Are Video Games Degeneracy?

Well, I think attributing those constructive positives to them is at least understandable. They are different from movies and TV because they're interactive. Like physical games (sports) or traditional games (table top), they can be intellectually stimulating due to the rules and goals at play and can help socialize kids and teach them their limitations in a stress-free environment. They aren't often treated that way though, and then parents let their kids sink tons of hours every day into shitty games that aren't conducive of anything helpful at all. Think of all the kids who grew up playing MMOs. That's a whole lot of time wasted during a very important phase in your personal development because those games definitely don't do anyone a service and don't actually socialize you at all.

Like I said in a thread a few weeks ago, I've been thinking about living vidya when I reach 20, I decided this after realising I had 1.3k hours in TF2, that's plenty of time I could have spent doing smth productive.
Now I'm playing some retro games I never had the chance to play, I do it as a way of saying goodbye to what used to be my passion.
Btw, what games do you play, faggot?

Yes this is probably a prime example of what I was imagining. MMOs are maybe the least productive, whereas I got a shit tonne out of KOTOR and KOTOR2. They had me thinking and questioning my moral choices throughout, and to this day I don't know what Id do i a similar situation.

Good response user, cheers.

This is exactly where I am at.

I am doing retro at the minute, well regarded titles I missed out on. Currently Deus Ex.

I like fantasy RPGs mostly though. Skyrim, Witcher and shit. (The Witcher 3 is the best game ever inho expect maybe Dark Souls)

When should a young man “not have anything to do!?” Rest and play is critical; video games help the brain check out but do not provide relief beyond the anesthesia.
t. RPG/JRPG addict

I'm playing short games that as soon as you finish them, it's done. Currently Resident Evil 3.
Also I'll add that I can't believe young adults use the "muh they gib me skillz" argument to justify their addiction. I grew up playing videogames, chances are you too, and I think we both agree that the whole "eye coordination, reflexes, etc " is pure BS and when it's not, it's usually a miniscule difference from someone who doesn't play.

if youre n addict, do you really think you provide a strong case for the benefit of video games?

Yes, video games is the worst of the non-drug hobbies.

care to elaborate. would love to hear your reasoning or arguments.

They're highly addictive and don't provide you with any real-world marketable skills. You said you can't stop playing them, I'm sure you also play them for several hours a day. I played video games from 5y/o to 21 every single day. Since I stopped my life has gotten better in every way.

Skinner boxes for feeble minds. (speaking of which, is monster hunter online any good on pc?)

Games are a better way to spend your money than any other media imo. 60$ for 16 hours of entertainment at the least. On your take about the time consuming, not really. If young men aren't playing Vidya, they could watch movies, read books, gamble,etc. However it is true they are designed to give as much hours of product as possible (especially online centered games).

No idea about MH, I never played a title for it.

Why do you say that about the skinner box? Not all games are repetitive reward loops, some are moral or thought provoking titles about politics and ideas, like KOTOR. Or would you disagree?

I mean gambling in casinos is worse

Interesting. DESU I don't play more than 5-10 hours per week, usually just on Saturday for the afternoon. I am picky about titles too and only want good narratives like Deus Ex or KOTOR as I think they are more grown up and thought provoking. I limit myself and am not an addict, but I wonder if that is still too much.

Did you play mindless stuff like CoD or WoW?

Is that the measure of worth though? Surelya chessboard is even better and you could argue booze is more cost effective if it is high quality or the 60$ is used to sharewith friends over several evenings. Is there anything about the medium itself that is inherently worth something?

>any real-world marketable skills
World isn't a competition.

Dont know why my last message says DESU, must be auto correct. Want to share your story for us, sounds like you had quite a transformation.

Jow Forums sustitutes "t b h" with "desu"

Entertainment

Videogames were great until they weren't. Now they are largely a eugenics program. 99% of gamers hold their wireless controller within 12 inches of their gonads for several-to-many hours a week. And people wonder why sperm counts, female fertility and cancer rates (testicular, ovarian, prostate, the list goes on) are skyrocketing. My sister's husband is a lifelong gamer (~30 years old) and he was just diagnosed with cancer in the bones of his wrist. Blue LCD light progressively blinds you and disrupts your circadian rhythm which comes with literally countless health consequences.

Your picrelated is a lightning-strike-tier rarity of intellectual substance in vidya game. There are very, very few games that are even worth the time investment for adults. Best bet is to transition to paper literature as your choice of recreation if you are serious about your health, wellbeing, and being the best person you can be.

I say this as a person who had been gaming since before I could read more than 20 years ago and who is slowly losing interest in the medium outside of the extremely rare must-play games

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Ah right

Well the skills gainz are seen mostly in the elderly, but this might be something to do with diminishing skills and any effort to save them has dramatic effects.

I am no neuroscientist, but I am more inclined to say there are more serious benefits, like narratives that offer you something. Some Telltale stuff is well written and as good as many wellregarded books. As are some other IPs out there right now.

>being this new

>lightning strike tier rairity of intellectual substance

This might be the realest shit anyone has said to me on Jow Forums (i know, not a high bar, but still).

I didn't think about it that way. I try to be picky with titles and am hitting a few classics I missed in chilhood like pic related (the original that is), KOTOR I and II, Morrowind, System Shock.

I really love good narrative and moral challenges like Witcher and KOTOR respectively.

But you are right, they are really like unicorns in the medium, too much mindless CoD and crash bandicoot around.

not much to offer the thread so far by your 2 posts eh?

Wanna touch on the topic at all?

Touching the topic by arguing with tough big guys that think games are a waste of time, ironically ignoring that posting here is not much better.

you mean that posting on pol is degenracy?

well we all know that user.

Yes, some of the games that I think are worth the time investment because of "literary" or artistic merit are Witcher 3, Deus Ex HR, the PSX and PS2 era Final Fantasy's, many of the shorter sidescroll platformers from recent years like Ori and the Blind Forest and Shovel Knight are good just from a design and craftsmanship perspective. I like Soulsborne games for the writing and themebuilding but I think many would disagree that it has substance outside of the gameplay.
And my all-time favorite series is MGS1-V, I am very excited to play Death Stranding and have literally postponed quitting gaming forever to see if it will be worth the wait. Since I already own a PS4 I'll probably play the VII rework also but FFXV was absolute trash and I'm extremely afraid that Squenix will ruin my good memories

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Are you me?

Agree with every title here except i never got into FF.

Will probably cancel my steam (beg the customer support) and come back to play Death Stranding on my brothers PS4. Kojima cannot make a bad game.

Exactly, people are in no position to call out a hobby lol.

its a discussion, not a witch hunt.

Quit video games asap.
Its a waste of life, easy gratification system with no real achievements in the real world. Kills motivation and makes you depressed.

A hypocrite one I may add, never stated it was a witch hunt.

I went through the same phase, hopefully wont be long till you put them down completely, I haven't bought a game in 4 years. I just dont get the same enjoyment anymore, I wish I had all the time back that I wasted playing games

>The Witcher 3 is the best game ever

>this pleb taste

christ

how is it hypocritical?

reasons?

thanks user for your experience. Was it a fizzle out or some epiphany?

>I have a sneaking suspicion they are as bad as Hollywood or TV and we are doing their work for them.
Your sneaking suspicion is on point.
Video games are just like film and television.
They are yet another facet of the electric Jew, designed to keep you too busy being entertained to actually go out and maybe change something in the real world.
Hey, have you prepurchased the new WoW expansion that starts after tomorrow?
Be a good goy and get busy levelling your paladin to 120, there are just so many awesome adventures waiting for you in the Battle for Azeroth.

As a LIFESTYLE, yes, video games are degenerate. Living a life where you go to a wagecuck job and play vidya when you're not is absolutely degenerate. That sort of escapism and substitution of a real life and real accomplishments for virtual ones is certainly degenerate.

Nothing wrong with playing a game or two a year though, just as there's nothing wrong with sitting on a beach a week or two a year. Not all of your life needs to be productive, but too much nothing means a life of nothing.

this is some real talk

the electric jew, kek

Yeah I'm halfway out the door as well. I made the mistake of investing a shitload of money into Hearthstone cards and League of Legends content and got permanently banned from LoL for calling people faggots, it made me seriously reconsider the utility of spending time and money on literally homosexual, diabolical, brainlet, soul-devoid media produced by degenerate moderns. I've probably lost well over 10,000 hours of free time over my life to accomplish basically nothing
What is your best game ever? Witcher 3 is definitely in the top 10 of all time and it's placement could only possibly vary based on the subjective opinion of the person making the list. The gameplay was meh but the scale, craftsmanship and writing have not been paralleled by any other games. Honestly I think you'd have to be pretty brainlet not to see W3 as being completely above and beyond 99.99% of games of all time

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I already said it in a previous post.

These are the words of an uncultured mind. I wouldn't be surprised if you couldn't name more than a hundred different video games.

They’re not degenerate they’re just a time-sink and a wasteful one at that. A rule of thumb is to only play them when you’ve TRULY got nothing better/more productive to do.
Also worth noting in this context that leisure/rest is important. People who take shots at gamers like
>hurrrrr you should be studying Nietzsche or Aristotle instead!!
are fucking posers.

Boomers can't understand

Those who play competitive vidya tend to be anti sjw.

nigga 'literary and artisitc merit' is subjective and falls flat when you attribute it to melodrama weebshit like FF.

The themes in MGS are fucking fantastic though, and I know this has become a meme but Sons of Liberty is so ahead of its time its not even a joke.

Also, to the OP who compare 'tell tale' shit to a well regarded book, just fucking wow..

A lot of writing in vidya juegos is hack tier, even the 'well regarded' shit, and ESPECIALLY the writers that become 'vidya famous' like Niel Druckman.

unironically MGSV, for what it could been, for what it wasn't, for what it is

Just look at twitch..
All the men out there are emasculated faggs.

Yeah Witcher 3 is definitely a lightning strike you mentioned. it's a fucking unicorn of quality,but i actully think that the combatis good. Compare to Skyrim which is basically whack a mole tier swinging of an axe.

I dunno aboutmy best of all time. Maybe KOTOR2 for depth and nostalgia combined. And Masss Effect 2 for oscar tier writing in places. Mordin still makes me rethink my views on abortion through the lens of the genophage.

I also recognize Dark Souls for its existential journey quality and I think it is the best gamers articulation of Carl Jung and Albert Camus. I really stand by that too, it is no joke a masterpiece of writing philosophy in a modern medium.

not proof of hypocracy, this discussion is not off the table just because Jow Forums is often a waste of time too.

telltale shit just wow.

Walking dead is crap, Wolf Among Us was a masterpiece. Its how you do dark and mature in a grown up way trather than just adding edgy shit and calling it a reimagining.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Seven_Basic_Plots
Same goes for video games.
There aren't 'a hundred different video games' out there.
There are maybe seven games out there, with hundreds of different skins on them.
It's all the same underneath.

Also fuck being productive. If you are enjoying yourself and living a healthy life, what the world thinks of you doesnt matter. If you already have a job and youre still trying to "be productive" even in your free time, youre a cuck.

tbf The walking dead walking adventure is the only one I've played, so don't know if they have redeemed themselves with Wolf Among Us

Unless you specifically play pozzed propaganda shit or you play games in lieu of work or self-improvement, then of course they are degenerate, this is true of consuming any media. Faggots will say "hurr any down-time/relaxation is time you could be working/improving" but they are unrealistic and idiotic. You need to spend time relaxing, it is good for your mental health and lets you work more efficiently, otherwise you'll likely get burnt out. Discipline is important but there's also no point spending your entire life being a joyless cunt who never lets himself have fun.

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>A rule of thumb is to only play them when you’ve TRULY got nothing better/more productive to do
Which is never, unless you are in prison.
Shit, even in prison you could be doing fucking pushups on the cell floor or reading books from the prison library.
Even that would be better for you than video games.

Ah seeing the trend in yourposting here.

Like many on /v/ its just neckbeard level of taste-trashing

>he likes Witcher 3 and considers it a superb game, urgh I'm gonna throw up in my neckbeard
> I only play titles that are 25 years old and require DOS, when games were pure and made with passion
>I insist on replaying a game at least 1000 hours before it is considered replayable, anything less is shit tier modern rpg
>Only 90 classes for my fantasy character and 3000 quests? Dogshit tier
>A mini map and quest marks?! *dies of heart attack*

Getting warm user?

This is intersting I will check this out, sounds like Joseph Campbell thesis right?

for the record I don't put the writing of an FF game anywhere near any of the MGS games but I think there is substance in the thought, craft and aesthetic put into them. Some of the games have some strong themes (namely VI, VII, IX, X and XII and the old Tactics). One way that I would say the writing in the above FF titles shines better than in individual MGS games is characterization throughout the course of the game. This is an artifact of the style/form of either series and MGS still wins out in the end because by now the persistent characters in that world have been massively fleshed out over time, but if you take, say, MGS or Sons of Liberty as their own units the characterization is extremely minimal and archetypal due to the generally fast pace and the as-you-know method of storytelling. I do agree that Sons of Liberty is completely prescient and I think it will only grow in notoriety over time. The plot of that game seriously warped my brain at around 12 years old and has seriously helped me understand the world in development since then

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Im 27 anonbro

also shit tier edgelord flag

is that how you justify playing some fag asian game for half the day?

Yes, he is mentioned there in the wiki.
Here's another site that can open your eyes if you haven't heard of it yet:
tvtropes.org/

MGSV would have been the best game ever if it was wrapped up properly. Kojimagate was seriously a tragedy against the media of videogames as a whole. I have spent a lot of hours playing that game. I wish MGSV had been more successful because MGO3 had seriously enormous potential as an arena shooter but was squandered in the fallout of Kojima's departure

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Ah yeah big fan of tvtropes

I am aware of the idea of meta arcs that never die but it doesnt stp me from loving the original Star Wars for example.

But then you were right with your electric Jew comment above I think.

Although how many big developers are owned by (((them)))? TV and news are, but are game devs?

good job on outing yourself as a crossposter
>implying im the faggot that considers video games his hobby
>implying I like games or play games enough to post on vee

But nice to see your so familiar with that board's culture and that Ive seem to rustled your jimmies by calling your "FAYVEWUT GAEM" shit.

Best part is I haven't even played the witcher 3, so good job on losing your shit and giving me nerd-waffle on some bait, friend

Damn, I wish I had played MGS2 back in the day. Might boot up the PS3 and get aLEgacy box set and playit as my final game. I got into the series with 4, which is underrated imho, but the least good of a masterpiece series. Like being Return Of The Jedi, up against your own friends as competition.

>There are maybe seven games out there, with hundreds of different skins on them.
While I agree with the sentiment, I don't agree with it coming from you, because I'm currently under the impression that you came to that conclusion not because you've played a lot of games but because you haven't played enough. You attacked MMOs, but MMOs don't cover all games. What about skill-based and strategy games? What about games with actual multiplayer that encourages cooperative play, unlike MMOs? What about adventure games that involve puzzle solving and exploration? And it's not like playing games is for children only, adults play games ALL the time, every single day of their lives.

>this guy likes W3, omg shit tastes
>Hah jokes on you, I didnt even play it, have I hurt your feelings

Some real adolescent shit here my friend, and the "gotcha" schtick is pretty pathetic.

Maybe bedtime for you kiddo

This, for the most part. Games are for periods of time when you deliberately don't want to do something productive, which you should occasionally want to do. If you don't give yourself that time, you have no outlet for stress, which will deplete your creativity and productivity. This goes for everyone.

I watched a clip on youtube the other day of the scene where the AI starts talking about how it's goal is to create 'Context in Content' (basically defending the ethics behind the curation of Big Data), and was taken back at how even more relevant that is today, this year, than when I played it when I was 14.

Kojima gets a lot of shit, but at least he makes fucking good games.

I think it's essentially a crime that there has never been an easy way to replay MGS2 since then, emulating that game is damn near impossible even with a gaming rig and I skipped PS3 because it was the pleb-tier console for its generation.

And yeah 4 was a strange game but I have no idea how much I would have enjoyed it without being utterly titilated by the fanservice and the wrapping-up of all the strands created by the previous games. I was seriously hoping that V would have been on the same level of fanservice but they never got to complete the Liquid arc. A real tragedy

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picrelated

hmmm i thought they did finish liquids arc?

He and ocelot fused in sons of liberty, then liquid ocelot dies in MGS4.

Unless you mean his objectives?

Yes I agree witht he crime coment, but there was to remasters for ps3 and I still have my old one, too bad I gave up my fucking TV to rid myself of fake news. Maybe time to dust off and hit ebay.

MGS4 was an emotional ride and even though it was my first, a quick wiki read up made me realise how far these guys had come together and what Meryl meant to snake etc. It would have been better with Kojimas original ending of Snake and Otacon getting hanged for treason for their efforts to dismantle metal gears. That would have been bittersweet. Snake still wouldn't have called himself a hero for that one.

Video games are not degenerate. They are simply a method of expression, like a book or movie. Any problem related to the medium is just a symptom of the degeneracy of society as a whole.

Tell me about it. Still the game had the most fluid movement and refined "gameplay" out of any in the series, so at least he perfected the fundamentals of STEALTH and TECHNOLOGY before konami asked him to stop wasting their money and fuck off.

FOBS is pretty fun my dude, but like with almost everything about this game, stings because it's obviously unfinished.

>thinks someone on Jow Forums is being immature
Do you not know how this place operates?

Yes.

thanks

>because you haven't played enough.
I'm 45 years old and I've played video games since I was 10 years old.
My first electronic games were the Nintendo Game&Watch games from the early 1980s
My first game computer was a ZX Spectrum+
I also had those Sega/Nintendo clones with 999 games on a cartridge
My first PC was an 386 DX40 AMD clone

I do agree that puzzle solving and exploration games might be useful as developmental tools for really small children in this modern age (gets them familiar with computer interfaces and stuff) but other than that it's just people looking for a excuse for what is ultimately a waste of time.
The benefits of skill-based and strategy games are limited to making you better at those games.
Encouraging cooperative play is fine, but you can learn cooperation in many different ways that doesn't require it to be a game per se.
Just be truthful to yourself and admit you enjoy the dopamine drip that comes from your reward system being activated, because video games are designed specifically for that.
There's nothing wrong with that, in the same way there's nothing wrong with drinking or smoking in moderation - just don't pretend it's good for you and stuff.

I was talking about Chapter 3 in MGSV. If you haven't yet you should look into how much content was never finished for that game, they were going to give essentially a fully fleshed-out origin story for Liquid and Psycho Mantis

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ah right my apologies, yes i know that is a Hamlet or Macbeth tier tragedy that it did not get finished.

One more question before i go to bed before work tomorrow. If I cant get hold of my old ps3 and remastered mgs2, do you think a lets play would suffice for enjoying the story? I am guessing it would make it less ejoyable than the experience itself, right? Even the ones without cmmentary to experience dead classics are not the same, you agree with thator not?

Yes, games are a waste of time. That doesn't mean they have no value. See Who cares what excuses people are looking for? The thread topic is whether games themselves are a problem or not. They aren't if you know how to avoid making them a problem. They are also the opposite of a problem, a BENEFIT, if you know how to take advantage of them.

Our society might not treat video games that way, but that's a problem with society, not video games.

/v/ has potential (and has occasionally realized that potential) to reach peaks in the landscape of human artistic endeavor that are not possible to traverse through /lit/, /mu/, or /tv/. The interactive element is not always a mere dopamine drip any more than enjoyable moments of /lit/ or /tv/ are basic, empty hedonism with no potential for growth of the human spirit. Yes, it is possible to waste too much of your time playing videogames that don't truly enrich your life, but for the same reason that Skinner box vidya is captivating it is also able to penetrate the soul in ways that noninteractive media are unable

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Don't even waste your time with a lets play, you would be doing yourself a disservice. You don't want to hear some faggot screaming over the mic as the existential mind-fuckery is unfolding infront of you.

Play the game.

>Although how many big developers are owned by (((them)))? TV and news are, but are game devs?

It doesn't really matter which game dev specifically is Jewish or of Jewish ancestry. The game development companie are owned by the same venture capital funds or big corporations that have ties to (((global capital))) and as such follow and implement the (((global capital's))) agenda, which is to make money first and foremost, but also to placate the masses and keep them entertained.
Hence the electric jew - more a figure of speech than an actual Jewish individual in a specific corporate position somewhere.

They only became destructive after about 2000 or so... yeap... Quake was a good game.

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I would say that a let's play doesn't hit the same way that an actual playthrough does, but I am also aware that there are some seriously good fan edits of all of the MGS games that will show you all of the cinematic content mixed with bits of gameplay and, lending to the cinematic quality of Kojima's directing, they are actually completely watchable and enjoyable. If you search something like "MGS: Sons of Liberty The Movie" on youtube you will find one

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top stuff, you have convinced me there polandball, cheers

this, the shift in writing is only going become more noticeable in the current climate.

Just look at how shit Naughty Dog has become in the last 5 years.