>college is a scam bro! The average graduate has a life ruining FORTY THOUSAND dollars worth of debt, and the average earnings increase is absolutely miniscule, barely over one million dollars!
College is a scam bro! The average graduate has a life ruining FORTY THOUSAND dollars worth of debt...
Ryan Rivera
Tyler Mitchell
It's a meme to get people to become conditioned to the idea of debt that they will continue for the rest of their lives.
It's engineered toenslave kids right out of school to obtain unrealistic amounts of debt, and syphon it directly from them , all for a few years of 'my golden years'.
theguardian.com
The most hilarious thing is that many of the courses are so hobbled together they lack real cohesion, literally thrown together lazily by pseudo-intellects who never worked in industry.
Just a fucking joke when your lecturer is getting their own 'worked examples' wrong infront of an entire lecture hall.
>cant even do basic math half the time.
Jacob Thompson
the average bachelor's graduate is 25
the average doctorate is 35
the average 25 year old with a bachelors degree earns about 800 dollars per week
the average 35 year old with a bachelors degree earns about 1400 dollars per week
now consider the fact that industriousness and IQ scale extremely highly with income when holding education 'constant' and you'll find that a PhD vs a BSc results in a pay differential of about 5% on average for a 135 IQ 40 year old (and then factor in the cost)
going above a bachelor's degree is unironically only worth it in a small number of fields
Lincoln Barnes
How is $40k unrealistic lol? You can easily pay that off in 2 years
Landon Howard
>How is $40k unrealistic lol? You can easily pay that off in 2 years
Sebastian Jones
>hey user come over here, this is your replacement Rajesh Praveet. He can do what you can do, but cheaper.
>so we’re letting you go
David Harris
Average starting salary 48k, you can bet easily live on 20k and pay off 20k of student loan each year
Cooper Diaz
How much is that after taxes
Andrew Allen
40k...
Swear this board is full of absolute retards
Gavin Sanders
depends on field again though, I know with you amerimutts it can vary depending on the study and the field you go into.
You must also consider the fact that interest is being charged on thie debt constantly whilst it remains outstanding.
Now 40kgbp (approx $50kusd) is quite difficult to clear down. Consider the graduate engineer goes into a 21k job, it may take 5 years to get to 35k pa.
Next factor in the cost of living, in the UK it seems high everywhere, I've lived a few places, in a couple of big cities and everything from your rent to your food is sky high.
So what? dont rent? oh yea that sounds great get into even more debt, first you have to find a 10% deposit, presuming you dont have a mommy and daddy to front you this, this in itself will take time to save, combined with the renting, the food, the bills, the car, the fuel and the student loan you are paying(thats still collecting interest), oh I forgot your pension is a statutory thing now also, so that 2.5% of your salary that isnt going on national insurance and tax.
My friend, I have a feeling you live in a somewhat alternate reality to the rest of us. Thats great if you are able to pay off 40k in a few years, and that you landed a job that would accomodate this immediately out of college whilst still paying rent or a mortgage, but it isnt true for the rest of us, and even worse if your parents were never extremely well off.
Im 29 and the only people my age I know that own a house/have a mortgage are those that received inheritances from grandparents, or had they're parents instrumental in all their finances their whole lives, like paying they're car insurance and covering holidays and buying a brand new car outright etc.etc.
Those of us trying to make it on our own have to work so hard to get nowhere in life.
p.s. Im really happy for you if your life has been swell, and 40k is just something you piss away on nothing, genuinely user, I wish I could say I was in the same boat.
Charles Hughes
I will also add to my post, that an electrical engineer in the UK can expect a median wage of 32-50k pa, this is with say 5 years experience.
An electrician though, with the right work ethic and their own business can make x4-x5 that. Have a friend who had x2 houses and a skyline GTR aged 25 from simply being an electrician.
Aiden Hernandez
I'm actually British... Of course it's much more difficult to pay it off here then the us but here it's more like additional tax
I grew up in a shitty council estate, abusive parents I cut contact with and could easily buy a house at 22 if I wanted to ( although I'm going to medical school instead). You honestly just sound like you're making excuses, it's EXTREMELY easy to buy a home anywhere outside London and a few rip off areas like Cambridge
>finish uni 21
>pgce 22, use the bursary for deposit
>get mortgage with teaching job at 22
Not hard at all.... Also 21k is awful for an engineer, you'd only get that little if you went to a really shit uni.
Ryder Robinson
>I will also add to my post, that an electrical engineer in the UK can expect a median wage of 32-50k pa, this is with say 5 years experience.
You're going in to the wrong areas. I know that there's an engineering grad scheme in electricity distribution that pays 40k starting, 55k within 2-3 years.
Oliver Ross
how much in debt are you still, do you know the interest being charged on your student loans monthly? I mean overall with mortgage how in the red are you actually, how did you afford the deposit for a mortgage? usually 10-15% for a half decent interest rate.
where the fuck is that?! nothing to do with grades, western power, e.on, its around 21-23 for graduates. Irony when you see jobs for electrical engineers with 5+ years experience for 35k and your saying theres an entry level for 40k.
Seriously, im curious where this is.
Also its no secret graduates get garbage wage until they get 3-5 years experience.
Brandon Reed
just as a point of reference, this is a SENIOR software engineer role, i.e. 5+ years experience. Now I know in america this would be more like 150$k depending where you work, but there are literal construction site workers making 35k here
Alexander Martin
I don't have a mortgage going to be renting until 27 (I'm 22 now) at least due to moving around for medical school. 10 BTC so probably would just end up buying the house in cash when I graduate, but let's assume I became a teacher right now and lost all my BTC and cash savings.
Pgce bursary was 28k last year, use student loan to pay living costs, that's the deposit. That's enough for a large deposit on a shit house or a smaller deposit on a nice one.
By 29 you should be able to buy a house reaaaally easily to be honest.
Connor White
>get mortgage with teaching job at 22
>doesnt actually have a mortgage
Im not making excuses I just dont see the point of tying myself to a 20 year contract for a house that may plummet in value in the next 10 years, houses are more expensive than they've ever been in the UK. Plus, anything goes wrong I dont have to pay our for a new boiler or plumbing etc. Also, if you did move away renting is a meme, the money you make is fucking negligible to the headache, you have estate agent fee's upkeep and maintenance fee's for the sake of 7 k per year, my landlord probably get half that after all is said and done, its not alot per year at all.
Thats insane amount of bursary, I was doing a degree and they gave me 7k pa towards living expenses, I live with my lady and the money still isnt enough to get by without having more income, maybe its easy for you in student digs where all the bills are included.
Do you have a car? another money pit.
Anyway, I dont intend to stay living in this country, I want to get to a stage where I can consult and live in central europe most the time.
Angel Hughes
I just dont see the point of tying myself to a 20 year contract for a house that may plummet in value in the next 10 years
Why do you care about the value of a house you use for yourself? I plan to buy a house in the next couple of years (not GB) and desu. I could not care less about what its value is in 10 years, if I plan to live there until I retire.
David Gray
Oh my god excuse after fucking excuse
Of course I don't have a mortgage cause
1) I'm going to medical school so can't actually get one. If I took up my pgce offer it would be a very different story
2) if I could get one, it would be stupid cause I'm moving around constantly
3) I've got 10 BTC so might as well just buy in cash if I can wait a few years
Owing a house is very, very clearly the better option. Yes it isn't as cheap as a single room in a shared house (what I do now), but this is such a shit way of living I can't take it any longer.
That is the bursary for pgce teaching courses, NOT student loan. You get student loan as well. I got 10.5k a year for my bsc living away from home, 8.5k from gov and 2k from uni and could easily live on 5k a year, 4k for rent/bills 1k for food. Obviously not luxurious but let me save about 5k a year (Nottingham)
No don't have a car can't even drive yet.
Go to Europe if you think it will be easier, (I highly doubt it) but honestly it's 100 percent your own fault you can't afford a house. How much money do you even have?
Camden Wilson
because I dont plan on living in one place the rest of my life, not until I have capital to buy land and build my own house.
I care about the value because my money could be better spent elsewhere, i.e. investments of developing my business.
Also I've met lots of people who obtained mortgages young, 22-23, and it just crucified they're finances so they are basically living on credit, I think mortgages with 20 year terms is the ultimate in getting jewed for the reasons I explaine earlier. My landlord probably see's 3.5 k a year from the house I live in, its valued at 150k.
So Jow Forumslets I know its hard for ya'll to do basic math, but 35k over a 10 year period for 150k investment, compared to if you stuck 150k into waste management stock, you would double your investment in half the time with less faff of constantly arranging plumbers, builders, gas inspection, tax return on income, estate agent fee's etc.etc.
But if your happy living in the same place for the next 20 years of your life, good on you, I tend to move on every 3 years from place to place and have done my entire life.
Jack Gutierrez
Honestly how much money do you have? Sounds like a load of cope
Oliver Hall
>because I dont plan on living in one place the rest of my life,
Fair point. But buying property is absolutely no matter for you anyways, so why do you discuss it in the first place?
>I care about the value because my money could be better spent elsewhere
Better than something that serves an elementary need (housing)? If I buy a house now on what we plan to use (~400k€) and the current conditions (together with my wife & my parents), we pay only ~500€ for the loan, everything else is an investment in the goal to achieve the security of my family.
I dont talk about returns here, for this I put money into a bunch of stocks at the moment. I talk about savings into security for the family when my parents get old, when my wife and I get old.
Camden Gray
On phone now. Good call, it's western power. Graduates go in at grade 6 which is 39.8k. After 2 year grad scheme you move in to a grade 8 job (design engineer, project engineer etc) which is 56k.
They don't tell you this publicly because most of their graduate recruitment is done through the IET power academy scholarship scheme.
They only want a 2:2 as well.
Zachary Murphy
college is not a scam. university/liberal arts IS a scam.
Lucas Edwards
>Plus, anything goes wrong I dont have to pay our for a new boiler or plumbing etc
this is the millenial mentality....justify not doing something because it may actually require work or learning something. you deserve to be raped by a plumber for not know a little bit about this stuff.
Home ownership is not bad, unless you bought a literal lemon and didn't DYOR.
Anthony Perry
I just think it's kind of dumb that you need 4 years of busywork to prove that you know things
Brayden Martinez
I graduated pharmacy school with $160k debt and it cost me $180k in total to pay back. Absolute rape but it's worth it for the $150k+ I earn annually.
Luke Cooper
"Knowing stuff" and "knowing how to apply the usefull stuff in a usefull way" are two completely different things.
After one year working in the field, I can assure you that I did know apeshit back when I started, compared to today.
Josiah Nelson
90% of the learning will be on the job anyways
Xavier Johnson
Yes and no.
You will not learn anything at all, if you pass on the basic 10% you learn from uni.