Jow Forums let's sit down and make a distro of darwin/xnu

Will it work 100%? What about browsers?

not him but why don't you just try it?

Stop being so greedy and contribute to the world.
Hmm I will. I'd just assumed it was vaporware.

It's garbage. Macos popularity comes from its userspace, as kernels go darwin is worse than both linux snd nt.

>darwin is worse than both linux snd nt
???

Why would I care about a kernel that's inferior to linux? Even freebsd's kernel is less shit.

What is a window manager?

Elaborate please. Genuinely interested.

How is it shit? It's literally a low latency kernel for desktops. You can google benchmarks you know. Meanwhile linux has specialised distros for audio engineers so their recordings aren't complete trash.

No, Apple engineers are already paid to do this, why should I contribute anything?

NT > *BSD > Linux > Darwin
It might make people mad, but it's the truth.

Free software exists so people can play around, modify, and contribute back to it. If we're all leeches like you, nobody would open source anything.

ok wheres ur repo then faggot

I don't have a repo, I work offline and submit patches manually.

>spend my time working on free open source software
>don't want to take my time away from that to work on Darwin which already has a team of people being paid to work on it
>this makes me a leech
The reason people don't do it is because it's thankless. All I hear is people complaining about the things I wrote now I have to hear about the thing I didn't write, for you. This has honestly made me reconsider my choices. The users are never thankful and rarely useful, they certainly never pay for anything, so what's the point. I'm just going to keep shit to myself from here on out.

That's great and I totally agree - I have three apps I sell and am never open sourcing them. However, I do want to see a fully functional macos distro.

Have you considered macos?

Darwin isn't shite outright but the project for many years now has known that ios kernel is the next evolution for apple - the last great effort put into actually introducing new tech was their metal effort and that was primarily for ios later down the line anyway. All "new" improvements that aren't just performance/security bumps are typically thought out to be portable across the apple ecosystem and not strictly great for XNA - doesn't inherintly make the kernel shite just means that when the next W^X level of security is required darwin gonna be dropped like the youngest baby in the Holodomor.

Yes, I have a 2014 macbook air.

Oh please. I know you like Linux, but it isn't impressive. It is just a run of the mill monolithic kernel, with all the pitfalls of such. XNU is just so much better from a technical perspective. Don't even make me laugh by mentioning NT, that shit is terrible.

>NT
imagine the IO performance

Linux is a server OS with server OS security features, I/O queues, virtual memory, etc. You need a really pimped out kernel for desktop/laptop use but that's exactly what XNU is.

>high performance
>low latency
Mach/Darwin/whathaveyou is neither of these things.

The only good parts of the XNU are what is stolen from MACH or FreeBSD or NetBSD. Linux is shite to be sure but the reason we all still use it is because the way it has approached development from the angle of being a community - something XNU also tried but then couldn't achieve because as a platform it's apples cashcow first an a community project second. Does this make a better product? Maybe. Does it make a better technical project, no. Linux fuck sucks because it's now a massivley whored out project with so many bad faith and self-interested actors that any clear design principles have falled away to whatever doesn't break everything. But at least it's not a corporate cuck who sits in the corner screaming that Jow Forums needs to make it a distro.

>when you rely on the bulletproof foundation that is new technology so you have the ability to host your entire service on memory cached objects initially provided by virtual kernel devices meant to be used with a managed languages across a distributed fleet of machines that may or may not even physically exist on your domain

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Look up benchmarks? Linux has special kernel releases and distros for low latency work to get close to mac os.

Clearly you're only interested in ideology. I am interested in technical specifics. This conversation will go nowhere so I am ending it now.

Can you give concrete examples of XNU shortcomings?

In technical specifics then, the linux kernel supports more filesystems than the xnu one, it has more hardware drivers and no iokit does not mean xnu has "infinite" drivers because fuse is also a thing.

yes

>In technical specifics then, the linux kernel supports more filesystems than the xnu one, it has more hardware drivers and no iokit does not mean xnu has "infinite" drivers because fuse is also a thing.

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You don't understand, the technical specifics don't matter. There are already several other BSD distros out there with very similar stacks, that don't have absolute shite communities.

Can you name some?

Mach and XNU specifically are bad because of the validity checking they have to do because the microkernel attempts to enforce a unix security model on every IPC message.

You want something simpler like L4 for modern systems, especially given the amount of attention seL4 is getting recently.

cs.utah.edu/~lepreau/osdi94/condict/abstract.html
os.inf.tu-dresden.de/pubs/sosp97/

Filesystems
>wow the actual permanence of my data is fucking unimportant bro, copy on write? non-formD? why would I want to use new and better technology
How about compilers then, linux even cucked the llvm team over to their side.

>>wow the actual permanence of my data is fucking unimportant bro, copy on write? non-formD? why would I want to use new and better technology
>How about compilers then, linux even cucked the llvm team over to their side.
I think you actually have no idea how a kernel works.

I don't get how this affects PCs. I turn all these off when compiling linux and only use xfs.

"Community" may as well be synonymous with "fragmented shite".
As a FreeBSD user I am astonished at how bad the development experience is for Linux. People have been calling it simple for years and it's barely even progressed as a project in this regard. Even when you're using something newer like the Arch build system or Gentoo's various build setups, it's all so convoluted and particular. Just to add something to the kernel and test it out. And the actual build process itself is magnitudes slower.
The BSD version is so simple that I can memorize it.
`make installkernel KERNCONF=/my/gay/shit.conf`
Linux is like "at least these tools and these configuration scripts in this order..." nonsense.

You must be an NT boi then I'm guessing.

>boi
I hate homos.

Wait what, of course you can apply patches to a kernel and make install it under linux what are you smoking,
and just like with freebsd builds if it takes too long cut some unneeded drivers.
Do you actually use freebsd daily or have you picked it up for ZFS on a server somewhere because to behonest the strongest development in freebsd comes from the community good example is infact the ZFS project itself within freebsd now uses linux code audited by the community.

>Wait what, of course you can apply patches to a kernel and make install it under linux what are you smoking,
I didn't even say that so I'm not even going to try and give you patience.

I think the fact that people treat installing Gentoo like a challenge and learning experience rather than a simple task speaks to this.

But it is a challenge. It's all highly linux-specific configurations and a completely arbitrary package manager. It's an OS that breaks the fourth wall.

>it's all so convoluted and particular
>it's barely even progressed as a project
>Linux is like "at least these tools and these configuration scripts in this order..." nonsense.
here are some examples of text that implies that linux does not feature a simple "make install" build system.
*hugs you warmly, rubs beard on your cheek affectionately*

I'll bite. How can I help?

We need to figure out how to make something simple like dwm for darwin.

I did it once, then I went back to Arch after I saw what it had to offer. I actually prefer systemd and that was mainly the biggest decider but outside that Gentoo is actually easier than arch, just takes longer to learn ALL the bells n whistles. In that regard Gentoo is far more configurable out of the box.

I'll maintain the floppy driver

When you make it obvious that you're not being sincere and are just goading for attention it makes me less inclined to give you a serious reply. I'm sorry but you're going to be ignored.

Here's a tip when dealing with so called "trolls", do not post a single post where the only engagement is a statement you will not longer engage with them. If you treat them with, allegedly, unwarranted sincerity and patience your position looks stronger even when it's not. If you have no reply to the arguments, don't reply and most certainly don't respond with a disengagement statement as it has the reverse effect and you now make freebsd look trash. Either provide why the build systems, as there are several to chose from, are worse on linux or don't sperg about your greener grass. Also build systems are specialist tools, like an IDE you're a retard if you call someone elses preffered type lesser - I know people who use Bhyve regularly to build their software under windows because of better native dotnet.

You'll need to port a display server first. The macOS display server (Quartz) is closed source and not available on Darwin.

Useless, worst part OS X is the kernel.

Let's make a suckless display server.

Already exists, see wayland. Has not been ported to darwin though.

This is literally a consumer technology board. The only non-consumer English imageboard still alive with a focus on tech is lambda.

Let's reverse engineer (legally) Quartz and make an open source substitute with the same interface.

That would probably be a lot more work. If you want to do these things why don't you get started instead of trying to play ideas guy.

might as well use bsd. darwin is a fork of that.

Errrr...... I have a MacBook, I don't *need* a darwin/xnu distro.

>when compiling linux
What a waste of time

I do it once a month, it's an automatic process.
>download and untar latest rc
>sudo make oldconfig grep-replace all -Os, -Od, -O0, -O1, -O2 flags in all files to -O3 -march=native
>sudo make -j4; sudo make modules_install -j4; sudo make install; sudo update-grub2

>-O3
mad man

Watch this.
>I've compiled nouveau with -Ofast

>darwin is a fork of that.
No it isn't.

okay, xnu not darwin. everyone refers to xnu as darwin anyway.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XNU#Kernel_design

theres already an x port for osx

Who the fuck wants X? The entire purpose is to have an open source macintosh OS with all its apps.

gnustep.org/

I don't get it, how will that help if macos apps can't interface x?

What's the point, necbeards have proven themselves again and again that hey can't do good UI/UX

I would rather make any *BSD usable for normies, at least close to Linux standards but with working desktop composition.