Some think Charlemagne was a French dude, he really wasn't. He was pretty much a German. He probably spoke a Rhenish Franconian dialect, some Latin and even some Greek. His first relationship was with Himiltrude. The nature of this relationship is variously described as concubinage, a legal marriage, or a Friedelehe. After her, his first wife was Desiderata, daughter of Desiderius, king of the Lombards. His second wife was Hildegard of the Vinzgau.
And he was buried in Aachen, today in Germany.
Not news, not politics. A better fit would be /hist/.
You're a moron with no historical perspective.
You conflate modern concepts like nationality and countries with a completely different Era where the only thing that mattered was your allegiance.
you mean he's buried in aix-la-chapelle?
They had countries back then retard. They were even more strict than we are because they would use clans rather than countrymen.
yeah no, he spoke low franconian (old dutch) and was born in luik. if anything, he was dutch
>You conflate modern concepts like nationality and countries with a completely different Era where the only thing that mattered was your allegiance.
He was German, not French. Deal with it.
LOL no, you're a fucking retard.
>he spoke low franconian (old dutch) and was born in luik.
And yet he spoke Rhenish Franconian... explain that, Dutchie.
He was not German, German is the most recent national identity in Europe with Italian, he was Germanic.
Still he's from germanic extraction. op is right.
>German is the most recent national identity in Europe with Italian, he was Germanic.
He was German, just German. Period. He was the father of modern day Germany. 1871 was just a reorganization of Germany, not a foundation.
yeah as a national entity as we know it today.
but the holly german empire existed for a long period of time.
The retard is right. It's Germanic not German. Germans are just a minor group within Germanic people. Germanics ruled Europe for a millenia while Germans barely rule Germany.
You're just as retarded, France is a confederation of people of various ethnic backgrounds, modern Belgian flanders were one of the original peers of the Kingdom of France, we have Germanic people all over the north east of the country and there were Gauls that settled in the south of Germany and in Anatolia more than 2000 years ago.
The Germanic were also used as a docile ruling class by the romans.
>Charlemagne
>Western european
His name was Costel Ciocanul and he was a romanian voievod
Prove me wrong faggots
stfu east francia
I am not talking about Germanics, but Germans. That is my whole point. He was German and he is the father of modern day Germany.
He was Dutch, more specifically Limburgish.
Well then you're also retarded although the last statement is correct. He's also the father of France.
being buried somewhere does not mean you speak the local language.
ahhhh GERMans the fucking parasytes of europe that destroyed evrything rome greece built also known for leaching off other countries famous people and then claiming they were german
"Francia is regarded as the common predecessor of the modern states of France and Germany.[citation needed] After the Treaty of Verdun in 843, West Francia became the predecessor of France, and East Francia became that of Germany."
what's your point exactly? West Francia is just a small part of what is France today, it's basically Alsace Loraine and some of Picardie and north.
>He's also the father of France.
He was a co-founder, modern day France was sort of founded earlier and their national identity also emerged slightly earlier.
Germans have no identity so they try to manufacture one by using revisionism
Well you can also say that Arminius was the father of Germany, Kaiser Otto can be given credit as well for seperating what is now Germany from the other Frankish realms as can Wilhelm I or Otto von Bismarck for creating the modern Germany.
Also the Medieval Frankish spoken by Charlemagne was probably more akin to modern Dutch than it is to Modern German
He wasn't Polish, dude. Your Slav people were vassal of Germany even then, by the way.
>modern Dutch
That is a peasant dialect and if anything, Rheinish Franconian is most similar to Hessian.
3 things
primo i didnt claim he was polish
secundo which slavs do you mean czechs who used your shit hre elections to rule your mess of a state or poles who since the formation of their country whipped your ass like the whores you are
terzo my country never in its history claimed another ones famous person as their own. I could mention atleast 5 diffrent people out the top of my head that GERMans tried to claim as their own
You really are delusional. dutch is not a dialect, And Karel de grote did not speak rheinish franconian, he spoke low franconian. Why would he speak a franconian dialect from a region he didn't grow up in?
>Why would he speak a franconian dialect from a region he didn't grow up in?
Charlemagne's exact birthplace is unknown, although historians have suggested Aachen in modern-day Germany, and Liège (Herstal) in present-day Belgium as possible locations.[19] Aachen and Liège are close to the region from whence the Merovingian and Carolingian families originated. Other cities have been suggested, including Düren, Gauting, Mürlenbach,[20] Quierzy and Prüm. No definitive evidence resolves the question. Charlemagne was the eldest child of Pepin the Short (714 – 24 September 768, reigned from 751) and his wife Bertrada of Laon (720 – 12 July 783), daughter of Caribert of Laon and Bertrada of Cologne.
>ui ui, Karl der Grosse didn't speak Rheinish Franconian, even though his mum was from Cologne!
Good post. Exclusive footage of his great-great-great-great-great-great grandchild. youtube.com
He and his family came from the Southern Netherlands/Belgium as did the Merovingians.
>>ui ui, Karl der Grosse didn't speak Rheinish Franconian, even though his mum was from Cologne!
So what, Anglo-Saxon princess Gytha of Wessex became the mother of 3 Russian princes of Kiev yet somehow I doubt they were fluent in Old English.
Charlemagne was clearly Australian. He was illiterate and accidentally killed his heir.
Sounds like Ivan the Terrible, you sure that Charlemagne isn't Slavic?
assuming you're correct somehow, and he actually spoke the dialect of aken, this would still fall in the old dutch language area. simply because it's part of modern germany doesn't make it german.
"Old Dutch is the term for the Old Franconian dialects that were spoken in the Low Countries, including present-day Belgium, the Netherlands, and WESTERN PARTS OF TODAY'S GERMANY, until about the 12th century when it evolved into Middle Dutch."
en.wikipedia.org
"In a modern linguistic context, the language of the early Franks is variously called "Old Frankish" or "Old Franconian" and refers to the language of the Franks prior to the advent of the High German consonant shift, which took place between 600 and 700 CE. After this consonant shift the Frankish dialect diverges, with the dialects which would become modern Dutch not undergoing the consonantal shift, while all others did so to varying degrees. As a result, the distinction between Old Dutch(low franconian) and Old Frankish is largely negligible."
en.wikipedia.org
charlemagne tried to genocide you
>yet somehow I doubt they were fluent in Old English.
Based on what source?
Where do you think germany (Allemagne) gets its name?
Aachen
Common sense would dictate that speaking English as a 11th century Russian noble would be essentially useless, especially since William the Conqueror just took all power from the Saxon nobles.
Point is culture goes downstream from the father, especially when women are excluced from the inheritance, so his mother's language would have very little effect on what his primary language would be meaning that his mother coming from Cologne doesn't matter in any way.
From the Alemanni Germans, retard. en.wikipedia.org
who disputes this?
pretty much all western europe sees him as the founding patriarch
I can’t
Trying to assign people any sort of nationality at that point in history is rather dumb.
>Core of Empire is in Belgium
>Capital is in Paris since Chlodwig/Clovis
>Franks became the French
>Spoke old Franconian, buried in Germany
>Founded dynasties in West-Francia, East-Francia, Lombardy, Lotharingia and Aquitania
I'd call that generally west-european, especially since he himself would look rather confused if you brought up concepts such as french and german, where he himself sorted people according to whether they were christians or pagans and whether they were part of his empire or not.
t. tout le monde peut être français c'est une question de papier
He DID acknowledge that people in the western half of the roman empire spoke Gallo-Romace and those in the eastern half spoke "Theodisce", but that was only relevant on an administrative level.
calm down everybody, he was a a Jew
calm down frogman. OP is slide who post intentionally ridiculous statement that automatically makes dummies respond.
Like throwing shit to flies. You just got caught
Karl der Grosse was a German though
Franks were (and are) Germans.
pure coincidence? I wonder how many times is this expression used.
Charlemagne was a rhenish jew anyway, like karl marx and all the others.
>Arminius was the father of Germany
Kinda but not really, he was more like the roman turning point, their stalingrad. It pretty much starts with him though
>Theodisce
Does this means "folkish" ?
>pretty much all western europe sees him as the founding patriarch
No that would be Odin way before this
western europe as we know didnt exist before charlemagne.
I guess we need to part north from west. Also during the reign of Odin the states were loose states not roman states. Here that first came after the romanizating through christening in the 1000ds, 1200ds for the swedes. Western states as we got today are all roman states. I do not think Odin went as far west as france either
France was founded and named after people of germanic extraction.
Franks were Germanic, not Germans. Germans is a more modern distinction while Germanics is a broader encompassing, and in this case more accurate, catergorization.
Well ye I know but I meant this more to make a point in how you can't just say any one person is the father of Germany seeing how it's a millenia-old entity with mulitiple iterations. Arminius was the first person in recorded history that led a united Germanic people though with the catch that he lost control pretty quickly and that he only controlled a small portion of Germanic tribes.
>all these butthurt french scum
AHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA
YOU CAN'T EVEN ACCEPT HISTORICAL FACTS
AHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHA
Why is someone like Charlemagne considered a great man because he did much to unify Europe, yet the people trying to unify the globe through globalization are considered bad?
I really do see him as the founder too
We call him sigurd here, sigurd fåvnesbane. Do you know what fåvne, the big snek really was?
What looks like a big snek? Moves like one, which he killed? This is called a kenning
you know goddamn well that's a valse equivalency.
Here is fåvnir, he killed him at teutoburger forest
When people read this stuff they always take it lit, there is no such thing as enormous sneks. Think the "glow worm" from the 13th warrior, they actually understood this thing kinda at least
>valse
>(((the people)))
>trying to unify the globe
oh, so that’s what (((they’re))) doing? you seem super knowledgeable- care to explain that premise to us?
He was a Frank. Not french or German. Germanic yes.
Well I mean Charlemagne didn't open his borders to uncontrolled amounts of Saracens and Moors. The argument you make basically means that unification between any 2 groups of people is basically the same as globalism.
Not only was Charlemagne German, YOU were also Germans.
idk but good point
Fucking rural and hegelian retards
He was a sub-saharan, people always try to white wash European history. He was a blackamoor.
He opened the borders to the Jews, and sold his Germanic brothers to Moorish slavery simply for fallowing a different faith.
>Jamal and Muhammad arguing over who was the original (((kraut)))
Franks were a germanic tribe. Germanics truly cucked all of Europe in those times.
Reminds me of this.
>polish flag
>the irony
> son of Pepin le bref, who's father was Charles Martel, frankish kings.
Anyway, as the franks where the dominant tribe in france belgium and west germany, he was french belgium and german you dumb kraut.
Uniting the white race is good. Bringing shitskins to Europe is bad.
>we wuz europe kangz
>meanwhile reformation,ww1, ww2, EU
w-we a-aren't working for freemasons or anything.
>muh hitler we based kangz pol we swear we gonna 1488 again. T-turks watch out we coming.
He was a born and raised in Arkelstorp, Sweden named Karl-Magnus or Karl-Mange for short
It's old high-german for "zum Volk gehörig", which I guess you could translate as "of the Volk", so "the language of the Volk/The Volk's language".
In English it's officially translated as "of the people/the people's language".
In the 4th century the bishop Wulfila already made a gothic translation of the Bible where he used the word "thiudisko" in place of Gentile, so the Goths would understand the distinction between Jew and Gentile as "Jew" and "someone of our Volk", meaning "someone who speaks our lanuage"; so Goths, Franks, Vandals, Langobards etc. already saw themselves as collectively being part of a common Volk on account of the common language, although this did not necessarily make them common allies. During the invasion of Atilla the Hun and the Battle on the Catalaunian Fields of 451 there were germanic tribes fighting on both sides.
Fuck Charlemagne, Pepin and the Pope. Lombards should have destroyed Rome
Maybe you have not noticed but most people who have got "the great" in their title are people who cracked a fuck-ton of skulls and conquered shit-load of territory.
Their contemporaries called them "the great" due to the awe they inspired at a time where the only really noteworthy thing you could do and the most sure-fire way to make it so people know who you are and remember you after you die is to be someone who killed so many people that a bunch of other people became willing to do as you told them to.
...and after they are gone people continue to call them "the great" because their deeds led to history taking the course it did and it generally is better to have a founding myth where the guy who started everything was a great visionary and not a warlord.
During the rise of german nationalism Charlemagne was antagonised btw., being cast as the first instance of the eternal Frenchman fucking around in Germany, starting off the eternal Franco-German rivalry/hereditary feud. At that time we cast the saxon king Widukind as the champion of the germans, eventhough his rebellion failed and the Saxons had to cuck out and become christians. The Thuringians also tried rebelling but were defeated.
Friendly reminder that the Franks ruled over whatever you would call the french but still spoke their germanic dialect of Frankionian at the time, only gradually assimilating and adopting the Gallo-Romance language of their subjects.
Karla magnus on the old tongue. I don't remember if it was one or two words though
germanic =/= german
The reason why I asked is because it sounded like it was derived from Þjóð which they still use on iceland, it means people you see. So that's also where the name for sweden comes from SviÞjóð lit swede-people, it's called Sverige today though lit the Sven empire.
Agan thiudisko, no it has to come from this. And yes Þjóð was also used by the goths. They also called their King Þjóðans. The language was very similar to that of ON and OS, like a 4th language from here. It's easy to understand when you read it if you already speak icelandic. One thing that is funny about it, this happens between related languages up here including german and english. Like how the anglos call their queen just a woman (kvinne/kvinna). This happens in gothic too, so in example when they write that two people are talking, they say they are tweeting. Kinda funny. How also danes say they are crying when they are laughing
Saved though very interesting indeed
Why are Frogs so intent of claiming Karl for themselves ,they even gave him that gay CHARLEMAGNE tittle thats even used in the anglosphere?
dont you have enough Folk-heroes?
Charles Martell , Napoleon?
He was of an Germanic Tribe.
deal with it.
its our guy
>Widukind
This guy probably shows up in some of our texts here, he appears to have a link to Sigurd Ring. I really have it on my tongue here, but I don't remember this saga by hand. I'll make sure to read it again
Just thinking loudly sorry, I wonder if this is the one about the two brothers that had to live in the forest and lit become werewolfs in the sagn. They put up wolf skins and did a lot of havoc as young
>tfw educating barbarian continentals
Karolvs Imperator Avgvstvs was literally a roman spy
Imbecile fool, he was a Frank. His empire was Frankish. Which means he was neither French, nor German. The separation of the Frankish empire that started with his three grandsons was the start that eventually lead to the formation of the nations you speak of. It is clear you have no education related to history.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Austro-Bavaria
based and correct opinion
But does he hail from Odin at all? They usually did, all of them
Don't L*RPagans hate the Chad Karl?
>tfw can trace ancestry back to Charlemagne
larpers do, the real ones only obsess with blood lines, 6 million times than jews. Judging people for things like that is unheard of and irrelevant, you judge them by their deeds and reckognize that. Even your enemies. See Atilla the hun aka Atli/Atle a common name today, which comes from him as Magnus comes from Karl, first intruded as the name of one our Kings and still a common royal name today, as in our next King Håkon Magnus.
They always either hailed from Odin or Njord. I don't remember the linage of the saxon and frankish kings, it's hard enough to remember ours
This means we apply our faith to everyone, all of you. Same rules applies to everyone. You don't go to no hell because you don't believe the same as us, that's christians, jews and mudshits that think like this, not we