When did the optimism of the 90's die out?

There's a cultural and a geopolitical answer.

Geopolitically, it's literally because of 9/11. In the 90s, people had the sense that large scale terrorism would never reach the US, and that Democracy was moving unstoppably forward. 9/11 changed all that, and literally reshaped international politics, because anti-terrorism and wars in the Middle East became central focuses. Domestically, people also started feeling way less safe after the Columbine shooting. Because of those two things, people stopped feeling so secure.

Culturally, the 90s were actually a pessimistic, dark reaction to the optimism of the 80s. The 80s was all about feeling like you were living in the future. The 90s called bullshit on the vacuous consumerism of hair metal and new wave, so really angry underground movements morphed into marketably miserable genres like grunge, industrial rock, gangsta rap, thrash metal, and britpop.

> t. 29 year old music geek with a degree in international relations

Destroyed by the multiculturalist anti-European project

how do they measure that

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I grew up in the 90's and we were an extremely degenerate generation. We did a lot of drugs, drank, had lots of sex and thought we were cool. About half of my graduating class is dead from overdoses. There was no optimism.

That was the 80's you dumb fuck.

It was 300 BC you dumb fuck

In the 20's

When that tower thing happened

>lying on the internet

Now Let me guess, your dad works at Nintendo right ?

Hope died with the great recession. Perhaps it should have died before that as the economy was operating under false pretenses for quite some time, but the Great Recession proved to be the nail in the coffin. And we are far from recovery. Too much collateral damage that has yet to be repaired and which likely will not be before another recession brings down the current economic bubbles.

did you not read the filename

Its in the filename. Its Nasdaq stock market.
Futhermore,There was a tech bubble and the 9/11 happened, and never recovered until 2008 happened. Plus two wars and a subversive US president against the west from 08-16. Plus the splintering of how people get their news from different sources, ect.

No. My dad is a computer programmer. But that's neither here nor there.

I'm not lying. Don't be a prick.

Internet, in 90's you didn't know what was happening in city next to yours and were largely at peace, today you're daily bombarded with reminders that you're schlomo's slave and one slip can get you demonized.

oh I thought that was optimism they were measuing

i still remember what that shit taste like.
i got the white one first

>When did the optimism of the 90's die out?
Dot com crash, 9/11.

What?

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nobody here will ever know that feel of calling that one huge mail-order music conglomerate over the phone, and listening to all the free music samples.

this fucking one company had over a million songs on some kind of ancient telephone database

2001 (China entering WTO, immigration, open borders, 9/11) signaled the collapse of the west

Because Bush, Bill Clinton and the Republican Congress let China enter the WTO in 2000.
18 years later and the US has lost over 700,000 factories.

In real terms (not currency adjusted, but rather the real amount of goods and services produced), China's economy is 25% larger than the US.
As just one metric, Chinese buy 27 million cars and trucks in a year. Americans buy 17 million.

NAFTA and WTO are explicit policies of wealth transfer and cultural transformation.

i.imgur.com/LajOnjk_d.jpg?maxwidth=640

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youtube.com/playlist?list=PLFDX06QHWaKyPZ-JFeAh0jpRYJIqB2ZHi

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those drinks were fucking disgusting.

WTF? Are you 15? There was never any fucking optimism in the ‘90s. Exactly the fucking opposite.

Bush-Clinton-Obama were happy to sell out to the Chinese.

Well, at least the Clintons, the MIC and their bankers should be happy that they got the ball rolling with the financing, manufacturing and technology transfers starting in the early 1990’s

We're in the endgame of financialization and globalization, and it won't be pretty for all
Our system is totally dependent on soaring speculative bubbles

Once that bubble popped in 2001, the Fed and other central banks panicked. Their response--lowering interest rates, unleashing unlimited credit/liquidity, etc.-- inflated a monumental bubble that was further boosted by China's admission into the WTO and the full financialization / globalization of the U.S. economy.

When this bubble predictably popped, the central banks really panicked. If we strip away the hype and propaganda, we are left with a troubling reality: there is no engine of "growth" other than speculative bubbles based on cheap credit and soaring corporate profits.

as a result of globalism (NAFTA, transferring industry to China, mass migration, h1bs, open borders, free trade) the US economy has been in a depression for the last 20 years, creating the opioid and suicide epidemics. Median wage gains have been stagnant for decades. The U.S. labour force participation rate remains at multi-decade lows. Even our own light-hearted Big Mac deflator suggests that the U.S. economy is in a depression.

There, too, by a variety of measures—ranging from petroleum consumption to consumer goods production to the Cass Freight Index—the U.S. economy appears to have not grown much, if at all, since the turn of the millennium.

i.imgur.com/tBVWH8ag.png

archive.is/uBz4A

youtu.be/1si_u3l7Eno

> No optimism in the 90s
> Czech

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>america sends industry, wealth, jobs to asia
>no domestic jobs
>recession 9.0
>rust belt happens
>hyperinflation rising cost of food, oil, products, houses
>businesses import 3rd world slavelabor to offset rising cost
>cost of housing, oil, food surges even more
>homeless, suicide, opioid epidemic

>free trade, open borders goes full swing
>transfer jobs/industries/wealth overseas
>no domestic jobs results in depressed economy
>govt and financial institutions provide a "bail out" in the form of low interest rates and lax subprime regulations
>depressed domestic economy propped up by a housing bubble
>lack of opportunities (due to free trade) forces entire country to exploit and speculate housing market thanks "free money"
>bubble burst
>great recession
>bubble reinflates with "free money" Quantitative Easing to recover from previous bubble caused by Free Trade and Open borders

free trade and open borders DOOMED the west

>before 2000, no housing problem
>globalists push for "housing for everyone"
>import millions of locusts from asia/mexico
>hyperinflated housing bubble happens
>housing now a problem
>homeless epidemic
>millions of native homeless die from opioid epidemic

it seems like the globalists preemptively planned and pushed for "housing for everyone" in advance of open borders.
it was a stealth plan to house every locust invader while millions of natives go homeless
there was never a housing problem in the US before their NWO globalism

I would just like to mention how an identical thing happened in UK, which I'm sure is a pure coincidence, except instead of Asians/Mexicans we got sandpeople and niggers.

everybody listen to this right now

Optimism died with the Dot Com Bust.

9/11 was a landmark, but that was it. It didn't really change the prospect of making it in America. It was the end of the boom, really. In 2003 either you had made it or you hadn't. 2003-2007 were particularly dark years that really ended what America used to be about.

Then in 2007 the Great Recession bankrupted a lot of the newly rich. They were suddenly exposed to the reality of the New United States, but many had high hopes of making it back again until they were confronted by the reality of King Nigger. You all remember how that went.

when every last orbitz floatie descended to the bottom of the bottle, that is when it happened.

Relative decline in power of the US.
Multiple economic disasters.
New media and old media are engaged in a culture war which has made it more obvious than ever that the US is run by oligarchs and less by democracy.

In Ireland our living standards have never been better and they are increasing. Which makes everything seem great even if our living standards are only like an average US state.

>mandy

Is this leaf for molly or am I not the degenerate I think I am?

1) Bush Sr and Clinton design free Trade Treaty’s w/ China and Mexico to flood USA w/ cheap goods sold at China owned Wal*Marts etc.

2) USA industry & biz suffer, can’t sell their goods. Lay off US workers, who unemployed can’t afford stuff, start paying w/ debt cards from banks owned by Corp giants and Chinese.

3) Local US mom & pop Main Street shops can’t compete w/ Chinese owned Wal*Mart types. Close doors. US Towns and cities become ghost towns. Illegal SUNKtuary gangs (protected by US Mayors) move in with drug wars.

4) Bush/ Clinton/ Obama admins increase govt biz restrictions to protect “climate change”. Giant Corporations can’t compete with cheap foreign goods and move to China, Mexico, Thailand etc. Bush / Clinton/ Obama and buddies then “invest” in overseas Chinese etc Giant Corp and get richer.

5) US middle class whose major asset was their house are encouraged by banks to take out “Home Equity” loans or buy houses they can’t afford. Then lose their good jobs due to Bush/ Clinton policies. 2008 crash. Middle class pop then unemployed and lose only major asset, their home.

6) Obama given prez job. Obama writes Billion$ dollar$ checks to print free money to Big Banks that US taxpayer must pay back. Scam called “QE”. Obama repeats trick 4 times. Now US hopelessly in debt. Unemployment high.

7) US middle class elects Trump as prez. Trump begins to reverse Bush/ Clinton / Obama scam of #1 thru #6. US media con-trolled by British Reuters warns that reversing 1 to 6 will destroy USA.

That soft cuck is the reason KSČM still exists.

When the .com bubble popped. 4/00. You could say something about 9/11/01 too, I suppose.

It would have never happened. The fluids were perfect.

>but many had high hopes of making it back again until they were confronted by the reality of King Nigger. You all remember how that went.
i don't know why this got me but it did

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I remember back in the 90s, I said to myself, take a snapshot in your mind right now. As much as this sucks, people will look back on this as being the good old days because things will get worse.

Well, here we fucking are.

>send industries/wealth to asia
>economy collapses every 5 years (planned by globalists)
>massive layoffs every 5 years
>import millions of shitskins to replace those natives layed off
>impoverished natives get health issues
>get bankrupt by medical bills
>go homeless
>get on chink heroin
>overdose
white genocide was never as easy as this

meanwhile trafficked poojeets/chinks are now the highest stolen income earners from the whites that perished under the globalist white genocide scheme

youtu.be/dzEJxUXexGU

When the money got tight.

I still remember the sunlit huwheat fields of my youth and my shitty first job at OfficeMax.

Don't kid yourself. Trump is every bit the corporatist Obama, Bush, and Clinton were. He's just a mouth piece for Pence, Gorsuch, etc.

Yes, outsourcing destroyed a number of industries. Starting a trade war with China isn't going to undo that.

The housing crisis was a symptom of the failures of our corporate system. Every establishment Republican and Democrat was given their career by corporations, so they support them. Old School Libertarians have been pushed out of prominence by corporate-sponsored pseudo-Republican corporatists. The far left (Sanders, Ocasio-Cortez) is anti-corporate, but they support wasteful, impractical "solutions" that would sink us in debt; they only got this far because the establishment thought no one would fall for those positions. The "alt right" is such a working class populist movement that its members literally don't understand the nuances of economic policy, so they're useful idiots to corporate power.

If anyone is in power who could fix things, I don't know them. They'd probably be doomed to fail without corporate support of the establishment or populist support of the far left and right.

When the hell are these coming back?

The US under Trump is attempting to reign in the abuse by other nations. These so-called globalists only practice this bullshit when their trading partner's security is on the line. (See any EU nation, China, Canada or Mexico's tariffs on US goods prior to any steel or alluminum tariffs)

Once the US imposed tariffs on steel and aluminum for national security reasons, several nations retaliated. Which the US has left unchecked, and for good reason. The US will likely not respond to EU, Canada, and Mexico by imposing further tariffs, but by filing a grievance in the WTO and further diminishing said countries credibility on trade matters, as they did not challenge the US assertion that steel and aluminum are national security interests of the US via the WTO as required by law; they just retaliated. It was a very rookie mistake by those nations.

China, on the other hand, has ineffectively responded to US concerns in the WTO regarding IP theft, and other matters.

The end game is to effectively leave the WTO and negotiate with countries separately, and on a case-by-case basis. Shoring up these nations will effectively lead to less barriers for US entry into other markets, while also protecting our own.

See pic related, it basically shows the decline of US output. However, it can be misleading as it does not account for the US services industry, which we dominate. The domination by the US is due to ingenuity meeting opportunity, not because we're treating our so-called allies like shit.

Trump is a dipshit imo, and I did not vote for him, but this is some clever shit. Couple this with shutting down the immigration bullshit in the US, we'll have rising wages coinciding with increased output.

What most people don't realize, is the US is the global economy. We consume their rubbish, we don't need to sell them a fucking thing. We were just suckered into lower prices of goods while sending the American Dream down the toilet.

from January 2000 to July 2006, starting with Bush NWO leader's Housing Bubble, home prices surged 900%

Avg price of house around 1998 before globalisation and free-trade went full swing
>$180k in NYC (boros)
>$190k in Bay Area
>$150k in LA
>$120k in DC
>$140k in Sydney
>$120k in Melbourne
>$140k in Toronto
>$190k in Vancouver
>£70k in London

Avg price of house after 2004 massive free-trade/open-borders
>$800k in NYC (boros)
>$1m in Bay Area
>$600k in LA
>$500k in DC
>$900k in Sydney
>$700k in Melbourne
>$600k in Toronto
>$1m in Vancouver
>£400k in London
---------------------------------------------------------
before free trade:
>domestic production of goods
>goods were affordable and of high quality
>lowest cost of living
>affordable housing (house costs only 2 times the annual salary)
>90% white

after free trade:
>homeless/opiod/suicide epidemic/white genocide
>unemployment
>highest cost of living
>unaffordable housing (10-20 times the annual salary)
>plummeting life expectance
>shit quality products that kill you
>millions of illegal shitskin locusts invading and killing whites

When I was a kid I remember reading an indy e-zine with a short story about a highly addictive drug that was a Chinese chemical weapon. The dead skin of people who used it concentrated the drug and then fell off, the dust was everywhere and so everyone was addicted. I don't remember what it was titled or the name of the zine.

09/11/2001

I am really interested in this Navarro and his book now

Bottom line is that all countries including and especially the US should run a net balance of payments which in this context means China sells no more to the US than it purchases and China could solve this problem immediately simply by observing this sound business principle.

No matter what any hack academic or paid China flack says there in nothing extreme in the slightest about such a policy of balance of payments.

If MN Gordon addressed himself to the government of China in such a fashion accusing China of an extremist policy of predatory mercantilism he would be very sorry.

China has had a GREAT ride on the World for 15 or more years but now the ride is over.

Crippled America’ book - 2015
“There are people who wish I wouldn’t refer to China as our enemy. But that’s exactly what they are. They have destroyed entire industries by utilizing low-wage workers, cost us tens of thousands of jobs, spied on our businesses, stolen our technology, and have manipulated and devalued their currency, which makes importing our goods more expensive – and sometimes, impossible.”

China violates fair trade by "illegal export subsidies and currency manipulation, effectively flooding the U.S. markets" and unfairly making it "virtually impossible" for US companies to compete. Currency manipulation and subsidies are stated as reasons that "American companies cannot compete because they’re not competing with Chinese companies, they’re competing with the Chinese government

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_by_China

forced tech transfer “Basically, if you’re an US company and you want to produce and sell into the Chinese market on Chinese soil, the condition of access to the market is that you’ve got to turn over your tech

9/11

When we SINK THE CHINKS and POOS

WW2 Victory Conditions: Unconditional Surrender

China Trade Victory Conditions: End all Trade with China

No matter what the deal is, they will Cheat and the Quislings in the US Congress will go back to business as usual the day Trump leaves office.

We need to immediately stop trading with the enemies and start quarantining them

Daily reminder that China is the BIGGEST NARCO STATE on the planet. The Chink drug cartel is BIGGER than mexican, afghan, and south american drug cartels COMBINED.
China is the SOURCE of heroin, fent, meth, mdma and precursors of cocaine. The dirty money from illicit drug trade is laundered into acquiring western businesses, corporations, properties, and is responsible for creating housing bubbles throughout the West.

Chinks turned mexico into a narco state during 2000s, coinciding with china entering WTO.

deal with the chink/mestizo/shitskin problem and you solve the drug, housing, white genocide and economic crisis.

brookings.edu/wp-content/uploads/2016/06/02_drug_trafficking_zhang_paper.pdf

bloomberg.com/news/features/2018-05-22/deadly-chinese-fentanyl-is-creating-a-new-era-of-drug-kingpins

m.theepochtimes.com/china-is-supplying-a-drug-war-against-the-united-states_1915904.html

>China as world's largest Fent, Opium and Heroin producer, that dump there products on Capitalist market.
scmp.com/news/asia/southeast-asia/article/1996146/china-lair-major-drug-lords-says-philippines-duterte

the-china-drug-connection/
archive.is/J0kQE

youtube.com/watch?v=8oekSnRNvOo

breitbart.com/radio/2018/06/20/exclusive-peter-navarro-china-underestimated-trumps-resolve-to-win-the-battle-for-our-high-tech-future/

9/11
At that point government stepped up interference with everyday life from privacy to exporting jobs to third world countries. Inflation and unemployment started to really affect lower and middle class people.

When pessimism became the mainstream culture.
Optimism is the new Punk Rock.

Pessimism grew and became a counter culture in a similar way Marxism did, Marxism was throoughly critical on Capitalism, but when asked to share how to fix it, offers a radical, non functioning utopia, in an "All or Nothing" matter. Either there's nothing to criticize and it's perfect, or it gets shit on.

Think of comedians. Think of the "Angry, straight talking" comedians. You know the ones. The George Carlin types. Their whole thing was pessimism, to criticize and berate. "I'm smart because I tell it straight, everything is bad. You should think it's bad too, or you're bad." and while we don't expcet comedians to go on stage and take two hours detailing a system that is less exploitative and functions more efficiently, the people they make laugh only pick up the jokes and not the discussion, they repeat the pessimistic attitude and the punchline is "Fuck that shit, it's all bad."

So you have this counter culture, the pessimistic view, in contrast with the "Full House" culture in media, you had these sappy nothing wrong shows, and then you had the gritty "Real talk" that felt almost taboo, the counter culture. The Simpsons got a similar start, but remained optimistic and hopeful. It was to counter the rosy view in media of the middle class life, but it still had the moral "But you can make it better.", Homer gave up his dream with the bowling alley, but found joy in Maggie. He works a job he doesn't like, but he has a family. He might choke Bart, but he's his boy.
Now compare that to Mainstream pessimism, now the Simpsons is mostly ill intentions, Family Guy's punchline is usually cruel. Pessimism is just the norm, too many people jumped on the train and it's no longer counter culture.

That's why we went from "I can't wait to see what the future holds, look at all this great tech, the internet is awesome!" to "I CAN'T DEAL WITH THIS SHIT, I NEED MY 9 DOLLAR DRINKS" 1/2

9/11/2001 - When the Jewish cold war on the western world went hot.

Watch the Matrix and you'll realize the optimism was already boiled up in the underground cool kids clubs

It's also a great alludement to how the internet would shape everyone's view of the world

when the Y2K apocalypse didn't take place.

at that moment i lost all hope for the end of civilization.

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ignore the haters. you made a good and concise post.

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When the loss of religion happened.

Born in 80. Donno about anyone else but pre 911 was totally different. Society definitely shifted and not in a good way.

The '90s were a decade of optimism (well starting from about '96-'97 anyway), but not optimism about the future itself, more about the immediate future, the new age, the Millennium. We were leaving the stone age of 1XXX behind and moving into the new unknown, the star trek of 2XXX. That's all the optimism was about and nothing more.

In 2007-8

The early 2000s were weird and uncomfortable.

Dude, TOTSE (Temple of the Screaming Electron) leaked man in the middle intercept of most of the US internet traffic in like 1998. That shit was in motion prior. 9/11 was just a false flag pearl harbor that was predicted to nearly the day while naming bin laden and the targets.

>90s
>thrash

Literally retarded.

These. The 90's were dismal and depressing as shit. As if you could tell there was something dying and you were right in the middle of it. I hated it. 2000's were nice by comparison. But the 90's were just pure despair. The music even reflected it.

Born in 82. Best years were the 80s through the mid to late 90's. Everything went to shit around 9/11 and it really showed. I'm starting to see some of that 80's optimism come back since Trump took office though. Feels good man.

I disagree. The counter culture was depression and despair. The fact is the vast majority of the country was full blown optimism since the collapse of the Soviet Union and the stock market bubble.

T

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lmao are you from fucking havirov or something? the 90s were utopic

And so pessismism was "Funny", it was the, at the time, taboo. People were attracted ot it because in the optimistic society they may have been burned, so they found something in common with others who were pessimists because it felt like they were the only ones actually listening to the problems.

Though, that grew, and grew, and everyone was getting in on "I too know pain", until it became what it is now, "I know pain more than you", oppression olympics, and nwo we're in this pessimistic state where it's ONLY about the flaws and pain, no one is willing to build and grow, or to fix these problems, because if the problems disappear, what is there to be a pessimist about?

Now, even when we fix problems and grow closer to equality, the complaint is "We didn't have this in the first place, so it's still bad."

So now we have optimism as a counter culture, it rebels against the system of "I hurt more than you" with "I can help more than you." and is constructive, building something great. While it seems dark, we have the tools to make it better, optimism will become mainstream again.

thought these were dragon dildos
but still it gives me an idea for new dragon dildos

90's was all about apathy. Doesn't anybody realize that was the era of grunge music? Most of thise artists either overdosed or killed themselves.

It's fucking weird that 9/11 was as far from the collapse of communism as today is from Lady Gaga.

This is true.

The 90's was the end of the crack epidemic that swept most of the nation in the 80's and the start of meths. The music went from mostly upbeat pop to nihilistic grung and gangster rap.
The average income for a family actually went down during am economic upturn (the first time in American history), and to top it all off we ended up with a president that literally couldn't stop raping everything equipped with a vagina in a 10 block radius.
Then to top it all off all of the laws and regulations that were appealed during the 90's directly lead to the recession of 2008-09.

The only people optimistic about the 90's were either high on smack or greedy Jews making a profit.

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How do we bring back optimism without being cringey and gay? I think these traditional art movements are great because they focus on creations that are born of great inspiration and are themselves inspiring.
This particular fashwave video for Take Back Our Future is quite brilliant in that it takes that sort of pessimistic sound which vaporwave is noted for and and couples it with the will to acknowledge the world around you and make a change for the better. Some may get lost in details such as national socialism or naming the Jew, but the overall message is the portrayal of an ideal to be strived toward.
The most important thing you touched on is how much art is intertwined with culture. That there can be an underlying sentiment that spreads and forms the foundation of many actions which follow.
youtu.be/TJrGOmlE3RQ

When Curt Cobain died.

exactly here

90's were all about apathy and pushing the gay agenda which has opened the door for today's normalization of pedophilia and gender dysphoria.

Politically - 9/11. I know it's cliche to say 9/11 changed everything, but it really did. The US spent most of the 90s on top. We beat communism, our only major war got wrapped up in a couple weeks with only 150 US casualties, we were basically seeing ourselves as the unstoppable good guys. 9/11 made us feel vulnerable, and it started us on a long chain of tragic losses and embarrassing defeats.

Culturally - The internet going mainstream and the rise of social media quickly eroded away the bulk of normal social interaction between younger Americans.

Optimism is the new punk rock. Make it cool and enticing, connect with people who hurt from pessimism. When you get someone depressed, suicidal, angry at society, or otherwise hurt, instead of continuing the cycle and telling them to make a fist, offer something better, a noble cause to get better.
Gen Z seems to be doing that, they're more economically minded, and I can tell you, they hurt enough to listen to optimism for a change.

While you could call vaporwave/synthwave pessimistic, I think it's an underlying desire to return to optimism, it inspires nostalgia, while many might take it to mean "The good times are gone, all we have now are the ashes of optimism" with it's sounds of distortion from dated media recording it, it also acts as embers, what was once fire has died down, but from these embers, the memory that we can be better, we can grow.

t. 36 year old boomer today

> i had sex

man this board would be a lot more productive without all these desperate LARPers

haha i remember being like 10 or whatever and asking my mom to buy me one and she acted like it was the most disgusting/terrifying thing she'd ever seen

9/11

when obisis got "elected"

>tfw getting my first NES in 95
>tfw getting my first 200MHz, 16MB RAM computer and playing preinstalled Duke Nukem 3D and Motoracer for the first time
>tfw spending my time outside from sunrise to dawn because it was not that shitty
>no smartphones or mobile phones in general
>tfw IT'S ALL GONE NOW FOREVER

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