Go to grocery store

wow

No. I also don’t think btc will be used to buy stuff. Stocks aren’t either. It’s a non correlated asset class Only for goods in the convenience store. Gas sales barely breaks even.

BTC is NOT a currency

Lol, not anymore it's not.
Now it's just a trap for morons.

Wow OP, just wow you really know your finances. Looks like you did quite a bit of research on this OP. Let me call my Brother who works at Goldman with this insider news................. Ok, just got off the phone with my Brother. Needless to say he fired off emergency faxes to all the trading houses.
>Just Sold Everything

Now that bitcoin has proved viability, altcoins will eat the world.

What if USD hyperinflated? What do you think the BTC/USD pairing would look like?
>Shale propped up through loans
>Chinks selling US real estate
>Nations looking to reduce US assets
> QE4 looming on the horizon
>Economic collapse can't happen here.
Keep telling yourself this.

>earn cashback for spending money
fell for "USA is the whole world" meme
>pay 4% upfront just to convert money to bitcoin
fell for the market order meme
>this takes 30 mins
fell for the bitcoin meme
>can't use this anywhere, all i buy is groceries/amazon
fell for the normie meme

why do you insist on using a revolutionary currency if you're utterly conventional? just like your kind didn't use BBS in early 90s, you won't get crypto until dapps are ubiquitous in the late 2020s - and even then, it's likely blockchain will be abstracted away from your perception as an end user

As a merchant I spend loads processing cards. And then you have idiots/fraudsters with cashback requests and stolen cards.

I would prefer getting paid in crypto, have finality to the payments. Crypto is better for merchants.

>hurr durr Ill just list all the doomsday shit that everyone and their mother knows since 2014

Get fucked faggot, maybe learn how the sp500 works before opening your dumb mouth :)

Just sold thx user

Attached: 53818E99-723B-463F-9A0A-BBB135ABB58C.png (480x480, 294K)

Dude, a visa transaction can take up to 4 months for the seller. Meaning you won't see the actual money in your bank account in a long time, they can be reversed if the buyer or visa decides for whatever the Fuck reason they may come up with. You need an actual bank account to use a credit card so you lose clients that can't or won't have one.
If you don't see the use case for btc or crypto in general you are retarded.
Someone pays you with crypto and you have your money within the day. You can tether up as soon as you get paid so you don't mess around with btc volatility.
Crypto will be adopted but it will take time and central banks will try to still adoption for as long as they can. The fiat getaways for crypto are closing for a reason

THERE IS A TRANSCATION FEE.

It is just included in the price. But every transaction a percentage goes to the bank, not all arrives at the seller.

Dial up sux the Internet will never take off

>what is international SWIFT transfer that takes few busuness days?
>what is paypal fees?

Corecuck detected.
>what is 0-conf?
>what is BCH
>what is NANO

Bitcoin: peer-to-peer electronic store of value

These arguments are literally all wrong and show you have no idea how these transactions actually work. Must be good to be a dumb ignorant normie, huh?

Yes bitcoin is useless shit

That is why I am now an ARK-missile

Yep, crypto is a steaming pile of shit, I've been shorting with the other Bobo's.

It was a game of musical chairs from the start, and the music has stopped.

youre also a faggot reddit normie

>no transaction fee

>Not knowing stores pay monthly fees just to offer CC use
>Not knowing it costs them roughly $1 per swipe to use on top of that fee
>Not knowing those costs are offset by charging you more for good/services. See Gasoline pricing.

Being this dumb, this is what is feels like to be fiscally liberal I guess.

>>Shale propped up through loans
>>Chinks selling US real estate
>>Nations looking to reduce US assets
>> QE4 looming on the horizon
>>Economic collapse can't happen here.
>Keep telling yourself this.
The USA will experience a shitshow soon, but I'd count on EU collapse before that, along with some other shit-tier countries. If anything, that'll justify the shale expenditure as we'll be exporting the bulk of production. It could be the thing that offsets a total collapse. So much for reducing US assets when the value of the dollar holds and everything else falls.

>[X] trading
>[X] hedge against economy collapse

Uses of btc:
[x] market manipulation
[x] shorting crypto while it crashes and burns
[ ] store of value

Attached: btc_price_prediction.png (2472x1466, 513K)

>lists a bunch of shit OP isn't even talking about

For daily normans crypto sucks. End of story.

You know the business has to pay a transaction fee for every credit card swipe, right? Do you think credit card networks operate without any overhead?

I agree but sending money internationally is so much easier with Crypto

Yeah I know I love Holochain also its so amazing

Attached: feet.jpg (310x163, 7K)

>Bitcoin doesn't need any use to be valuble
This is what coinfags actually believe. My sides.

if you don't understand by now why buying coffee does not equal use you honestly should just sell it all and leave crypto.
god why are people THIS retarded? on biz, of all places.

which fucking loser needs to do that anyway

So what the fuck is use then again? I’m not seeing it

>I’m not seeing it
nobody is. that's why it's getting decimated

That doesn’t make it a good currency. It’s too volatile. Nothing any crypto can do will fix that.

>>instantaneous
>>no transaction fee
Looks like you don’t have a fucking clue how anything works. You’re useless.

>pay 4% upfront just to convert money to bitcoin
ChainLINK

what happens if you or someone you care for suffers organ failure and you need to acquire a new kidney or liver, but for some reaosn you cant get one in your country? then you have to buy one through "irregular" channels, which must be kept hidden from the eyes of the state. you'll need crypto then. i mean, have you even thought this through?

>Bitcoin doesn't need any use to be valuble
>This is what coinfags actually believe. My sides.

when was the last time you paid for anything with gold? exactly.

>it’s a hedge teehee I posted it again
>money moves towards risk during market turmoil

Attached: BBC22684-ABFC-45CE-A921-21A98541C745.png (1136x640, 565K)

this! around 6% charged to the merchant.

Attached: 15331618129950.jpg (640x853, 49K)

This graphic is fucking retarded. I buy bitcoin all the time just using my bank account. There’s no need for the middle men in the last image, except maybe if the recipient needs to cash out.

>You
>Your bank
>Coinbase or whatever you use
>Their bank
>Individuals

Seems the same user

btc can be traded peer-to-peer you fucking mong, and vendors can receive crypto directly if they incorporate a platform to do so. banks dont have to figure in the equation at all.

>instant
wrong. credit card transactions take months to finalize due to ability to reverse purchases. for most mundane purchases as soon as the transaction is broadcast it's effectively finalized. only for the most expensive purchases would it be important to wait the couple minutes it would take for the transaction to be finalized on the BTC blockchain without fear of it being reversed at a later date.

vendors can't really take btc for their goods there are strict accounting rules that need to be met they would need to convert on spot using a service and a bank.

I should clarify - For must mundane purchases ON THE BTC NETWORK the transaction could be assumed final as soon as it is broadcast to the blockchain (IE before confirmation takes place by miners).

>they would need to convert on spot using a service and a bank.
you've never heard of smart contracts or LINK? check this:

medium.com/@OpenLawOfficial/openlaw-teams-with-chainlink-to-bring-real-world-info-to-smart-contracts-4e7a3dac80a8

>Our first integration with ChainLink will leverage our existing smart legal contracts to demonstrate the capabilities of this integration with ChainLink. Assets (cryptocurrencies, tokens, etc.) transferred on OpenLaw can now be denominated in U.S. dollars. Then, using ChainLink’s middleware, we can calculate the equivalent amount of ETH at the moment of transfer. For example, if a party agrees to a $10,000 per month contract via an OpenLaw agreement, the exchange rate can be converted via ChainLink’s oracle each month to pay in Ether at the latest exchange rates.

i'm so fucking sick of spoonfeeding you idiots. you spend 12 hrs a day here and still dont know shit about crypto.

pretty shitty idea... double spending is childs play. you pay for a coffee using minimal fee and double spend that address within a few minutes to a different one with higher fee you got a nearly free coffee with almost zero effort i bet there would be apps for this shit if the practice ever gained popularity.

dude you need to use a service and a bank there are rules to how cashiers work until they change to incorporate crypto nothing smart contracts do matters one bit.

you are literally retarded and a millenial and seem to have forgetten that people can still pay with cash. where do you need a bank to tell you you can accept paper money.

pro tip: you dont

In this hypothetical world I would presume that KYC was widely used and that instances like the one you described would be treated as an "overdraft" on an account that would be covered by someone else (lightning node operator as an example) and would need to be covered by the owner of that btc address at a later date + penalty fee for overcharging their address.

>people can still pay with cash
yes in a very clearly defined existing set of rules about accounting and cash-register operation and custody and also reporting to the irs around here the cash-registers are online.

>I just use my bank account
>DUHHH YOU DON’T NEED BANKS
Thanks for the enlightening response, the poster I actually replied to specifically mentioned having a bank be part of this process. Have you ever bought crypto with cash in the bankless manner everyone claims is a such a virtue? I bet fucking not. And fyi a CC purchase involves banks.

oh it's a hypothetical world now... i see.
in a hypothetical world hypothetical legislators might be fucked to incorporate hypothetical cryptos into the hypothetical payment and accounting process i guess.

and? i dont even know what your point is. filing accounts for crypto has always been a thing, as it is for any other kind of economic activity. how does this hinder peer-to-peer transactions or peer- to vendor transactions? it doesn't.

>where do you need a bank to tell you you can accept paper money.
no actually that's state mandated something called a legal tender look it up!

it hinders the same way as if you tried to pay for apples with oranges in the store. even if the store was willing they couldn't process your transaction. you would have to sell your oranges to someone first and pay for your apples.

o boy. so i need a bank account to mine btc??

hahahahahhahaahh!!!!!!!!hahahahahah!!!!!!

you millenials/zoomers are the dumbest fucking generaitons to ever have lived.

>so i need a bank account to mine btc??
a very fat one for that matter if you even want to think about it.

>1 cold wallet
>1 wallet on your phone for stuff like buying groceries if we havent switched to having it all delivered by then
>swipe phone to capture transactiondetails
>check your screen and hit ok
>transaction is being sent and picked up

you may even have things akin to banks, where you can deposit a bit of crypto and they just batch transactions. The advantage for crypto will still remain as you can just keep your cold storage for yourself.

and? a bank doesnt have to give me or you permission to accept money otc. again, what isi your point?

you talk about a double spend problem and I bring up a scenario that could resolve the issue you clown. Up your hypothetical gaping ass

frankly what you just described is a step back from ln. as you would have no natural full custody over your coins that you deposited.

i just destroyed your argument, thank you. you dont ever need to interact with a bank to mine or transact bitcoin. /thread.

no just fucking read what i write nigger! the state authorizes and also actually forces the merchants to accept your paper money that they printed. there are rules for the transactions and the handling of bills and accounting the purchase. no such thing for crypto. you all think it's somehow technical but the real issue for adoption in real life is legislation.

you can't solve the double spend problem in a 0conf system. if you could we wouldn't have pow blockchain existent at all.

this is getting surreal and i still dont know what your point is.

>the state
the state isnt a bank. nice attempt at a bait and switch though.

its the way to go, unless lightning network can actually deliver.

its like putting cash under your bed and only depositing it every month to easily cover expenses. The point is to only do 1 transaction and then do hundreds of smaller ones from your account. That way you can only lose the small amount, while you still conveniently hold most your coins in your wallet.

>There’s no need for the middle men in the last image, except maybe if the recipient needs to cash out.
You ever try to cash out? YOU CAN'T!

>replying to a point I never made
I didn’t ask you if you needed it, I asked if you actually mine or pay cash for it to skip the banks.
You can read the reply ITT where someone said they use the bank to buy btc, which you seem to be completely detached from.
Just to remind you what I’m talking about

You literally just described the current system using cash instead of crypto.

Really stimulates the synapses.

Why are you so stupid and ugly, mentally and physically damaged both here and in reality? I have literally never seen you post anything remotely intelligent, original or funny here. All you do is shit up the place with you 8 syllable sentences and let everyone know it was indeed you who dropped that turd of a "thought" on this board.
Thanks to you I have started to advocate for euthanasia to be accessible without any specific reason to everyone, so you could freely end your existence on this planet, because you will NEVER EVER find happiness nor wealth with your cruel handicaps.
Everyone wishes you were dead, ESPECIALLY your family, nobody loves you and nobody likes the idea of having deranged cripple who only produces debt, misery and uncertainty in their family. They might never say it out loud but everytime they look at you they wish you would die already and would stop being a baggage of depression to them.
Maybe you think you are strong just by virtue of existing - but you couldn't be more wrong, the people around you tolerating your existence, the family of yours who carries you as an emotional and financial burden, the doctors pointlessly trying to cure you, THEY are strong. You however, are just a rotting, retarded waste of oxygen and protein.
Do one good and brave thing and end the suffering for them and for you.
Kill yourself.

>the state isnt a bank.
that's just something you tried to push nigga... i have no idea where you pulled it out of.

You seem upset. Is there something troubling you?

>Not knowing BAKKT is built on the exact same model
>Not knowing retail wants nothing to do with crypto
>Not knowing retail sales have dropped from 270 million to 60 million in 5 years
>Not knowing everyone in the real world, ie. crypto's customers it needs, have moved on.

i dont care what anybody else said. i'm saying that crypto allows people to mine and transact currency without ever needing to interact with a bank.

this isnt really controversial. prior to fiat money people would barter; they can do so still today. in the UK if you barter you still need to pay taxes to the government, but you dont need to interact with a bank. same with crypto. no banks needed, but still need to pay taxes. i not really saying anything out of the ordonary here.

Do you really think businesses wouldn't add the exact same transaction fees to crypto?

BAKKT is looking to do exactly that.

Nobody is sitting out there going "Oh, yes, crypto gets a free ride, oh, yes, because those poor faggots on Jow Forums deserve a lambo"

Fucking faggots. All you have is fairy stories and excuses.

current system:
>put money in bank to save
>bank account gets frozen and you are SOOL

crypto in the future:
>have money in your wallet
>no one can freeze it
>deposit a bit of your crypto to an account in a Bank so you can buy many cheap things without having to pay transaction fees for everything

Crypto means, you are in control of the money, not the bank. You can still use the wallet to make every transaction yourself, but i dont see it being viable, unless LN delivers

>i'm saying that crypto allows people to mine and transact currency without ever needing to interact with a bank.
unless of course you want to make a LEGAL purchase as of now.

What is cash? Serious question.

>ordonary
Well, considering you're illiterate to begin with...chav gonna chav...

current system:
>have money under your pillow or in a safe
>no one can freeze it
>deposit a bit of your money to an account in a Bank so you can buy many cheap things without having to pay transaction fees for everything

same shit nigga no matter how i look at it you are not reforming shit.

without ln actually working there will be no convenient retail possible and it requires intermediaries and you will pay the price.

I've never had a bank account frozen, nobody I know has had one frozen. What the fuck are you even talking about? Worst case scenarios? That most people will never encounter? That's about as meaningful as "you need Bitcoin because the sun might explode!"

Fucking faggots in here.

Why are you so stupid and ugly, mentally and physically damaged both here and in reality? I have literally never seen you post anything remotely intelligent, original or funny here. All you do is shit up the place with you 8 syllable sentences and let everyone know it was indeed you who dropped that turd of a "thought" on this board.
Thanks to you I have started to advocate for euthanasia to be accessible without any specific reason to everyone, so you could freely end your existence on this planet, because you will NEVER EVER find happiness nor wealth with your cruel handicaps.
Everyone wishes you were dead, ESPECIALLY your family, nobody loves you and nobody likes the idea of having deranged cripple who only produces debt, misery and uncertainty in their family. They might never say it out loud but everytime they look at you they wish you would die already and would stop being a baggage of depression to them.
Maybe you think you are strong just by virtue of existing - but you couldn't be more wrong, the people around you tolerating your existence, the family of yours who carries you as an emotional and financial burden, the doctors pointlessly trying to cure you, THEY are strong. You however, are just a rotting, retarded waste of oxygen and protein.
Do one good and brave thing and end the suffering for them and for you.
Kill yourself.

cash is not secure:
>can be easily stolen
>you are in high risk when going to the bank to deposit it
>cant just move around 100k cash easily without a briefcase or something

while crypto:
>its a key to a wallet
>you just type it in to make a transaction instead of handling paper
>no need to physically move anything
>and of course you can just take it anywhere without someone questioning the origins or taxing it

People will love this

>unless of course you want to make a LEGAL purchase as of now.
no. i can still make a legal purchase without a bank being involved. seriosuly, i'm trying to be patient here with you but it's getting hard.

let's do this:

1.me and you both have btc wallets which we set up without needing a bank.
2. i have some rare chainlink dice cubes which you would like to buy from me.
3. we converse via email and set a price of 0.1 btc for 100 dice.
4. you send me the btc to my wallet from your wallet, and i post the cubes to you

we have just done a legal transaction that exchanged btc and goods without the involvement of a bank.

is this so hard to understand?

It is irrelevant, the discussion was about the reality of bitcoin purchases, which is that most people are using banks to buy it and aren’t mining for it or using cash in a private sale which I’d count as excluding banks. You jumped in with your shit about banks not being necessary. That was never my point. See Note the picture showing idealism vs reality.

What about a point of sale application that can quickly check the used public address for current BTC amount minus current pending transactions with 0conf? That would resolve the double spend issue unless you are expecting the same address to be used multiple times instantly for goods delivered instantly which is unreasonable. This situation is only really possible online and those vendors could reject the transaction after a minute or so it takes for them to realize there are no funds in the wallet.

>You jumped in with your shit about banks not being necessary. That was never my point.
so you admit i was right. thank you.