Is it undemocratic to ask whether Brexit is sensible?

let the shitty island sink, idiot, why do you care?

>Trump has said he wants to impose tariffs on cars imported from the EU. And by the EU, he means Germany.

This was before the US and the EU agreed on not raising any tariffs. Sorry, but this is old and outdated now.

have you got an article on that I can read? I haven't heard that.

>If the vast majority wants to get on with it, why is everything is painfully slow?

Because we're following the legally prescribed rules? Unlike the French and Italians, we're autistic when it comes to following rules (unless we've managed to carve out an opt-out that is).

>Why does your government keep on bringing up the CETA plus plus plus model?

Someone asked a question of David Davis, and that was his response. It's a simple way of saying "the UK is far more important to Europe than bumfuck shitholes like Canada so obviously you'll give us a reasonable trade deal that doesn't economically cripple both of us". That's not a very punchy headline after all.

>Why not just CETA and sign it within a month?

Because it would be pointless for the UK. If a trade deal doesn't go much further than that of Canada or even Norway it doesn't outweigh the advantages of free trade and being a brutal low-tax haven off of EU shores.

Well, the EU is currently negotiationg with the US ... May 1 is the deadline (will probably be extended) until which no special punitive tariffs are levied on the EU by the US or on the US by the EU.

economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/international/business/china-urges-eu-to-act-together-against-us-protectionism/articleshow/63644582.cms

The turnout was just over 50%
Millions of EU citizens living in UK were not allowed to vote either.
It was still close.
The majority would want free money too. Doesn't mean its feasible.

Ex. Blair negotiated/forced Polands entry into EU in return for missile bases for UK and US.
Western Europe paid heavily for this decision.
UK now wants to "take back control of their borders".
Kys

WE'RE LEAVING THE EU TOO BAD FOR YOU BUTTHURT KRAUT

Come on, we both know you were talking shit before then. The US is saying "give us more money, give us fairer deals, or we will fuck you over".
Which brings me to my point of, Germany needs all the friends it can get right now and is hoping the UK can still be on a nice trade deal. Which works out nicely for us because we get to trade with everyone.
Some how we British survive this shit and always come out smelling of roses, this seems to be a similar case.

>The turnout was just over 50%

The turnout was 72% which is virtually the highest turnout for any election in British history, giving it more of a democratic mandate than any government the UK has ever had.

>Millions of EU citizens living in UK were not allowed to vote either.

No shit.

>It was still close.

4% isn't close you nonce.

>the rest of your post

Blair is the most hated man in Britain by a considerable margin.

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I hope everything will be daijoubu.

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>Come on, we both know you were talking shit before then. The US is saying "give us more money, give us fairer deals, or we will fuck you over".

There is no deal between the US and the EU. The trade is done on WTO terms.

Yeah no deal but Trump can impose tariffs to cripple parts of your exports trade.

72% probably means something else in brexit nigger babble, but not even close.

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Trump knows the US are an empire and he is flexing. For too long was the US pandering to other powers crying for fair treatment while simultaneously dismantling the American empire for their own gains. Germany are one of a few who are going to see what the American Empire actually has. And the UK just jumped shit in time. We are a free agent with a lot of centuries old business connections. You're fucked Germany, you need to bow down or be blown out.

suck my dick supranational beuracratic fascist technocratic fag

jumped ship* Or shit, same thing.

freudian slip

we like trading with you, we just dont want to become the same country, its not hard understand fritz

>72% probably means something else in brexit nigger babble, but not even close.

Do you even know what turnout is you fucking Jerryiatric retard?

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>It's a simple way of saying "the UK is far more important to Europe than bumfuck shitholes like Canada so obviously you'll give us a reasonable trade deal that doesn't economically cripple both of us".

Japan, South Korea, Ukraine, Canada etc. are important trade partners. TTIP with the US would have been more important than any trade deal with the UK.

Again, why not just sign TTIP or CETA or the Japan deal and that is that. You do understand that any deal which is more integrated and tighter than the CETA or TTIP agreements requires things like rules on migration or regulatory alignment in services and even ECJ oversight on regulation... all of which is pretty much ruled out by the UK.

Trump can impose tariffs to reduce trade, true. But this will hit both the EU and the US, no question asked.

>eu bean counter

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>Japan, South Korea, Ukraine, Canada etc. are important trade partners

They are all far less important than the UK, your third biggest trading partner.

>TTIP with the US would have been more important than any trade deal with the UK.

No shit. That's the U.S, the world's incontestable economic hyperpower.

>Again, why not just sign TTIP or CETA or the Japan deal and that is that

Because it only benefits Germany, and not the United Kingdom. The UK doesn't make shit anymore, we deal in services. Those 'off the shelf' deals don't do fuck all for us, which is why the UK is going to just walk away if no services deal is given to us. Even Spreadsheet Phil, the most pro-EU man in our cabinet, is willing to let Britain walk away without it.

>requires things like rules on migration or regulatory alignment

Nonsense. The EU has a billion carve outs on every single rule that exists, they can make some for us - and they will. Migration is already toxic enough for EU member states as it is.

>all of which is pretty much ruled out by the UK.

Not the regulatory alignment part, but obviously the politically toxic migration and ECJ oversight which have no basis in common sense.

Just a reminder that EU rules are not dogma, and have been opted-out from on multiple occasions over the past sixty years.

The US economy can out live the German economy. Trump is trying to make things at home, he is more nationalistic. And he knows the US has the resources to make it happen. The only other country that might cause any actual grievance to them are China. If Trump can convince people in the US to take a temporary hit in their pockets, maybe pay more for shitty pieces of plastic, then the US will win this trade war. If he can't convince people to take a temporary hit then he will be voted out and China will become super power in the next 20 years.

>we like trading with you, we just dont want to become the same country

Fine, so let’s sign an FTA and go our separate ways. Why say you also want a deal on the Northern Ireland border, on access to the EU financial services market, a deal on accessing EU criminal data, a deal on participating in the EMA, a deal on Erasmus, a deal on Galileo, a deal on Brits having the right to move around freely in the EU, etc.

Why not just have a nice CETA copy-paste FTA and be done with it?

>The UK doesn't make shit anymore, we deal in services.

Not true. 85 percent of your exports are goods not services.

>Nonsense. The EU has a billion carve outs on every single rule that exists, they can make some for us - and they will. Migration is already toxic enough for EU member states as it is.

Reality is reality - whether you think it is nonsense or not.

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>so let’s sign an FTA and go our separate ways
>posts a list of hurdles the eu is throwing down as preconditions to even begin discussing an FTA
Are you serious? theres nothing the govt would love better than to not have to deal with those headaches. Its your lot who are playing silly buggers

>t. European Commission

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I think the EU proposed a CETA style FTA in April 2017 and the UK rejected this proposal. It is a year later and now it is going to be exact that type of FTA, there is no other way to go forward.

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The EU want too much from us. We want to leave and to fair to May she is sticking to the all out agreement of the British public. The EU want us to stay members of the EU without having the title, which loses us more power than if were in the EU.
We need totally out now and it's looking like we are making good ground.
And the reason this is taking so long is because there are a lot of small details to work out, and we won't be mugged off by Merkel in the small print.

>I think the EU proposed a CETA style FTA in April 2017 and the UK rejected this proposal
you are mistaken
>it is going to be exact that type of FTA, there is no other way to go forward.
you are probably right although i would guess more CETA+ with defence and intelligence cooperation thrown in. desu i wouldnt care if we went wto

>with defence and intelligence cooperation thrown in.

i.e. the only shit that the UK has to offer the EU.

No. That would be like us handing over our prize possessions and the EU giving us peanuts. If they want access to one of only two semi-decent militaries on the continent they're going to have to pay for it.

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give me a (you) if you think brexit will be overturned by a second referendum
>either we become a full member of the EU or we leave it and pay 40 trillion a year to use the single market, it's for realsies this time ! w- we swear this one is legally binding !

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Funny that you think that a large group of apes can be sensible in the first place

Goodbye friend, it was nice knowing you. Good luck being under Merkel and Germany forever.

i'm getting the fuck out lol
but i hope the UK does too, though honestly even if you get out you have some big fucking issues

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It is you Brits who say it is paramount we cooperate on defense, sanctions (for Russia) and crime post-Brexit. We are fine with NATO and Interpol... we really don’t need special sausages for the UK.

You're going nowhere. You'll live in your hellhole under German supervision forever.

lol i'd rather die
if i don't get my green card i'll go teach french in asia or some shit, maybe singapore

>It is you Brits who say it is paramount we cooperate on defense

That's only to highlight the fact that without our army the continent has fuck all.

>sanctions (for Russia)

Because Germany is the most pro-Russian cucked country in Europe due to your pathetic reliance on their gas.

>crime

You're going to have a lot to worry about when your 'new Germans' grow up.

>We are fine with NATO and Interpol

Alright lad. Good luck with an anti-NATO U.S without Britain in it and an Interpol reliant on Franco-German intelligence

>we really don’t need special sausages for the UK.

And that is what your government is going to have to explain to your population.

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Do you have a trade or qualifications? If you do, then you could move to New Zealand. I was living there for a few years and if you have a trade they will take you in Christchurch because they had a big earthquake. If you like living in the middle of nowhere then it might be for you.

>i.e. the only shit that the UK has to offer the EU.
we have our fishing waters, financial services, pot noodles, whisky, space and tigers, bse, fake taxi porn, boy bands and so on

that sounds good, i hear they have good gun laws + i'm a pilot and new zealand might be interested in that

If you had something like a pilot license I'm pretty sure you could work to residency over there. My brother just got a residency over there with some coding experience.
You do have to be into solidarity though, their cities aren't really cities.

The reason why it is taking so long is because you are (like all European nations today when on their own) a second rate nation which cannot defend her economy without allies and your politicians know that, even if you don’t. Tell me, how long did the act of leaving the British Empire take the US? The time it takes to make a few signatures! If you need to wait for the actions of the EU, you did not win your independence, it was granted to you. Actually it isn‘t even granted yet, it‘s promised.

You think you are on equal terms with the EU (and you where) but you are now in a much weaker position. If the EU so likes, you get some sort of Norway-solution. If it doesn‘t it will carve you up by taking Scotland and maybe Northern Ireland from you with referendums.

You can ask each other questions all you want, that's all you can do though.

I kinda feel sorry for the EU.

Germans are destroying Europe again and there's nothing then can do.

At leas the UK is trying to save itself.

Fuck the EU and fuck Germany.

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>
The reason why it is taking so long is because y-

lisbon-treaty.org/wcm/the-lisbon-treaty/treaty-on-European-union-and-comments/title-6-final-provisions/137-article-50.html

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How long did it take the civil war in the US to come to an end?
We have to work out how much we are going to pay for projects that we agreed to pay in to, how much pension we will pay for people in EU countries who are British citizens, and all the other shit in between. We aren't shooting guns at you and when you give up we are gone. Ours is a war of paperwork.
Like I say, Trump started a trade war, the UK has never been in a better position to be open to international trade.
Germany are fucked, that's why Merkel is getting so close with Macron, she never used to be that close but now she knows the French is all she has. With political change happening slowly in Germany, the UK have power here. And as I've said before, the old British empire business partners haven't just disappeared, we still have a lot of connections in the world, you don't.