I have just finished reading The Bell Curve. It has been used by white supremacist as an argument for their claims, but from my general impression and understanding of it, it actually debunks the white supremacist narrative.
My question is why is this book used for the white supremacist cause, and why is it criticized for being white supremacist propaganda?
It was co-authored by a literal Jew, the same Jew who gathered the results of Jews supposedly having higher IQ's. Very Jewy indeed.
>it actually debunks the white supremacist narrative
Would you care to lay out your arguments for this? No one can debate what you don't say.
Are you implying Jews can't be right about things solely by consequence of them being Jewish?
What about Byron Roth, who argues that even in spite of higher intelligence, Jews are occupationally institutionally overrepresented across America, and that most blacks and Hispanics shouldn't even be going to high school since it's a waste of resources?
youtube.com
Exactly, never trust a Jew.
This is a quote from the book.
“there is no convincing direct or indirect evidence in favor of a genetic
hypothesis of racial differences in IQ.”
He goes
on to make three arguments. First, the very concept of race is illegitimate,
given the extensiveness of interbreeding and the imprecise nature
of most of the traits that people think of as being “racial.” Second, the
division of races is recent, occurring only in the last tens or perhaps hundreds
of thousands of years, limiting the amount of time that groups of
humans could have taken separate evolutionary paths. Third, developments
in genetics demonstrate that the genetic differences among human
beings are minor.
But he makes points that virtually all of Jow Forums would agree with?
>there is no convincing direct or indirect evidence in favor of a genetic
>hypothesis of racial differences in IQ
Observe Africa. Now observe Europe.
Nuff said
>supremacist
That's a strawman, it implies a want to rule over other races and that our race is better*. The vast majority just want to be left alone. White nationalists would be more accurate.
*You could make a case that the white race is better at certain things. But it is certainly not better at everything, this goes for all races. For example if you value sprinting/running then blacks are clearly superior.
Does that correspond with the actual data presented?
I'm not claiming to agree or disagree with the author, but what boggles my mind is why is a book with quotes like this used by white supremacist for their cause, and why is it claimed to be a white supremacist propaganda. It makes no sense.
I will give you a video of the author Charles Murray prevented from making a speech at a "prestigious" university:
>no convincing direct or indirect evidence in favor of a genetic hypothesis of racial differences in IQ.
>IQ
has significant correlation with success and stronger link to likelihood of criminality over SES
>Successful mating tends to pair by IQ ( No divorce )
>those who dont divorce and have High IQ tend to have higher IQ children
due to parenting and empathy from ( GENERALLY ) being more intelligent, high IQ women tend to raise high IQ children.
single motherhood ( rising across all races ) is most noticeable among blacks, single mothers tend to have disproportionately lower IQ -> lower IQ children -> daughters more likely to be singlemothers
the affect is compounding.
its part of the reason why income inequality is so "bad" its because western culture is causing more retards to be born ( or develop into retards )
Parenting, and single motherhood is to explain mostly.
parenting style and single motherhood is perpetuated from black culture or maybe ((them))
but yes genetically because of how complicated the USA is its hard to tell but id say its definitely a strongish factor because for someone to adhere to a dumb culture they would need to be inherently dumb
sorry for the bad structure and rambling
I read it. I don't recall those passages. I think you are making it up. Post an image of the books pages with that quote.
>has significant correlation with success and stronger link to likelihood of criminality over SES
i meant to say that IQ has a stronger link to likelihood of criminality over SES not that IQ's link to criminality is stronger than its link to success.
Well we have data that backs up that idea now though, so peanuts.
The science is good, just take it with the normal grain of salt
You're reading the wrong books, friendo.
Read
I also recall the main import of the book. It explains how IQ affects SES and is becoming a major divide between lower income and higher income groups. fyi
That's what I was thinking
The rationale is that the test questions used are implicitly culturally biased, I believe it was, on select IQ tests represented by the bell curve distribution of intellect. Needless to say, the average fellow is an uncreative ecospherically and economically myopic inertial rider culturally as a lemming amongst lemming heading toward the edge day of destruction.
Anything that's not FUCK WHITE PEOPLE is raysis
The Bell Curve is a garbage old meme and so is IQ. You don't need a bunch of tests when you have the history of the world to show which races are better at civilization.
BUT WHITE NATIONALIST
They are basically saying that it is ok to have own country, identity, heritage.. Unless you are white!
And if you are against this, they call you white supremacist. When you google that, you get these pictures. You see?
>extensiveness of interbreeding and the imprecise nature
>of most of the traits that people think of as being “racial.”
yes because its in the USA,
my take is that there is a small genetic effect that has an amplifying effect because slightly lower IQ on average tends to do slightly stupider stuff
leading to stupider kids -> leading to stupider kids -> leading to stupider kids -> leading to stupider kids
not a fan of Peterson but what he says about IQ and that people in the bottom 10% literally have nothing to contribute in modern society is not to wrong
Because of the growing tendancy for those who do reproduce ending up with similar IQ's its a leading factor to inequality, and if whites Asians and jews have a head start over goblinos and blacks all we can do is grab them by the arm and hope they can keep up ( welfare state )
Jews only have high average iq cause all the dumb ones were Holocausted
>The Bell Curve is a garbage old meme and so is IQ.
Wanna know how I know you've got that room temp iq?
That 'implicitly culture bias' bullshit is always trotted out. Just MAYBE they've adjusted for that over the last 100 years.
the bell curve was a nuclear bomb simply because it acknowledged iq differences between the races, a lot of people struggle with this simple fact. claiming the iq differences are based in genes is the red pill on the next tier. baby steps.
That would require that the holocaust actually happen
Iq is not what I am saving
>The Bell Curve is a garbage old meme and so is IQ
because stormfaggots have the reading comprehension of 8 year-olds
it was the reason for it, what doesn't kill you makes you stronger, or shows that you had the brains to overcome it.
OK....
> Herrnstein and Murray propose that the cognitive elite has been produced by a more technological society which offers enough high skill jobs for those with a higher intelligence to fill. They also propose that by removing race, gender or class as criteria the main criteria of success in academic and professional life is becoming primarily based on cognitive ability.
End of this thread.
>cognitive ability.
>what is iq
The left just doesn't want to face the reality that races do differ and one of the differences, on the whole, include IQ. So they just want to End It.
>supremacists
>no pride month
Why can't you mongs leave them alone if you don't like them?
>>cognitive ability.
>>The Bell Curve is a garbage old meme and so is IQ
definitely room temp
Wrong graphic
The book is used by racialists as an argument for the differences between races and why it matters. Low intelligence is used to show that some groups are not compatible with the rest.
The problem here of course in using this argument is that there are races who have higher average intelligence. The white nationalist argument here is that these people basically take up a spot of their group. So low-IQ races are bad because they do not fit into society and high-IQ races are bad because they fit in too well. These two sets of arguments can only be used individually if you have a believe in race as an esoteric concept, otherwise using one will cancel out the other.
>inb4 b-but muh regression to the mean
that's not how regression works
>high-IQ races are bad because they fit in too well
That's not the argument at all. High IQ individuals do not necessarily have to engage in parasitic nepotism like Jews do. A successful bank robber does not "fit in too well" into a society. Despite his success, he remains a criminal and his actions cause harm to the society he lives in, which is reason enough to eject him from it.
I don't understand what your post even means in response to mine. What does bank robbers and criminals have to do with success in relation to the The Bell Curve other than it being negative in this context?
Those races with higher IQ like Asians have lower crime rates, lower amount of sexual relationship, better marriage rates etc These are the metrics that we define 'good' by.
Really don't understand your post, you felt it was necessary to tell a person that someone can be successful criminal and still be a bad person?
Jews do have higher than average IQs doesn’t change the evil things they do.
I'm challenging the assertion that white nationalism means that high IQ races fit in too well into white society. While lower than average intelligence correlates with undesirable activity, it does not mean that higher than average intelligence correlates with desirable activity. A race with a higher average IQ is not inherently more moral or desirable in a multiracial society.
Neither does it mean that IQ is the sole determinant of whether a person fits into society. Intelligence is entirely separate from morality.
They have a high average IQ because they pick smarter Jews to be in a "different race" of something that already isn't a race. It is a religion, they're are Semitics which is the same shit as Arabs.
We are the same, goys
Go back to sleep
>While lower than average intelligence correlates with undesirable activity, it does not mean that higher than average intelligence correlates with desirable activity.
Don't know how that works when we know the strong correlation between crime and IQ and productivity and IQ. These are for practical purposes the extent to which 'good' and 'bad' behavior in society can be quantified as they are mostly economic in nature.
>Neither does it mean that IQ is the sole determinant of whether a person fits into society.
Sure, but that is not what I am arguing here. I am saying that white nationalists will use The Bell Curve to show that black people do not fit into the nation due to their high crime/low productivity and since there are races who can be shown to perform better on these metrics, the argument then becomes that these people are 'stealing' the spot of a fellow group member. So all of the arguments against blacks etc follow the first argument and once someone points out that Asians outperform whites, the second argument is used.
There is a hypocrisy here if you are trying to argue on the factual basis of arguments, and this usage of both arguments to defend the same position just doesn't work unless you believe in race as some higher concept.
>thinking there's any meaningful difference
>implying someone with no cognitive ability would have a high IQ score
>potatonigger acting more intelligent than anyone
Your nation's entire history is getting shat all over by Anglos until they had enough mercy to let you be your own country.
Post the page numbers shill.
It's not about stealing spots dipshit. It's about being forced to live in proximity to an individual or group of individuals who destroy property, neglect their own property, lower the value of everything they touch, and shit on everyone they meet or interact with.
You have problems with reading comprehension.
Stefan got into a strange semi argument with this dude didn’t he? Because the author claims that people are born with their potential al personality and nothing can change it so long they have an “ok” upbringing.
He even hinted on his next research about being raised in a family. I wonder what it will be about.
IQ is not a "meme" but a psychometrically established fact.
>there is no convincing direct or indirect evidence in favor of a genetic
>hypothesis of racial differences in IQ.
Except for every standardized test given across the world. Literally all of the objective data.
>were Holocausted
>thinks the Holocaust was real
Because liberals (elites) want to distract from the actual argument of entrenching political and economic power in bubbles within cities by the coasts. Bell Curve predicted Trump but everyone was too stupid to see it. Liberals built their own gated communities, literally and figuratively, and were blind to the consequences.
Before we discuss the IQ differences between blacks and whites, let’s define heritability. Over the centuries, the average heights of both males and females has changed considerably. Both men and women have become taller. Yet, the heritability of height can still be similar between men and women. This is because heritability is a measure of what causes the average differences between groups or individuals at a given time, in a set environment. It’s like using a measuring tool or a snapshot to determine what is causing the current situation. Depending on the extent to which the environment differs between two groups, the environment may begin to explain more of the difference than genes.
We know from adoption studies that blacks and whites who are raised in similar environments have adult IQs (when IQ becomes most heritable) similar to what you would expect if the hereditarian hypothesis was correct. Moreover, mixed children who grow up in the aforementioned similar environments have intermediate adult IQs between that of blacks and whites. In fact, the more European admixture a black child has, the higher their IQ will tend to be when they reach adulthood. Another noteworthy argument for hereditarianism is that Black children who are born to the richest 20% of households have similar SAT scores - the SAT is essentially the same as an IQ test since a person’s SAT score correlates about as well with their performance on an IQ test (0.86 correlation between SAT score and IQ) as the same person’s IQ test scores correlate with one another (0.87 correlation between IQ scores from the same person) - to white children born to the poorest 20% of households in the US. Despite the vastly different environments, black and white children tend to perform in line with the hereditarian hypothesis. What may partly explain the phenomenon of blacks from richer families having worse SAT scores than whites from poorer families is something known as regression toward the mean.
All children, regardless of race, born to intelligent or even dumb parents tend to regress toward their population’s mean. Whites tend to regress toward the mean of 100 while blacks tend to regress toward the mean of 85, even if the black child is born to intelligent, relatively wealthy parents. This, in part, helps to bolster the hereditarian argument since regression toward the mean is in part a result of genetic effects (additive vs non-additive genetics).
Thus far, I have avoided discussing the impossibility of absolute equality. First of all, we know that many of the alleles that are correlated with higher IQ between people in general are not equally distributed between the races. Furthermore, there are a myriad of phenotypic differences on average between the races, pic related. Similarly, we know there exists average differences in brain size (MRI testing) between the races and that brain size and IQ are correlated at 0.4 when normalizing for gender - the gender difference in average brain size has a special relationship with IQ that I won’t go into here. Some studies suggest that there are also average differences in brain composition between the races. Worldwide, we see the same racial trends in IQ that are present in the US, even in places that did not have slavery or segregation. Knowing all this, why should we assume that all differences in IQ test scores on average between races are attributable to differences in environment?
When we look at the performance of blacks and whites on specific IQ subtests, we find that the subtests that are more heritable and the subtests that are more g-related (the general intelligence factor) are the subtests that blacks perform worse on. This is quite difficult to explain by just appealing to environmental reasons for the black-white IQ gap. In order to explain this, egalitarians will likely need to come up with something that is ad-hoc, contrived, and possibly untestable. Considering the evidence that has already been presented, it’s preferable to invoke Occam’s Razor and to realize that at least some of the black-white gap is probably caused by genetics.
Because none of them actually read it
Forgot pic
The top 15 million whites have a higher IQ than the 15 million jews.
This is the right answer. The Bell Curve was written in 1994. We've had an entire generation's work on testing nurture versus nature. The results overwhelmingly point to a predominantly genetic component in IQ.
OP's not wrong though. Quoting The Bell Curve pre-2010 was strictly the realm of white supremacists because the supporting evidence wasn't there. Now though, it IS there.
That's why the Left is in such hysterical state.
>why is this book used for the white supremacist cause
Because niggers don't read.
Jow Forums is literally the worst, most ignorant group for discussing the bell curve. They LOVE how it describes "most whites are more intelligent than most blacks" but they lose their shit and lash out like shrieking liberals when they same data forces them to admit a minority of blacks are more intelligent and capable than them.
>30% of negroids are smarter than 70% of caucasoids
>let's celebrate
go back to making hentai
Jow Forumstards are retards so every thread about simple things turns into a convoluted mess. Here’s a quick rundown so you can leave this thread more informed than you entered:
>most of The Bell Curve didn’t focus on racial differences in IQ, that was only one chapter
>it only compares blacks, whites, and East Asians
>the authors stated they could not say what proportion of the difference between the IQ’s of these groups were due to genetics or environment
>the book was written in the early 90s so that was their view given the evidence at the time
Don’t you know that the top 1/5th of blacks outperform the bottom 1/2 of whites? Like come on Jow Forums. Get on my level.
Look how triggered you got over a simple statement of fact. You immediately thought I was talking about you because you knew you're one of the ones who acts so irrational.
A minority of blacks are more intelligent than the majority of whites, but a majority of whites are more intelligent than the majority of blacks. No one is arguing this fact, and attempting to imply I'm not aware of the way your statement can be seemingly interpreted as a positive by those less educated in the facts but in fact makes a negative claim about black intelligence in relation to white suggests you are also unwilling to address the accusation.
To break things down for you, here's how the scenario usually plays out:
>Jow Forums sees a black man who is DEMONSTRABLY more intelligent and successful than them, or a competing white figure
>"he has to be stupid because he's black, the bell curve says all blacks are dumber than whites!"
>ignores the fact the existence of black geniuses, in a non-zero and, though smaller than whites, not-insignificant amount, is statistically guaranteed by the exact bell curve they think justifies their dismissal
get out, reddit spacing, meme flag kike filth
I've read it and the reason it's used is because of the data, not the way the authors, especially Murray, hems and haws about their findings in an attempt to save their careers by tempering said data with less committal conclusions.
Here is a normative distribution and its break down by standard deviation. Remember that every standard deviation represents 15 IQ points. 2.2% of whites and 0.1% of blacks have an IQ that exceeds 130. This means that, if the populations sizes were the same - which is obviously not the case in most western nations - there would be 22x more whites than blacks with an IQ over 130. Considering that there are 4.5 times more whites than blacks in the US, there is effectively 100 times more whites than blacks in the US with an IQ over 130. And because of affirmative action efforts, blacks who make it into prestigious positions in society often aren’t as intelligent as their white counterparts, which in turn means that if a black person and a white person with the same or similar credentials were to debate, the white person would still likely have a higher IQ. Ultimately, all this means that there are many more whites with IQs over 130 in the US (the US is where many of these debates are had) than there are blacks and that if two seemingly intelligent randos were debating, the white person would likely still have a higher IQ than the black person.