google/google
stackshare.io/android
stackshare.io/instagram/instagram

C# nowhere HAHAHAHAHA

Again you made a fool of yourself

Attached: firefox_2019-03-12_23-51-33.png (714x182, 11K)

Many paid pajeet Microshills on Jow Forums today like just proved.

Couldn't expect less from someone who thinks async/await are not coroutines
>comparing .net core to spring
ASP Core is not .NET Core. Learn to read.
ASP Core is not a micro service yet it has performance close to micro services but where are the full-stack java frameworks? you need to scroll down beyond the limit to find those.
What about comparing the same thing without frameworks?
benchmarksgame-team.pages.debian.net/benchmarksgame/faster/csharp.html
Java still loses and Kotlin is even slower.
>no proof
compile it yourself
>JavaFX is the least bloated
Sure thing retard.
>C# nowhere
trends.builtwith.com/framework
COPE intensifies
>HAHAHA
funny way to Seethe

Attached: AAwAF.png (1032x463, 76K)

if you're anywhere near competent in C++17 you have every right to laugh in his face

KEK what is this image supposed to prove? You're comparing Swing to FX? FX is a way more powerful GUI framework. Swing is from the 90s.
>benchmarksgame-team.pages.debian.net/benchmarksgame/faster/csharp.html
posts the most normie benchmark site that has ever existed.

Why don't you comment on actual professional benchmarks that actually measure how they perform in backends? techempower.com/benchmarks/

C# ABSOLUTELY sucks there TOP KEK

>trends.builtwith.com/framework
?????

I'm a blockchain developer and I tried porting a library to .net core the other day. It's fucking horrible. It lacks tons of cryptography libraries, most of them still have to be ported from .NET

You don't have this problem with Java. Even if you're running your Java/Kotlin code on GraalVM you can use common Java libs.

Attached: 2352.jpg (646x687, 69K)

C# is great, I prefer it over Java. Its fun to write, has great performance for a highlevel language, and theres many C# jobs.

Also .Net Core is multiplatform and if there isnt something supported yet (like GUI on OSX/Linux) just use an open source library. itll work.

I use C# primarily in my current job. one of my former coworkers left and now works for a place that uses Java.

c++ is fun
c# is not

C# is stuck?
techempower.com/benchmarks/#section=test&runid=fc4c28f5-5647-4507-89ea-35428ee073b9&hw=ph&test=plaintext

thats w .net core 2.2, .net core 3.0 has +15%-20% gain over these

They just added more low level stuff, like full Intel AVX/SSE/SSE2/SIMD intrinsic support ( fiigii.com/2019/03/03/Hardware-intrinsic-in-NET-Core-3-0-Introduction/# - Intel Compiler Engineer himself collaborated w .NET team)
+ there's tiered JIT compilation + guarded devirtualization + raw function pointers coming.

aka.ms/aspnet/benchmarks

Go on page 2/3/4 you Java shilling pajeet. and inb4 u think this is some joke, these charts are literally on a huge screen inside .NET Core team and update w daily builds and tests in case a PR fucks up so they can revert, and its all open sorce.