Realistically what will the future hold for AMD? Will they be fucked if Intel figures out 7nm?

>Realistically what will the future hold for AMD?
Gaining double digit market share in enterprise which will bring dramatic improvements to quarterly revenue.
7nm EUV parts launch next year with Zen3. Enterprise Milan has already sampled to a couple customers.
In 2021 we'll see 5nm EUV Zen4 based parts. The enterprise line is called Genoa. Alleged to bring 10 channel memory configs on a new socket.

They're going to be pretty damn secure throughout 2021 and 2022.
>Will they be fucked if Intel figures out 7nm?
You can't just magically make a smaller transistor with even more exposure steps and lith masks when they're still floundering on 10nm. The chance of this happening is absolute zero. Intel has brand new 14nm high perf and mobile silicon coming throughout the entire 2020 fiscal year. They can't produce large die high clocking 10nm parts, it'll be quite a while until they can. That as well means 10nm will be missing from their enterprise lineup.

>Muh 7nm
Intel doesn't have to do anything their 14nm monolithic CPUs will always be better than glued together garbage.

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>glued together garbage.
then why is intel doing it to desperately compete?

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Most people are stupid anyways.

They are forced to, but obviously don't want to go that route.
2x28 cores is no way near as bad as 8x8(4+4) configurations.

Technology was always about making chips smaller and integrating as much as possible into 1 unit. AMD is doing the exact opposite by separating CPUs into multiple dies and CCX units. While Intel tries to integrate Wi-Fi USB, Thunderbolt and more into CPUs.

AMD is unstoppable. I was on r/AMD the other day and they basically showed off that AMD has plans to go all the way to 3nm within the next 5 years. Intel won't even be on 10nm until 2021. AMD is going to be pushing 1nm by the time Intel hits 7nm.

It's fukcing over, Intel is going out of business, SELL ALL STOCKS FROM INTEL NOW.

>if Intel figures out 7nm
kek

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>They are forced to, but obviously don't want to go that route.
i've never seen so much coping in one sentence

>2x28 is a forced NUMA
>8x8(4+4) is not NUMA (only first gen EPYC was NUMA)
Which do you think is easier to support by software?

Intel is all tick and no tock, Doc

idk man it’s good that there’s some competition finally

Indians are not people.

Competition? Intel is fucking dead especially in the server market.

Which configuration is easier to schedule and has less latency? That's what matters

There’s competition even if it’s a blowout rn. Meaning they can’t be complacent

Wrong, Intel was going the chiplet route in the 2020s. AMD simply beaten them to the punch. They wanted to make chiplets be HPC/enterprise only while mainstream/laptops would be on monolithic dies.

Intel gambled far too much on their 10nm process to fall through without too much hassle. Unfortunately, for them it end-up being the exact opposite. 10nm chips that are coming out are just a shadow of the intended process. They had axe cobalt and other new manufacturing methods because their yields were economically unfeasible.

Pretty much. 5mn chiplets in 2021 for Zen means AMD has secured their position for a long time.

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>die shirnk
>more space for transistors
>2-3 years from now we will have an x2 increase of cores
>intel literally cannot follow such strategy at all

Yes, but Intel needs chiplets in order for 7nm to produce realistic yields.
Problem is, Intel's is locked into 14nm monolithic and can't switch to chiplets without destroying their supplychain.

>They are forced to, but obviously don't want to go that route.
i dont think intel is retarded enough to go
"lets make more MASSIVE chips w/ shit yields that are insanely hard to produce in any meaningful number whilst being useless in any other product"
over
"lets make small chiplets w/ crazy good yields wich are cheap and can be used from the entry level to the high end server gear"

wich one do you think makes more money?

well, a certain certified shit wrecker works for Intel now...

They do care about money, but not so much as to move technology backwards. You want a future of microscopic CPUs that can fit on contact lenses, not to go back to the 50's where you needed a truck to offload your CPU

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so you are saying that Intel cares about chiplets

How do I start a semiconductor business myself?

Tell that to all the data centers that are going with EPYC Rome since that's where the real money is. Intel basically has no real answer to it right now, because if they did they would've already announced it.

>since that's where the real money is
Vendor's control the datacenter market and they aren't switching on a dime to AMD just because they hit it big again like they did in the Athlon days.

just wait bro
just delid it bro
just delap it bro
just apply chiller bro

70% yield
guru3d.com/news-story/amd-zen-2-production-yields-for-ryzen-3000-dies-at-70-percent.html

Yeah. Intel is already so close despite being so far behind in size.

70% is pretty good for a first gen process on a new node, those yields are likely due to the small dies (less chance of a junk die)

Its just not real, its straight AdoredTV asspull that other sites repeated because they live on on ad revenue.
The CCD isn't that small for the process. If AMD had magical god tier yields at TSMC we wouldn't have such terrible spreads for clock binning.

TSMC themselves have claimed "very high yields on N7", wich usually means "well in excess of 50%", you know, 70ish%

fuse.wikichip.org/news/2567/tsmc-talks-7nm-5nm-yield-and-next-gen-5g-and-hpc-packaging/

>grasping at straws and pulling things out of your ass entirely just to justify AdoredTV rumormill shit that king autist himself walked back
Stop trying to bluff your way through conversations when you know nothing about the topic.
Their claims have been about defect density which is a metric you know nothing about, and is not an ultimate figure. If they were delivering 70% or more known good candidates per wafer, that many fully functioning dies, they would be delivering such retardedly high volume that there would be no issues with gross disparity in clock binning. We wouldn't have SKUs that are basically barrel scraping with one CCX dramatically better performing than the other on the exact same CCD.

If reality does not align with your retarded narrative, reality is not the problem.

who said anything about fucking Adored?
TSMC had 7nm in dev for years w/ "double digt yields in 2016"
tsmc.com/english/dedicatedFoundry/technology/7nm.htm

just yelling "duuur grasping straws for adored" is not an argument, TSMC has been making 7nm chips for YEARS now, first for apple and later for AMD, their yields are that good, just accept it
and yes, they are shitting out chips like noone else, because they still make shit for other products
the graphics cards are 7nm
all the cpus are 7nm, wich each need ATLEAST one chiplet, and up to 4 on epyc/threadripper (wich is where the best stuff is going, and has been going for a while thanks to the datacenter contracts)

TSMC had been making low power ARM SoCs, in risk production. There is a huge difference between a low power super low voltage part and a high performance part which is fabbed with an entirely different track, and isn't at all forgiving when it comes to process variability in fin profiles.
TSMC never made any of these retarded claims, AdoredTV did, you are literally regurgitating a clickbait rumor which spread around the web because of AdoredTV.
Instead of being a normal person you're just doubling down like a retarded autist.

intel's 10nm is equivalent to tsmc 7nm. so intel already has a 7nm competitor. 10nm++ out at the end of year will bring mid to high 4ghz range according to leaks. yes its embarrassing it took intel nearly half a decade to get 10nm valuable but they they did actually do it. along with sunny cove actually did bring a 17% increase in raw IPC clock for clock that was proven by benchmarks from review sites. so intel already actually has a skylake successor that's faster than zen 2 clock for clock as well. which was already benched and proven.

intel's 7nm is the competitor to tsmc 5nm. intel claims that's on "track" but honestly seeing how long 10nm took we will see.

2020 should be interesting. that will be the launch of willow cove in the form of tiger lake for desktop. the 17-20% ipc increase that sunny cove brought along with a complete redesign of the cache system. 2020 should be a good year for intel if they actually can a launch tiger lake for desktop.

AMD will make billions from Rome and Ryzen by time Intel release 7nm desktop and server Chips ~2023.

>intel's 7nm is the competitor to tsmc 5nm. intel claims that's on "track" but honestly seeing how long 10nm took we will see
They'll probably skip 10nm on desktop/server. The yields are so bad they can't profitably sell them outside of ultrabooks. Intel's 7nm will use EUV and should be on track.

No. Silicon is basically tapped out. Even if they can reduce sizes, performance wouldn't go up by much since there's a limit for the atoms' proximity to each other themselves.

The only way now is for devs to figure out how to code for multiple cpu.

when they figure out how not to be jewish sure
their entire lineup is obsolete

realistically, in 5 years AMD will release their 3D CPU, they already have knowledge of 3D chips with their HBM modules. Intel will probably also release their 3D CPU in about the same time and we will see who made better product then.

Stop with this antisemitism

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zen2+ doesn't exist

hello intel bot

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>2x28 cores is no way near as bad as 8x8(4+4) configurations
400w vs 250w

>literal intel shill
are you that french ex intel employee from twitter?
you write just as a passive agressive internet tough guy as him

>so intel already has a 7nm competitor
not on dekstop or server

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if intel is so shit rn why is it still near impossible to find AMD powered mobile workstations? i'd buy one if they existed

It's actually lower than that untill recently. AdoredTV pulled that number out of his ass and everyone copied it. Yields where pretty bad and AMD wasn't trilled. But EUV seems to be bringing quite the improvement, so expect an impressive Zen 3 lineup and agressive competition with GPU's.

>Will they be fucked if Intel figures out 7nm?
If you look at Intel's roadmap, this is not even remotely their plan. Basically, their sticking with 14nm until 2021 and 10nm will be used for things that don't need high clocks (since Intel discovered it cannot do that). Their 7nm node will finally launch in 2021 and is set to compete with TSMC's 5nm node at the time. Things are not looking good for intel. I guess we'll see how that new GPU goes.
>inb4 sad Intel shill
No I actually am happy to see them loosing their throne. But I don't like how long it will take for them to get back up despite the several years of warning that AMD is catching up.

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In this situation, AMD.
Board vendors literally refused to support these behemoth Intel chips.

I wouldn't either. How are you even supposed to cool that 400 W Intel stove? I don't think it's even doable without active water cooling.

I'm looking up old i5/i7 Intel chips on Amazon and why haven't they all been devalued to nothing yet?

New $110 Ryzen 5 1600/$120 Ryzen 5 2600's should be forcing all of the old used i5/i7's under $50. I've been totally expecting these old chips to be to be devalued to about as low as you can buy a used Core2Duo/Core2Quad ($10)

Core2 was application of a mobile architecture that was developed independently from netburst, they have no such thing now.

>posting facts that go against your infantile adoredtv narrative makes me a shill
You're retarded, kid.
This is my other post ITT: Please, do tell me how I'm a shill.

Judging by how Intel's 10nm performs, AMD should be fine.

It's Intels fab that's holding them back atm, would they dump, the fab side of the house or design a node on TSMC 5mn to be competitive/relevant.

Market is acted upon by people and people are dumb AF.

Intel's foundry business is the reason why they're a blue chip stock. If they spun that off investors would riot and the company would be in utter turmoil.
Literally never happening.

That's also why they're so adamant about sticking to their 10nm guns. It'd be really bad if they admitted that the whole thing was a disaster and a complete waste of money.

They're a big enough company with enough revenue to eat a fuckup like this. They did it with 14nm too.
They'll keep floundering until they eventually see decent yields with 10nm, then stay on the node for years. When they do eventually bring out their 7nm process it'll be a repeat of what we've seen in the past few years.
Super low power dual core parts. Terrible yields, low volume. High perf parts nowhere to be seen for years afterwards.

But how long can they coast on 14nm?, what will they do when they get desperate?

I wouldn't be surprised if they released a 14nm part in Q3 2020 honestly. They probably will see 10nm mature enough to be a 1:1 replacement to 14nm at lower power. Its just a question of how long it takes. Going by what we've seen from roadmaps, intel themselves apparently don't see that happening until 2021.

checked

>Samsung is going to fab 14nm CPUs for Intel, to address shortage
>According to the semiconductor industry on the 17th, the Samsung foundry division plans to mass-produce Intel's products in the third and fourth quarter of next year [2020] at the 14-nanometer process. It is estimated that Intel's 14-nano PC CPU 'Rocket Lake' will be released in 2021.
guru3d.com/news-story/samsung-is-going-to-fab-14nm-cpus-for-intelto-address-shortage.html

Can it get any worse?

>AdoredTV AdoredTV AdoredTV AdoredTV AdoredTV AdoredTV AdoredTV AdoredTV AdoredTV AdoredTV AdoredTV AdoredTV

are you obsessed or something? i dont watch adored, just yelling at me and telling me that im a shill is not a bloddy argument, the dies AMD uses for the chiplets are SMALL, and have been in production for almost a year now, while the proccess is almost 2 years old
yields are good because of both of those factors, the smaller the die the better the yield
>TSMC never made these claims
do you even read their press releases? they literally say that they have VERY HIGH yields on 7nm

>please stop calling me out for talking out of my ass and blindly regurgitating baseless clickbait rumors!
You little retards really are a sad sort. The HPC track for 7nm is not the same as the track used for low power ARM parts. The chipets are not "small" for the process either you absolute brainlet.

A company that produces 99% ARM parts saying their yields are good is not a statement about magical impossibly high yields for their singular high perf CPU client.

>The chipets are not "small" for the process either you absolute brainlet.

they are half the size of the Zen1 die (kinda obvious, but either way)
the Radeon VII, wich is based on the Mi50 card, is also TSMC 7nm and has a die size of 331mm2
The die size of a single chiplet of Zen2 is ~70mm2

they had no issue supplying Mi50 and 60 dies to the datacenter and later to the consumer w/ the Radeon VII
you can make (almost) 5 chiplets for Zen2 for each Radeon Die
also the 5700/XT are based on the 7nm TSMC process and have a die area of about ~250mm2

if TSMC had lackluster yields, they could not release this many 7nm products at once, and not at this price-point
the Epyc chips are severely undercutting the competition and both consumer lines [cpu/gpu] are priced adequatly and available in good numbers
besides the R9, wich everyone and their dog is buying

They're less than half the size of Zeppelin, kid.
Despite having no memory PHY, external IO, control hub or anything else on die a single CCD is stil 3.9 billion transistors. The complete Zeppelin die is about 4.8billion at 212mm2.
The jump in density here is ridiculous.
Look at how the Radeon VII launched with limited volume and was rapidly made EOL. The reject dies for an enterprise part which sells for a few thousand dollars were made EOL. That really says something.
And yet again, the spread in clock binning is atrocious, and this only comes from process variability issues. We have one CCX clocking significantly better than the other at lower voltage because TSMC has not ironed out fin variability. If their yields were Godly like you tech illiterate AdoredTV fanboys believe then this wouldn't be the case. The more variability in fin profile you have the more defective chips you have at both ends.
All of your assumptions are absolutely retarded.

Take a look at TSMC's wafer capacity before posting something this dumb. You don't need great yields to ship volume. 7nm is a huge node for them. They can ship 100,000 7nm wafers per month.
Jesus this board.

Maybe if Intel figures out how to use EUV long before anyone else.
But so far Intel's EUV engineers don't seem to be up to the task.

>before anyone else
Samsung has a 7nm EUV in volume production, they actually never did a DUV process like TSMC. Though now TSMC has 7nm EUV in volume as well, their 5nm EUV(first really inclusive EUV node) is already in risk.

Intel's has a few technical hurdles they haven't overcome yet, and partial EUV inclusion won't address either. They have an issue with metals in BEOL and MOL, but they also have a problem with how complex the actual Trigate itself is. They'd need full EUV exposure to eliminate all multi patterning involved in etching out these far more complex gates compared to everyone else's FinFETs.

I guess they're fucked then

Intel can only make new 10nm for enterprise if they pay big, or mobile.

They will 14+++++++++ on consumer desktops

They're still using 14nm+++ for their more performance oriented mobile chips going into 2020 as well.

Well, apparently Intel is fucked then.