If a person was born in a country not of their ethnic origin, but grew themselves to respect all aspects of that nations history, culture, traditions and values, why shouldn't they have the right to call themselves as part of that nation?
Why would for example
>black
>polish
Be so upsetting if that person were to assimilate perfectly into that culture and cause no problems?
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>assimilate perfectly and cause no problems
As long as they don't race mix I can get behind that.
But that's just a fantasy. The reality is alot more fucked up. Many of these immigrants are consciously aware of the fact that they are destroying our civilization and raping our women. It's why they come here in the first place.
I'd like to add my own personal story
My parents are both from Asia, and I grew up in the U.S.
Neither myself or my parents have ever held any negative regards to the country. They taught me to have a respect for the law and authority to a degree, as well as to try to become and industrialist hard worker. They taught me that there is no such thing as something for nothing and that everything in life must be earned through genuine effort and will
My dad and I love to shoot, we enjoy talking about motorcycles and racing. We go sailing every now and then on my Cal 35 and are members of our local yacht club which often holds charity events. My mom is a devout Christian and is adamant that I go to church even if I've moved out. Everyone in my family is politically conservative and have an absolute disdain towards contemporary marxists and social justice bullshit.
I refuse to have a victim mentality. This is to let you know that I am not complaining, but am rather curious as to why race is such an automatic barrier to never being able to call yourself part of that country.
Bump
If there are enough Asians in America, new Asian immigrants will be less motivated to assimilate to "American" culture.
>if a hamster is born in an aquarium then why not call it a fish?
It's through no fault of mine that the white race has allowed itself to be chucked so hard as right now. You've happily allowed the Jews total victory over your culture.
More asians wouldn't matter if western culture were promoted and preserved, keeping dominance over the land making other cultures less threatening.
If sheer numbers alone is what's necessary to collapse the west, I dont think it's not the gatekeepers fault for letting in the barbarians so to speak
Hamsters and fish share no similarities unlike humans which (although admittedly do differ in some traits) are still very much alike.
False equivalency
...
Of course, race mixing is an issue. But at least the father has strong nationalistic pride for their host nation amd will do everything to protect that nations culture.
Take myself for instance.
Turkish Cypriot, born and raised in England. Father is an immigrant who worked every day of his life since coming to this country and has utmost respect for our laws, cultures and our queen. He hates useless immigrants and loves British (white) people.
Like my father, Im pro british, extreme nationalist, to the point Ive been called a Neo-nazi, white supremacist, etc.
I know I'll never be English. But the least i can do is respect British culture. Yes, i will date and marry a white woman. Yes, i will have kids with her. And of course, I'll teach my kids to only breed with another white.
As a brown person, I completelty understand the "mudslime" mentality, of seeing white girls as easy fuck victims. At least i can educate others to see this.
You need to go back Pablo
Friedrich Nietzsche used to think he was polish for no apparent reason.
Easy for you to say Yang,
Say don't you have an engineering class to go cheat on? How about you sell that BMW 325i your mommy and daddy leased for you and spend it on some rhino cock instead, faggot
You will forever be an outsider, you will never be trusted but you will be favoured for studying and respecting the culture
I would not be upset by a few well-behaved immigrants who genuinely want to integrate and don't bitch endlessly, but you can not refer to them as part of your own ethnic group by any stretch of coherence
Look at the Khoisan, oldest human group on earth. If i went there with my wife, had a son there and he grew up speaking that clickclickclick language of the bushmen and hunting with arrows, do you think he would automathically become a part of said group of primal humans?
Yea. But I can respect most East Asians. Niggers on the other hand don’t have the mental capacity to assimilate into western culture. East Asian culture is in many ways similar to non degenerate western culture and is part of the reason they are the only group of races capable of competition with whites.
You mean like Hitler?
That makes sense to me and I'm okay with that.
But isn't the U.S supposed to be a country that's fair game for anyone so long as they're not contributing to the degeneracy of the nation?
And how does National Socialism respond to a mash up of people like the U.S?
A person that assimilated will understand why they can never truly be of the group but only associated and allied with it. Their descendants through intermarriage and sacrifice can be after generations of weaving themselves into the national narrative, but the progenitor will always never be anything other than a cultural dilettante.
Sheer numbers can collapse any culture.
Assimilation is great
The problem is we don't enforce assimilation anymore because it's erasing their culture or some shit
>why shouldn't they have the right to call themselves as part of that nation?
Their descendants, second and third generation, will snap back and long for the homeland.
They cannot call themselves as part of that nation because in the old world(most of Eurasia) the concept of nationality and race fused from the very beginning since one ethnic group pretty much dominated a particular piece of land for its entire history.
I don't care how integrated you are, if you are Black you will NEVER be a real pole the same way an ethnic pole is. You will NEVER be accepted as such, no matter what.
Settler colonies(like burgerland) were multiethnic from the beginning(various european ethnicities sharing the same land), so nationality and race did not fuse together in the same way, or fused very weakly. Government in settler colonies are designed to handle the concerns of multiple ethnic groups, unlike old world governments that are designed for only one ethnic group.
As hard as it may be for me to accept, this is what I've come up with so far
Even though certain members of an outsider group may assimilate, most will not and enough people will destroy a culture, like niggers and kikes so it's in the West's best interest to remain weary of all individuals unless shown otherwise. It's human nature to be skeptical of another group, and history has so far proven the consequences of letting in other groups in large numbers.
So then should the emphasis be put on preserving western principles such as layer out by the U.S? Or is race an all determining factor?
The holocaust was a choice
bruh, you are a motherfucking pussiboi who is part of a yacht club. you ain't got no room to talk shit on him for being rich
Depends on the numbers, OP.
If it's only a relatively small handful of people (compared to the size of the majority group) it's not a big deal. But there is such a thing as too-many.
An Arab moving to a 98% Japanese Japan is going to feel a great deal of pressure to assimilate. If an Arab moved into a Japan that was only 30% ethnic Jap - with the rest being people from all over the world - he isn't going to feel as much pressure to be like the 30% group. The culture of that 30% group will no longer be the dominant one in Japan, and Japanese Politics would be changed massively by the Demographic percentages. Politics & Culture are inseparable. Each influences the other. Politics is shaped by Ethnic/Racial demographic percentages.
I don't think the analogy was to be taken so literally, the point is that people, much like hamsters cannot be expected to assimilate and thrive in environments to which they don't belong.
So then in application, a Marxist self hating Pole that actively tries to subvert the country is forever more Polish than an immigrant that loves and will fight and die for what he considers his home?
The trick is to accept outsiders in small numbers.
Make sure the outsiders assimilate. When in Rome do as Romans do.
If you get 100 Syrians in every 5 years nothing bad will happen. They will assimilate.
If you get thousands every year then you are going to have a problem. If you there is a crisis and these are war refugees like in the case of the Syrian Crisis, then you should keep them in a separated area.
Turkey took the biggest amount of Syrians. I know Turkey isn't the best example to modern culture but everyone would admit that their culture is different than Arabs on several levels.
What they did is they made tent towns for Syrians. Only accepted a minimal amount of Syrians into actual Turkish populated lands.
Turkish nationalism is civic nationalism anyways, everyone knows they are ethnically different from original Turks in Central Asia. So they accepted those few who "when in Rome did as Romans do" while rejecting and in times physically fighting those who act in ways incompatible with the society.
One example is that there are stray dogs and cats in Istanbul that people take care of by putting meals and drinks outside for them. When a few Syrians decided it was a good idea to torture those animals people gathered up and beat the shit out of those Syrians.
They are a neighboring country with these people for generations and they know what these people are like, so they are cautious about it.
Naive Europeans on the other hand think that everyone in the world is a peaceful flower just like them.
I was 17 when I wanted to learn how to sail. My parents weren't but I knew my grandfather was a fisherman so with that I went out of my own volition to contact a crew and ask if they needed an extra hand.
They accepted me and I joined through proxy. I got handed down an old boat which I spent years learning on and now I take my dad, who spent most of his life working on little outings.
yes because they are not racist and welcome outsiders
>a Marxist self hating Pole
Well you just said yourself he's a Pole. So yes, he's more Polish. Is he as good a person to have around as the other fellow? That's a different question.
Yes, the marxist pole is a traitor, but he will always be Polish, through and through. An African or Arab can never be polish, no matter how much they love poland or are loyal to it. Nationality is not just something you get by acting good or by being born on polish soil. You actually have to have polish ancestors going back for generations and generations. It is hereditary, just like race. You don't earn it for good behaviour if that is what you are implying.
Assume that in this case, the "Pole" is a blue haired onions that would sooner destroy a historical statue, and the other is well functioning and well meaning.
That commie is still preferable?
>fishes and hamsters cannot speak the same language
>fishes and hamsters cannot breed
>fishes and hamsters are not the same species
>fishes and hamsters physically cannot get along due to their environment
Do Hungarians still act like Huns who were nomad savages?
Do Scandinavian countries act like vikings, pillaging other European countries?
People aren't animals. People adapt.
>if you replace every part in a car with shitty parts that sorta work exactly the same!!! is it the same car you started with?
Well I don't know I failed out of college.
>take sthe automatic assumption that pol is a racist hivemind
no
just stop, its all so tiring
being concerned about the un agenda for replacement migration doesnt mean a coloured individual cant be a patriot. but thats not fun or edgy to talk about. silent majority around here isnt jumping in to explain this constantly because its tiring. fuck off
Hasan is clearly a Muslim, which naturally leads to the belief that he holds his old countries values. What if that were not true and Hasan was just his name, his skin was still brown, but dressed in regular clothing and acted like a regular Swede
There is this black guy in my uni who is super white in everything but skin colour. He's alright, he can fuck a blonde swede if he wants to.
Smokd
>But isn't the U.S supposed to be a country that's fair game for anyone so long as they're not contributing to the degeneracy of the nation?
That's the post-1965 idea, yes. The debate is between people who don't like the change (and want to revert to the pre-65 American ideal) and those who seem to think the poem on the Statue of Liberty means the US has always been about this post-65 vision.
Because it's up to the people of the nation who decide what the conditions of membership are, not your own self identified skill level.
>Be so upsetting if that person were to assimilate perfectly into that culture and cause no problems?
If they assimillate perfectly to the standards of the people of the nation, then what's the problem?
>I am Nohrian through and through.
Because, like I said, Nationality and Race fused together in the old world. The Swedish people are united because they had the same ancestors on the same(or similar) plots of land with the same climate and folklore. They are united by Race/DNA. A blue haired shrieking feminist communist swedish women will always be more swedish than the best behaved arab. They are united by DNA, not necessarily culture.
I think I understand.
1.To be part of a nation takes more than just one generation to assimilate, and this is implying that the 2nd and 3rd don't revert back.
2. Too much of a foreign people will overwhelm the host culture, giving less incentive for others to adapt
3. I have to be okay with being an outsider. That's the natural cost of immigrating, especially when other immigrants are destroying the nation
I suppose it's just hard on the ego knowing that you'll never be truly intergrated since people obviously long for social acceptance. To be in the sort of middle not wanting to tolerate disdain towards a host nation but also never really being part of it at the same time, but that's looking at things from a self-centered position not taking into account what's really best for the nation
why do you pretend not to understand metaphor?
then either muruna or
>That commie is still preferable?
Depends: Preferable in what specific circumstance - because I can imagine scenarios where I'd have a preference for either.
The idea that one's people should be seen as things you can just dispose of when the situation suits is a potentially dangerous one, I think. That's part of the reason we're in the mess we are in today (see pic related). "If you people temporarily become a problem, just replace them with new migrants, rather than try and tackle the problem"
If I was a Pole, I'd prefer the country was at least 90 - 95% Polish. I wouldn't mind at all if people like yourself made up the minority. If I disagreed with other Poles politically, I'd prefer to try and work to change people's minds within the Polish politcal/cutural/social system - rather than just replace them.
That's a good summary.
nailed it, yes
>"If you people temporarily become a problem
That's meant to read: "If YOUR people...."
If we are talking about the Old World(Europe etc.) it depends on how genetically similar you are. If you are very genetically similar(A german immigrating to Sweden for example), your ancestors are close enough that you can "pass" as the other people, especially if you mix with the people there and have a half german/swedish kid.
If you are extremely genetically different(nigerian immigrating to germany) you will NEVER be accepted under any circumstances. Your best hope is racemixing with the natives until your genes are basically exterminated from the gene pool(ie. having a great great grandkid who is 99% swedish and 1% nigerian genetically) so that they can look close enough to the average swede to "pass", and then they can be fully accepted.
Hey, if I were allowed to be a creepy, violent shitbag, I just might.
I might not, but I might.
Because it implicitly requires that the foreigner be in receipt of social advantages and opportunities, that would otherwise rightly have gone to the native descendants of those who built the nation.
Space and resources are not finite, and governments very much enjoy stretching them as thin as they can.
This added social burden of the foreigner on top of existing corruption has had very severe effects on many nations.
When I said standards, did I say a damm thing about race or culture?
Different nation states and communities have different standards on who they accept into the in group.
You may never be accepted completely, but perfect cultural integration absolutely does make a huge difference.
cant wait to emmigrate to china russia iran or mexico!
OP if you're still around, you might be interested in this speech by British Conservative Roger Scruton on "Liberalism & Loyalty" - because it touches on many of the themes your getting at here.
youtu.be
Cohesive, peaceful societies have so far usually needed kinds of "pre-political" Loyalties to exist between peoples (shared Religion, shared Ethnicity/tribe, etc).
Liberalism fails to really address the question of Loyalty - how it is formed, if it is required, will it exist, will loyalties between groups of peoples present political challenges, etc....
I think you'd find it interesting.
No idea what that means but ok
Because nation means: breed, race, tribe, blood. Literally being born of some people.
One thing is a handful of people, who because theyre outnumbered completely assimilate. Another thing is a exodus of millions who try to force you to assimilate, a race of races where the end goal is racial patrimony.
Can a haitian for example assimilate to dominican culture? Yes, he can, but what does that assimilation do in our favor? Haitians are race of dullards, and their blood is poisonous to the national body. How do asians asians help here? They dont, they only open way for foreign interference and raciallt there blood offers little in ways of creative or useful intelect. Only euro immigrants have the capability most of the time of bettering a nation, and not all euros can better even a bad nation, just certain individuals
That is interesting. That's a new topic I've never even heard of let alone consider
Fuck off you fucking faggot, WE DON'T WANT YOU HERE is that not clear, YOU ARE FOREIGN HERE.
Its 2018, ethnicity have much more meaning than the country you are born in.
Look up the term "honorary Aryan".
A rat can be born in a cow shed but you'll never be able to milk it.
My point is that fulfilling some arbitrary standards(be smart, have a job lined up, speak the language etc.) won't make a damn difference in whether you are actually accepted into the people of the country or not. At best it will make you a more tolerable outsider, but you will still be an outsider. The government doesn't choose who belongs to the people, the people do. And that decision is made through ancestry(in the Old World specifically), not whatever standards the state sets.
Perfect cultural integration makes 0 difference when it comes to being accepted. All you do is go from an annoying outsider to a tolerable outsider. But you are still just as much as an outsider as before.
thats larping lol
its like when i see bolivians with argentine t shirt
like fuck off subhuman we dont want you devolved shitskin species
if i were to genocide a population i would first and foremost target the larpers
>If a person was born in a country not of their ethnic origin, but grew themselves to respect all aspects of that nations history, culture, traditions and values, why shouldn't they have the right to call themselves as part of that nation?
Society is a racial construct.