These are the only languages acceptable for use in a serious project...

Elaborate on this...

yes, please

python is fucking amazing you doublenigger

Anyone who uses/advocates for Java and its derivatives should be shot.

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The JVM is pretty fucking based though.

where's python?

only use c

OH SAY CAN YOU C!

fixed

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>where's python?
and where's PHP if were including all Luditte languages?

Reminder that rust has better performance than Java/C# and in some cases even c/c++ while also being more safe than all of em

techempower.com/benchmarks/

Rust is #1

where on the site? I don't think you've even looked at it. it's for webapp frameworks.

based, but remove c#
it's shit

>web framework
>relevant benchmark

JVM is a mess and a waste of computer resources, so much that throwing it into the trash probably is greener than an electric car.

>guise, my tranny language is safe
>*unsafes everything so it can compete with C++*

>No "Holy C"

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It allows deployment of multiple languages in a single infrastructure but sure it's bad lol.

You don't know what you're talking about. The JVM is honestly the best thing they came up with. It allows you to use the JVM with a lot of things, other than java.

t. never worked a day in his life
Enjoy writing web apps in C or C++.
In reality, the one that should be removed is C except for very few specific use cases. But if we care about rare use cases, then there's more languages.

>It allows deployment of multiple languages in a single infrastructure but sure it's bad lol.
Oh yeah, jit compiling shit into a virtual machine is soo good, that's why everybody loves to run unoptimized shit that kills a dragon per second to draw a rectangle in my screen.

The only thing that is slow on a JVM is the startup time you moron. The reason people use the JVM on top of the ease of use is how fast it is aside from the startup time. You don't know what you are talking about.

>C Shart brainlet
don't reply to me again.

>Java

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based

Oh no, it seems I triggered a low level autist who doesn't understand why high level languages were developed and nobody uses C anymore unless necessary.
What are you gonna do? Gonna cry? Gonna piss your pants maybe? Maybe shit and cum?

no or barely any unsafe in the rust code

the future is web based saas you jobless retards, web backend performance matters a lot

next time you try to fix something finish the job

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>Swift is tied with Apple
No. But it still doesn't have a decent IDE outside of xcode.

>not as autistic as C++
>implying Rust isn't the gold standard in autism
Dilate

Lol at work for me it's the exact opposite. When a new project comes up everyone suggesting a new meme language. I'm usually promoting Rust or Kotlin

itt retards who have never written anything nontrivial in their lives whitelisting "acceptable languages" without trying anything else or understanding that languages are tools and there is no such thing as a universal too

i know this thread is bait but retards will genuinely believe that Java is inherently slow or Go / Rust / Kotlin / Haskell / D don't need to exist because of the languages in your pic

based

look whose still using dos/batch

>Leaves C#
Go suffocate on a bunch of Nigger cocks you massive faggot.

Scala is pretty based.

>t. .net babby

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You have no idea what you are talking about.
C++ gets used for backend, security, IOT.

Not that you will know being a micro$shill C# and its .net asp.

Which is a laughable cheap bootleg of Spring framework and Java's JVE.
Which it can't really compete for more serious work.
For banks, industry or even faggy shit like netflix.

as a beginner what language should I choose for backend between java (spring) and c# (.net core)?

Fortran is better than all those. Don't believe the Cniles and their lies.

I may be a little biased but spring is really nice to use in my opinion

Java if you want to get a job.
C# is better than Java but it has fewer jobs.

I have no idea why someone would use C# other than bind yourself to one platform.

>Swift
>Objective-C
Eww. Who the fuck would use these unless they were forced to?

>Who the fuck resorts to some new-age hippy shit like Kotlin or Go or Rust?
Well, IIRC Google intends for Kotlin to replace Java for Android development since Kotlin is better than Java in basically every way. Go is of course hot garbage and not worth using, though Rust is generally well-enjoyed by those who have used it. Just because it's new doesn't mean it's not worth using.

Because most people aren't as uninformed as you and live in the current year, not 5 years ago.
C# is no longer bound to Windows, and as a language is much better than Java, with Java always being >5 years behind it.

Even 5 years ago, C# still had Mono. With .NET Core around, it's looking like a pretty solid choice of languages, though the library selection is still lacking.

>C++
>C#
>Fixed.
Kill yourself.

eh the .NET VM is actually better than the JVM imo. for one the reflection actually works at runtime. JVM supports both scala and kotlin though, so at least they're hip.

are there any jobs that actually use C today? afaik all non-legacy embedded projects use C++ now.

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I work as a C programmer writing open-source software.
Many of my colleagues have a strong distaste for C++, and it's utterly inappropriate for they type of software we develop.

Mono was rather bad, and most importantly, not officially supported.
The ecosystem is the only thing that keeps Java alive (besides tons of legacy code, I guess).

i'm relatively new to C++ and haven't really ever used C seriously, what's distasteful/inappropriate about it? is it just C but with a whole bunch of useless stuff attached?

>is it just C but with a whole bunch of useless stuff attached?
Yes.
But C++ is really fucking shit for writing libraries in, because of its lack of a stable ABI. It also just encourages people to write really needlessly complex software.

Not to mention, we have people doing Linux kernel stuff, so obviously that's all C.

Only it has a library you can use to amount of 14 million.
And its easily portable to any OS.
And yea JVE can be used by a dozens of other language Scala is pretty good and Kotlin

While they are doing a bootleg like core.

Depends you absolutely need C once you hit hardware level.

neat, i haven't even heard of ABIs before, this is good info thanks!

which lib do you use for reflection? i tried Guice but couldn't get it to work right, although i was pressed for time and didn't give it enough attention so likely my own fault.

are there any resources you guys can recommend if I want to start learning about interfacing between hardware and software? I've done basic arduino shit but i have no idea where to start with an actual computer.

>remove c#
LOL kill yourself. Until you've worked on C#, don't even bother commenting. C# is a vast improvement over C/C++. C# is a real object oriented language like Java, but in the comfort of C like language and native support in Windows (now also on linux/mac with .net core).

>C# is a real object oriented language like Java, but in the comfort of C like language
What the fuck are you talking about?

>The only acceptable language for use in a serious project is assembly. Who the fuck resorts to some new-age hippy shit like C or C++ or Java?

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Get a arduino and dish the c++.

You can include the avr library.
Its pretty daunting at first cause you are manipulating the register to shift bits to control the pins and interrupts.

Its no handholding by then.
But you will be surprised how much code you can stuff in there with C

Like 800 byte, for 11k byte in c++

scala is god tier and its on JVM

I even use Scala in Java frameworks.

Scala seems better for converting machine bytes too.
Before sending it through JNA JNI

java's reflection + generics makes it one of the most powerful languages around, with these you can implement most programming paradigms, meta-programming for example the only problem you might have with java is the verbosity and memory usage in terms of speed it's one of the fastest around(for me it's the fastest because it's unfair to compare languages that are compiled to machine code to one that runs in a VM)

Try java with spring boot.
Its what C# tried to imitated but can never be.

C# tried to bring object oriented programming to Windows, and it worked. C++ is not an object oriented language despite its introduction/advertisement as such.

Python is an object oriented language, but its bit of a hack. Java lacks proper support. That leaves C# as the only contender for object oriented programming language on Windows.

Java 8 lacks proper support java is just fine

>That leaves C# as the only contender for object oriented programming language on Windows.

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>C++ is not an object oriented language
>Python is an object oriented language
What?
>Java lacks proper support
What?

>because of its lack of a stable ABI
90s called, that's no longer true.

I checked a few job descriptions and they ask for spring boot, spring data, spring cloud, spring security etc... wtf? is that all part of the spring framework?
thanks, user

as I said I'm a beginner but I also thought that java seems to be the right choice until c#/net core/aspnet core mature more and turn into a true multiplatform set of tools

that's what I wonder: if I choose c# and .net core am I tied to windows/powershell/visual studio/ms sql server or is it possible to use gnu+linux/bash/postgres/rider ide?

>though the library selecton is still lacking
care to elaborate and make a general comparison to java?
thank you, user

GCC had to break their ABI in C++11.

Laugh all you like, I'm dabbing my tears with my piles of .net money.

Java shops pay peanuts, and the only thing more meme-tier than a C# webstack is a java webstack

go back to discord

Just learn Java bro. The first language doesn't matter that much and Java has very many libraries to do whatever you want.

>actual computer
What do you mean? Arduino is basically as low as you go except for asm in microprocessor programming and it's not really a big leap, it's just a slightly different interface. You could do VHDL but that's a different discipline.
If by actual computer you mean something like handling a typical x86 PC you're asking for how to write an OS. I don't know enough about writing OSes to recommend a source.
Maybe you mean a more realistic environment you might have for an embedded product. Then it depends on what type. For some small toy controlled by microcontrollers you'll have a similar environment except you'll be targeting the atmega alone (or other microprocessor) for programming and installation on a board. You don't pack an arduino in a talking teddybear obviously. PCB design is probably not your job as a programmer.
If you're thinking embedded control systems they tend to be higher level. You get some piece of custom hardware (or not, it's just a way to remove flexibility from customers usually) and usually install an OS. Most commonly a lighter Linux distro like Gentoo. It might even be handled by a third party that assembles this distribution for you according to spec and ensures the environment works for the hardware. Then you work with whatever programming language you're set on in a Linux environment. Usually C. Some of the features might be implemented in sysfs (/sys/class/leds/led0 on the RPi for instance) and you just access things through the virtual file system. Other things come with C libraries and has the potential to be more arcane.

I think maybe other programming fields have tricked you into thinking everything is complicated.

Are you high? Python is huge, way bigger than swift and obj c combined. JS and PHP are web dev shit, and are the biggest on the market for web fags. Even ruby on rails has a dent in the business world. I won't argue that Java is a fucking great language, but it has less than a decade left, OP.

Tfw just starting to learn C# and it's really enjoyable to use.

Java seems like ass compared to it.

F fucking bpbp

>Arduino is basically as low as you go
HAHAHAHA OH DEAR GOD

Not really Objective-C. That language is a turd. The lacking type safety is absolutely terrible.
It has also fucked up Swift due to their strict compatibility and Apple's entire API design.
Every time I see a fucking Selector, I cry inside. Why not just promises with lambda callbacks? Why not async / await?

But the JVM is fucking fast. Have you seen Benchmarks? It's fucking insane how fast something that abstracted runs. That's why so many big companies run Java on their critical infrastructure: It's the best compromise of productivity, safety and performance we currently have.

thank you for the words, user. I'll follow your advice

Java has been comfy af ever since they implemented type inference. New switch case is neat too

Sort of. I prefer Shiro to SS but Spring X is just Spring's liv for X.

thanks guys

Java? Ew don't talk to me
>Write once fail everywhere

ditto

>Never seen the wages of embedded and IOT engineers
Csharplets when will they learn.

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I really, really like c#

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It's an IDE. It programs a microcontroller. There's countless of those and they've been around for a long ass time. Arduino is just an accessible board.
It's not different in principle from other microcontroller programming.
Such a moron this guy.

Yea the c++ is trash.
And just for hobbyist.

But the AVR lib which is included can be programmed in MPLAB and be used as any other atmel chip there is no difference in arduino and real C-embedded programming.

All the electronic components are just ready to go

Kotlin is based and redpilled. The rest, yes.