Hello Jow Forums. I'm unsure if this is the right place to go but I'll ask

Hello Jow Forums. I'm unsure if this is the right place to go but I'll ask.
I'm looking into setting up a small casual restaurant in a major european city, particularly in one of the more expensive areas near college campus and night life. Also planning on providing food delivery services so besides me in the kitchen I'd probably need 2-3 employees.
Wondering in what price range the initial investment would be if anyone has any kind of experience with this.
I would appreciate any other input and feedback as well, thank you for your time.

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1. Technically it's the right place to ask but it's not the right place to ask. Most people on here have no entrepreneurial experience or even go outside.

Also there's just too many factors to say. Are you going to buy a restaurant with everything in place already and modify it for your purposes or are you going to build from scratch?

Just buy link and wait it's a better investment plan

I was planning to rent one out and modify it, buying is way out of my price range right now.

this on both points

seems like you are daydreaming rather than have an actual project

Which city? 1 to 5 spectrum in terms of cost
Which country? Cost of labor, eating habits, etc.. vary greatly
What kind of restaurant? take away only or sit-down? if so, how many seats? If sit down, what kind of service? basic service 1 FOH staff for 30-40 guests, ultra high end is 1 per 2-3 guests
What kind of cuisine? of cutlery
Electric stove, gas stove, of wood fire? these aren't the same price and will also affect the type of extraction you need, and some areas may be barred to certain type of installation due to zoning/construction codes

I could go on and on
I ran restaurants for ~10 years in Lisbon,(Portugal) Meribel, Nantes (France) Martigny (Switzerland)
I'd be glad to help, but please come back with some kind of business plan rather than a pie-in-the-sky "how much does a restaurant cost?" question

This is all very dependent. You said delivery so I'm assuming no customers actually in the restaurant. Heres a few things to consider in your costs:

What kind of food will you cook? This tells you what equipment you'll need. You'll probably need sinks, a dishwasher, oven, fryer(s?), grill, at a minimum.

Do you know how to cook GOOD food? If not you need to hire a chef who can teach you

Is the building safe to cook in? Do you need a ventilation hood? How about fire safety equipment. These are expensive.

Branding and a website are a must. You must make yourself known. No walk in customers so your brand and food quality is all you have. No wooing customers with great service.

Are you buying or renting property? Buyings better long term and restaurants are a long term buy.

Do you want to work 50+ hours a week?

Have you ever worked in a kitchen? You're probably underestimating the number of people you need. You need dishwashers, prep cooks, line cooks and someone to expedite. And enough of these to fill a whole schedule. And that's just back of house.

You sound like you don't know what the fuck you're doing so you're likely to be in the majority of businesses that fail.

Thanks for the slap in the face, but I guess I deserved it. Yes it's still a very early idea, just trying to figure out what to aim for after dropping out of college, and cooking is the one thing I like and I'm good at, so I would like to know if it's within my reach to pursue.

1. Yes I do know how to cook good food despite no real chef training, I have just been cooking all my life and it's something I like to do. Despite this I might need to hire another chef because I would also be in charge of management, supplies, finances, etc so it may be too much on me.

2. Basic equipment would be fine, it would not be fancy food. Going for a "home-made" feel if I had to say, gas would be ideal but electric stove is fine.

3. Probably a 2 in terms of costs. Madrid may not be as expensive as London or Stockholm but it's up there in the more pricey areas

4. My idea would be a casual small restaurant. Space for 20 people sitting, plus the option to deliver food or take away which is in high demand due to lazy college students. Would need probably 2 waiters for a bit more than basic service, but definitely not something fancy.

5. No idea about the property, haven't looked into that yet but I could probably find one that has basic equipment and adapt it to my needs. Definitely renting not purchasing.

6. I could work as much as needed, I'm not doing anything with my life right now. This includes web design for online visibility with the option to order online, as well as designing pamphlets for publicity. I know how to get a 3rd party to distribute them for me.

No, never, but as I said I do love cooking and I have been cooking for my family and myself for near 20 years. I think I would need at least another cook and 2 waiters, at the very least. As for kitchen equipment I would try to find second hand ones from somewhere going out of business, definitely not going fo rhigh expense.

food delivery can be outsourced depending on the location. its better to outsource unless your operation is big.
youre basically going to need 4 cooks and about 4 wait staff for even a relatively small place.

That is something that I thought about, we do have like 3 food delivery services that I could work with so I don't need to do it myself or have one of my employees do it. No idea how much they charge for it though.
As for the employees, I would honestly not expect that much volume of work early on, but I suppose I should be prepared for that.

its not about volume. volume is good for a restaurant, but the baseline for employees is working hours. even if you have no customers and no work (although restaurant always has some work) you still need staff to stand around and do nothing

Oh fuck now I feel stupid, you're right.

Running a commercial restaurant isn't cooking for your fucking family. It's an intense job. Maybe you can make a dish well but can you handle many dishes on multiple tables with many moving parts that all have to arrive at the paying customer's table together and in a timely manner?

Go work in a kitchen and actually learn something or I guarantee you will fail. This business isn't rocket science, in fact following tried and true methods there is a pretty good chance of succeeding but it definitely requires experience.

>t. cooked in 400 seat restaurants

all f&b runs on cheap labour. 99% of restuarants would die without it.

You couldn't have spelled out "I've never worked in a restaurant" more clearly.

Do NOT do this. You will be eaten alive. Go work on a line in a a real kitchen and see how the machine works.

I suppose that's solid advice. Don't think anyone would hire me without any kind of formal training though, so time to look into that.

well, it is possible to have not much experience but have really deep pockets so you learn as you go.
but you need something like 400 grand to throw at the project.

I washed dishes for 3 months then started cooking shit. Culinary school is an immense waste of time.

Just for shits and giggles

(You) +2 cooks+waiter.
Assuming you pay yourself as much as your waiter
a. net salary is half of what the company spends to pay (the company pays, taxes, etc... then you're left with gross salary on which the employee pay taxes)
cook: 1500-1700 euros for comfirmed but not star chef. meaning, 3-3.4k out of your pocket, double that amount again if Paris or London, maybe 5 times in scandinavian countries
same for server, around 1200 net
You're looking at around 10k in salaries per month for a 4 man operation.
assuming mid-range service, 1 server wil take care of 20 to 30 guests, no more. A solid chef with a hard working commis can send thet out

averga ticket: let's say 20e
10k/20: you need to sell 500 meals per month to pay salaries. thet's 250 per week, 50-60 friday and saturday, the rest spread over the week

50-60 covers in a 20 seat restaurant is 3 service. that one guy front of house better be a veteran, or you're in for a shitshow.

this could go forever

I don't mean to break your dream, but opening a restaurant with zero experience is near garuanteed failure, be it only to finance. You need investors/partners, and no one is going to lend to a drop-out with no experience.

I'm not trying to discourage you, here's my advice.
1. Get work experience, work in kitchen and FOH, build sufficent skill that you can be productive in both.
2.Learn to buil a business plan. Basicaly you make a count of all you expenses, and break it down into how many dishes need to be sold.

3.there's a lot I barely scratched :menu design, pricing, floor plan, reservation systems, specs of service, standard recipes, hygiene, etc...

It's great that you love cooking but running a restaurant is whole other ball game, and you'll make yourself hate your dream if you walk into it blindly.

4. Read Setting the Table, by Danny Meyer. You'll love it, and it'll give you an idea of the reality of opening a restaurant

Appreciated, man. Going to check online for that book.

I have nothing to add, but this is exactly correct. Sometimes you can go right to a line cook if you find a bad place that's a little desperate. Once you have some experience and know some people, you can then go to a less-bad place that is a little less desperate. People really only care about results for this sort of thing.

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N.B. this assumes you can cook to a fairly high quality under time pressure with sometimes second-rate ingredients, but if you can't do that, you won't be successful anyway. Better to find out on someone else's dime than be out 200K in leveraged startup costs, right?

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