Lately I have been noticing a major split between people on this board who want subtle optics and more stormfront-tier people who want very blunt optics and think that any kind of subtly or subversiveness is just cucking.
You can see this split in how people are reacting to Kanye. Half of Jow Forumsocks think this is a great victory for right-wing politics because it normalizes right-wing nationalism/Trumpism and brings us closer to normalizing white nationalism
The more stormfront attitude says that this is normalizing non-whites to be associated with right-wing nationalism, and that Kanye west endorsing MAGA is actually working against us.
To me, the Stormfront-tier attitude just makes no sense. Non-whites endorsing conservativism makes brainwashed whites feel like they aren't bad people for endorsing it as well. After this is normalized, we can slowly normalize white nationalism and traditionalist values to white people after they've accepted that basic right-wing nationalism is not evil.
Leftists didn't normalize Marxist principles overnigt, it took decades of moving the overton window left.
>Leftists didn't normalize Marxist principles overnigt, it took decades of moving the overton window left. This is very true. However, there is such a thing as being too concerned with optics to the point where you just retreat retreat retreat like the cuckservatives have done for centuries. Being provocative shows confidence in your righteousness. Being violent brings real political power because you are no longer written off as just a nothingburger.
Really, we should have both tactics working in parallel. Be the Jew - play as many sides and as many angles as are tactically useful, even when they contradict each other.
Adam Sanders
If this is a serious thread let me add a third point of view. I am a National Socialist who thinks stormfront and NSM are 100% cringe optics funded by ZOG. I also think Kanye is bad for MAGA because he is a poor role model who advocates for bad ideas like not going to school and marrying whores.
Gavin King
it takes provocative action to move that Overton Window btw - the Jews spent decades shoving their message in the public eye, against lots of opposition. We need to spend decades forcing our messages into the public memescape just like they did.
Angel Phillips
>left You can say "Jew" user. We are on Jow Forums after all.
>Leftists didn't normalize Marxist principles overnigt, it took decades of moving the overton window left.
Realistically both serve a purpose, and should be used in tandem by creating intentional fabricated conflicts between the subversive right and the overt right.
Ultimately however: we don't have decades. By 2050 without massive change, Western/European countries will have crossed the point of safe return.
Liam Gomez
The correct position was the Stormer (as opposed to Stormfront) attitude to lol at the whole situation while not forgetting that Kanye is still a stupid nigger (really nothing but a dumber, less talented version of Puff Daddy) who should never be treated seriously. The Stormfronters and Alt Light both made the same mistake of treating him far more seriously than he deserved.
Jace Gomez
Hi Brittany, post tits
Robert Carter
>it takes provocative action to move that Overton Window btw - the Jews spent decades shoving their message in the public eye, against lots of opposition. We need to spend decades forcing our messages into the public memescape just like they did.
Well Jews did a lot of retreating and re-organization
They would come out with a controversial movie about homosexuals or something taboo, it would get a ton of backlash, sometimes they would kinda pedal it backwards and then bring it back in a new more palatable form
There is a difference between "retreating" and delivering the message in a different way.
Like SJWs are REALLY bad optics for liberalism. If they had just maintained a more moderate or accessible attitude/image and kept arguing for neo-marxism, they may not be losing as bad as they are right now.
SJWs were the worst thing to ever happen to leftist optics
Thomas Lee
You're becoming more moderate and left-wing in order to be more popular. This is why conservatism is a dead end, it endlessly slides to the left. In 10 years the conservatives will bring out the BASED pro-Israel Muslims in MAGA hijabs >democrats are the real islamophobes!
Nathan Ward
Read Alinsky. Bad optics and openly shilling for communism is why the New Left failed miserably in the 60s.
Isaac Scott
>I also think Kanye is bad for MAGA because he is a poor role model who advocates for bad ideas like not going to school and marrying whores.
Endorsing his political views is not necessarily endorsing him as a "role model". Endorsing him as a person will cause massive chaos in leftist politics and also help brainwashed masses to act as lemmings for us instead of for the left as well
Josiah Walker
>conservatism is a dead end, it endlessly slides to the left This is why the Right Wing can no longer be conservative. We must be radicals. We have to go on the offense, pushing for our own changes.
I'm not interested in the same old cuckservative stance that got us nowhere .
Ryan Wood
>Ultimately however: we don't have decades.
I think normalizing our ideology will go MUCH faster than how long it took the left. We have the internet now and our ideology is natural so it clicks more naturally
Dumb skinheads aren't going to go away just because you think they hurt your optics. So you have two choices here: 1. retreat out of public eye in fear of being associated with them - thus letting them be the only representatives of far-right radicalism and making the PR problem worse 2. grow up, grow some balls, and keep getting your message out, thus balancing out the MSM's "omg scary skinhead natzees" projection of us
Elijah James
>failed Are you retarded? They won the civil rights movement and the anti-Vietnam war movement, and now the adulterous commie MLK is universally praised as an American hero.
Eli Cox
Lately I have been noticing a major problem with posters from reddit spacing
Aiden Clark
His political views and his moral character are both questionable at best. Endorsing anyone 6 years out is shilling, fake, and gay. It's transparent and probably designed by the left to make him look bad so their base will ignore his message. By endorsing him the right is doing harm to itself, it's base, and it's message. But this is obvious, which is why it is being shilled so hard...
>The correct position was the Stormer (as opposed to Stormfront) attitude to lol at the whole situation while not forgetting that Kanye is still a stupid nigger
I agree with most of Andrew's optics ideas. Kanye is a huge opportunity to fuck with the left and fuck with the DNC's voter base though. It's aleady causing chaos, if we can even get like %5 of minorities to not vote, or vote independent, or maybe even vote republican, this will MASSIVELY fuck with their elections
Maybe they'll even start a new liberal party and fracture the DNC, who knows
Jace Barnes
That's a retarded magapede opinion. Hey goy lets aim for 12% of the population, 33% of which can't vote due to a felony, and ignore the large portion of angry white voters who are on the same side as the chimps.
The key to winning is asking for the White vote. Be clear about it. Ask for it. And support the White race like the Jews support theirs and the Asians support theirs. Show average HRC voters why Jews and Niggers ruined America.
Camden Howard
Read Alinsky x2. Learn from the left and implement Jewish tactics. Be aggressive and on the offensive when arguing or debating. Learn from Trump, he succeeded also because he was a fighter, not a classic cuckservative who's afraid of taking the fight to the lugenpresse. Don't be a radical in the sense of going around and randomly calling people niggers and kikes, but argue for positions that are considered (almost) acceptable. Race realism, race and IQ, how Marxism destroyed the West >democrats are the real racists and so on. Don't name the Jew or nobody will listen to you, at least not initially. That comes later.
Also, don't discard people that can be useful to your cause just because they're not GTKRWN. Sargoy may be a literal cuck, but he makes fun of the crazies in an entertaining way that makes people realize how batshit insane they are. David Horowitz is a neocon Jew, but the way he understands the left is unique and very valuable when it comes to redpilling people. Milo is a faggot niggerloving Jew, but most of his content will speak to your average bluepilled normie.
Alexander Jackson
fuck off optics faggot. go jerk off to some anime.
Jace Wilson
i think both sides have good points. you are correct that natsoc marches do no good for the movement. if anything, they turn people away. charlottesville and movements like it are complete failures, and nazi iconography will always bring up bad memories in america.
but i do think the obsession conservatives have with blacks or other minorities agreeing with them is a bit much. it's kind of weird - the claim many conservatives make is they want a color blind society where your race doesn't impact people's judgement of you. but these very same conservatives will put a black man on a pedestal if he agrees with him and emphasis his blackness. you see the same thing with gays, trannies, or hispanics who vote trump.
Grayson Carter
Our ideology would have to takeover the education centers, which I think would be a hard task.
David Ortiz
Op is some sort of nigger kike Retardican. And op obviously hasn’t learned anything in ap history.
They imploded because of optics (1968 DNC convention riots, 1972 Nixon vs McGovern landslide) and open radicalism. They succeeded much later, once they realized that not revealing your true motives while slowly subverting universities with Marxist ideology is what works best, instead of going out and rioting. Alinsky's tactics. The Civil Rights Act was passed mostly due to overwhelming Republican support, without them it would have died in the Senate. The end of the Vietnam war the New Left's main accomplishment, I'll give you that.
William Murphy
THIS
I remember watching a young Turks video, where they interviewed a tall, handsome and well spoken/well groomed white nationalist. So many of the comments were people saying how they can't believe the ideology is spreading to normal people.
It's not that it is spreading to normal people, it's that normal people have begun to speak up.
Angel Ortiz
I agree with everything you say and I am out there daily I dedicating time to spreading the message of positive National Socialism.
Based
Wise.
Lincoln James
>Op is some sort of nigger kike Retardican. And op obviously hasn’t learned anything in ap history.
This is what I'm talking about
For some reason stormtards automatically think any discussion about optics is being a civic nationalist.
Anthony Edwards
>but i do think the obsession conservatives have with blacks or other minorities agreeing with them is a bit much. it's kind of weird
White people in general are obsessed with this.
Normalizing right-wing nationalism is the first step to getting away from this
Jonathan Stewart
>Well Jews did a lot of retreating and re-organization >They would come out with a controversial movie about homosexuals or something taboo, it would get a ton of backlash, sometimes they would kinda pedal it backwards and then bring it back in a new more palatable form fair point
Joseph Fisher
Stormweenies need to fuck off
Jacob Davis
Need a mix of both. When these leftist goons start assaulting people you need the Nazis to come out and kick some heads because that is also good optics for us, think battle of Berkley ect, Sieg heiling retards on the news at Charlottesville do more damage than good so it is very much a case of using the right optics at the right time.
>Be stormfaggot >Being at (A) is the worst place in the world >Trying to get to (C) >Not willing to go through (B) even though its better than (A) >Stay in (A) forever complaining that you cant get to (C)
these guys are retarded.
Jackson Richardson
>That's a retarded magapede opinion. Hey goy lets aim for 12% of the population, 33% of which can't vote due to a felony, and ignore the large portion of angry white voters who are on the same side as the chimps.
What the fuck are you talking about, I'm talking about ruining DNC elections not being a civic nat
Can stormfronters not think?
Gabriel Cook
Get bent
Colton Hall
every non white is an enemy, we dont need a nigger who has to use his whore wifes money to pay his bills. A nigger is a nigger A spic is a spic A streetshitter is a streetshitter A sandnigger is a sandnigger A gook is a gook
Grayson Jones
Agreed
Caleb Wright
Nazi is a term crafted by a Jew and used by the left. I am a National Socialist. Never allow anyone to call you a Nazi without being corrected and never let your friends say it either. Nazi is a bad word. This is one of the first steps to getting our optics back.
Easton King
w/e i am explaining to normies not to Jow Forumsacks
Ian Williams
Jews think in terms of hundred, thousands of years. Whites think in terms of quarters.
Cooper Green
You are talking as if the right has time to pussyfoot around trying to get cucks and boomers on board. Transparency is key and using kike level subversion tactics in an attempt to make people comfortable is essentially a lie. Either they accept what is being offered or they do not. Just that simple.
Anyone who cares about "optics" of Jow Forums is an embarrassing newfag and has to go back
Nicholas Morales
StormNiggers like you need instant gratification, yes
Elijah Clark
>Need a mix of both. When these leftist goons start assaulting people you need the Nazis to come out and kick some heads because that is also good optics for us, think battle of Berkley ect,
I agree. That's why I like the group Patriot Front. They're willing to get violent but they also look good
Robert Taylor
Here is a good example, Tommy Robinson dropping this mouthy African on his ass, this is good optics and justified application of force.
They pretend they are teleporting to the corner store when they want to go there.
In reality they are walking through places they dont want to be, to get to places they do want to be.
The way to the ethnostate is through the republican party.
They are just right wing SJW. they have put ideology above results.
Grayson Thomas
Sure you do bud. That's why Israel is 20% Muslim and the only Jews breeding are brown Moroccan Jews
Tyler Wright
>muh optics You can disguise a piece of shit by wrapping it in a present box but it's still a piece of shit and anyone with common sense and the ability to smell will realize this.
Until you fix the problem of 90% of your base going on about muh jews and blacks and muh pure white ethnostate utopia you will always be regarded as exactly that, shit. The beliefs are simply put so toxic to the majority population that they won't follow you no matter how much you try and dress it up behind suits and pretty decorations and disguises. The ideology is rooted in violence and using a "other" enemy figure to rally the base against and to hurt, and for normies violence is abhorrent.
This is why white nationalism and far right ideologies will never take off again, they've been tainted from the past, they're being continually tainted in the present by the people who follow it and you nerds give the communists a run for their money in terms of "being bloodthirsy, power hungry, and continually backstabbing and making power plays with your organizations".
Mason Thompson
>Nazi memflag >StormNigger You are going to be that type of faggot? KYS
Seriously, you know where I stand and there is no kike tier subversion being played on you or anyone else. You either accept it or not. Just that simple.
Agreed on the black part but jews are shit and it's pretty easy to convince people of it.
Grayson Adams
>Transparency is key
Lol no, Charolettesville is an example of this. That was full transparency and it wasn't pretty.
>JEWS WILL NOT REPLACE US nobody even knew what the fuck they were talking about. "Jews? Replace us? They're like 0.3% of the population? What are these weirdos talking about?"
Transparency works in small and controlled doses. Don't believe me? Take a look at SJWs and tell me how that's going for them
Easton Wilson
What country are you even from
Benjamin Williams
> muh jews dindu nuffin he claims even as Israel tries to drag the world into ww3 Yeah nah
Brandon Moore
Show your flag Jew. Your tension is noticeable. Are you scared? You know where you are at, you know whats coming. The only reason you are here is because it is a treat. Your angst gives me pleasure. Your fear motivates me.
Michael Ward
Why are these Ancap meme niggers even in this thread?
Aiden Nelson
Shills consider any discussion of changing National Socialism's look as the most dangerous topic there is.
Gavin Reed
Jews were once brown, dum dum. Ya think jeebus was a white man?
Daniel Allen
>That was full transparency and it wasn't pretty. We will have to disagree on that.
>Transparency works in small and controlled doses. I disagree. Kike tier subversive attempts to fool the public is not apart of anything being offered.
You don't have to be apart of any of this. You are free to rejoin your leftist pals and wait until we call your number.
lately I’ve noticed a bunch of OP faggots speaking jibberish. What are you babbling about?
Dylan Butler
Point out where I said that my man. The Jews are a dying race due to natural causes, the vast majority of the ones in the US barely practice and have devolved into basically being an identitarian group like immigrants. Going after them is an incredibly efficient way of cutting your own throat, because wew lads, when some old jewish grandmother end up getting 200 calls from daily stormer dorks threatening to cut her throat and shit it looks bad for you. Happy you autist? Woah, shocking, it's not a ZOGCTRshillWTFBBQ Israeli flag!
lolbergs have always been terrified of an organised Authoritarian right that focuses on good optics because unlike them they can actually get politicians elected.
>transparency To support your argument: The Soviet Communist Party's motto was "Peace, land and bread" not "NKVD, Gulags and 60 million deaths". If today's leftists at the DNC were fully transparent and told the masses what their vision of America truly is, they'd get lynched in front of Capitol Hill the next day.
Adrian Davis
Ask yourself this:
Why did Trump win and why did George Lincoln Rockwell lose?
Brandon Gray
You are still a Kike shill. Everyone is waking up to the Jew. Germany 2.0 is happening and there are no brakes.
God damn those mutt milkers make my sputnik go up.
Asher Kelly
Here's the fundamental problem: The basis of the political platform is race, by embracing nonwhite conservatism, particularly the "democrats r the real racists" mindset your fundamentally undermining the goals of the movement and in fact validating the criticism leveled at it by the social progressives.
Jackson Thompson
This. Right now, White nationalism is the bailey, and larger conservatism is the monte.
If Kanye is going to signal and increase the size and power of the monte, they're no actual reason to stop him. Just don't make any concessions/let him in the bailey.
Elijah Flores
Yeah looks like you're going back to BC era of human development
>Why did Trump win Because the Jews put him in power, same as all other politicans. >why did George Lincoln Rockwell lose Because woah, nobody wants to support NatSoc groups. Also it's ironic that Rockwell literally got shot in the back and killed by one of his fellow party members, long history of backstabbing (sometimes literally). God, I wish I was a kike shill. Then I would get to be paid for talking about how retarded current far right ideology and tactics are instead of just getting paid purely in (You)s and salty adhom attacks from mongoloids like yourself.
Adam Fisher
When you spend billions of shekels to create a box to bury your enemy in you will do a lot to keep it that way. NSM is a joke. America needs a new National Socialist Party that doesn't want to break up the country, wears suits and ties, and waves american flags.
Dylan Taylor
Racism is not right. What matters is the way someone thinks, not what they can't change.
>Unironically thinking shilling requires shekels. At least you admit to being a shill even when you deny it. Gas chamber for you faggot.
Leo Mitchell
I see groups like faggot skinhead neonazis as potential confederates who've completely gone feral. Isn't making groups as pathetic and leaderless as this a simple matter of projecting the right kind of dominance? If you can show one of these naziboos the nazi trap, you could gain great swaths of political territory.
Xavier Richardson
imho the best optics are joining and starting GI chapters as it's not quite Nazi but not quite civicuck.
Joseph Anderson
Quads of truth. NSM people look like trailer trash, what kind of normalfag would want to support them. You need intelligent, well-spoken and educated people that lemmings can look up to rather than look down upon.
Nicholas Anderson
>new National Socialist Party Okay, fucking retarded idea. When you literally name your group the "National Socialist Party" it won't matter how many suits you wear or how many flags you wave, you're going to be pretty much near universally shit on.
Most of the "alt-right" disagreeing are leftist subversion. The left is toast if they can't lock in women and minorities onto the Lenin/Marx bandwagon.
We are in total war, absolute and total war. Mental, political, military, spiritual, economic, cultural war. You have to fight on all avenues that includes taking the enemies tricks and using them against themselves. If it becomes a win win for everyone, so be it.
White Nationalist and Black Nationalist have the same goal, why not join together.
