How long before we feel the effects of net energy production falling, and failing to keep up with growing populations?
Net energy decline
Luis Powell
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Levi Sanchez
As in the infrastructure or production?
Leo Roberts
Production. Though I could see the infrastructure being a problem as well, though I don't know that it would be the primary issue.
Thomas Barnes
I'm in electrical engineering so i can assure you that infrastructure won't be a problem if you live in developed country.
As well as production since we're seeing massive progress in alternative energy as well as more efficient means of using coal and oil.
The real threat to energy production is the profits and trade wars
Robert Ortiz
>massive progress in alternative energy
Honest question, what qualifies as massive? Because renewables only account for around 8% of energy production in the U.S. and wind counts for 5% of that.
Nuclear seems like the only worthwhile alternative but...
>plants in the U.S. are going bankrupt
>decommissioning costs are ridiculous
Shale is also only alive because of government subsidies, which cannot continue forever.
Kevin Moore
Saudi Arabia is projected to run out of oil somewhere between 2025 - 2035. Saudi Arabia is the largest producer of oil by far. (They have the largest wells of any country) although there are no real hard numbers of this because this is a state secret.
If they are about to run out, that raises the question: how long untill the entire world has run out?
Fracking will be somewhat of a bandaid. But it's a bandaid for a big gushing open wound. Every country on this planet that is an oil producer keeps the amount of oil they project is left in the wells state secret (with the exception of Norway)
So A: they secretly have way more left then what they are telling us, just to jack up the prices.
Or B: they know that the offset of oil is not going to satisfy the demand (protip: it already isn't) and this is going to lead to a economic and probably societal collapse.
Why? Because it's oil what keeps this world go around. Not only is it a crucial component of basically every industry out there (from agriculture to energy production)
Had we invested in replacing oil with different technologies since the 40-50ties, then we would have probably been alright in this day and age. But we didn't. Growth and a more comfortable lifestyle was deemed more important and just like immigration policies and environmental tactics of the last 75 years YOU are going to pay for it. Most likely not with petrodollars, but with your life.
Personally I blame MTV.
Aiden Rodriguez
Venezuela has more oil than Saudi Arabia. Also suspect Russia has more oil under Siberia in deep wells as both countries combined. We ain't running out of the juice for 200 years for sure. All those stats published in 70s and 80s are bs. Remember murrica got both oil crysis and stock market crashes in that era. You want all these ivory tower nerds like Nate Silver to be able to predict.
If we have a "crisis" it will be artificial supply control like with diamonds to get the price up.
Carson Rogers
>If they are about to run out,
Then why is China buying into Saudi ARAMCO if that was the case?
Daniel Ortiz
Would you mind giving me some data and sources on that Venezuela thing? I am intrigued. Also please bear in mind that
A: Venezuela might not have enough oil for the entire world.
B: you don't account for the energy that is invested for what you get back. Siberia is a long way away. And it might take more energy to pump up that oil then there is actually in the well. Especially because most of that oil in in or around the the most northern part of the Bering sea. Witch is not at all easy to get to.
Just because there might still be some wells left doesn't mean that we can get to it, nor that it is actually worth drilling it up. Although given that it becomes more economical viable as time passes and we are running out.
Oliver Martin
As the economy shrinks and goes South power usage will drop.
Christian Edwards
The power started to even out and started to drop with the last financial crisis.
Dylan Cook
Because just like the rest of the world China has sold their population a rising standard of living. And they want the last scraps just like the everyone else. They don't have much of an option either. Because Russia is not selling them what they want. (They intent to keep as much as possible for themselveself without crashing their econony) and China itself had very little oil production even tough they are a big country. That is why they are also that hellbender on getting the south China sea. As it is one of the few places with actual cost effective amounts of oil.
Austin Jones
Yeah but power consumption is probably because lots of people are going to kick the bucket in the transitional period.
Jackson Richardson
*Going to drop
Fucking phoneposting
Dylan Gutierrez
>Venezuela has more oil than Saudi Arabia
Not a massive amount more though. Also, there is all kinds of consideration for how much it costs to pull it out of the ground in Venezuela and ship it at profit. If you put more in to get less out you're doomed to collapse. This is why shale is such a fucked up industry.
Money is basically tokenized energy. Are you insinuating that because the economy shrunk that energy production did as a result?
Caleb Gonzalez
>Venezuela
Can you even google retard?
en.wikipedia.org
Carter Johnson
Jackson Cox
What do u know about TAE?
tae.com
Aiden Allen
why not give every home some free solar panels.
i'd install them myself but im certainly not going to fucking buy them lmao
Chase Jones
>Just because there might still be some wells left doesn't mean that we can get to it
Fucking kys nao.
Brayden Murphy
US plants can't compete with super cheap arab oil and gas
Also, the US has the largest coal reserve in the world, when it comes to coal the US is like Saudi+Vanzuela+Russia combined in oil
In addition to huge amounts of shale gas etc. etc.
However the US operates in a mode that always aims at pursuing technology driven by increasing regulations, whether they are economic or environmental, but realistically the US will never have a shortage
India probably will soon, but they seem to be able to live without running water or light and it wouldn't bother them as much
Mason Carter
>Venezuela has more oil then Venezuela
I'm really sceptical about this tough. I think this is a common misconception, in that Venezuela momentarily has more barrels of oil in the ground then Saudia Arabia. But that is only because they have more small wells and thus it is harder to pump up. And simply Saudia Arabia has exported a shit ton more. And thus now have less left. That doesn't mean that Venezuela has more oil then SA had.
Also look at what SA is doing currently. All of a sudden they try to diversify their econony. While also all off a sudden start to become more of an open country with less extremist policies, basically overnight. The media has you believe that this is due to just one prince. But I think it has way more to do with them trying to get Al sorts of forgein investors to their country in a panick.
Joseph Carter
>I'm really sceptical about this tough.
Good good. Send application emails to all world leaders then, maybe they make you their analyst.
Lucas Phillips
>As of 2014.
You have to read since 2014 Venezuela has the most oil in the ground. Also 3.1 million of barrels production is not even near SA.
>Almost 70% of all won oil comes in Russia comes from this area.
And you sold it like it was still untapped lel
Evan Reed
Shoot me then. But pay your rent first.
Brayden Sanders
Yes also these methods are way more expensive and energy intensive. And still doesn't mean that oil stoppes being finite
>Kys
The argument of a scolar and a gentleman
Hudson Evans
You gloss over the fact that you need oil to keep any sort of power plant operational. From coal to renewables they all require oil to function. Even nuclear power plants have this problem.
Jordan Cooper
Solar on it's own is a really pitiful source of energy, and the amount of energy and money sunk into making the panels on that scale would not viably offset itself. The advancements in solar have been a massive overstatement, look at the bullshit with the panels Musk was pitching.
>Venezuela- 300.88 billion
>Saudi Arabia- 266.46 billion
So it's a difference of about 44 billion, and this doesn't even account for the viability of actually getting oil out of the ground in Venezuela while being profit positive.
Benjamin Rivera
Yeah and people seem to forget that these are current numbers, not the actual size of the wells when discovered probably somewhere in the early 20th century.
Ethan Barnes
This is basically the fundamental problem with all forms of energy. They require the investment of energy in order to produce a yield, this speeds up the amount of potential energy used chasing after more energy. It's not a sustainable system for sure. I'm not saying that the grid is going down tomorrow, but there's no way the world doesn't contract massively in 30 years as a result of this shit.
David Morgan
thats not a problem
go read a book
Jack Jenkins
I never said that we are fucked tomorrow. Although I believe that we will see the remificarions of our actions within our lifetime.
Asher Gomez
Care to explain to me how? Alternatively what books user?
Andrew Hill
I'm sure you've heard of recent breakthroughs in battery technology as well as a continuous improvement in wind and solar energy. Production of these products are becoming cheaper and cheaper. It's possible to take your home completely off the grid in modern times. The problem is just that was expensive.
When households can be disconnected or at least run on the grid as a secondary source the amount of needed electricity production can be used for factories and businesses etc.
For most part alternative energy isnt just about mass production of electricity for people its about individual production.
Know about the science, but not the company itself. It's a techies wet dream but still a dream at this point
Adrian Kelly
That is really cool and all, but both the lithium, petroleum and other rare earth minerals needed for both solar and the battery's are finite. It might prolong the problems (for the elite that can afford these things) but is nowhere near an good Long term strategy in my opinion.
Furthermore if only the elite In this world can afford these things (I use elite as higher middle class and up in richer countries btw) how will that stop an economic and political collapse for those that do not have access to those technologies? I personally don't think 6+ billion people are just going to roll over an die for the common good.
Isaiah Price
But you don't wait for a resource to run out before you start planning for a solution. The solution in this case is introducing alternative energy to countries that can afford it and with that reduce the usage of coal and oil. Therefore extending it use in areas that can't yet switch over.
No need to just roll over and die. They just continue to use the old methods. No need to be excessive.
Like driving your smartcar to work so that you can enjoy longer sunday drives in a muscle car.