U.S. National Debt

Nothing will happen because the US owns most of it and the chinks won't ever come to collect

It’s been an issue since it started mate

And some people think Reagan was not the worst president in history for the economy.

>Clinton gets rid of the deficit
>Bush then creates a massive one through economic mismanagement, tax cuts, a expansion of the federal goverment and warfare
>Then to cap it off, ruins the economy leaving it for Obama to fix
>Obama uses stimulus to stabilise and fix the economy, with a temporary increase in the deficit that he gradually decreases
>Trump gets elected on Obama's good economy and somewhat improved financial situation and goes crazy with a tax cut and massive omnibus spending bill.

Hmm who seems to be the problem there.

>Why do we keep ignoring this?
Because it's money we owe to ourselves.
>What’s gonna happen if it keeps growing?
Hyperinflation.

Clinton completely gutted welfare and cut the military budget to achieve that surplus
The war on Terror and the bus tax cuts did fuck it up however Obama barely grew the economy in his eight years even after going 11 trillion in debt

Neither Dems or Republicans even give a shit about the debt at this point

Graphs that go parabolic like that are not sustainable. Check out world population graphs too for another eye opener. Water use is another. Eventually we're all heading for something ugly.

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>using actual dollar amounts
>over a 70 year period
>without inflation taken into account

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You are looking at the wrong figure. What you want to look at is the cost of the debt, the interest, as a percent of GDP. It peaked in 1990 and has been on the decline every since. Things are actually better than they used to be.

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This. It is irrelevant political talking points to fool normies who don't know shit

Nothing cause our currency is actually worth anything nor is any other.
All the stuff about muh debt or fiscal cliff is a distraction stuff that does matter.

>Obama uses stimulus to stabilise and fix the economy, with a temporary increase in the deficit that he gradually decreases

Your post is so retarded, if it weren't for your flag I would have thought you were Obamaleaf.

The housing crisis was a result of policies from both Reagan and Clinton. Trump just pulled the pin again on banks but it'll take years before it happens.

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Either default, identify the cause and amend it (women's rights)
OR
Identify the cause and amend it (women's rights) before you cease being able to pay debt.

I don;t know why America keeps voting for Republicans. Always fuck the little guy and help the rich who'll always escape unharmed anyway.

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You obviously have no concept of economy and the printing of money.
The US debt has to grow.
The president can never remove the debt.
Most of the US debt is to the privately owned (((Federal Reserve))) and Treasury Department who make money for the US.
The presidents just kick the can down the road and hope the economy doesnt collapse on their watch.
Every dollar in circulation in the US has debt owed to it.
If you remove all the debt, you also remove money.
Debt=Money.

>fought against your own interest
>all the axis powers declared war on us

You faggots keep forgetting this

There is more debt than money in circulation
Also we have to service that debt each year and the only reason we have been able to do so is because of extremely low interest rates. If they went up to 5% we would be paying 1.1 trillion a year just on the interest to our debt

This definitely will not be sustainable by the next decade without austerity measures

Holy shit the one day I work from home I see obamaleaf still posting! Goddamn, you on here 24/7? I can get maybe not having a job...but being on Jow Forums all day? Sad!

The debt only matters to the retards in this country when a Democrat is president.

I wonder who all these countries keep borrowing money from.
If you believe the official story, fiat money makes 0 sense.
Yeah dude, never mind that massive surplus building in banks across the world. Totally irrelevant, not even worth thinking about.

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"taxation is theft"
"balance the budget"
"debt is bad"
"no foreign wars"

except when conservashit republicans do it.

I know there is more debt than money in circulation.
For every dollar created is created with debt.
This is why I said you cannot remove the debt, or even really come close.

Don't know what you are talking about but stop making stupid votes.

This "debt doesn't matter" meme is beyond retarded.

It's from their own citizens mostly. US treasuries are that debt.
China has about $4t too plus there's others but the bulk of that $20t in debt is to US people.

>nominally side with the allies by providing them all the material support (even to the commies) they need to hold against Hitler.
>Enforce an oil embargo against Japan (act of war)
Yeah America was dragged in by the Axis!

It's even worse to owe money to your own people because you can't default without wiping everyone's wealth out.

onions

basedboy

s.o.y

s.o.y.b.o.y

>What’s gonna happen if it keeps growing?
Can't pay, then credit rating goes down, followed by congress finally being forced to spend within its means.
Also hopefully MAJOR reductions in social security, medicare, and medicaid.

Of course projections are just that

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Nope, always and forever no matter who. You can't change the system in one administration.
Ex. Democrats last 100 years

It really doesn't. Treasury bonds are not like your credit card or whatever consumer debt you are drowning in.

Bonds have maturation date and cannot be redeemed early. Only sold in a secondary market. If you need to pay off maturing debts, just issue more bonds. EZPZ

So I am going to get a bunch of my taxes back in the extremely unlikely event they ever pay any of those debts back?

No, but if you owned treasuries you;d get the principal at the end and interest in between.

Why does it matter?

Except now the issue is rising rates and a huge pool of debt money to pay interest on that rises with those rates.
I had read, rising rates may get capped as it wouldn't be able to rise too much before the US had issue paying those debts and defaulting.

Yeah that is true. Well, if there is a recession, coupon rates would lower again.

>What’s gonna happen if it keeps growing?
Nothing. It's just used as a tool for coercion. In reality, it's completely meaningless.

Deficit =/= Debt you fucking retarded monkey shit faggot.

Talk about the 100+ trillion in unfunded liabilities while you're at it

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That debt is never gonna be paid.

It will only start mattering once 'murrican supremacy is under foreign doubt.
But something like that would never happen, right? )))

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Basically this. The debt is just pixels on a computer screen that don't mean anything. It's never gonna get called and its never gonna get paid. So the best thing to do is just print more money and spend like boomers oblivious to future generations

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The reason Trump dropped corporate taxes is to try and spur the economy so that debt shrinks.
Also, a primary reason for inflation is the de-valuation of money over time. Assuming the US could not grow the debt, in 30 years or so it would be equivilent to about half of what it is today because the money would be worth less even though the debt didn't move.
Also, by that same inflation, the economy grows as a number further reducing the debt to the GDP as a percentage.
So this is likely the long term plan.

>Why do we keep ignoring this?
Mostly because we are on top so losing really isnt possible.
>What’s gonna happen if it keeps growing?
Eventual civilization collapse if we dont straighten out.

Nothing as long as the world is strong armed into using the petrodollar. If China's petroyuan gains traction its all ogre. But we'll go to war before that is allowed to happen.
The debt backed digital fiat we use is the perfect tool for the corrupt(see: Jews) to siphon as much money as possible from the State without much chance of reprisal

Wouldnt that make the debt smaller? Probably plot the debt in terms of gdp.

>National Debt 1940-Present
>1940- Present
>Present
>2008

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Yep. There's no magical bond vigilantes who will put a gun to the Fed's skull and force them to default unless Congress goes full retard again with the debt ceiling. Sovereign governments cannot involuntarily go bankrupt. They quite literally have a magic money tree.

The US, Britain, Japan, Australia, any country with a fiat currency they control and no promise to turn it into anything else (e.g. Gold Standard) can spend as much as they want, since they create money ex nihilo when they spend by just crediting the relevant accounts. No corresponding liabilities for government spending, the sale of bonds is just to sop up excess bank reserves since a public deficit is a private surplus. Hence, you can't run a permanent surplus without removing and destroying a fuckton of demand in the private sector and causing massive unemployment. The optimum level of government spending is usually somewhere in the deficit side, since you don't get inflation much until aggregate demand>supply and America is nowhere near full employment. They need to spend MORE, not less.
They don't even have to issue bonds or debt at all, since they can control exchange rates with other monetary tools like the overnight rate/support rate/discount window and the interbank reserves loan market. Mostly it's for corporate welfare and providing superbly reliable assets for companies to buy.

Look at Japan and their Lost Decade(s). Massive deficits, stupendous national debt and all the other things that would make deficit hawks say they're about to have an inflationary crisis or go bankrupt, but they were fighting deflation rather than inflation and living standards never exactly imploded. Britain post 1812 ran the world for a century despite starting with 200% debt to GDP.

Britain did that after WW2, although without the tax cuts. Let inflation rise a bit, in ten years a third of the debt was gone and nobody noticed.

>Sears Roebuck House Kit #264b155
>Materials delivered to the closest Railroad siding
I owned and lived in one built in 1925. Pretty comfy until three kids.

I’m not an economics expert but how the fuck does the us but it’s own bonds. Da fuq. Am I the only one that sees the irony in buying your own debt to fund yourself?

No the government issues treasuries and corporations or citizens buy those treasuries as they are guaranteed by the US government.
Issue today is as interest rates rise, treasury yields also rise. This causes commotion in equity and bond markets as money leaves them for 'safe' treasuries. However, the US has to make good on that promise and pay those interest rates out which becomes a burden as the pool increases and the money paid does the same. If the US were to default, that would be hella bad for the US and the whole world. Just like when China's economy sneezes, we all feel it. So top when the US has trouble since US dollars are currently the standard.

It’s even higher now

Because this shit creates unnecessary inflation, it deepens the gap between the rich and the poor and is the reason why people have a hard time covering basic expenses without working themselves to death, hence the 50s were great, because money was worth more and you hade more time to do what you wanted.

Debt is not necessary for an economic system to function properly- actually, the opposite is true. The reason why gold has real value is because its limited in existence thus there is a limited supply. Fiat currency destroys that and indebts and robs future generations of wealth and prosperity.

And the fed is a privately owned bank. There are huge conflicts of interest and lots of secrecy going on behind the scenes. Its a cabal.

Fucking shill.

Thanks for the explanation. Makes way more sense. We better pay that debt down before it gets outrageous.

Will just fight off our creditors

21T

No one says anything because we can't do anything about it. The right refuses to cut funding to the military; the left refuses to cut welfare and the like; both are happy with rampant subsidization. We're so far gone, and no one's willing to suffer their favorite programs cut that it's too late - there's nothing we can do at this point. All one can really do is prepare for the eventuality.

Dig deeper on the debt, though. That graph is only showing direct government debt. States have their own ridiculous debt. Additionally, the social security system itself is another 6 trillion dollars of debt.

It's over.

whos going to try and collect?

ten years ago your debt was about half what it is now. You've had numerous shutdowns. 'Emergency measures' are running dry. The next step is government default, that is boomers not getting their pension. The petrodollar can only stretch so far.

They'll live. One of the benefits of a fiat currency is that if everything ABSOLUTELY goes to shit they can hyperinflate and reboot, although that would be pretty horrific since, you know, world reserve currency.

I doubt there will actually be a debt crash at any point. Look at Europe, they sunk 40% of eurozone GDP into their banks and prayed, and despite basically banning fiscal policy throughout the eurozone they managed to struggle through once they worked out How To Central Bank. Debts tend to come alongside economic disasters, unless it's a freak situation like Wiemar they don't CAUSE them.
Then again, the Eurozone doesn't have a government that cares about a "debt ceiling".

Notice how when it began to level off in 2000, jews staged September 11th to bring on more war debts..

this. what can anyone do to the US to try and collect their money? Military threats? Economic threats? Those won't work.

what is even the point of having a debt counter at this point if every country is on fiat currency
the actual money itself is worthless on a global scale. maybe socialism is the right way to go since debt is meaningless at this point because every country has massive amounts of it but nothing ever happens.