Gold is real money. BTC relies on the dollar

you guys are both retards. The primary function of money is to use it to buy and sell stuff. If you want to increase your value you invest in stuff not hold it in currency

Dollar value of gold does not matter at all moron. The entire point of buying gold is because fiat is a scam and you want money and wealth for when hyperinflation happens.

If the dollar dissapeared from planet earth tomorrow my gold would be completely unaffected. You understand this right?

No dumbass the primary function of money is to measure value of goods! That's why gold is money to buy things! Because it measures value perfectly!

>No dumbass the primary function of money is to measure value of goods!
no retard, the whole purpose of money is to use it to buy and sell stuff. Money are not an investment, you aren't supposed to get value just by holding money

Again, dollar value of gold doesn't matter. Gold is just money it isn't a stock. You don't want the price of gold to go up

How dumb are you zoomers that you don't understand a stock is different Jan gold? Stocks go up when a company generates revenue and gold is money and is supposed to be stable, hence why it has been money for thousands of years.

You fuckheads say btc is the new gold yet there was never a problem with gold. You are throwing your money in meme coins because the dollar is dying, unironically because it isn't backed by gold and can't make it anymore because it isn't backed by gold

The only reason ancient people used rocks for trade is because they were hard to counterfeit and lasted long. Now that we have computers and scanners these shiny rocks are useless as money

ANd why can you buy and sell stuff using it? BecAuse that money measures value. A Lamborghini is 400k the cost is a measurement of value in dollars.

If we all went to live in a beach and deemed that sand was money that wouldn't work to well now would it?

The dollar is a terrible measure of value because 100 years ago 20$ was a good weekly salary. But today that 20$ barely buys you lunch at a bar. That gold ounce equaled 20$ 100 years ago so a gold ounce equaled a good weekly salary 100 years ago and today a gold ounce still equals a good weekly salary since its fiat value is $1,250.

Gold measured value perfectly for 100 years.

Goldbugs are so mentally ill.
We know fiat is a scam

Consider the following:

"As a thought experiment, imagine there was a base metal as scarce as gold but with the following properties:

– boring grey in colour

– not a good conductor of electricity

– not particularly strong, but not ductile or easily malleable either

– not useful for any practical or ornamental purpose

and one special, magical property:

– can be transported over a communications channel

If it somehow acquired any value at all for whatever reason, then anyone wanting to transfer wealth over a long distance could buy some, transmit it, and have the recipient sell it.

Maybe it could get an initial value circularly as you’ve suggested, by people foreseeing its potential usefulness for exchange. (I would definitely want some) Maybe collectors, any random reason could spark it." - Satoshi Nakamoto

Dumbass zoomer:

Do you even understand that it is gold that gave value to the dollar?

As in...... the dollar REPRESENTED gold!

And ever since going off the gold standard we have had massive inflation to the point where you faggots are literally throwing your net worth in internet coins BECAUSE it's impossible to make it anymore now that we are off a gold standard.

60 years ago you could drive a bus full of retarded kids to grade school as a career and you could easily have the wife at home raising your 3-4 kids.

That isn't possible anymore when off a gold standard.

Your investing in shitcoins BECAUSE the dollar is dying because it isn't backed by gold.

How do you morons not understand this basic logic when I'm spoonfeeding it to you?

Also the government can and will take your gold like they've done in the past (FDR 1933). You aren't safe just because you have gold.

Yeah fiat or dollars are a scam because gold doesn't back it anymore. That's literally it. So there's no problem with gold, there's a problem with dollars because it isn't backed by gold.

Do you think it is just magic that "income inequality" had become a top 3 issue?

Under a gold standard the term "income inequality" didn't even exist

Nobody confiscated gold in 1933. Some faggots turned it in. And if they did come for it which they won't.... there's something called the 2nd amendment.

Also... you literally just made the best argument for owning gold in this entire thread. If gold wasn't valuable as fuck then why would anyone want to confiscate it?

Get it through your thick skull grandpa, shiny rocks are useless for money. Their only value comes from tech industries little demand, if it wasn't for that those shiny rocks would be as worthless as other shiny pebbles

gold did well this week. lets hope it follows through. once we break 1366 the jr gold miners are going to act like altcoins and 10x - 100x. these idiots have no idea what the JR Gold miners are capable. the entire crypto market was designed to imitate gold and jr miners but at fast forward (5x speed).

crypto is a scam. the NSA has a sha-256 collision which allows them to fake the entire bitmain hashrate from a 1996 laptop with an internet connectio. chinese intelligence sells those stupid miners to zoomers. this is just another racket intelligence agencies run just like drugs and guns.

So if you had inside info that hyperinflation would hit in one month... you wouldn't convert any dollars to gold? Please tell me your not this dumb

what these zoomers fail to realize is that the entities suppressing gold are eventually going to GO LONG and pump precious metals into the mother of all bubbles as the dollar implodes. the yuan is going 1 to 1 with the american dollar and oil is going to 400....gold is going to 10k at least. Imagine the prices of the jr miners with 10k gold.

What miners do you own?

do any of you idiots realize we literally had Federal reserve OPERATION TWIST (named after chubby checker song) in 1961......then again in 2011??? so that would make 2018 = 1968.....do you fools realize what is coming???

Asteroid mining will make gold as cheap as aluminum.

we gonna fork instantly and continue from the last valid non attacked block
crypto won, you are done

There are a lot of problems with gold. Its heavy, hard to conceal, hard to transport across borders, hard to divide, and can be seized or stolen. Bitcoin has none of those problems

Nice try moving the goalpost retard. Hyperinflation is something extremely rare that would only happen in a global meltdown or WW3 or if you live in a 3rd world shithole.
Your original argument is about gold being good as money in general not being good investment when there is a global meltdown. When the meltdown happens gasoline will skyrocket in price too that doesn't mean I am gonna stack up on gasoline just in case there is a global meltdown

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all the ones paulson owns that aren't in south africa (south africa is going to INTENTIONALLY COLLAPSE which is part of their plan to cause a panic). THM (he owns 2/3 of this one so ive got A LOT ON THIS ON), TMQ (trilogy metals), NG...I also own new age metals because once south africa implodes platinum production is going to drop 75%...I also bought jaguar mining in brazil based on my observations of the buying patterns of some freemasons. the more masonic the name the better. Tower of babel....

goldmoney.com

Operation Twist (1961)
The Federal Open Market Committee action known as Operation Twist (named for the twist dance craze of the time[1]) began in 1961. The intent was to flatten the yield curve in order to promote capital inflows and strengthen the dollar. The Fed utilized open market operations to shorten the maturity of public debt in the open market. It performs the 'twist' by selling some of the short term debt (with three years or less to maturity) it purchased as part of the quantitative easing policy back into the market and using the money received from this to buy longer term government debt. Although this action was marginally successful in reducing the spread between long-term maturities and short-term maturities, Vincent Reinhart and others have suggested it did not continue for a sufficient period of time to be effective.[2] Despite being considered a failure since a 1966 near-term analysis by Franco Modigliani and Richard Sutch,[2][3] the action has subsequently been reexamined and in a 2011 paper economist Eric Swanson of the Federal Reserve Bank of San Francisco has suggested that "Operation Twist" was more effective than originally thought.[1][3] Swanson suggested similar action as an alternative to quantitative easing by central banks;[1][3] the FOMC did in fact take an analogous action in 2011.[4]

the 6 day war, opec oil embargo, yom kippur war, iran revolution were ALL CIA psyops to create SURPRISE INFLATION. the SURPRISE is key for FINANCIAL REPRESSION.

what is financial repression?

youtu.be/PAq6QgW1tZo

read this academic paper and look at the options....usa definitely likes to use SURPRISE inflation

heinonline.org/HOL/LandingPage?handle=hein.journals/intlr104&div=47&id=&page=

Except bitcoin can go to zero. Gold can't. It's stored economic energy

I collect Pokemon trading cards, the only REAL and trusted store of value. Checkmate faggot

who's ready for "the great inflation" 2.0???

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>It's stored economic energy
thats the dumbest thing I've heard so far. Please stop posting you are embarrassing yourself

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Don’t you understand why everyone here is concerned with sats? Don’t you understand why own 21 btc is the #. Gold is hard to store and heavy to transport. Bitcoin will win out. It still has 100x in it too but will you be too lazy to learn why?

And gasoline will skyrocket in price because the dollar will be imploding dumbass. Do you understand cost of living going up means the dollar is becoming more worthless.

No, gold isn't an investment at all. Gold is money. When the dollar shits the bed.... you'll have a gold revaluation. You wake up one morning and gold is 50k per ounce to purge all the debt from the system then you have a deflationary collapse of all asset prices. So your home that's 200k now is worth 50k after the collapse. Then your 1 ounce of gold (converted to the new currency, probably some crypto) buys you a home outright. That's how it works.

We are 21 trillion dollars in debt, everyone is getting poorer. And you think the dollar is going to be the king forever and ever. So fucking stupid

America got A LOT POORER from 1968 to 1980. before the "great inflation" a man could get a job out of high school and support his entire family and have a vacation home too! after the "great inflation" women were forced to enter the workplace because WE GOT POORER....they disguised this as "women's liberation"....."great inflation 2.0" is going to make us 3rd world. if you dont have mining stocks and gold you are about to miss out on the biggest wealth transfer in human history.

You zoomers are EXACTLY like feminists. Women today are the first group of women in history that desire to have the right to kill their own child in the womb.

You zoomers are just like these feminist dumbasses in that you are the first generation to be anti gold in world history. You think you are so edgy and high IQ except your literally the dumbest fucking generation in history.

And it's actually more than just zoomers. Boomers are just as anti gold as zoomers. The entire western world is anti gold. It's brainwashing.. it's a sickness

you are fucking retarded m8. People were much poorer back when they had the gold standard. Deflation is much worse than inflation, when there is deflation everyones salary gets smaller and smaller. It doesn't matter if stuff are cheap when your income is getting smaller, you will be even more poor and have no money left to save

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gold ownership was illegal until 1975 which only allowed americans to participate in the blow off top of the gold bubble. the best time to get in was 1968 before the london gold pool collapsed. people that are long gold now are like the people who bought gold for $35 an ounce in 1968.

That's what it is stupid..... how the fuck do you think gold is valuable? It's valuable because of the ENERGY used to extract it out of the ground!

Gold is stored economic energy and a store of wealth.

All your shitcoins..... stocks, bonds, real estate get their VALUE based on energy produced in the FUTURE. Gold gets its value from energy used in the PAST

this is why I own BPT (pays amazing dividend but super risky but I dont care because I am certain that oil is going to skyrocket), CHK, NE

learn the big mac index fucker

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>Gold is stored economic energy and a store of wealth
no its not grandpa, its just a shiny rock, there a lot of them around, nothing special about the yellow one

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60 years ago min wage was $1.25 and gold was 35$/oz.

So it took a min wage earner 1 week paycheck to purchase an ounce of gold.

Today min wage is 9$ and gold is $1,250 so it takes a min wage earner today an entire month paycheck to purchase that same ounce of gold that it took a min wage earner 60 years ago to purchase with a week paycheck.

People are much poorer today. The fucking middle class is decimated. Everyone's in debt. In the 50's and 60's the middle class was huge!

There was no income inequality chants 60 years ago and today it's a top 3 issue.

How stupid are you people are richer today? It's impossible to have even just 1 kid today. 60 years ago you could drive a bus and have the wife at home easily raising 3-4 kids.

How stupid are you people?

WHy is gold valuable tho? because of energy used in the PAST to get it.

The value of your stocks and real estate rely on energy produced in the future. Gold gets its value from energy used in the past.

who cares what you idiots think. you people cant be convinced until you feel the fire. FYI I made a lot of money on bitcoin and got into commodities in winter 2017. I realized the scam was over.

>What is forex?

boomer here, you'll be dead by then, its been supressed along with silver...maybe with the "golden bear run" or market crash it will be a good hedge...but are you prepared to wait another 10 - 20 years before it even comes close to the zoomer 20k btc price. btc has surpassed gold in price in a fraction of the time, even at all time lows its value is still higher, we are not in the "ye olde" age, it is information age, and information is valuable. things are hyper inflated because we need things done quicker, faster better (evolution), this old way of thinking doesn't work anymore, who cares if its a minera,l a tulip or avacodos w/e.

buddy its about to get a WHOLE LOT WORSE

learn the difference between cost inflation and price inflation

im a millennial and its coming sooner than you think

hey hey hey boomer
you already know you crypto is what you need
you are just bargaining with your programing

just do it

inflation is an INCREASE IN THE MONEY SUPPLY you dumb cuck. the price level rise is symptom. WE JUMPED OFF THE SKYSCRAPER when we did QE....we just havent hit the ground yet. the prices will rise its already in the pipeline....

no you didn't
>The value of your stocks and real estate rely on energy produced in the future.
no they don't
and why would they spend their salary on gold? people needed to buy food, clothes, cars etc not shiny rocks

Yeah your maybe right.... it may take 10-20 years BUT it could also happen Monday morning.

no its not you moron. learn the definition of inflation, its the increase in prices in a year. Increase in the money supply is just one of many factors that can increase inflation

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I see you brainlet don't have any arguments and just started posting memes

on the same sentiment, everyone knows btc/gold/silver is a hedge...market crash is happening...and its going to be brutal.
Pic related, gold/btc timelines

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sticky prices
consumer expectations
macro economics
commodities

Do you fundamentally understand that they aren't spending their money on gold. All you are doing is transferring your wealth from worthless fiat to real money and a real store of value. That's all you are doing. Your becoming your own bank.

You understand we are 21 trillion in debt right?

The idea behind buying gold is that when fiat fails and prices collapse and gold is revalued you are the beneficiary of that seismic shift in value from worthless debt paper to sound money.

Nobody buys gold at 1250$ to sell at 2,000$. Gold is just gold. It doesn't go up like a stock because of yearly revenues. Gold goes up in dollar price because the dollar is failing.

A gold ounce 800 years ago is still that same ounce of gold today. Doesn't matter if the dollar exists or not. Do you understand something that simple?

milton friedman was arguably the most renowned economist of the 20th century you dufus. he agrees with me.

Do you fundamentally understand that gold does not get its value from the dollar existing?

He was wrong. He convinced Reagan to not go back on the gold standard. Our founders were economic genisuses.

The price level P is the price of goods in terms of money. Its inverse, 1/P is the price of money in terms of goods or the value of money. Like any other commodity the value of money (i.e., its price in terms of other things) is determined by the supply and demand for it. An expansion of the money supply, holding the demand for money constant, will cause the value of money to fall and the price level to rise. An expansion of the demand for money, holding the quantity constant will cause the value of money to rise and the price level to fall. All price level changes---and, hence, all inflations and deflations---can be analyzed within the framework of the demand and supply of money. For this reason, inflation is obviously a monetary phenomenon.

It is probably reasonable to argue that Friedman, under the circumstances in which he made the statement, meant somewhat more than this. He also tended to argue that inflations of any significant magnitude and duration are always money supply phenomena in the sense that they are caused by excess monetary expansion---i.e., increases in the money supply relative to the normal growth of the demand for money that would result from growth of real income and the trend rate of change of velocity. While it is true that small inflations and deflations could be attributed to shifting trends in the demand for money, in every case where inflation has been a problem (that is, where there have been periods of substantial and persistent inflation) it can be attributed to excess expansion of the money supply. Of course, even if a movement in prices is the consequence of a shift in the demand for money, there is an adjustment of the supply of money that would have prevented it, but it is generally not possible for central banks to anticipate every shift of the demand for money so that they can offset it with appropriate adjustments of the money supply.

It has frequently been argued during periods of inflation that the observed rise in the price level has been the result of greedy price setting by firms or greedy wage setting by unions. It turns out, however, that profit maximizing firms, even if they are monopolies and "control" prices, will have no incentive to raise their profit maximizing prices without a prior shock either to their costs or to the demand for their product. And unions that are following the preferences of their members will choose to exert an optimum degree of real wage pressure and absorb and optimum degree of loss of jobs as employers move up their negatively sloped demand curves for labour, and will have no incentive to increase their wage demands without bounds. Both firms and workers, of course, will raise their prices and wages in response to an increase in the nominal demand for output resulting from an expansion of the nominal money supply (or a reduction in the demand for money). Because firms and workers do not have an incentive to raise prices and wages beyond optimum levels, persistent inflation cannot be caused by the actions of unions and firms in the absence of excess expansion of the money supply by the central bank.

yes he was "wrong' just like allen greenspan was wrong and now he's suddenly and ancap again...they are trying to destroy the united states. they know how economics really work but they are doing all of this intentionally.

ok but what about infinite lateral growth?

youtube.com/watch?v=KcgA-hMAozI

I agree with your gold analogy, but you would be foolish into thinking that this is no different

you are retarded. in 2008 gold crashed. in 2011-2013 at peak of EU crisis gold crashed even harder. Your shiny rock is useless and its price went up because it was just another bubble

are you too dumb to understand that gold price is based on the dollar and not the other way around?

nice pastas retard. Inflation is primarily based on the goods and services in the market not the currency. Even if you have fixed supply currency you would still have inflationary periods. Regardless of all these, your whole premise is also based on the fact that inflation is bad, which is not. And no, having some inflation is not the same as hyperinflation

jefferson was the greatest genius that ever lived

hamilton was an idiot

im happy people think this way because its going to make me rich. See ya in puerto rico!

you missing the point, its been going down for so long and to think the reverse wont happen is naive

Don't worry bucko, I will be there shorting your shiny rock bags when the time comes

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>assuming a closed economy
>assuming consumers are price change tolerant
>assuming inputs are finite
>assuming no changes in market competition
>assuming no technological change

>ruins your oil price speculation graphs

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>ruins your finite commodity price projections

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>ruins your energy growth dependent economy shortage

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gotta spend money to make money

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>hyperinflates your gold standard

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how do digital goods work in a friedman economy?
the supply is infinite so, prices should be close to 0 right?

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just tell me how to protect my loved ones :(

Assuming that there are no costs in producing or maintaining said digital goods and assuming the absence of ip protection, then yes.

Yeah, but now we can jack off to traps on something called the internet. Everything is going to be just fine, nothing to see here

*replaces entire gold market by 2030*

It's really simple friend. There are two kinds of people that buy bitcoin. One kind wants to use it as a digital currency, and exchange it with other people in dark net markets for all sorts of goodies. The second kind wants to hoard the coins, and hope for the supply to skyrocket in order to get rich eventually.

The first group hopes to god for the currency to remain stable. The second group are a bunch of assholes ruining everything.

The dollar price of gold fluctuating just means the dollar is going up and down.

Again... gold didn't all of a sudden become valuable when America was born and the dollar was created. So why would the dollar price of gold matter?

Your literally buying gold because you reject the dollar as a store of wealth dumbass

>The dollar price of gold fluctuating just means the dollar is going up and down.
no you moron, it means the price of gold is going up and down

I realize there's a dollar price of gold. But gold is just gold. A gold ounce 800 years ago is still that same ounce of gold today. Nothing is changing with the gold. What's changing is the dollar.

Do you understand that people buy gold as a hedge against the dollar collapsing? So if you understand that then it doesn't matter what the dollar price is because your fucking buying gold in the first place because the dollar is garbage.

I don't give a shit if gold goes to $5,000/oz or 500$/oz in dollar price

Wouldn't gold be an inherently worthless good to buy then? What is it good for except insurance?

>Nothing is changing with the gold.
the demand for gold is changing you dumbass. The only real demand for gold is for some electronics and jewlery, the rest of its price is by speculative gamblers like you

This. Governments and banks believe in gold yet a bunch of lazy "investors" here don't. 6000 years of trust in gold both as a store of value and a commodity. Crypto cant even last 10 years. Fiat on average only lasts 40 years. People just dont understand history. There is no such thing as progress when it comes to money. Zoomers will never understand. They just wanna burn shit down and complain blaming others but themselves.

china is purchasing 2/3 of the world output for a reason sucks.