First of all, i never posted anything here, only lurked around but now i might need help from you guys or advice because i think you have more experience than me.
I am finishing my studies as a software developer and am still on an internship in a company. Now the company offered me an employee contract. I was happy at first but then i read the stuff and am kinda disappointed (i didnt sign anything yet). There was no negotiation about my starting salary or other things? They just said "We are happy to take too, you get 1800€ and 25 free days".
So the conditions and what bothers me are:
>1800€ starting salary Its below average and i asked other people who are finishing studies with me now. They get around 2300 - 2500. >15 hours unpaid overtime Contract says its in my salary included. >Everything i invent/idea or software i develop is property of the company They dont even have to give me something back like money or other things. This one really fucks me too. Why do they own everything that isnt even related to them.
I have to accept anyway, its better than nothing i guess. Should i try to talk about the money? There are 2 other guys in the same position also in this company and they also get same salary. And two guys who started last year got also same salary of which one got a higher salary now.
That's the guy who posted his private key. He lost 5000 OMG.
Eli Young
The thing i am struggling now is if i should ask if its possible to higher the salary or just take it without a word. Dont want to risk to get unpopular with them or that they just withdraw the offer. I want to work a year in that company until i can find a new job that pays better. While working there i might improve my CV and get higher chances for a new job. What would you guys do in my situation?
But what has that to do with my stuff?
Jack Taylor
You are getting lowballed, the only way to fix it is to ask. Your employer knows you don't have experience and thus very little bargaining power. You have 2 possibilities: ask for a raise or suck it up and work just for experience. Devs jump the companies more than any professionals
Jose Reyes
So if i ask for a raise, what would be the worst outcome? A no or could he actually say "nah we dont need you anymore". My idea was to work to gather some experience. Maybe i will get more attractive for other companies like that.
Jacob Bailey
Go get interviews at other companies. If they offer you higher pay, you can ask for higher pay or tell them to fuck off.
The last part is completely standard though, although specifically it should be everything you invent at/with the company. If they're paying you AND not getting any ownership of software, they're basically getting nothing.
Daniel Cook
did they offer you that salary or did you have to ask for it?
assuming they offered it, they obviously wanna keep you
tell them the average in your field is 2300-2500 , 1800 is wayy above average so you can't accept that.. they will likely give you a counter offer
when it comes to software developing, it's normal to sign a contract that everything you do is property of the company, what people usually do is develop in their free time, quit and then a day later release it.. just say "ye i developed it in a day" lol how do they wanna prove that you didn't
Ryder Martin
He won't fire you if you say it in the accepted corporate way
>what are the future prospects of my salary at the company?
He will however 100% tell you to fuck off. Managers have limited funds to hire people. Unless there's a shortage of entry level people, he won't say yes. If you want to get a raise, prove to him you're good at your job. This means delivering better software, in a faster time and showing you're capable of doing more. Managers care about two things
>the quality of the product >how much it takes to make it (related to how fast because employing coders costs money)
Increase the quality and decrease the cost. Convince him that he'll be losing more if you leave than if he gives you a raise, and you'll get it.
Matthew Harris
What country are you in?
Cooper Robinson
>how do they prove If they ever sue you, they'll compare the code to what you gave to the company. If it's similar, (I think it's 10% or more in my cunt), then you're liable for copyright infringement.
Jeremiah Campbell
"a friend of mine coded that"
your scenario doesn't happen in the real world to be honest, obviously don't copy paste code and work on your own stuff seperate from your work stuff
is it legally possible to happen? yes.. does it happen? no except maybe 2-3 special cases that got blown up by the media
Gavin Carter
forgot to call you a scared little faggot bitch
Connor Adams
They are just fishing for a desperate person to take the bait. What do their regular employees get? Any stock options (401k matching?) Dont be the desperate guy that accepts it, patience pays off ten fold. (I have lost so much money buy rushing things)
Ryan Martinez
bump
Landon Campbell
Sorry about delayed answers, captcha has network problems or some shit and i just cant post shit without waiting. The time window is to small to find something next to that. I can start working there right after my exams. They asked what my future plans are, i said i would like to work here and he said "Great, our starting salary is 1800..." without any chance of negotiation. Also there were two people sitting there, i expected the boss on that conversation alone with me. What if i say "i cant accept that" and they then just say "oh, well thats a pity, good bye". It feels like a gamble for me. And ya, if i had a good software idea, i wouldnt tell them probably. I am very good at my job and very fast in it. But i am just starting there so i couldnt really show that much. I might ask them about the prospects of my salary tho. Germany I dont know how much others get because they wont tell. Only one said that works part time and gets 14€ a hour (i would get 10,5 a hour). Also no stock options i know of (dont know what 401k matching is). And what other opportunity do i even have?
William Stewart
>Why do they own everything that isnt even related to them. If you quit then invent something, expect them to come for you. They will say it was while you were there you got the idea i.e it theirs!
Ethan Powell
lol how can you get JUSTed so hard in Germany? Don't you guys have stringent labour laws that protect you workers.
Negotiate hard or report them to your Germany labour ombudsman. Prepare to walk and go find a better company in Germany. I'm sure there are better paying ones with better working conditions.
Easton Smith
Yes, thats what bothers me. There are but i have nothing but this offer right now. Also Germany labour ombudsman would probably not help. They just take the offer back and i have nothing then. I have to bite the bullet and just take it. On the meanwhile working there ill search for something better paying. The working experience might help me find something faster.
Cooper Murphy
stay clean user people like will get what they deserve sooner or later
Jose Perez
Lmao how do eurocucks make so little? 2500 Euro per month is the equivalent of 36k USD per year, and for a SOFTWARE DEV??? Even for starting that’s trash pay. In the US even an average software dev makes 75-100k their first year, and 120k+ at a top company. We have lower taxes than eurocucks as well. I don’t know how you guys cope.
Dylan Evans
People underestimate how little saleries you get in germany. Germans earn like a third of what us employees get in the same Jobs. T. German
Jordan Hernandez
Germans are the people with the least percentage of homeowners
We are literally poor
Jaxson Miller
How the fuck is Germany considered a first world country then? Wouldn’t rent + taxes take up nearly 100% of your paycheck if you’re making 2500 euro a month, unless you live with roommates?
Jose Bennett
It would be 1800 gross. I would have like 1200 after taxes. Sadly i couldnt decide where to be born.
I talked with some guy and he probably has 500-700 left after paying rent and taxes.
Cooper Miller
yes and it does we get told we are rich by the government and most people blindly believe it
im focusing on moving to the us, working in IT like OP
Gabriel Young
Gotta pay for those rapefugees somehow I guess
Luis Nguyen
I think people get paid that low even before all that. I would emigrate but it is probably really difficult. I always wanted to live in Ice land but i think its even more expensive there. I guess ill suck up the 1800 and ask about the prospects. Saying just no to low and sitting at home without earning money would be shit right?
Easton Hill
Move to the U.S. midwest. EU is done for. The U.S. is the last bastion of hope for the white race.
I am not white. I just do not believe in (((multiculturalism))).
Jason Jackson
You can always accept the offer then continue interviewing with other companies. You know it's lowball, you know it's hard to get a job without experience. Any company that lowballs is not worth working for. Give those fucking retards what they paid for. Code it crappy then leave.
Fucking Jews.
Adam Young
>who posted his private key. why would someone actually do this?
Eli Wright
The thing is i need to have a job first in the U.S. and need to make a test before entering i think. I guess speaking fluently comes with time. Yes, that was the conclusion of all this. I take the job and search for soemthing else while being there. Really depressing to be honest. 4 years of doing works on saturdays to just be barely able to buy food and tickets for the train. Was really happy when i got that offer at first.
