I don't want to discriminate against those who aren't white and I love my country..
This is why I can't be a full NatSoc autist, what people don't understand is the the left enable all of the minorities to run riot..
Think about it, in the 40s,50s, minorities were NOT a problem because the left were not a problem.
it’s easy to be civnat because you can mask your problematic views. back then it was just a weak centrist crutch to not upset mainstream racist conservatives. it’s even easier now to be one than when they were litterally 1-3% pf the population.
it’s useless for today’s problems.
They would be fine under a dictatorship, the left enables them
Being a CivicNat is great, I surround myself with like minded people, regardless of race, and we talk about making our country great. All and all, conservative polices would mostly benefit whites and slowing immigration would bolster the recovery of the white demographic. CivicNat is almost inadvertently EthnoNat, if the right policies are applied. I would be completely satisfied with living in a majority white county as opposed to a completely white county so long as the majority of people are patriotic and care about their fellow American.
>HURRR DDEERRR WOULD YOU RATHER LIVE IN A FULL BLACK COUNTY OR WHITE ONE!!
It's never going to be full black, that's a ridiculous scenario. Nothing would enable blacks to completely eclipse the white population. Even so, would YOU rather live in a completely degenerate (legal pedophila, rampant drug use, transgenders and homosexuals everywhere, men are 3rd class citizens, etc...) white nation or a wholesome majority black nation? If you call this scenario ridiculous than I can say the same of yours. Civic Nationalism is not going to lead to white genocide, in fact it may very well prevent it.
Then how do you address, say, Welsh, Scottish or Irish nationalists who want no part in your civic identity?
Tell me more. Am I excluded if I hold transhumanist views?
(read: Improve human condition through genetic engineering and cybernetics, not tranny shit.)
Clearly ethno nationalism is stupid. Europe was mostly white for a long time and it's exploding into flames. Yes you can say "because nonwhites", but who is begging for these people? Europeans.
Rome had civic nationalism. That's how the Byzantine Empire genuinely believed itself to be the successor state. Because people care about ideas and virtues, that's how you build an empire, not on skin color brainlet autism. Again, all white nations are trash, the 21st century shows you what happens, this is a feature not a bug. Japan is going to be a ghost nation, China is inhuman. Homogenous nations are trash and breed trash.
Which is why we shouldn't accept refuges. They come from homogenous nations of trash. Stop importing people, America is full. We don't want more Eurocucks or what else. Work with what you've got, worth things out. Civic isolationist nationalism.
Thinking you can trust your own race is bluepilled
The only ones you can trust are those who value your culture
>in the 40s,50s, minorities were NOT a problem because the left were not a problem.
What?
40s were practically full out war time so all other problems were kinda under the rug.
But 50s were full blown start of the Civil Rights Movement:
1951 — assassination of Harry T. Moore.
1954 — Brown v Board of Education
1955 — Emmett Till's murder
1955 — Rosa Parks and the Montgomery Bus Boycott
1957 — Desegregation of the Little Rock Central High School with fucking national guard and shit
Civic nationalism is dumb not by idea but practicality. Even if you're a fence-sitter recognise that you're not going to achieve anything as a moderate today so pick a hard side and stick to it. Work to your way from there
fuck off proto-globalist.
mongrel detected, back to south africa
Wow awesome argument fellow NPC
I can get behind CivNat 100% with strictly enforced assimilation, both legally and socially
>English as the only official language, must speak English to receive government services, education institutions that get tax dollars must teach in English exclusively, exc.
>enforce borders, ship out illegals, obviously
>only citizens born here are allowed to vote
>no welfare, period
>any firm that hires illegal immigrants must have their assets seized and management arrested for violating the law
If we do these things as well as aggressively dismantle the propaganda engine, and replace it with pro-natalism, pro nationalism, and voluntary eugenics, we’ll be well on our way toward a CivNat that isn’t just cucking out. This is all basic shit but it’s not what we’re doing, we talk about standards and boundaries but we walk it back at the slightest pushback. We know that self-deportation works. We know we have the right to control immigration and enforce our borders however we damn-well please. Don’t rail against assimilation as a concept when the left has been rigorously dismantling it for the last 70 years. Germans and Italians assimilated because of the environmental pressure, we want that environmental pressure back because struggle breeds strength, and the weak will deport themselves.
Civic nationalism works best when you have very few minorities.
But who would fuck the white women without minorities?
Fuck up you filthy slanty, civic nationalism is for unironic plebbitors who are too scared to accept reality.
>>>>>>>>>>>>/plebbit/
Civic nationalism never works because of demographics. Either you constantly cull minorities or civic nationalism is doomed to fail over and over again
>no welfare, period
Fundamental flaw with you civtards. You just have complete abandonment for the downtrodden countrymen of your nation. You scum would probably steal the pennies off a dead man's eyes
you're a literal flip that's trying to tell us to take people like you in because you're all oh so productive and we're oh so destructive. I need no arguments. You just need a bullet to the head.
I hate nationalism, it has confined western man to these pitiful little borders. Fuck your little national self-determination, the world moves under empires.
I'm a civic imperialist. Spengler was right we need EMPIRE, not the Anglo model of government.
Sick cunt
You need to fuck off back to Pakistan. This is not your country. We are not your countrymen.
>Rome had civic nationalism.
It never did until the last stages. The republic mostly involved italic people and Greeks. When it became a civic empire coupled with increasing minorities it's when it fell. Your own example disproves the validity of civic nationalism
>but white people are the ones inviting shitskins
Sure, leftism is a problem. This doesn't however mean that a homogenous Europe isn't far better than a mutt one. No one claims whites are perfect uncorruptible gods. Some are leftist idiots and just as bad as the minorities they import
With CIvnat, you have to carefully craft laws in order to not disproportiately benefit minorities.
You also need to suppress subcultures while mellowing down all values of the leading culture.
this is why it cannot work
Good point on the second paragraph, people on the internet believe their political utopia is beyond corruption. Even here in Jow Forums, natsoc is painted as a one-fits-all flawless solution.
Civic nationalism can only work in places such as Italy, where state fascism is the manifestation of the nation, not ethnic fascism (Germany).
And I'm not talking about "racially diverse" countries either, such as Bulgarian where there's Bulgarians with Aryan features and """Bulgarian""" gypsies. Im talking about countries where national identity is shared among different ethnic groups.
it is a flawless solution
Im an ethnonat and i don’t believe in outright welfare either. I would be inclined to allow for government assistance for those who have signed on to a job search program which involves searching for some form of permanent or semi-permanent employment in the private sector. They would receive some form of a parole officer which would visit them daily or at least 3 times a weak, to ensure they’re allocating the resources correctly and for need rather than want, and that they’re searching for employment. Outright giving money to people who may or may not be lazy is moronic famalam.
OP, i've been trying to explain that to them, but Jow Forums is full of stupid underage kids that don't want to understand that you should keep the 2% actually useful immigrants. You also need to keep borders open to trade and information.
You actually just need to be harsher with punishment. I actually advocate for death penalty world wide again.
You mean like the US before obama? People that grew up after 9/11 should be banned from politics
Which is why it will fail if contructed. Fanatics can't be critic.
In the 40s and 50s, minorities weren’t a problem because they were like >5% of the population. If they were still that small of a percent they wouldn’t really be a problem, but we’re almost to the point now where they’re going to outnumber us within our lifetimes. And when this happens things are going to get VERY bad in this country. Just look at anywhere where non-whites are a majority... that is what your nation will be like in less than 40 years. So be a civic nationalist if you want to be led down the path of ruin by shitskins but if you like the living standards of the first world, ethnonationalism will be the only way to hold onto them
>it is flawless which is why it will fail
This. CivNat and WhiteNat have common, almost 1:1 solutions to these problems. The difference being WN doesn’t care about whether or not a nonwhite person deserves to be evicted from their homeland, to them it doesn’t matter that they’re countrymen because they’re a different race. And then they wonder why people who are otherwise decent and patriotic resent them.
Eugenics is what we want, so transhumanism has something to offer. I don’t know if it’s through and through based because megacorps are bluepilled.
>you just hate poor white people!!
Absolutely wrong; I acknowledge that they’ve fallen for vice, and this culture consumes men by feeding their vices. They will never abandon those vices or become stronger, more whole men without environmental pressure. Welfare is a slippery slope that simply shouldn’t exist, it’s not fun to be on welfare, it’s hard to get off of it. Do you really want your countrymen to be perpetual serfs like that?
What of the disabled? What of the veterans who had their legs blown off in war? What of the terminally ill? The sick? You're part of the problem and you're a detriment to the race.
>I-I don't want to waste my disposable sheckles on those who need it t-that would be silly!
Based frog.
Explain Scandinavian countries like sweden then ? Explain pre ww2 germany when the left were psychos. Or spain pre civil war.
Not what i am saying at all. No system made by man is flawless. To deny that is foolish.
I was talking about unemployment benefits you fucking moron.
Disabilities should only be payed out to those who truly need them, such as Veterans. Disabled people who were born disabled, especially mentally disabled, should not be incentivized to exist, especially considering that they have nothing to add to the gene pool.
The sick should have to pay for their own insurance, they should learn to be strong. Veterans would refuse government healthcare as they actually paid into the system with their lives.
The whole point of National Socialism is to foment strength. The promotion of lazyness and government subsidizing lazyness is antithetical to National Socialism, it is the promotion of weakness, you should promote a strong nation, not a nation of people who cannot fend for themselves when they absolutely must.
Yeah, look at sweden: it’s basically West Syria. That’s coming to the entire world, no white nation is safe
National Socialism is not made by man. It is absolute adherence to the laws of nature.
>Veterans would receive
Fixed
They have been a problem from the start. Remember the suit suit riots?
Yeah. Civic nationalism can work when different ethnicity groups hold on to their identities
I'm Italian but have a French carrier that gives a French IP. Sorry Jean-Luc
I really have trouble believing that, had humanity truly known what the laws of nature were, we wouldn't be in the mess that is CURRENT YEAR. Ah well, not shitting on you or anyone, just cynical about it.
The reason why civ nat is superior is because it can realistically be achieved. Ethnic nationists can't get any victories. They're losers as their ideology can't adapt to the environment due to its excessive utopian ideals. Its not like homogeneous nations can't work. Its that achieving it in the West is absolutely delusional. You can formulate and hypothesize how your ideology would work in power, but doing so is meaningless without any way of achieving significant power. An ideology's success is innately determined by its ability to take power and maintain it via sufficient support. Ethnic nats don't have that ability anymore. Often e. Nats. make assumptions on whites. In what they secretly widely believe and how they will widely act in regards to race.
whats to explain of sweden?
White people are the only group of people who are afraid of taking their own side
Why not just peaceful ethnonationalism?
we're in this mess specifically because humanity rejected that adherence to the laws of nature
Yeah it's probably more delusional to think that non-whites will ever want to join forces with white people lmao.
No, you don't get it
Civic nationalism is when your send back everyone to their respective countries so that they can rebuild their own nation, and if their government is too corrupt to do so then it's time to bomb it
>can't get any victories
>>>>>>>>>>>>/plebbit/
Shoo shoo smelly joo
Considering that Republicans can still win national elected office even though theyre in America, the darkest Western nation by a large margin is proof ethnic nationalism can work in the West. All minorites vote Democrat consistently in every election in every state. The republican party is pretty much a White ethnic party and even with leftist asleep Whites and Jews voting Democrats the Republicans can still carry enough White votes to win the Presidency and both Houses of Congress. There are enough White voters to win even on an ethnic nationalist platform.
The rejection is adherence is the laws of nature. The laws of nature simply dictate that if someone can't adapt, they cannot reproduce. Only that which survives a given envionment survives and flourishes. Nat soc failed to adapt to the environment.
>freedom of association
>sexual selection
>replace race-mixing globalist propaganda with pro-natalism and national identity rooted in European heritage
>defend borders and enforce immigration at all costs
White people naturally select their own when it’s time to raise a family.
There are more of us than you’d think. Most of us perceive that our homeland is under siege and that most of what we know and love and admire comes from the white side of our heritage. We were born into the western world, therefore we want to defend that world.
t. knows absolutely jack fucking shit about natural law yet pretends to be an intellectual social darwinist
Ah okay you're a non-white that explains why you're afraid of white nationalism. Here I thought you were a cucky MPCer
>mfw i 90% agree with natsoc, but i'm civnat because i'm half caste
>in the 40s,50s, minorities were NOT a problem
The mud races have been violent primitives since forever. It's just that your country didn't have enough of them to cause significant trouble and ours had sensible Jim Crow and segregation policies to insulate human civilization from their dysfunction.
If you agreed with NatSoc you wouldn't have political views that fit in with your selfish desires and needs
The introduction of The Fourth Polit. Theory expands on this idea. Interesting read.
Took you long enough. Aren’t you WNs just able to “know” who’s white and who isn’t?
Yes I can see your face through the internet
>would you rather live next to Thomas Sowell or Ted Bundy, post
Averages exist
Eventually all CivNats become NatSocs as they age and realize there is only one way.
>Think about it, in the 40s,50s, minorities were NOT a problem because the left were not a problem.
Because western states were already ethnically NatSoc in policy and population. Being NatSoc doesn't mean having 0 non-whites it means having a sane immigration policy that doesn't let your country become taken over through diversifying the will of your people away.
I'd say that's it's more delusional to think that whites will ever form a large unified force against non-whites as the vast majority of them would cuck. They'd rather join forces with non-whites than against them en masse.
Whites also happen to make up the majority of democrats too. The republicans also rely on a significant margin of hispanics. At the same time, they also explicitly fight for extensive non-white interests too. This only goes to show that whites innately have a vested interest in appeasing non-whites even in parties that are significantly white. I'd go so far as to say that its widely biologically ingrained at this point.
I'm libertarian that wants an ethno-nationalist state, not a fag NatSoc.
So it’s about looks and not a deeper essence. Is that so?
I thought there was something spiritual going on.
Civic Nationalism is inherently NPC thinking.
>Look at this based minority! Ignore the fact there’s one hundred leftist ones in his place
>impossible to achieve
America/Canada :Balkanization is the only plausible way forward, I'll give you that.
Australia,NZ/Europe:close the borders deport every illegal, send refugees home after throwing some money at the dirt hill they come from, and deport non European immigrants who commit serious violent crime. Promote pro natal policies. Done. Especially in Eastern Europe this could be done tomorrow and the people would love whoever did it.
>im a lolbergtardian
>wants an ethno-state
lmao
Balkanization is going to happen eventually. Not even Trump can save the US economically. It’s all going to come crashing down to the point this country will go bankrupt. America is basically the new Rome and will likely end that way. We have way too many barbarians.
if civnat is a means to an end which is natsoc and niggers and chinks learn that it is best for every population to live amongst their own and there can be civnat cities and travel would of course be allowed then its ok but civnat cant be the end, there will always be conflict among different races and ethnicities dating thousands of years so calming that as much as possible by living on different continents and countries is the best course of action for everyone
Civic Nationalism will just give you Brazil with trump hats. The majority of nonwhites are leftist and will remain that way. No matter how many based ones leave the Democratic Party. They’ll just import thousands more in their place. Civic Nationalism is even more of a losing battle than Ethno-Nationalism.
Yeah fuck those evil Nazis based niggers railing my daughter in Swedish Democrat hats will stop them all while I watch
>in the 40s,50s,
in the 40s and 50s there were barely any of them in our countries and they were still a problem in the US, just a smaller one. the people who are pouring into the UK don't love your country. they want to fuck it. literally. they are there for the dole and English girl pussy. it makes me angry because my ancestors were Anglos who took the country I was born in at the tip of a sword. In Canada Anglos are CONSTANTLY shit on. we're responsible for every evil imaginable, we deserve to be stripped of any power we have and humiliated, we aren't allowed to object to the racial replacement of our people because "we're all immigrants, if you don't like living in a nation of immigrants why don't you go back to England? Besides the fact that we don't have a right of return any more (we used to by the way, Australians, Canadians, New Zealanders, we used to be able to move freely between all of our sister-dominions and the UK) but even if we did go back England isn't the country our ancestors left any more. Look i'm gonna guess you're a working/middle class brit right? then take it from a colonial anglo when I tell you that these people do not think the way we do. they can't. they don't care about your ideals, they only care about their own group interests, and even the conservative one all relish the thought of a future Britain in which they are the majority. If my French conquering, Iroquois killing ancestors had known that removing themselves and their genes from the motherland would leave England so hopelessly undefended, I think they wouldn't have bothered building the biggest empire in world history. I shudder to think what they'd do If they could see what has become of the old country. Why do you think it is that only the non-white former colonies are allowed to emigrate en masse into Britain? Same reason Canada must embrace a "beige horizon". And it's they same for the other anglo nations.
true assimilation would take generations. the more different a person is racially the harder it will be for them to assimilate. they may assimilate superficially after a few generations but they will always be viewed as a foreigner and also long as they are different you'll never have true assimilation.
civic nationalism is a meme unless immigration is completely stopped for at least 5 generations. a European immigration is 100% assimilated by the 2nd generation. for non whites it takes so much longer because lot more different culturally and racially.
Maybe in your life you were friends with someone who wasn't white. Maybe you were smarter then them, more athletic, bigger dick, etc. But did that person try to get along? Did they do their job, pay taxes, try to be a good citizen and person? And you're comfortable with stabbing them in the back?
Nationalism is about shared culture, its about feeling like your compatriot is just like you and that you are willing to sacrifice something for the good of the nation, the good of those who are just like you, and they are willing to do the same for you.
No matter how many values you share with someone, if they are a different race and have a wildly different phenotype from you, you will always have something between you. Our race, our phenotype, is the single most defining feature of ours.
So although you might have 'based minorities' they will always be a minority, and naturally they will identify more amongst themselves as they share not only values but skin colour.
Civic nationalism is a meme ideology and I am convinced that everyone on Jow Forums who supports it is a shitskin.
>calls someone an NPC
>invades an imageboard and can't even take enough time to learn it's culture
You have to go back.
>Civic nationalism is a meme ideology and I am convinced that everyone on Jow Forums who supports it is a shitskin.
yeah I wish that was the case because it would mean a significant amount of these people understand on a certain level the problem they're causing but if you ask me it's more likely these civnat shills are all or mostly just Sargon tier whites trying to appear morally superior and big brained
You are all missing the essential point that is biology.
Other races are inferior and there is nothing you can do. They have lower average IQ, more disfavourable behavioural traits like aggressive and impulsive behaviour and aren't capable of delayed gratification as much as northern Europeans.
You may not notice the degradation at first but it's still there.
Egypt was a gigantic empire at some point but somewhere between the 9th and 13th century a lot of sub-Saharan blood mixed into the general population and now it's a shithole. The copts are somewhat closer to the original population of Egypt but they are a 10% minority.
Miscegenation is forever and irreversible and even small amounts can propagate and accumulate into a grave decline of favourable genes.
I mean how long have you been on Jow Forums? You can't even assimilate to not posting like a reditor.
The US can't go bankrupt. The US debt is in dollars and the US fully controls the dollar.
It is impossible to go bankrupt on a currency you control unless you do something unbelievably dumb.
It's possible to have an economic crisis though.
muh leddit spacing. I love triggering faggots like you.
it's too much fun
>Miscegenation is forever and irreversible and even small amounts can propagate and accumulate into a grave decline of favourable genes.
The even more extreme examples of this can be found in India and (hate to admit it but) Greece too.
they know they will always be shitskins no meme ideology will ever change that.
Exactly, civic nationalism is what got us in this mess in the first place.
We need a zero tolerance policy, no exceptions. Jews love pushing you down the slippery slope.
I'll give you that eastern Europeans can do it except Russia. However, West Europe and Oceania will not achieve ethnic nationalism or become homogenously white. You mention specific actions that can be done when i power. My whole point is that achieving said power with a government that is anti-nonwhite is virtually impossible in the present and foreseeable future. If whites in the US identify only 49% Republican and 40% Democrat, what hope is there for the much more left-leaning euros amd oceania? You can get civ nats to slow the non-white demographical changes help whites a little, but removing the existing legal non-whites is never happening now or in the forceeable future. It could happen in the far future, but it becomes less likely over time as the demographics change.
I never saw a picture of a black person just doing their job on Jow Forums, although I have irl
White men 60-100 years ago who weren’t even nat soc would call you a traitor and beat you to death at the premise of sharing the civilization our ancestors built with niggers
That’s what I was saying. CivNat would work if we were more strict about our standards, like immigration enforcement.
I’m hapa and personally disconnected from my Asian side completely. This place is all I know. I just want brotherhood and to kill commies when shtf, instead of being a paranoid loner destined to die alone anyway that shoots at everyone that doesn’t look like him.
Country = soil + politics
Nation = soil + people
The US is a country but it is no longer a nation. Civic nationalism in itself is an oxymoron.
>muh natsoc
>muh pagan
Both are LARPs
This is also why (a united) Europe cannot ever be a nation, it will always be a country same as the Soviet Union was.