>Russia tired of sanctions and American hegemony
>Announces Trump was their puppet all along, even though it's untrue
>Has had months to falsify evidence
>MSM eats it up in a frenzy
>Fodder for investigations and impeachments ad nauseum
>Left goes berzerk
>USA destabilized with minimal effort, chance of civil war
Well, Jow Forums?
Other urls found in this thread:
en.wikipedia.org
money.cnn.com
youtube.com
independent.co.uk
twitter.com
If there's a real happening that's as close to fruition as this I'd like to know what it is. America has been destabilizing countries for decades, it's a bit of irony that Russia now has the chance to wreck us simply by saying "we did it." Literally requires very little effort on their part.
Is this what leftist elites are hoping they do?
Bump. I'm genuinely interested in what non-shills think about this. I realize that this requires some critical thinking and common sense, so leftists can fuck right off.
>USA destabilized with minimal effort, chance of civil war
this is already true because of the MSM. They would never risk the country galvanizing against Russia when the MSM is dividing the country just fine...
Risk what exactly? Sanctions are already topped out, visas from Russia are absurdly difficult, our oil and gas policies are openly hostile, and tensions are max. The left would absolutely eat it up, too, not galvanize against Russia. The left wouldn't be upset at Russia, they'd blame "rural and suburban retards." It's an ideal opportunity to destabilize the USA, the left is practically begging for it, and I've no doubt that their elites have wet dreams about it and that our intel agencies are planning for contengencies against it.
Also, thanks for commenting in good faith, a rarity here.
They won't, because he's not.
Jesus these fucking threads are everywhere. I guess you guys have convinced me now you can stop.
>he's not
That hasn't stopped a political witch hunt from impacting our political landscape for nearly two years. Go to any MSM home page right now and tell me how much of it is covered in "Blumpf is finished" tier bullshit? It would only require a few drops of gasoline to make what is already a huge fire into a massive inferno. They've had months to manufacture evidence, and even if they didn't, that would stop neither the MSM nor the left from autistic screeching non-stop. If you haven't realized it yet, evidence is not necessary.
Kek why do shills hate discussing this possibility so much?
As if the Dems ever actually had any problems with Putin. Laughable. Russian spooks and jews are the US Dem party's greatest ally and financiers. They would love to take Putin's word for something negative he says about Trump, but Trump is definitely the alpha in all his business relationships, as he shows time and again, so that just doesn't happen
I agree fully, but if Russia gets in on the game, you and I both know that the left will gladly sink the country to prove "see we were right all along" rather than see Trump's policies work and a conservative renaissance unfold.
Also, it would present the ideal opportunity to replace the petrodollar, the cornerstone of American hegemony.
Bump. Slide threads and shills are in full force, but this needs to be discussed. Why is Jow Forums afraid to talk about this? Shills hate this topic but I'm not sure why, is it because it shows that of Russia were muh ebil bogeyman then they would have already agreed that Trump was their puppet?
Bump
Bump
>Russia was behind subversion of us politics
Try reading the OP, Chaim
I'm the mind of the deranged shitlib, the fact that Russia isn't making up a story about how Trump is their puppet, despite the left handing them the opportunity on a silver platter, is proof in and of itself that they are in cahoots.
good question, but when in history has a foreign power ever officially claimed that their spy colluder is in top position of the other nation? Even the german empire had the chance to claim Lenin was their spy and cause division in the soviet union, but they didn't. Someone should try it for the first time. But it would look bad infront of their own agents, spies and officials if their leadership just blows the cover of one of their own for a move. Even if he isn't technically one of their own, but if they chose that narrative it doesn't matter what he is, it would break code
>unspoken rule
The USA has destabilized countless countries with far more subversive tactics. I'm not sure I understand exactly what you mean by "code." What code? Putin himself always says "international relations isn't personal, it just is.'
Even if everyone knew. Did the US ever out one of their agents on foreign soil? That's the code. And even if the guy is not your agent, you claiming that he is, would immediately make your agents lose confidence in you being willing to protect them. If the Russian claim Trump is their agent officially, next day most russian agents are looking to defect
Also, those times you reference are before the media was an instant medium complete with video. You could control what propaganda circulated with relative ease. Today the MSM has the excuse "it's news and they'll see it online anyway" so they have no fear of government reprisal.
Your logic makes no sense. First, the claim is not that Trump is an agent, it's that he's a puppet. If you accomplish the mission of your agents, ie destabilize their enemy, then they feel patriotic pride towards you, not anger. Making up a story that your opponent's leader is a puppet has nothing to do with your field agent's trust and confidence. Spies most of all would understand.
Yes, but that only means that today you don't control your media by official government channels, but by secret intel agency methods. There must be agents in top media positions, period.
>russia
Funny way to spell israel
Yes there are, and as we've seen they are equivalent to shitlibs if not in form than in fumction, so it makes no difference. And even if we assume an attemptes media MSM blackout, this will only fuel leftist rage more as it confirmation biases their suspicions that the Trump admin (which includes the Federal govt embedded in the MSM technically) is in the pockets of Putin. Streisand effect.
Read the OP retard.
Still you just blown your own 'puppet's' cover infront of the world, you just doxxed him. I'm even somehwat sure that it would be grounds for treason charges in Russia for whoever does that, especially an official. Also I'm pretty sure that the Russian government already officially denied that Trump is their creation, so they would have to go back on that and lose face and look stupid. For Russia the ship already sailed.
Again none of these excuses matter if Russia decides that the benefits now outweigh the cost. All they have to say is "we denied it until he served his purpose, now do with him what you like." It's standard craft to do what's in the interest of your country. You are being far too monodimenaional to understand how vast their array of options are and how many different narratives they have to pluck from. Besides, Putin is already hated outside of Russia (especially in the USA) due to MSM propoganda so this conforms to their image perfectly and thus would be very difficult to defend against. Inside Russia it would be cheered; in case you didn't know Russia is very anti-american right now as their economy is suffering immensely under sanctions. Ending the petrodollar would be a massive potential boon.
>treason
Lol if the Kremlin makes an official decision to spin this narrative than neither Putin nor anyone else can be tried. Are you daft?
Trump is a matryoshka doll
On the outside it looks like Russia controls him but once you get to the dark core, it is Israel that calls the shots.
The other dolls are
Best economy in 50 years
Lowest unemployment in decades
Highest number of workers EVER
Wants to increase border security
Increased military spending
New branch of the armed services to inspire young people
More kid fuckers and traffickers arrested in first 2 years of Trump than in 8 Years of obummer
Refuses to get drawn into pointless wars
>Russia loved us all along.jpg
Even if we forget about secret intel codex of non doxxing for a second, you have one big mistake. You claim that there are 100% benefits waiting for Russia if they just do the Trump thing, which is bogus. It's not that predictable of what will happen, certainly not the 'destruction of the petrodollar' like you suggest. 1st potential: Trump gets impeached, Pence takes over and has a obligation to retaliate against Russia now. No civil war, just new elections soon and everyone has a grudge against Russia and obligations to retaliate. Congratulations you just played yourself. Potential 2: Trump somehow survives the shitstorm and now he has a grudge and an obligation to retaliate, because you just fucked with him. Congratulations, you just have the wrath of Trump against you, this could lead to war.
Long story short: There are 100% risks and retaliations of what you do. But maybe 5% rewards and benefits, if you can even see a civil war a american + world economy collapse as a benefit, which it is fucking not.
Putin is not untouchable even if it appears that way. He can't just betray his secret agents with no consequence. Stalin was poisoned by his own comrades at the height of his power, Hitler was attempted to be blown up by his officers at the height of his powers. Putin better play ball or else
What nonsense. It's impossible to disprove a fabrication like this and they already have the entire media and almost half of Congress on their side. This would 100% result in a constitutional crisis, and the left would gain a massive windfall in the midterms because the impeachment hearings would take far longer. Now you've got an embattled President with a Democrat House. Impeachments can literally go on forever and the left can obstruct everything he does, including defunding any war. And yes the benefits to Russia are very real and very obvious.
Fully agree with OP's analysis in that it would benefit Russia and the vast majority of the population. Not sure if they'd do it, though. But they should.
The timing must be right though. In a few years, during the next recession when the US is even more divided would be perfect.
>thinks America is controlled by Russia
>Israel Exist.......
Shill
I'm sure that's what you'd like us to think Kike
btw I wasn't attacking the OP
Why not for the midterm "October surprise?"
Bump. This topic is kryptonite to shills and /leftypol/ shitlibs. It's uncanny, really, and as a result rarely gets bumps. Take my energy OP.
>He can't just betray his secret agents with no consequence.
Newflash Hans, Trump isn't a secret agent. That's the whole point. From an 'in-the-know' Kremlin perspective the story is 'we're causing an internal crisis within the US that will destabilize them, hinder their credit rating, and accelerate the fall of the petro dollar.' From an 'outside the know' perspective (i.e. to the average Russian) it will be 'we used Trump as our puppet the way America has to other countries time and again, this is poetic justice, we used him until we had no use for him and now let them fall.'
None of your kvetching about agents, codes etc. changes any of that. It's all nonsense.
If they'd do it during the start of the next recession (about 2-3 years from now), there would be too much chaos in the US/NATO bureaucratic apparatus, and any attempts to make plans to control the damage would fail.
>start of the next recession
Crystal-ball tier bullshit is boring.
>speaking about Russia
>no Russians in whole thread
Пpивeт.
The reality of your situation might be too much to bear.
Recessions follow rather regular cycles.
en.wikipedia.org
Also:
money.cnn.com
The only real answer to the OP is that the intel agencies embedded within the MSM are all warmongers, and Russia knows this. The only thing that ever unites them more than hatred of 'right wingers' and 'white peeble' is a change to send white people off to the other side of the planet to go die, especially if they die while killing other whites.
Russia knows that the Joos would get to pick whether they want to: a) Destabilize their attack dog, rendering it a helpless basket-case or b) Do a 180 on the 'muh Russia' narrative and try to gin up anti-Russian sentiment to a fever pitch, which considering shitlibs are already there isn't that difficult. After all this 'Trump is our puppet' narrative would massively piss off conservatives who wouldn't believe it.
So the logical conclusion is that Russia has done the math and decided that the jews will use the MSM to try for actual war or at least a new cold war and probably boots on the ground in nations bordering Russia at a minimum, in addition to potential blockades/new sanctions. Since they know how quickly jews will swap narratives, and that they are the most hated (by jews) nation on Earth right now, it's not a optimal risk.
Regardless, OP presents a very interesting question that results in a great mental exercise rare on Jow Forums. Which is why this thread doesn't get much bumpage.
this is the only way to save the future. it's not even a meme any more.
>and that they are the most hated (by jews) nation on Earth right now, it's not a optimal risk.
Isn't the US the most hated nation on Earth if I'm not mistaken?
By jews? lol why would you ever think such a thing?
It just seems to be the case that the US is widely hated. From East Asia to the Middle East, to Eurasia and Africa, the US seems to be widely hated.
The only people outside of the US who seem to like the US are liberal democrats and the Wahhabi Islamists. Naive youth so,etimes likes the US, but it's getting rare nowadays.
>completely ignores the (by Jews) qualifier
kys
Also, have you been asleep when the US flags were burned around the world rather recently? Or are you too young to remember?
I want the orgy vid to be released. With scat and pee on Trumps face.
I don't think Russia CAN do this because as soon as they do, they have to reveal the leverage they allegedly had on Trump that was keeping him under control. The instant they do that, they lose even the pretence of control, and they also lose their story.
If they did this, it would also put Trump in an IMMEDIATE position of needing to do something so anti-Russia as to make his denial that he was a puppet beyond question.
The reason that they won't do this is because Russia and America are both better off as friends, since we don't have anything real to fight over.
This is good point.
We both can easily get along, just take off all this stupid sanctions.
Stupid goy
What Hans is saying makes sense, he's just not saying it well. It boils down to:
If a country points to someone in a foreign country and says "that's my agent", then all of that countries agents in the field now have to worry about being outed.
It doesn't matter if it's true or not, because the truth will be impossible to really know anyway. In either case, outing an agent in the field will make all of your other agents trust you less.
>they have to reveal the leverage
Why would they? They can simply say 'were keeping those as states secrets unless and until we need them. This is a strategic national decision.' Now what? Call them liars? lol. No, my analysis that they fear the Jews turning the media 180 degrees and ditching the collusion narrative in order to send whites off to war to go kill whites (their favorite thing) makes more sense imo.
Besides the other points there wouldn't be a civil war since all trump supporters and right wingers would just bail. After all, they just spent 3 years supporting a traitor and Russian puppet.
He's not an agent dumbass. He's a stooge. You don't point to your stooge and say 'that's my stooge' and then have all your field agents go "REEEEEE BUT I'M YOUR STOOGE TOO REEEE" they are professional field agents and will instantly know whats going on. Honestly this is the dumbest narrative on this thread.
>all Trump supporters would just take Putin's word for it
kek. No, libshits would take Putin's word for it while Trumplicans would double down on supporting him. Stick to Serbian politics.
I'd love to figure out a way to get rid of those sanctions but the Democrats have really done a nice piece of political fuckery on us -- anything nice we do for you directly will be pointed to as "collusion because Trump is a puppet".
The key is North Korea. We need you to give North Korea a security gaurantee, and to help us get the same from China, so that NK can denuclrarize and maybe reunify.
If you give us that, then dropping the sanctions can be part of the deal and the Democrats have to shut up about it because denucliarizing, reunifying, and opening up North Korea is worth a few sanctions.
If they don't reveal the leverage then the con doesnt work, because it has zero credibility
>you need evidence for a con to work
Have you had your head buried under a rock for the last two years?
"Give us your assets with no compensation, as always."
No, fuck off. Now we will seize some assets from you, forcefully if needed, now. And if you have a problem with that, there's always the red button. There isn't much you can do.
Russia has been trying to subvert everyone's politics, it's an entire fucking industry for them.
Yes. And it was Putin behind JFK murder.
That's the point: Republicans will never admit they aided/abetted. Trump will never admit he colluded. Kremlin will never admit they meddled.
The only way you're going to get any justice and satisfaction is retaking control of the US government, handing down some indictments to Congress and sanctioning the Kremlin/Oligarch's.
>This question goes unanswered
Every. Time.
>implying a bunch of autists and neet's are going to be able to accurately predict what would happen in a scenario that relies on dozens of factors within the span of your average thread lifetime
independent.co.uk
They have admitted to having blackmail materials, at least. Although what they could have that wouldn't be worse than what's already out is anyone's guess.
This is a matter of record, associating it with ancient unrelated conspiracy theories doesn't doesn't change shit.
You could blame Russia in everything, spread lies in mass media, but it doesn't make it truth.
>he cares about truth
Those who lie skillfully win. Might makes right.
If Russia wants to triumph, it should play every move possible, without worrying about ethics.
I think they wouldn't flat out come out and do/say something like that because the implications on the global stage would be disastrous for them as well.
It would all but destroy their chance at building a stronger relationship with Europe which is their goal and also alienate them from China because the Chinese depend on a stable America.
The entire international finance system is currently held up by the American dollar and that depends on American stability.
As a global power its very clear we're on our way out, a multipolar world is becoming more and more clear and the US gov. is trying to use its leverage to reign in some of our vassal states and main trading partners while we still can.
That was the purpose of the TPP, that is also the purpose of the more straight forward trade-war threat that Trump is leveraging.
My personal take on the Russia situation is at this point any direct collusion is irrelevant because although it would be a bad idea for Russia to come out and claim collusion, leaving a certain amount of doubt among the American people and our government about whats really going on in our country is to their benefit.
The metapolitical goal is to turn America on itself and to socially destabilize us to the point where we aren't seen as someone who can be relied on long term, it's to make our weaknesses so glaringly obvious that people pivot away from us, not to cause a sudden catastrophic collapse. They seek to accelerate our decline.
All they have to do is leave carefully placed bread crumbs to make the public go crazy. Spread hints about a peepee tape, have a foreign agent get "caught", make appeals to officials and then let some buzzfeed journalist catch onto it.
From a geopolitical perspective Russia should be 100% capitalizing on the current American situation by fueling the flames.
IMO one of the most interesting aspects of all this is that boomers especially have no framework with which to understand why Russia would not move forward with this. They literally cannot answer the question as to why they wouldn't do what the OP is asking.
This is because boomers are not redpilled on the JQ, so they can't process the world in terms of a supra-national clique of bankers tied together by a common pseudo-religious ideology (aka Jews).
Boomers who are conservative have to read this question and blatantly recognize that evidence is not necessary to create a political crisis. They may have believed that before, but if the rise of Trump taught them anything it was this: the Media can push any agenda it wants and generally ignore anything it wants and that's where the narrative will drift. Always.
So even believing that there is no actual evidence that Putin can produce means nothing for the plot. Putin doesn't need evidence and never has. Outing a political stooge as a stooge - one who was never a Russian national and is sure to be seen as alien to the nationalist masses - is not outing an 'agent' and would not result in any deep state backlash against Putin. The man himself was KGB. They trust him implicitly for this reason among others.
But back to boomers: Because they can't process this paradox, they will either experience cognitive dissonance when pressed with the question, or they will seek an escape. Such as the "Q" larp. The "Q" larp allows boomers to escape reality without facing the JQ.
However I think this is completely lost on a large portion of the public but not the politicians. I am confident the entire DNC and RNC knows exactly whats going on as far as Russian meddling being overstated, but everyone is preparing to descend on Trump and turn this into cheap political points.
Trump entered a world he was not prepared for and the backstabbing and all around scumminess of our politicians should becoming more clear than ever to anyone paying attention.
Are America winning in this situation? Not at all.
Russian positions about Ukraine, Syria, sanctions - all of them are clean and easy to understand. No stupid shows, Twitter hysteria and trade wars with biggest economics of world.
Truth can greatly help to make alliances and reach strategic goals.
that's an interesting idea, but I doubt the Russians would go down that road. we have a massive nuclear arsenal and THAT kind of destabilization of our country might put themselves in harm's way.
*is winning
Because for one it's not true. And if it is true announcing it is useless.
If Putin announces it and produces evidence Trump is removed immediately and the US enters martial law mode and they will have to posture against Russia militarily just short of open war I highly doubt all the Trump cucks will start a revolt when facing martial law.
It's more useful for Putin to keep the narrative and the division running occasionally no matter if it's true or untrue occasionally keep throwing meat for the democrats here and there and making low key hacks in favor of Trump
Decent analysis but I strongly disagree that it would result in anything like an immediate collapse of the USA or the dollar. It would accelerate the collapse very quickly in comparison, but it wouldn't happen overnight. Perhaps in about ten years as opposed to twenty to twenty five as I would presently estimate (then again, 'collapse' is a malleable word).
China and the other BRICS nations are already actively circumventing the dollar, setting up alternative banks, alternative gold and silver settlements etc. Russia may upset Europe but would they really? Europe absolutely detests Trump and would be forced to virtue signal against him, and the brown hordes would continue unabated. Does anyone really care what Europe thinks anyways? They only purchase what Russian resources they need to survive as it is and very little else.
It's in Russia's best interest to give the USA a slight push while we are teetering on the side of the hill. Yes leaving bread crumbs is fine but the evidence thus far does not make it appear that Russia is leaving bread crumbs, but rather our own deep state agents simply laundered information from un-credible sources. I'd hardly call that 'leaving breadcrumbs.'
The reality of course is that our own deep state agents are not loyal to US interest but are hopeless ideologues incapable of removing their own blinders. They were selected by Obama for this reason, as he and his advisers recognized birds of their feather.
dude, where can i get some of that LSD you're taking?
>implying Russia can destabilize US
Is your country so fragile and helpless?
Oh right, it really is.
Sounds better than creating ISIS and being a terrorist nation. I want civil war. I demand justice for Vegas, school shootings and the attack on our capital 6-14-17.
>he thinks a claim needs to be true to induce mass hysteria
Again, have you been hiding under a rock the last two years?
>Mueller? Mueller? Mueller?
wrong time to use that .gif, my silly friend. it has to be paragraphs and paragraphs, not 7 bullet points, to validate its use.
Russia is a deflection from the control Jews and Israel have over our Government and Media.
The Jews best tricks, are diversions.
I'm saying that announcing it as Putin doesn't yield any benefits for Putin weather true or untrue he cant control what happens after
>making political chess moves is pointless because things happen after that
k bud
Still dont see civil war. Just GOP/conservatives/white people getting btfo forever. Dem deep state puppet installed at next opportunity. Borders opened. Worst recession of our lifetimes over the next decade or so. I mean maybe. But everyone is too fat, cucked, and stupid to fight for what matters anymore.
the likely outcome is a coup d etat that just removes Trump from power and what does Putin do then? What did he win in that scenario? Bit of Trump says in power Putin can continue to visibly support Trump while continuing to cyber attack the DNC and Trumps opponents giving the Democrats ammo yo come after Trump forcing Trump to fight back paralyzing the political system