Is it even worth learning in 2019?

Is it even worth learning in 2019?

It seems like it maybe could be nice on a laptop...

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It's the best for quick hack jobs or if you're editing something over ssh

for stuff that could benefit from a gui i use VS Code

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No. Anybody who tells you to use it just trying to justify their own wasted time and efforts.

No. Vim, C languages, and windows are garbage. Any person who uses any of those should kill themselves.

You shouldnt need to learn how to use an editor. Try nano and see if you like it.

i tried learning it 2 weeks ago, i would say it's very easy to learn, i only use it for quick edits to conf files and it's sometimes faster than nano

>he doesnt script entirely in Notepad

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Yes, for me it made editing text significantly more pleasant.

Its meh. I fell for the/g/ meme and tried it out once. You can add scripts for autocompletion but they are slow and shit. An IDE is superior.

It's super easy to use once you understand that it works in "modes".

>open up your terminal
>type 'vimtutor' and hit enter
>spend 30 minutes learning how to use it
>bretty gud
literally no downsides except 30 minutes learning to use it.

>You can add scripts for autocompletion but they are slow and shit.
This is such a retarded thing to say.

>An IDE is superior.
What does that even mean? An IDE is a set of tools bundled together, practically every single one of them can be used from inside if vim.

>This is such a retarded thing to say.
Sorry, but you don't get to tell me how my user experience was. Fuck off faggot.

B-but it's written in C. Hackerlarpers told me it would be fast.

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Your user experience is a direct result of you being enormously retarded.

>B-but it's written in C.
Vim itself is enormously fast, but it also comes with its own scripting language and retards can fuck things up on that route.

it's a must if you're unix wizard

No. You're just a slave who's in too deep to admit that anything that can't be done with a normal editor is better done with AWK.

That would be vi not vim.

>anything that can't be done with a normal editor
Everything can be done with a normal editor, you don't use vim because it enables you to type magic symbols.

It's like a tiling WM.
Once you get used to it, all is well. In my case, I can't really use anything else.
I have an alias for GNU Nano: alias nano='echo USE VIM YOU FUCKING MORON...|lolcat && sleep 2 && vim'
I also use a vimlike file manager and browser (ranger and qutebrowser)
It makes things simpler, less bloated, etc.

There is also vimtutor, but I haven't used it. I just referenced the docs anytime I forgot a keybind.

>not developing entire software suites in windows notepad run through wine on a libre gnu+linux thinkpad.

vim is essential if you work on the shell frequently. Immutable or not when you have to log into the server to debug or tweak something nano is a poor substitute. If you actually work a position where you are on console or crash cart them obviously a hundred times more essential.

If you don't ever edit files in shell ever and never will? Then I have no idea why anyone would use vim. I still would but I'd know it was just bias at that point.

Also anyone who seriously considers "learning vim" as an investment is being silly IMO. Vim is text editor. Yes it has an arcane control scheme, and yes it will take you an hour to acclimate.

Occasionally you'll have to Google how to enable some things and maybe steal a vimrc but you'd have to configure and learn anything that isn't notepad at the end of the day.

For the love of God just set tabs to be spaces and make your life easier also I know hot take

>Then I have no idea why anyone would use vim.
Because it makes editing text easy and convenient?

I mean, don't get me wrong, I love vim and use it locally for almost all purposes.

That said I have multiple terminals open all day. If I was opening a terminal every program and just to use vim or using some sort of weird gui vim Id go back to vscode with vim key commands

yes and learning vim will teach you vi

wasted trips

based

Yes. Vim is the most convenient code editor for folks who don't like training wheels.

It's not a meme. Vim is very comfy. I love it.
Colleagues think I'm a weirdo and ask why I "haven't started using VS Code yet" until I come to their terminal and manipulate source code way faster and easier than them.
You don't need fifty plug-ins and a huge vimrc either, things like autocompletion are built-in (, , etc), you can navigate source code easily with ctags, buffers, and splits. Plug-ins are good for more modern conveniences like git integration.
You can get crazy with vim script, macros all over the place, complex remappings that call unix tools, or whatever, but simple everyday things like moving around a file with / instead of using the mouse, basic text objects and motions, things you can learn in a few days, they will take you far enough.

i spent years learning vim now just use Jetbrains IDE software

>learning vim for efficient editing
Waste of time
>learning vim to be one of the cool kids
Totally worth

if you think of vim as a universal control scheme then its value should be kind of obvious. there are vim plugins for pretty much all major software for editing text; browsers have vim plugins; tiling window managers and tmux can be setup to use vim-like keys; etc.

it also takes, like,

>You don't need fifty plug-ins and a huge vimrc
This. I have maybe four plugins, and my vimrc is only ~280-300 lines (with comments). Compare to average Emacs with a bajillion plugins and 1000s of lines of Elisp.

>It's like a tiling WM.
The splits feature behaves like a tiling wm too.

Yes

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There is absolutely no reason to use Vim when Emacs exists, and I say this as someone who used Vim for almost 5 years before switching.
Everything Vim does, Emacs can do as well, if not better. And obviously, it can do much more.
>muh vim keys on ssh
>vim is installed everywhere!
Not true. First, they are Vi keybindings, Vim did not invent them. Second, familiarity with Vi keybindings is useful, but it doesn't require using Vim in any way. Third, POSIX requires a Vi implementation to be installed, not necessarily Vi (a couple servers I connected to had BusyBox Vi instead).
Now, pay attention: I'm not saying Emacs is the single best tool for everything. Sometimes, a dedicated environment, with fine-tuned specific support is better for the most part (Eclipse for Java is an example). Sure, you can use Emacs in that case as well, and it's enough sometimes, but you won't have as much support.
However, Emacs still has no equal when it comes to general text editing tasks.
Seriously, don't bother with Vim, at this point it's just a worse Emacs. You might as well use the real deal instead.
My only regret is not having switched to it sooner.

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>Eclipse for Java
you disgust me. use IntelliJ

Install coc.nvim

It's a great text editor, but don't try to make an IDE out of it. The basics of vim are absolutely worth learning, but don't go out of your way to try to learn and configure everything.

fpbp

I only use vim because of having only CLI access to our remote servers.

Is this bait or are you just retarded.

1) Vim already has autocompletion, press Ctrl+N or Ctrl+P
2) Vim is not an IDE, the whole benefit is that its a lightweight quick lean terminal editor. Anyone who tries to turn it into an IDE is retarded. Use VS Code or emacs if you want bloat and to turn it into a frankenIDE thing

It's not really a drastic difference unless you wanna use your editor as an interface for sending mail and reading PDFs (which no sane person would want anyway)
t. used vim, not the biggest fan of it but moving to emacs ended up being a lot of work for no real gain

>buffer completion is the same as content-aware completion
>vim is lightweight

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>i spent years learning vim now just use Jetbrains IDE software
I also spent years learning vim.
Now I use at work:
vim+tmux
Jetbrains IDEs
VS Code

Every now and then I disable my vim emulation in Jetbrains and Code, because they get too clunky or I feel like there'd be an advantage to using vanilla Code with all their key chords etc. But that doesn't last long before I get frustrated at slow text editing and re-enable them

spacevim

spacevim.org/

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If you want content aware completion use:

An IDE
OR
Neovim with some fancy async linters that you are comfortable setting up by hand with a linting server, because you have autism and want to prove you're not one of those normies who uses an IDE
OR
Just use an IDE like a normal person, enable their vim plugin (there's always one)

I use the vscode vim plugin every day at work. Saves me from RSI. Definitely worth taking the time to learn vim (or emacs I guess) if you're a programmer.

I just want an editor with:
>features for programming (auto-completion, bracket matching, auto-indentation, synthax highlighting, etc)
>normal interface where I can use my mouse and classic shortcuts (ctrl-c, ctrl-v, ctrl-x, ctrl-s, ctrl-z)
>isn't slow as shit
>no telemetry at all

But it doesn't exist

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Or just use YouCompleteMe. It’s not that slow in my experience and works well

>“Its not that slow”
Ive used vi for half a decade now, the best implementation is emacs evil mode. There is a non zero change that you are using vim wrong because its a piece of shit and vimscript is unfixable

VS Code has vim plugin too.

>Jow Forums hates vim
Ok so using vim from now on got it. Remember to always do the opposite of what this site says

it runs on terminal so you can use it over ssh, if you work with servers you HAVE to know how to at least edit and save something, If not then leave inmediatly. anyone who tells you its hard or useless its an idiot, anyone who uses it for anything else probably is one too

Don't kill yourself.

If in 2019 you still can't answer this question yourself, you shouldn't learn it.
You shouldn't learn anything.
You should fucking kill yourself, you retarded motherfucker.

It's takes legitimately an hour to learn basic commands, then after a week of immersion you have it mastered. Anyone who says otherwise is trying to justify their own impatience.

It takes an hour to learn basic commands then after that like a week of immersion to master it. Anyone who tells you otherwise is trying to justify their own impatience

what are the basic commands? the only thing i'd say is slightly hard to get into one's head is the parallel clipboard (if you don't know how those work, that is)

pretty accurate. vim is great until your .vimrc gets > a few dozen lines, then you're almost always better off with an actual IDE.

A week to master it? Yeah, a week to master the basic commands/navigation, but nobody is going to be an intermediate vim user in a week.

Do kill yourself.

>not ssh-ing from a chrome-book into a linux box with x11 forwarding that has a windows vm and using notepad there.

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Not running a ChromeOS VM inside Windows 7 so you can ssh into a Linux box with X forwarding running a Windows 10 VM so you can use the latest version of notepad

neck yourself. you are severly limiting yourself if you use nano. at least use syntax highlighting. use emacs, learn cursor movement and how to open and save files. takes 10 minutes. there, now you know how to use a real text editor already and when you want to do more with it you can instead of being limited like nano.

>worth learning in 2019
what is there to learn? you have like 3 commands and a few key presses but otherwise it's a standard terminal text editor.

What is Visual Block mode
Don't listen to a single vimlet
Install vim plugin in a modern editor there you go it's modern now

>Jow Forums outed as a bunch of IDE reliant codelets
at least dont use arrow keys for cursor movement you dumb fucks

IDE is a tool, don't confuse yourself

t. still uses arrow keys
the only language you need an IDE for is java

Does evil mode have any extensions? How about nice features like text-objects? (di”, yi{, etc are amazingly convenient). Or is it barebones like nvi?
>vimscript is unfixable
I’m thinking of moving to nvi. I think that lets people use Lua

Moving to neovim*

What is there to learn? Just read vimtutor, you can "learn" it in 1 day, 3 day if you want to go at slower pace, 5 days if you're legitimately retarded.

post vimrc daddy :3
p.sicp.me will be cool daddy :3

Based. But fuck zoomers. They should be stuck with the inferior vim.

Can someone provide evidence that working in Vim improves productivity over other editors?

vscodium

Bump

If you want to use a light saber, take an afternoon and learn Vim. If you're content with a clumsy blaster, stick with whatever else you're using.

It's focus is editing text first, and producing text second. It becomes much quicker to move within the document to make changes than other editors.

>Vim improves productivity
How the fuck would Vim improve productivity?
I'm a professional sysadmin with over 10 years of experience and I do everything in vim.

Does it make me more productive? Fuck no! Does it make text editing and writing faster? Yes.
Does it reduce the mental burden of having to think about editing text? Yes.
Does it make save me time? Probably a bit, but not that much, since I'm not a coder. I guess for them difference would be bigger.

For me the main advantage of vim isn't speed, but the fact that my muscle memory is so good that I don't have to think about editing text. I can focus on what kind of change I want to do, and then do it with minimal or almost nonexistent effort or break in my thought process.

I don't know about you, but for me the speed with which I can iterate on a solution(and by iterate I mean edit > test > check result > edit > ...) gives me a much better flow of work. Which is why for devs its so important to have almost immediate feedback for changes they just made. And which is why long build and deployment times make the job of devs much less productive and much more frustrating.

Really, just use whatever makes you feel like you're not using it at all. It's like those old sayings about the sword being the extension of your own hand.

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Thanks for the insight but I think you're contradicting yourself. If you dont have to think about editing files, doesnt that make you more productive?

yes, if for no other reason than you can use some of the same keyboard shortcuts in less, diff, etc
also because when you have to ssh into a machine running busybox your options are probably ed and vi, and if you know vim, vi is easy enough to use

>If you dont have to think about editing files, doesnt that make you more productive?
Not really. My job isn't editing files, my job is building, maintaining, and expanding infrastructure. My productivity is dependent on how fast I can learn new technologies, how well I understand them, and how easily I can connect them to make a working system, and not on how fast I edit text files.

Yes, my job involves writing scripts, terraform infra definitions, ansible roles, and so on, but my productivity is mostly dependent on my ability to use those technologies, not how fast I can edit files they use. I spend far more time reading docs and command output and thinking than I do editing files.

As I said, the benefit could be possibly bigger for a dev who spends a LOT of time editing, but I wouldn't expect it to be huge. maybe 5-15% faster, as a guesstimate? I guess it would be also dependent on how good they are at using Vim too. 15% could be for a VERY proficient user. It would definitely be interesting to do a study on what is the benefit depending on proficiency, but it would also be dependent on the type of text editing people do.

It takes like 10 mins to learn. From a command line, type 'vimtutor' and complete the tutorial. There. You've just learned vim.

>Implying nano has no syntax highlighting
Niggq u wot

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No bullying please. I have some questions regarding the use of tiling WMs, if they are a bit noobish I apologize. Firstly, is it really more efficient than using other WMs and a DE such as xfce4? Secondly, is customization as hard tedious and irritating as it seems or am I a class A retard, I can't get termite to properly delete characters when ssh'd into my pi (It places a space character) as well as other problems with terminal emulators.

Yes, it's one of the few memes that are actually worth learning.

>is it really more efficient than using other WMs and a DE such as xfce4?
Words like "efficient" or "productive" have nothing to this. The only thing it can be is more or less comfy once you get to know it.
>is customization as hard tedious and irritating as it seems
It can be, as you have to usually learn somew new kind of syntax. Lua for Awesome WM, haskel for Xmonad, or their own freshly invented wheel for i3.
But the configuration is usually quite powerful.
>I (am) a class A retard
I'm sorry to hear that. If understanding things is hard for you I recommend meditation.
>I can't get termite to properly delete characters when ssh'd into my pi (It places a space character)
Your TERM environment variable has the wrong value, google it.
>as well as other problems with terminal emulators.
Terminal emulators can be a bitch sometimes considering how old they are. Keep at it.

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I use vim because it's the modern version of vi
while emacs is totally different thing
>name one thing a program can do that other similar program can't do
this is retarded argument, if you're talking about text editors then all of them are capable editing text files, expecting a feature outside of text editing is retarded

>vimuser.org
I'd say it's not worth learning.

>t. leah

Why would a tranny vim user tell people not to use vim?

Because projection.

youtube.com/watch?v=wlR5gYd6um0

Watch this video and make your mind.

It's not for everyone, but it can be interesting.

***Benefits of VIM***
-when there are random server shells with no graphical environment you frequently ssh into and configure

-GBP from the elderly computer science professors.

-Not using a mouse for faster typing... yeah I really like being able to line jump and search that efficiently and jump my cursor while barely using my hand.

-If you know the shortcuts well enough it's like you become one with the text editor and merge souls for a while, as you know, a wereVIM.
[Tip: Do NOT do acid in this transcendental VIM state because it feels like the VIM side takes over and you have to stop VIM from leaching your identity til there is nothing left of your true self]
No matter how much I try to learn EMACS, Jetbeans, VS Code, atom, or any variant of notepad... the experience of becoming one with the process of the editing with no conscious thoughts of hand movement just isn't there at all.

-Impressing the boys with your VIM skills.

-Convincing Heidi that you are a dangerous 1337 hacker because Swedish chicks only like bad boys who are a threat to society so maniacally laughing at VIM is pretty much my only hope before I crack and wear programming socks to get my jollies.

Holy mother of cringe.

have transcendental vimsex

it's very comfortable, I can't stand key combinations, I can edit text very fast without hurting my fingers. Vim as an advanced programming environment is probably shit, but I guess a good implementation of its interface in an ide or emacs can work good enough.