Lightning Network is about to explode

there is no incentive to run the LN? that's pretty fucked up and makes no sense

read this
medium.com/@timevalueofbtc/the-time-value-of-bitcoin-and-lnrr-e0c435931bd8
Lightning is still new and figuring out proper optimizations of liquidity and fees, but eventually there will be a reference rate that's created

Attached: 1 j_dLZGVM7rV8wsJRronzyA.png (338x296, 17K)

Vapor ware

i'm asking legitimate questions which you are obviously unwilling to respond. bitcoin's hashrate has been increasing exponentially every 2 weeks because the conditions are good enough for some investors to invest in mining equipment (etiher due to low capital cost, low electricity cost, or due to their in house asic development). what i'm asking (which you are tying so hard to not answer) is how is the LN supposed to function without anyone to settle LN transactions on the main chain when block rewards are zero and transaction fees are not high enough?
some ln nodes don't even charge any transaction fees in the name of supporting the network. how are you even supposed to compete against that?

>some ln nodes don't even charge any transaction fees in the name of supporting the network
That's healthy at this stage. You're used to shitcoin scams instead of actual tech development. The free nodes will grow in traffic until it's costing them noticeable amounts which gives a baseline for reasonable pricing. The less they make on the few transactions now the better it will scale under real pressure.

You can't even profit from that

What about recent hacks? When will it be ready for prime time? Seems like alpha software

Lightning network will never scale as long as there are high on chain fees

you can literally run a node for around $150 with a raspberry pi and an external hdd. given the decreasing trend in storage cost and size, cost of running an ln node will never ever reach to a noticeable amount enough for some to stop running their ln nodes for free.

Every single LN node operator has lost money so far

>some
If it's cheap enough that volunteers can handle all of it for free that would be great. No other payment method could ever compete.

Communist pipe dream

I'm just running with his assumptions. As load increases prices will too and load will always increase until it costs something.

on chain fees have nothing to do with whether ln can scale or not on its on network
electricity cost of running an ln node is too small to even worth mentioning as a loss, unless you meant those who lost money due to the bugs of the network.

people are still shilling this garbage? you can only transfer 5 cents out of every dollar you put in.

let's say you are a "bank" and have thousand of opened channels so you can easily route payments between retail users and let's say McDonald or other tendies sellers, you will learn a (very small) routing fee for each transaction.
If you start routing thousand of transactions per seconds than you will have a profit
but at the current stage LN is not yet stable and there are not many channels opened with big organisations accepting LN payments
in future, it could happen, it could not, i'm mostly interested in BTC as an hedge against central bankers and inflating-printed-out-of-thin-air FIATs

and how are my chances to ever route thousand of transactions per second?

I suppose it would be limited to the individuals hardware
but you can have multiple nodes independently processing transactions across the network there isn't really a limit

So Turbo channels use zero confirmations. I thought the Core supporters were shitting on Bitcoin Cash for doing the same thing. Seems hypocritical but oh well.

>i'm asking legitimate question
>how is the LN supposed to function without anyone to settle LN transactions on the main chain when block rewards are zero and transaction fees are not high enough
your loaded question is ridiculous and full of assumptions, do you want me to create a time machine?

i honestly can't decide whether LN is a giant fucking clusterfuck or not. i understand that a 2nd layer is probably the way to go but LN looks like an absolute piece of shit with zero consideration for UX.

2 different things
bcash is trading off mainchain security while turbo channels utilize a 2nd layer trade off with more functionality
in bcash user a to user b with 0 confirms risks b
in turbo it's atm c to user a then user a to atm c to user b only c the ATM/payment processor is at risk but he already has your money so there is no risk
and a is at risk until a confirm but can also spend at anytime or bump fee
it's a better trade off for everyone involved and doesn't compromise any mainchain security

OP, you have no idea what you are talking about and you are a huge faggot. hardware has nothing to do with how many transactions you can route in a given time. it depends on the size and number of channels you can open on the network. even then the chance of routing thousands of transactions per seconds is zero at this stage.
you are in denial. it's called insight (something which you clearly lack) and not time travel.

Why the hell would anyone use this contraption over scalable chains?

my rasp pi couldn't route a bunch of transactions and it isn't recommended you try to operate a routing node with a rasp pi so you're wrong... again
you can't have insight into something you have no fucking idea about
how do you know market conditions in 10 years? in 50 years? YOU DON'T YOU FUCKING IDIOT
so you don't know what the fee market will be like

If it's cheap enough to be an ln operator then some people will be keen to be seeds just to make small amounts in poor countries. Businesses will also have incentives to operate ln so the get more bitcoin customers if bitcoin takes off. Much like how some places provide free wifi. If it gets tgem more customers if the transaction fees are cheaper for them then they will do it. Businesses have high costs with credit card transaction fees so if ln is stable and reliable, im sure businesses would be happy to operate an ln node or whatever they're called at a fraction of the cost.

turbo channels are going to fill up the mempool with 1sat/byte transactions
then more and more channels with different conditions will fill up 2sat/byte 5sat/byte until there's a somewhat regular transaction fee reward per block

Aaaand

not recommended by whom? my raspberry pi worked just fine when i was using it as an ln node (check out raspiblitz). also you don't need to know the market conditions in 50 years time or invent a time machine to know that block rewards will reach to epsilon (near zero) in the future and that the miners would need to earn enough only from transaction fees to stay afloat. in that case either fees would have to be so high that nobody would want to use btc or somebody needs to break moore's law and come up with an asic so efficient that it would make other asics obsolete and centralize the network even further. as i said before you are confusing assumptions with insight. either that or you're full of shit.

try to route and maintain channels and peers with over 30 people on a raspi, it'll crash because it only has so much free memory
you're assuming bitcoin will remain in its current form 10+ years from now, and I already explain on how it'll evolve
if it doesn't evolve to maintain the incentive structure security it'll die but there's a bunch of projects working on this
merged mined sidechains and ln settlements are 2 ways
there's transaction batching segwit and other stuff on mainchain

you didn't forget to set up swap space did you? if you are that worried you can always get a nuc. you talk about segwit and "other stuff" on mainchain as if they are any more real than the block rewards and the emission schedule i've been mentioning that are set in stone and you're accusing me of asking loaded questions with loaded assumptions? LOL

you are assuming there won't be enough activity to incentivize miners with transaction fees
but we've went over this 10 times and you don't get it

there will never be enough transaction fees to compensate miners because

If you're a fan of Lightning, look into what Stakenet (XSN) is doing with it.

They are THE leading Lightning Network coin out there, not even kidding.

>They HELPED the Litecoin team implement Lightning on mainnet...

With Stakenet, Lightning will be used across a network of 2000+ masternodes, these masternodes is already incentized to run because of the block rewards, so adding lightning nodes on top of them is just an "extra" income stream.

This makes lightning completely decentralized, and with Stakenet's new Multi Currency Lightning Wallet, you'll be able to send and recieve coins INSTANTLY over lightning, virtually fee-less.

Not only that, but Stakenet is also building the worlds first Lightning DEX, which has the following advantages over any other DEX solution out there:

>Instant trading
>NO KYC
>NO Registration
>VERY low fees
>No need ot SYNC up with the network, masternodes holds all the blockchains.

Stakenet will add privacy, it's got it's own cold staking feature.

If you believe in Lightning, do some actual research into XSN, seriously.

PIC Related - The new Stakenet Multi Currency Wallet with 1-click Lightning Transactions + TOR-integration

Attached: Multi Wallet.png (1355x693, 178K)

I know BTC and LTC are leading on lighting. With XSN doing unreal innovations.

What are other projects doing cool things with lightning? I don't know many.

Exactly. The obvious flaws with lightning and BTC is the incentive to run a lightning node, because there really isn't any as it is. This is why this project stands out so much from the rest of the pack.
Masternodes are already in the green, adding lightning nodes to these already running servers, is just an EXTRA income - And believe it or not, there is gonna be made a lot of dApps that will benefit masternodes even more, including their Lightning DEX, which will be an integrated part into the Stakenet Multi Wallet soon as well.
This means, that stakers can choose to STAKE XSN, but be paid in BTC (Via lightning), pretty cool, right?
Cold staking contracts will be moved to masternodes as well, which means if somebody wants to cold stake his coins, he fee he pays for this service, is paid to the masternode providing the service. This masternode wont be able to move, or spend the coins, only stake it.

I can't believe why nobody pays attention to this project, but once BTC maximalists finds out they can use the Stakenet Multi Wallet to day-trade BTC's/Tether via lightning instantly on the go, with the upcoming android/IOS app, I'm sure it will get people talking real fast.

>but once BTC maximalists finds out they can use the Stakenet Multi Wallet to day-trade BTC's/Tether via lightning instantly on the go, with the upcoming android/IOS app, I'm sure it will get people talking real fast.
hahahahahah

if you want to know why btc maxis don't give a flying fuck about your shitcoin: here is why

Attached: shitcoins.jpg (1883x2207, 2.78M)

I completely understand why you don't get the bigger picture. Without knowing exactly what you will be able to do with the wallet, I'd doubt it's legitimacy as well.

Anyway. Once USDT (Tether) moves to lightning, which they confirmed they plan to do, it will be added to the Stakenet wallet.

You will be able to download this wallet to your phone, on both IOS, and Android. Your wallet is secured by a 12-word security code (Just like Exodus). Which means you can use the same wallet on your PC simultaneously.

So imagine yourself at a family reunion or whatever. You check the price of BTC, and notice it just pumped $2000 in the last 10 mins. You KNOW it's gonna go down again, and quickly opens your wallet, sell your BTC for USDT; and once the price settles down again, you SELL your USDT back to BTC. The whole process is instant, 100% secure, as you don't need to even use a centralized exchange to do all of this.

This is a cool way to daytrade BTC, or even LTC if that's your thing.

The wallet will have the XSN Lightning DEX integrated into it, so you'll be able to trade whatever you feel like on the go as well. Without EVER risking your funds. Everything is COMPLETELY anonymous btw. No accounts needed, No KYC. No fucking bullshit.

Laugh all you want, just means you haven't done your research at all.

Also worth mentioning is that you don't NEED to spend a single $ in XSN to use this wallet. However the masternodes who acts as the backbone of the wallet and the DEX is paid all the transaction fee's involved. So whoever uses the wallet benefits XSN holders this way.

There's a LOT of shitcoins trying to compete with BTC, but Stakenet is trying to ENHANCE Bitcoin, and it's use cases. Big difference.

what fiat on-ramps are allowed? does this require kyc? what if someone wants to purchase bitcoin but is afraid of future gov confiscation, does this solve that problem by allowing anonymity? also what are the transaction fees? how do they compare to coinbase?

FIAT on-ramps requires KYC no matter what scenario you're looking at.

heh funny. Because DAI / Ethereum and at soem point BAT require no KYC. You can fuck off with your bitcoin.

on the zap website they show a demo sending money from 'visa' so why not a gift card maybe.

I'm not even talking about Bitcoin, lmao.
Read my replies to this thread, I'm a huge believer in Stakenet, and it's Lightning capabilities.
Stakenet doesn't require KYC, I HATE KYC, and the majority of people in crypto does as well.

Anyway, FIAT on-ramps requires involvement with central banks, and you wont be able to work with these without enforcing KYC on your users, and even IF you could, it would change real fucking soon.

Regulation is here to stay, like it or not. I'm against it, which is why I'm moving ALL my trades to decentralized exchanges, so should you ;)

>Not yet
Then whats XSN?

Would perhaps work with smaller amounts of money, but there are a LOT of limitations.

Stakenet could partner up with a service that provides FIAT on-ramps for their upcoming Lightning DEX. Stakenet themselves wouldn't enforce KYC, but the service providing FIAT on-ramps would, at least with bigger amounts of money. Moving forward, I believe it wont even be possible with small amounts either, as regulation will be harder and harder. It sucks!

>Turbo channels
>splicing
>loop in/loop out

Attached: bde.jpg (580x627, 31K)

Exactly.

Stakenet is leading the lightning development, and very very few people know about this.
The Litecoin team needed help from the Stakenet devs to implement lightning on mainnet.

Source: litecoin-foundation.org/lightning-network-collaboration-with-x-9-developers/

Nice money laundering retard chain

How is it money laundering?

You mix the transactions in the lightning nodes. You can’t trace your bitcoins now.

And how is that a bad thing? I'd LOVE that.

So would bankers, corrupt companies, drug cartels, and politicians so you don't have to file taxes on your 1000$ of capital gains tax. Go to jail moron.

medium.com/@craig_10243/why-lightning-will-never-be-currency-and-why-bsv-matters-60dfa5c9ac4d

twitter.com/bsvboom/status/1151122110867300352

yes user, you can.

trustnodes.com/2019/08/20/guy-makes-20-a-month-for-locking-5-million-worth-of-bitcoin-on-the-lightning-network

20$!!!!! or 240$ per year for 5 million locked up. hahahahhahahahhahahahahahah

coindesk.com/lightning-network-developers-warn-of-bug-that-could-cause-loss-of-bitcoin

uh, but muh banks will use teh main chain to settle. Mainchain transactions are not for plebs.Muh banks will incentivize da miners to mine. the day the miners shut down or move to other non lightning coins and the lightning coins die from a chain death spiral will be glorious. I just feel bad for all the anons that bought into Core´s narrative,

go fuck youself you shit. Scaling happens on chain or it doesnt.

>be a digital bank

Oh good, finally Satoshi's vision of having parasitic centralized “banks” as middlemen in the network has finally been realized.

okay, forreal...LN does nothing for bitcoin
no matter what, a scalable layer 1 upgrade has to take place at some point to reach global adoption.
this clunky layer 2 solution would still be at the mercy of layer 1 network congestion

Attached: pent.gif (720x480, 811K)

no user, it was plane. doing some next level aerial acrobatics. Surely it couldnt have been a missile being shot at the only part of the pentagon under construction. How dare you.

Bitcoin that scales onchain? I´ll take what does BSV do for 200 please,

turbo retards.

>T-this time it will work I p-promise
>technobabbles ensue
See you in 18 months I guess kek

Answer my question about watchtowers you piece of shit, it's the main thing holding LN back

Still worse than nano

>i'm mostly interested in BTC as an hedge against central bankers and inflating-printed-out-of-thin-air FIATs

Eth incrased block size it is scam now?? Should I sell it??

It was always a scam that never worked. There's no such thing as on chain scaling.