"Javascript is the future!"

There's no inherit reason why js itself lends itself to cross platform, it's ONLY because it was pushed over all the others. everyone wants to write shit code inside a browser instead of actually program properly.
Why the fuck do you think bundling an entire browser with each application is a good idea? There's a reason why all performant applications aren't switching to electron any time soon.

Who said there was an inherent reason? I'm saying it's currently the easiest way by far, what ever the reason for that situation is

thankfully. i've had it a few times that i could just delete a project from my disk on windows, cause the file paths were too long

It's acceptable for programs that don't absolutely require being performant, for example programs that analyze and mutate large data sets; if you're just creating simple applications like messaging apps whatever. Hell, there are acta

It's not about JS, it's about the browser, you could throw any language in there you want aside from JS. The browser is what actually makes electron lend itself well to cross-platform applications, because any device that can use chromium can also use electron. JS was chosen because it is was adopted as the standard web script/program language.

Hell, there are actually games written with JS like CrossCode (which uses a heavily modified impactjs) which run perfectly fine on relatively archaic hardware.*

who's moving to /netcore/ here?

This is closer tied to Lisp than Unix even if there's some overlap in this particular case.

Windows 7 definitely is the future.

I'm planning to, but i havent setup yet a development environment in linux that is adecuate for the framework. So far ive been using emacs for other languages. Will i be good by following a couple articles, or is there any advice i should be aware of? Should i switch to Visual Studio Code (afaik Visual Studio hasnt been ported to linux)?

Javascript is BASIC of XXI century.

Use anything you want desu. All you need is dotnet program to get started. I personally use Vscode because I used to Visual Studio Community on my main PC

Java. And I get better concurrency, db support, a better toolchain and a faster language.

>Java
>better concurrency

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Java is not easier and it has worse concurrency. It is faster but JS is plenty fast for the applications you would use electron for

it's a fantastic idea to bundle a whole browser with your app or any dependency. Dynamic dependencies SUCK. static linking and shipping your bundle with all it's deps is the correct way.

Storage is cheap, grow the fuck up, apps don't need to be 1kb anymore

wtf i love electron now

>java
>concurrency
top kek

I love my 200MB CRUD webapp

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>being so autistic that 200MB seems like too much in 2019

It's not. But it depends on the application. I'm not installing a 200Mb RSS reader, for instance.

Even Python is better.

>implying size is the only problem or even a big problem anyone cares about
You should rather consider
>what is the end of moores law
>what is optimisation
>what is not needing 32GB to run a few apps

> Dynamic dependencies SUCK
= I can't implement them, quantity over quality

B-but I want my CSS animation and I can only code Javascript that is WEBSCALE

>just buy another disk goy

now say that without crying

I have tons of soifaces just for (You).

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Found the javascript "dev".

>node.js IS JavaScript
great argument fagtron you sure have me convinced with those hot opinions

>you get to sleep with me instead of LeShaun
that implies for all the other days the sœyboy sleeps with LeShaun

PWA doesnt have to be JS I guess

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>Javascript is the embodiment of EVERYTHING wrong with computing today
you're right, but try telling that to the talentless web dev faggots that rely on this fucking cancer. these are the same stupid faggots that think node.js is not bloated, not a security nightmare and is better than python.

yes, that is correct

completely disagree

Just install electron using your package manager and make sure that applications link to that installation.
Now you can have cross platform applications with a small bundle size always using the latest electron version, reducing security risks.
The main issue is wincucks. They will always be behind and have to be spoonfed, because devs have to make sure electron is prepackaged.
I fucking hate wincucks

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hey, there may not be cryptominer in some of hundreds of dependencies i installed withing last few weeks

and it also tells me that there maybe only 2 vulnerabilities of low to medium severity in my project

and i already put node_modules in .gitignore
150MB or so is not that much after all

i only slightly fucking despise using the sluggish, convoluted mess that is vscode for the real projects, only because it has a decent debugger, instead of nvim

t. entrie level web dev / designer

p.s. - i need money fuck you nodemonkey position pays like 5 times the average wage in my eastern european cunt fuck you i don't care

>being this retarded
>oh p-pls user you must also install this specific version of dependency for my piece of trash software to run
kill yourself

what if your app is incompatible with latest version of electron?
user updates electron, your app breaks. this is why dependencies are declared with versions

>using a hypothetical situation to prove your point
Not a strong argument

Are you retarded? what do you actually do for a living?
that situation has happened to me many times.

Just bundle your own version of electron with every app friend.

kek that's what I've been preaching all along

Perl

kill self

Yeah I'm sure a single threaded event loop that gets stuck on a single CPU bound task is a great solution.

Qt. Even has Python bindings for lazy faggots.

>Python
>cross platform
Have fun using shitty 3rd party freezers that may or may not work and have shitty documentation. Also, CSS is vastly superior to Qt for designing UIs

youtu.be/V6VP-2aIcSc

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8086 assembly for MS-DOS.
Runs everywhere.

C

>>Storage is cheap,
but ram isn't and cpu cycles aren't

Why doesn't somebody just make a GUI toolkit that's like html+css but can be used with real languages?

>just add another framework™

It works for apple

Javascript is for people who want to have loads of money.

>32GB
>a few apps
Please, it's not that fucking bad, stop over exaggerating.
Agreed, although I still believe developers should strive to write efficient programs and optimize them as much as possible.

Also don't forget the fact that because you're using a browser engine you immediately have a way to communicate with servers and APIs, can easily communicate with other electron apps (running on the local host after all), have an incredibly easy and simple way to create a front-ends and have the power for end-users to extend the application and modify the interface baked right in with all with minimal effort required to set any of this up. It's really fucking nice to work with and takes away so much of the time and effort from the development process.

I feel like the only developers who shit on electron and similar frameworks haven't worked with it or other browser-based frameworks themselves before.

>being this deluded

Eventually this will happen, instead of an entirely new framework, it would be nice if we had a browser engine like Chromium that was modular, more performant and could be built with only the functionality we need to reduce resource consumption and application package sizes.

>being this masochistic
>wanting to develop all of this functionality yourself

Work as Entry Full-Stack Developer. Recently completed a customization with functionality needed for one of our enterprise projects. Didn't use anything beyond HTML/CSS and a little bit of JavaScript on the front-side; and then, one of middle-developers, who is my partner, suggested to add "responsive" design, which resulted in adding multiple libraries, extending code by the factor of three, with exactly the same functionality and increasing page load time.

We are basically wasting huge amount of resources for the graphics, without enhancing the functionality of the software. And, while I agree, that it might be needed in the gaming industry, but when it became I problem to reload FUCKING one page in the browser and not to add bloating useless features. Why humanity is so retarded? I literally look at the websites of ~2005-10s era and ask myself, what is the problem with that nice looking, efficient and functional web-sites?

I remember when java took over and I thought we had reached rock bottom but pajeets
I was wrong

Responsive UIs are not useless.You really should have been developing with responsiveness in mind from the beginning but I guess that's forgivable based on your experience.

I come from an extensive background working with websites, web apps and electron/node apps, started off making basic shit back in the mid 00's like forums and site-specific CMS using mainly PHP (and ColdFusion), which was the standard. Yeah, sites were efficient and used small amounts of bandwidth, but from a development standpoint it was a bitch to work with PHP and early ECMAS specifications to develop anything with a modicum of complexity, and having to refresh pages in a lot of events just to change one or two things (graph updates for instance) wasn't a good experience for the end-user.

From my perspective the inefficiency of websites comes down to shoddily written code by people who lack the experience with HTML, CSS and JS required to make it efficient.

When you craft your stylesheet(s) properly, you end up only needing a few specific media queries to accomplish responsiveness along with a bit of JavaScript for interactive functionality. You don't need to use multiple different libraries to accomplish responsive design, CSS media queries with elegant use of the flex implementation have you covered for everything outside of a canvas. Do it mobile-first (it's easier to scale up than down), accomplish as much responsiveness as you can with CSS and only then use JavaScript to accomplish anything else you need, like drop-down menus for touch-screen devices or interactivity. There's absolutely zero need to stuff multiple libraries in there to accomplish responsive design.

tl;dr from a development and end-user standpoint older websites sucked for a lot of reasons. Current websites are inefficient because of the inexperienced developers who craft them, not because of any inherent problem with HTML/CSS/JS itself.

this is the only answer. I don't even remember that and I've used node for the past 4+ years

> RSS reader
so you are truly stuck in the past, how's life in early 2000s?

t. pajeet

Daily reminder that JS is NOT single threaded anymore and you absolutely can write multithreaded JS using Hamsters.js, Napa.js OR NATIVE nodejs.org/api/worker_threads.html

so all the above threads about the so-called "optimization" are invalid and utterly stupid and ignorant.

>front end
>node modules

pick one. if you can't develop the front end in vanilla js you're just fucking terrible.

You absolutely can have eye candy and keep a SPA efficent.

You just have to have fucking developers with a clue and experience. stop believing Jow Forums

amen to that. fuck Jow Forums ignorance

RSS feeds are actually pretty nice and I've been using them for years desu, don't need to fetch any useless shit just to read an article.

Pic related is newboat, perfect 80 character column length makes it easy to read and I can fit most of the article onto my workspace; gives me an aggregate feed of information from many different sites without the need to actually visit them, all easily viewable within the same interface.

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Vanilla js

>Current websites are inefficient because of the inexperienced developers who craft them, not because of any inherent problem with HTML/CSS/JS itself.

exactly this, every time I see Jow Forums saying JS is "easy" it makes me laugh. I write daily python go and more (c, c# and others in the past) and JS is by far the hardest to master considering the "Js fatigue" and the speed of development in that word

SPAs are not a joke, devs believing that they actually MASTER JS (ES6/7/8 and TS) and are clearly not able to do so are.

I also review many people trialing for the company I'm working for and I reject the majority of these "full stack devs" that have no clue or what's the frontend nowadays

> eye-bleeding font rendering and font choice
> losing context and images/videos related to the topic
sure that's definitely something a sane man would do today (aside Jow Forums neckbeards)

normal people use medium or dev.to or hacker news. But hey they don't have pedophile anime

Electron applications aren't cross platform, the only work on electron. Electron itself is cross platform for a limited number of platforms. Its also literally a web server and web browser.
You're not a cross platform developer, you're just a webdev.

Not into anime myself, font is literally a bitmap font, and I'm using it precisely because Linux's font rendering sucks ass unless you have a 4k screen. I have dev.to and hacker news rss feeds set up.

see

It's cross-platform to the extent it can run on any end-user platform that can handle Chromium, which is most of them.

Static linking is nice, but I can guarantee your application doesn't need all of that web browser. You're only using a small portion of it. Why ship the whole thing? Because you refuse to use decent development tools.

Consider: instead of developing your application in JavaScript, you write it in Rust instead, and you let link time optimization REMOVE THE SHIT YOU DON'T NEED. And your application is only a couple of megs at most despite having a ton of dependencies.

still no reasons to lose context, comments, links, images and videos IMO, but go on with RSS until it lasts

you know that you can remove any unused package in JS too right? that you can bundle your all application on a single file right? that tree-shaking is working as well ?

I doubt it.

almost all software could be fully Web based by now thanks to WASM, but then who would buy OS licences/hardware that comes with them? oh that's right, let's just pretend these things aren't technologically possible yet... while charging everyone for software that shouldn't exist.

fuck Electron, fuck npm.

>Because you refuse to use decent development tools.
Because it's easy.

>but I can guarantee your application doesn't need all of that web browser.
Naturally.

From: >it would be nice if we had a browser engine like Chromium that was modular and could be built with only the functionality we need to reduce resource consumption and application package sizes.

Mate you get links to images and videos at the bottom of every RSS article. I can view them if I want to, most of the time I do not need to do so.

not an argument :^)

>context
what
>comments
gay
>links
you can open the rss source if you want more
>images
bloat
>videos
B L O A T

>When your position is so bad you have to resort to autistic hair splitting

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>Qt
QML is Javascript. You can't run.

>devs believing that they actually MASTER JS (ES6/7/8 and TS) and are clearly not able to do so are
Completely agreed. I don't mind working with inexperienced devs if they're willing to learn. If they have the tenacity and enthusiasm I will absolutely help them go through the hoops required to master the language and tell them when they're stepping into a pitfall. It's the fucknuts who think they are above the language, who will never take the time to actually master it, that I despise. Regardless of whether or not you enjoy working with a language you should master it purely out of necessity and out of an appreciation for writing clean and efficient code. That's what a good programmer does, any programmer that refuses to do this regardless of the language out of their own egotistical bullshit will NEVER be a good programmer.

Yes, but you can't remove all of that code that came with the web browser that you are embedding in your application.

you can do responsive with one media query and less than 10 lines of flexbox in pure css.
but nice bait, have a (you)

thanks for the usleess replies, ofc you can if you want but you are forcing yourself to do more operation than just move your fucking eyes, is it that hard to understand? luckily I'm right and RSS is dying

to the bloat guy, you're embarrassing yourself.

>"I'm on the RIGHT side of history"
cringe