I'm an european muslim AMA but keep it civil

are you the one with the dutch flag who lurks /sp/ and keeps calling mexicans and brazilians subhumans?

No, in fact it is entirely true

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Go back to middle school religious studies.

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Unlike you, I actually critically analyze the koran instead of listening to regurgitated dogma from the middle ages.

The "barrier" or veil aka hijab the koran mentions is in no way meant to be taken literally. It is a metaphor for decent, modest dress and behaviour. If it was to be taken literally, Allah would have also described the exact nature of the veil, whether its a Burka, Niqab or Hijab etc.

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Thoughts on circumcision

What a load of tripe, no respectable scholar of any madhab even remotely said anything of this sort. and calling teachings refined over a millennia "regurgitated middle ages dogma" just proves you have little knowledge of what you're talking about.
furthermore the prophet's wives wore fill khimar since they were supposed to be role models for the believing women.

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>teachings refined over a millennia
More like teachings that have stagnated since millennia.
>furthermore the prophet's wives wore fill khimar
They didnt. Even if they did, they didnt do so because of what is written in the koran

why cover the entire face anyway?

I didn't know muslims could be this based

>stagnated
ya you're a retard, one of our most basic concepts is that we must imitate the salaf and that our teachings are valid for all times and places. You're not smarter than the millions of scholars that came before you kiddo, and you shouldn't bend your ideals because of exposure to western norms.
>They didnt.
yes they did, this isn't even debatbl and there are even tales of ali (RA) not allowing people to take a glimpse at his wife's shadow (hyperbole I assume but serves a message about how the salihuun acted)
if by based you mean nonsensical and baseless yes. I can interpret the some out of context verses to conclude that the earth is infact T-rex shaped but that doesn't make it true.

The Muslim community has been poisened by Saudi Wahhabi Ideology that is regressive, overly culturally Arabic and rejects any form of progress. Generally, traditional Muslims are extremely hung up on adapting to modern times because they are paranoid about bidaa aka adding new things to the faith, which is why they deify medieval scholars and their schools of thought for no good reason. None of the 4 Imams knew the Prophet personally and live centuries after him.

Additionally, Muslims see the West as the enemy, which it isnt. In many ways the West is more Islamic that many supposedly Muslim countries

So umm, did the OP just not even bother with this thread?

>ya you're a retard
Typical salafi decency
>we must imitate the salaf
We must imitate their character, not their dress or appearance, which is based on local culture, not religion.
>our teachings are valid for all times and places
Indeed they are, because they can be adapted to modern times, which salafis refuse to do
>You're not smarter than the millions of scholars that came before you kiddo
Yes I am smarter than some medieval dudes from Persia
>and you shouldn't bend your ideals because of exposure to western norms.
muh west
>yes they did,
No

>None of the 4 Imams knew the Prophet personally and live centuries after him.
Imam malik was born a few decades after the prophets death and others were raised and taught by the companions what the fuck are you even talking about at this point.
the fact that you view basic islamic teachings to be wahabi extremism is hilarious. it's fine to be wrong kiddo, I thought like you when I was 12, then I took my head out of my ass and started making sense.

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What's your opinion on gay muslims in western countries if they're faithful to their prayers and duties as muslims?
yes, they exist.

>me
>salafi
that's it I've seen it all
>We must imitate their character, not their dress or appearance, which is based on local culture, not religion.
what the fuck? dress difference is maybe wearing differnt hates, but what they consider awrah is what we must consider awrah.
>ndeed they are, because they can be adapted to modern times, which salafis refuse to do
they adapt they don't bend, homosexuality is haram in all times, the awrah stays what it is for all times, the dress code is cemented.
>Yes I am smarter than some medieval dudes from Persia
pure kibar, and this is coming from me of all people.
there's nothing to gain from arguing with you anymore, this stuff can be debunked by some 9 year old who has basic fiqhi understanding,I only hope you recognize the error in your ways and stop misleading anons.

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t. Texan femcel

eh shouldn't really be a problem unless they fuck,I know converts of this caliber.

I wasn't asking you, incel.

as retarded as always tumblerina

here, I replied properly now, incel.

Is there any other point to support muslims other than lessened gynocentrism and getting to marry 11 year olds? I have a hard time seeing other benefits.

My parents are muslim.

Nope I'm a turk.

Nah its not that hard, there is always chicken, beef or lamb based food. That is while disregarding restaurants run by muslims.

No I'm a dude, also I don't have a problem with fags as long as they don't shill their degeneracy openly. What people do in their home is their business.
Also the genders are biologically not equal. I don't mean it in the sense of 'women are dumb lol XD' but more that men and women think differently and value different things, saying they are totally equal and should have the same rights and duties is retarded. Men and women should by law be equal I guess but stuff like the wagegap is a non-issue.
Also white genocide won't happen even if it happens its more because europeans gave in into liberal and progressive thought or in other words hedonism.

I never go their.

I'm something of a based muslim myself.
But seriously you seem to be on the right track. Not enough people read the Quran and try to understand it. Some stuff is very explicit. For example homosexuality is bad as Allah nuked a whole city for it and stuff like pre-marital sex is also forbidden. As a muslim you aren't technically allowed to marry a non-virgin if you are a virgin yourself.

Yeah I'm back.

Following a religion for any reason but spirituality is a waste of time and basically you would be LARPing.

don't feed him.

Don't ask retarded questions, stupid femcel.

Atleast he seems to be trying to read and understand the Quran. Honestly there is nobody around me who is even trying to do that so I respect people who try to. I'm currently on my third reading of it.

I know one guy for example who says that reading the Quran directly might cause you to misunderstand it so you should read works of scholars instead.

>this thread just turned into a bunch of muslims arguing
It's like watching memri tv live

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Well I'm not a spiritual person and I don't actually care about the religion. I'm more interested in concrete benefits to society and me as an individual.

Nothing wrong with it desu. Also it decreases penis related diseases.

your friend isn't wrong, obviously you don't need 10 volumes of explanations whenever you want to read but you should always have a tafseer on hand to understand the context behind the revelation of certain verses and what they refer to.
intellectual gutter, arguing over shit that's supposed to be dead and buried.

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>Islam good because I was born muslim

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>Nah its not that hard, there is always chicken, beef or lamb based food. That is while disregarding restaurants run by muslims.
My Indian friend who is a Muslim never eats any meat unless its halal as in prepared the halal way

t. Gaytheist

In that case you should stay an atheist desu. Also if a religion has teachings which benefit a society then maybe it really comes from an all-knowing deity who tells you how to be an optimal person?

I get that and there is nothing wrong with looking up works of scholars for further explanations but most of the Quran is very straight forward. Its plain laziness to not read your holy book.

Why would you read it more than once? Would rather read a book learning how to invest instead of a religious book.

>Also if a religion has teachings which benefit a society then maybe it really comes from an all-knowing deity who tells you how to be an optimal person?
You like drinking camel piss and killing people to get them to drink camel piss?

kek, what? where is that implied?
again what?
Yes but what really gets me are people like that swiss user interpreting stuff to fit their agenda rather than actually searching for the trutt.

Well that's a bit harder to find. I generally am content with finding meat from non-haram animals.

That camel piss was given to those people as a medicine and appearantly it worked. They however got fucked up because they were causing trouble after they were helped.

ALLAH ACKBAR KUFFAR WONT DRINK CAMEL PISS MY MUSLUMIN BRODAS THE KUFFAR IS FILTHY!

He might genuinly think that way after trying to understand the message.

Reading and memorizing the quran is only natural as it's the unaltered revelation of Allah(SWT), Burgers won't understand as this is even somewhat rare in devoutly christian communities.

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Absolutely halal

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I'm Armenian you simpleton. What good will it be if I read the bible 20 times or once?

Or maybe the teachings are based on thousands of years of observation of people and don't come from an invisible man in the sky. Also, you didn't answer my question.

then he understood it wrong. the quran isn't open for interpretation in that way.

Have you drank camel urine when you feel sick?

Because its around 700 pages of divine poetry with many hidden meanings and that if you only read it plainly.

So you think that an illiterate merchant figured out human behaviour when sociologists with the knowledge of millenia at their fingertips couldn't do it?

there is thawab to it and there are other reasons.Also the bible is different because the methodology of how it was written and came to be is highly suspicious.

What if I told you that it’s poerty sucks and written as would a scitzo?

>reading poetry
never gonna make it

That's it, you have to leave.
People with uncut dicks are untrustworthy and shit, see yanks and jews don't have foreskins.
Savage shit.

Then I would tell you to fuck off.

I think that an illiterate merchant stole the glory. It's a far more likely explanation.

I have to say it's quite refreshing after a I come back from molesting children in the street.

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>Metion Islam once
>Seething MENA apostates flood the thread

Yanks and Americans get theirs cut nerd. It causes most of them to have a stick up their ass though

Cut I meant, obviously.

Mention*

I read it in turkish so it wasn't in poetry form. But the original arabic is, so if you want to really understand it then you would need to read it in arabic.

Why do you care about my dick so much bro?

If that were so that illiterate merchant would have to be far more cultured than anyone I have met. Doesn't sound very likely to me.

The thing about cutlets is that they've all got sticks up their ass and unironically throw around stigma against uncut people. The same cutlets who support mutilating males will always attack Muzzies because some of them mutilate their daughters.

Nobody is worried about your dick. People are worried that you're gonna go and mutilate your kid's dick because your parents mutilated you

>implying its not because the US got jewed

sounds hot

Fuck off

Symbol of barbarism and larping as jews.
Protestant yanks do it because they wanna be jews, you lads possibly do it for the same reason.

So you're thinking about pre-teen dicks then?
Sounds both pedo and gay desu, are you greek-american by any chance?

What do you have against illiterate merchants?
It's far more possible than skydaddy, after all merchants are supposed to be good with words.

There is nothing wrong with jews aside from them trying tk take over the middle east and turn it into a jewish apartheid state desu. I actually respect their culture for valueing education and knowledge so much.

I don't have anything against the prophets occupation but I'm trying to point out how impossible it would be for him to fabricate the Quran.

>There is nothing wrong with jews.
This. carpet bombing muslim niggers is pretty based.

I'm Armenian you fuck
>thinking of pre-teen dicks
>sounds both pedo and gay
Yeah bro wanting kids to not get mutilated is fer sur pedo and gay and if you do this lose my number B. Touching their dicks and cutting them up is 100% my mans.

Yes, an illiterate merchant was able to construct the most masterful piece of arab literature in existence which wasn't matched by any of the literary geniuses of the peninsula.

I mean mutilation sounds pretty based

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Why would it be? It's just a poetry book, it's not like illeterate people haven't been composing them since thousends of years ago.

Maybe he was just that smart, after all he got from being expelled and almost killed to ruling the whole place.

fer sur B. Gonna go cut my ballsack and take my testicles out of it for the lols

Its contents surpass the knowledge an illiterate merchant would be able to acquire.

Why, as a merchant he would travel all over the place and meet many people.
Things like beowulf or the illiad and the odissey were composed orally, it's not that weird.

What prophecies do beowulf and the illiad contain? Because the Quran basically foretold global warming and explained 1400 years ago that the ruler of Egypt was not always called a Pharaoh.

Based
Unbased.

Do you guys still get circumsized?
As far as I know most jews are atheist, so there wouldn't be a reason for you to do it.

None, but I'd like to read them, but anyone can claim something vague for the future and something similar becomes real.
Also read some azoras of the quran in spanish and it had characteristics of oral poetry like repeating verses and titles.

are you a quranist?

Yes, no not most Jews but there are quite a bit of seculars.
They do it because they want to "fit in" or shit like that and whenever someone speaks against it people go batshit.

I think that it's insane that it's considered okay to do something like that forcibly I mean putting moral and ethics aside it's supposed to symbolize a covenant between God and a person why force it upon someone, wouldn't it affect them a lot more if they get to choose to do it to become part of the religion/community fully?
Only like 5% or so of Jews born nowadays don't go through it and some do it later in life due to social pressures because women say "Ew disgusting worm dick" if you ask them about uncircumcised dicks but in reality they watch porn that's made worldwide with quite a bit of uncircumcised guys and they probably don't notice and probably wouldn't care if someone wasn't circumcised.
There's other stuff too like pro circumcision people spreading rumors that they'll be bullied during shared showers in the army but nobody gives a crap it's tired 18-22yos who are on good terms usually they wouldn't give a shit even if someone has three dicks.

Its not that vague desu, one verse says that the sky was made to protect the earth and a later verse says that a day will come that the sky will melt and the earth will burn because of that. The idea that the earth will burn without the sky or that the sky isn't some constant and eternal thing isn't common in historical literature and as far as I know unique to the Quran.

So its seen as a cultural jewish thing then?