OpenBSD vs. Gentoo

OpenBSD is too broken and lacks developers and support. But Theo is a bad motherfucker.

FreeBSD is bomb. Can confirm.

>easy install, nothing works
>hard install, everything works

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OpenBSD > gentoo = void > alpine > shit > your opinion

they're both pretty based

I played with alpine and liked it but how do you getaround the whole glibc thing as a dependency?

Pretty sure alpine is meant to be a router/container distro or possibly for some server shit. Not something to be typically run on a daily driver desktop or for gaming.

both are good but gentoo is obviously more suitable for desktop use

OpenBSD is built for a more narrow purpose: security and simplicity. Gentoo can be changed to approach OpenBSD's level in the aforementioned terms, but it's a pain when you take into account that'll take reading a lot of documentation, messing with config files, and compiling - it's time-consuming.

OpenBSD: Love it for what it is or fuck off.
Gentoo: Have it your way.

>Gentoo: Have it your way.
but give me your life.

Something like that.

>OpenBSD is built for a more narrow purpose: security and simplicity. Gentoo can be changed to approach OpenBSD's level in the aforementioned terms, but it's a pain when you take into account that'll take reading a lot of documentation, messing with config files, and compiling - it's time-consuming.
No, this is not how it works.
OpenBSD implements several hardening features, Gentoo implements none (beyond what Linux offers, which is the shitty KASLR that's nothing compared to OpenBSD's KARL), as for a userspace level, Gentoo enables a few hardening features like PIE and ASLR, that's nothing compared to OpenBSD's pledge, unveil, W^X, etc.
OpenBSD also has the advantage of regular code audits, code simplicity, privilege separation, and security-focused design.
Gentoo has some of these, but not to the OpenBSD level.
I'm not saying that Gentoo (or any Linux distro) is insecure, but I'm saying that it's wrong to compare it to OpenBSD.

Gentoo if you want Linux, OpenBSD if you want BSD. Don't bother with anything else

I don't know a whole lot, but Linux and OBSD tackle security issues in slightly different ways. The actual differences in security emerge IRL, because OpenBSD is pretty rock-solid by default, while Linux tries to cater to people's tastes and thus most distros are "lax" out-of-the-box and permit hardening if the user is inclined to do so.

Plus, the projects themselves are ran different and go by different guiding principles. OpenBSD will flat-out refuse to do things if it's not a high priority and it goes against their principles. Linux has a wide dev pool that shits out software of varying quality to make everyone happy.

>While Linux tries to cater to people's tastes and thus most distros are "lax" out-of-the-box and permit hardening if the user is inclined to do so.
I partially agree, while there are/were some cases where Linux distros offer partial hardening as an option (like how Gentoo used to offer PIE optionally) and you can always disable extra features to reduce the attack surface, the big stuff that OpenBSD has like W^X are simply not there, there might be a few reasons why this is the case:
-There are very few entities that are interested in hardening Linux (Grsecurity used to be a major player in Linux hardening, but they stopped publishing the source code publicly for their patches and went private).
-Linus' insistence on not breaking userspace, even if that meant breaking some obscure non-important programs.
>Plus, the projects themselves are ran different and go by different guiding principles. OpenBSD will flat-out refuse to do things if it's not a high priority and it goes against their principles. Linux has a wide dev pool that shits out software of varying quality to make everyone happy.
I totally agree.

I don't see really anything wrong with using Debian. Is there inherently something completely shit with it over using other distros?

GuixSD + emacs is all ya need.

Not them, but I don't like Debian because they overly patch their packages. This will introduce bugs that only affect Debian because the Debian maintainers don't know the code base as much as the upstream developers do. This was especially catastrophic in 2008 where the Debian OpenSSL package was affected by a Debian-only vulnerability because the maintainer was retarded and patched it in a shit way, what made it worse is that the bug wasn't fixable by an update only, all the certificates and keys made by that vulnerable package (which lasted for 2 years!) had to be regenerated.
Debian also keeps their packages terribly outdated, which sometimes forces them to patch the packages by hand.

I don't understand the hype around Guix, is it because GNU finally made their long-awaited operating system?

>Is there inherently something completely shit with it over using other distros?

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Is there any other non-meme tier alternative that works pretty much like Debian? I need to know because I've got the flash drive in hand right now.

Depends, do you want a BSD or a Linux distro? What are you planning to use it for?

>wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Hardened_Gentoo
Some of the stuff OBSD implements by default can be found in this Gentoo profile. Again, it'd be hard to find examples in the wild since laziness and poor documentation get in the way. Linux is a nice alternative to Windows (too bad Linux does not get as much love from game devs as Windows does). I use Linux, because I hate Windows - the latter suffers from feature creep and backwards-compatibility bloating the system, while Linux might follow the same path thanks to the SJWs infiltrating projects. Abundant headless software being available, and having good performance, in Linux are also selling points.

OpenBSD is great in its own way.

The page you linked has outdated information, because as I mentioned earlier Grsecurity/PaX stopped publishing their patches publicly.

As for your other points I agree, Linux is a great alternative to Windows.

Planning to use it for software dev, I'd prefer to use a linux based distro because I'm more familiar with them.

As well as just general projects aside, I would also like to run shit like jupyter nb, and qemu.

Use whatever that you want then, it shouldn't matter what distro you choose for these tasks.
openSUSE is nice, so I'd recommend that.
If you decide to use a BSD, I'd recommend FreeBSD.

So anything other than Debian is what you're saying?

anything besides Solaris is for permavirgins.

Yes, you can use Debian as well if you want to, but I don't like it due to the reasons that I stated above.

Reminder that Gentoo is unusable trash without ECC memory.
Have fun with your corrupted binaries.

Nope, functional package management + not being cucked by muh eunicks is the future.

Linux is a kernel.

windows with a linux subsystem

I especially like this article: ambrevar.xyz/guix-advance/ where he strarts out by shitting on Rob Pike for spreading FUD about OS research.
That man has probably done more damage to OS development than any other figure. He contributed to Eunuchs, shilled it, and convinced everyone that it's impossible to do better, and cultists such as cat-v believed him.

Linux is what Windows was to me when I began using Linux. I'd use OpenBSD for everything if it was not for certain software I require. For those occasions I use Gentoo.

I tried it. GuixSD is utter trash. I like the idea of having all your configs defined in one portable file that can be used on any new machine, but GuixSD does it in the most annoying and under-documented way possible. If you're going to have your own language and custom functions for this, you NEED to expose ALL functionality of the underlying software through that system. I tried it recently, and could not even find out how to do simple things that are well documented on normal systems like disabling mouse acceleration in Xorg. Guix does not expose options for doing that through itself, and it no longer has the X configs in /etc and no longer has a /usr, so you're fucked.
I prefer a solution more akin to chef for configuration management, where it's basically "I want this file to look like that".

which anime is this from if you don't mind me asking user?

>If you're going to have your own language
Literally every distro does this except Guix, which uses a tried and proven existing language with decades of research put into it.

It's Yuru Yuri, user.
Now please do me a favour and install OpenBSD, Gentoo or Void.

>It's Yuru Yuri, user.
ah, i've been waiting for the upcoming season of it to be released so i can binge through it in a week, my autism can't handle waiting for animu.

>Now please do me a favour and install OpenBSD, Gentoo or Void.
i already am on loonucks, been using loonucks for about 6 years now, i ran gentoo for about a year before i made the switch to my custom lfs 8.4 based system this march.

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ah also, forgot to say thanks, thanks a bunch.

ClosedBSD > openBSD

You're welcome.
>my autism can't handle waiting for animu
We're very similar.

Tell me about your LFS install, are you using any package managers? Alternative userland?

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>are you using any package managers?
no, no package managers, i have 387 packages built in total including lfs 8.4 base, some packages from blfs 8.4 and patches from gentoo/arch repositories.

>Alternative userland?
no, everything is fully gnu at this point. although i've been meaning to do a busybox+muslc+mdev build as a side meme project. void has muslc workaround patches and there are muslc toolchain build guides i've found on github as well.
let's see how much i can cripple myself for the "muh minimalish" and "anti-gnu" meme. this current build is pretty much has only the packages and dependencies i need without much crippling happening so it's pretty comfy, the size is 4.8gib after stripping libs and bins.

i've been compiling my kernel with clang8 from the clangbuiltlinux and chromeos patches for the last couple of months so i really want to see how far i can go without ganooware.

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Ah, I see. I'm pretty sure I've talked to you already.
I'm running Void with glibc, gcc and plan9 userland, nawk and rg without crippling myself much.

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ah i remember, you are the one who said
>it's okay to cripple yourself for the muh minimalism if it satisfies your tism
right?
i've moved to fully fbterm+tmux on tty from xorg and since i've talked to you and other than javascript intensive browser work, i'm fully xorg free. elinks 0.13 with spidermonkey/js185 for javascript and lua/python for css/html formatting support on terminal works really nice for less complex stuff. it's really nice if you want to keep your focus on one place as well.

>I'm running Void with glibc, gcc and plan9 userland, nawk and rg without crippling myself much.
that sounds really comfy. how different plan9 userland is from busybox or sbase?

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Yeah, that was me.
>i've moved to fully fbterm+tmux on tty
Nice. Although I like xorg, especially if you're running it without a wm. Have you tried abduco+dvtm as a replacement for xterm?
>how different plan9 userland is from busybox or sbase?
I'm not sure about busybox, I just remember that one of the suckless people said the code is shit at some point. sbase is basically plan9 rewritten, I'm actually using a mix of those two.

>Although I like xorg
i have no issues with xorg either, never even had it die on in 6 years of linuxery. i already have been doing literally everything other than js intensive web browsing on terminal already so i really had nothing keeping me from letting x go.
>Have you tried abduco+dvtm as a replacement for xterm?
i don't know abduco but i've heard about dvtm, it looks really really interesting. thanks for reminding me, i'll definitely give it a look.
>sbase is basically plan9 rewritten, I'm actually using a mix of those two.
figured as much, since you can't really go far with rewriting the same thing with posix compliance and simplicity in mind.

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