Should I listen to the MGTOW movement?

>The whole "traditional family values being destroyed in modern culture/dating" thing is overblown.
That's exactly what has happened, though. Sure, you can find isolated pockets of behavior counter to mainstream trends, but that's not what defines a society.
You'll be fine as long as you don't share my autism. That's what scares people away--not the beliefs, but the intensity of them.

>It's nothing new that the majority of all people will have views that don't align with yours. If you never date/fall in love/whatever because of this, you're basically just coping out. Relationships are just as hard for literally everyone, be it the traditional family vs liberal values thing, or any other disagreement that makes or breaks a relationship for someone.
Fucking this. It is tough to be with someone because no matter who you are, there'll be some substantial issue you disagree on.

One of the most beautiful things in life is when you and your SO can actually put that disagreement aside because you value your relationship. For instance, I'm pretty staunchly conservative but virtually all of my exes have been very liberal. It's the greatest feeling in the world where you each acknowledge that the other disagrees and affirm your feelings for one another in spite of that.

It's really the most shortsighted thing in the world to make dating decisions purely on some black-and-white assessment of a person you barely know. Figure out if you're attracted, then spend some time dating, and if her beliefs really are so extreme that you can't handle it, don't ask her out for a second or third date. MGTOWs and incels (and a lot of autists around here) struggle with matching girls at all because they take everything a girl says far too seriously, as though each sentence is the distilled essence of her soul, rather than an expression that fits the context of the situation.

why do you feel the need for all of society to agree with you though?

You know gays, trans, whoever the fuck was ostracized by their sexuality and or relationship goals in the past, have dealt with the same exact shit only way worse.

I admit, people who want a traditional family are hard to find these days. And yet, I still found that person myself. Dating and finding a partner for life was never "I get my pick of all the women out there". The majority don't want the relationship you want, so you find the one who does.

You don't get to decide what's best for society in a free country.

MGTOW is a good idea but the followers are retarded and mostly just incels looking for somewhere to dump their sadness.

MGTOW is a good way to learn how to not become a weak docile man. For learning how to know when you should prioritize your life and career over a relationship. Learning how to maintain masculine appearance when talking to females.

Basically MGTOW only applies if you are actually improving yourself drastically compared to when you were chasing women. Most people use MGTOW as an excuse to give up on finding a mate.

If you are aware of certain flaws in yourself/ your life that need improvement, MGTOW is a good idea.

If you plan on just becoming an unhealthy neet and telling yourself you're not in the wrong because muh MGTOW, you should reconsider your choices.

Someone with common sense. My man.

>single-mother's are scum sucking whores and unfit to raise children
>single-father's are perfectly capable of raising a child without the biological component of birth thought

Attached: 1215321467388.jpg (2893x1875, 1.39M)

>(and a lot of autists around here) struggle with matching girls at all because they take everything a girl says far too seriously, as though each sentence is the distilled essence of her soul, rather than an expression that fits the context of the situation.
I needed to hear this... Thanks. Is this something that applies to guys too?

You don't need a cult of mostly virgin autists to improve yourself.

>The whole "traditional family values being destroyed in modern culture/dating" thing is overblown.
>The majority of women these days want to play the field

user, these are a bit contradictory...

Hm? What I said was about guys, that they take everything a girl says too damn seriously, as though a girl's every utterance represents a clear look at who she is rather than something that's gone through several layers of "social appropriateness filters".

Guys "filter" what they say a lot as well, either putting on layers of hardness (when talking to other guys) or layers of being "appropriate" and "not perverse" (when talking to women they don't know well). Guys have a reputation of being more straightforward, but just as often the things they say are said because of the context rather than a core belief.

>why do you feel the need for all of society to agree with you though?
I don't, I want them to all follow certain conventions which align with my ideals and the ideals of society beforehand. What we have now is a morass of empty people wandering around without purpose.
>You know gays, trans, whoever the fuck was ostracized by their sexuality and or relationship goals in the past, have dealt with the same exact shit only way worse.
So? Faggots could keep it in the closet and trannies kill themselves anyway, and both are small minorities of society barely worth considering. Meanwhile, the free-for-all race to the bottom of morality in society today ultimately hurts everyone by undermining the fabric of society itself.

>You don't get to decide what's best for society in a free country.
Oh, please, "freedom" entails responsibility, and that's the exact opposite of rejecting moral standards like modern hedonists do--they don't want freedom, they want freedom FROM responsibility. That's a critical difference. And this sidesteps the sticking point that allowing people to individually decide what is "moral" simply results in morality not existing at all.
Most people don't have a strong moral compass in any way, they just do what is convenient and enticing at the time. Moral rules don't exist in society for those who always follow or always break them regardless, they exist for the majority of people who fall in the middle--those without inherent morals but who can act decently when given structures to follow. Take those structures away, and they act poorly.

It's a real thing that's happening, yes. The amount of people who think it's the cause of their relationship failings (or lack thereof) are straight up wrong, though.

It's overblown in the sense that user probably isn't single because a good amount of women don't want a serious relationship.

user is most likely single because he A : hasn't found a partner with the same views/wants/goals, and B : expects women to just be who he wants them to be and gets mad when they aren't.

Finding someone you love is hard. What a lot of the people in this thread want is an idea of a woman that isn't real, was never real, and never will be real.

What idea of a woman is that exactly?

Pay attention to the chart on the right. The number of decent women has most certainly collapsed, thanks to the unmitigated disaster of sexual """liberation""".

Attached: 1490346388820.jpg (4920x4161, 2.69M)

>empty people wandering around without purpose.

There are always people who don't fit into alignment with popular views. This is not a new trend, and you don't get decide what would make someone happier/make their life better for them.

>So, faggots can keep it in the closet and trannies kill themselves anyway, small portion of society barely worth considering.
Congrats, the times have changed and you are now that small portion of society barely with considering. You still don't get to decide what ideals people have.

>freedom entails responsibility, moral standards, etc
The morality of this is not a concrete thing, it's entirely your opinion of it. Opinion does not and should not be law. If you want that, go to an authoritarian/communist country.

You're sitting here whining that people need to think like you for you to be happy, but if that's what you need to be happy then you weren't destined to do well at any point in history. That's a childish view that actual adults don't have unless there's something actually wrong with them.

>Should I listen to the MGTOW movement?
No one really cares if you decide to die alone. Live your life, bro.

Do.what works for you. Just don't be a dick to others who disagree and never claim a monopoly on truth or act better than others for understanding some secret truth no one else gets. Because reality is very subjeftive.

That's all there is to it.

Watch me do it:

I disagree with you entirely. Have a good life. Easy right?

Why does the 'number' of what you consider to be decent women matter?

You only get one, autist. There's millions out there who agree with you. This isn't rocket science.

Different fag. But...

Seems the lonliest faggots want a 10/10 unicorn who was a virgin until they met him but ready to whore up for him and marry him and take care of him and never disagree with him.

Kind of the impression they give.

Women are people. It means any one of them is like this: sometimes they suck and sometimes they don't. You need someone who.sucks in ways you can handle and doesn't in ways that compliment the ways you do and don't. That's it.

this

I feel that way as well and dont expect a virgin gf. I dont slut shame and never have. The only thing I take consideration of is the idea that the number of sexual partners or at least certain ones among them will change you as a person.

>you don't get decide what would make someone happier/make their life better for them.
I'm not talking about micromanaging, I'm talking about broad moral standards--and this includes bringing back a sense of shame. But this is a non-argument to begin with, since you hold up "freedom" as some divine truth. Here's what "freedom" has gotten women especially so far:
ftp.iza.org/dp4200.pdf
>"measures of subjective well-being indicate that women's happiness has declined both absolutely and relative to men. The paradox of women's declining relative well-being is found across various datasets, measures of subjective well-being, and is pervasive across demographic groups and industrialized countries. Relative declines in female happiness have eroded a gender gap in happiness in which women in the 1970s typically reported higher subjective well-being than did men."

Blow your "freedom" out your ass along with your strawmen.

>the times have changed and you are now that small portion of society barely with considering.
>implying democratizing ideals isn't exactly the problem
You're brain dead, lolberg.
Let me spell it out for you, you complete and utter spastic: to find a woman, you must sift through those you don't want, and navigate society to get to the one who does share your beliefs. If in one society, a quarter of the women share my basic ideals, then I can start my search for a compatible personality from one quarter of the women. If in a second society, only 5% of women share my basic ideals, then I have only one-fifth the initial dating pool overall, and moreover it is restricted to isolated pockets as a fringe viewpoint rather than diffused among the population in a healthy society. Ergo, it is harder to find a good woman.

Pretty experienced with women, a bit older, and married. Trust me on this user. It's not the number that matters. It's why, and where they are now.

1/5 of 100 is 20% though :^)

The only knowledge of women and relationships he has is this one picture he posts everyday. He's never been in a relationship with a woman and doesn't interact with any. There is a certain amount of danger to a person when they lack the knowledge and experience to bridge the gap between shit they read on the internet and the actual real world. He's convinced these graphs represent the minimization of "decent" women while not actually having any working knowledge of real world decency. Its like he read the world is coming to an end but hasn't actually been outside to check.

I don't know where to meet women. I'm self employed so I seldom have to leave my house. It's just gym, grocery store, etc. I don't really do anything else. Does vidya or programming count as a hobby?

Oh I believe you. I just wish I could find the right ones to even get a chance with.

Definitely not losers, its mostly middle aged to old white guys that have been fucked over by their gf/wives and the court system.

When you put a bunch of relatively smart white guys together youre going to get some good ideas.

Not really Hitler... Everyone as a whole person is fringe. I don't share your beliefs. In fact mine are still mainstream. And yet for one reason or another I'm not compatible with a huge majority of women.

There are a million ways than just this one ideology you can differ on than someone.

So most people are fine with casual sex. Great, for me, that opens up more casual options than you.

For an actual soul.mste of a partner, you and I have the same odds.

Only difference is if you find a woman who's a voluntary virgin and wears it on her sleeve, she's already screaming at you "I probably share a lot of your views".

I gotta do a lot more digging and invest a lot more time and emotion.

We're all disadvantaged one way or another. You probably jsut feel more so because you've added sexual frustration on top of it as well as your social rejection making you bitter...

I meant "one fifth of the previous dating pool". So one fifth of one fourth.
>experience poster
Retard. Next you'll tell me anecdotes are more important than statistics.

It does to an extent if you're kinda short which is the worst thing a man can be in the eyes of women

He said bridge the gap. I've explained it to you before and it flies over your head every time.

There is more complicated reasoning behind why people with more partners are more likely to divorce.and it isn't dooming themselves to failed relationships. It's less fear of leaving shitty ones.

That's where your experience fails you. You don't realise that about people.

And you think marriage is the be all of relationships. For you it is. For many now, it isn't. Listen to comedtly for the last. Oh I don't know... 5 centuries now..

Miserable marriages is the oldest meme there is. We aren't afraid to leave anymore.

>Throwing stats out like they matter in this scenario

You. Still. Don't. Get. To. Dictate. What. People Do. Think. Or. Believe.

You can go ahead and talk about bringing back broad moral standards, but reality is unless everyone agrees with you naturally, then it'll happen, and if they don't, it wont.

I can sit here and judge people for a whole host of shitty beliefs and morals that I don't like, but the reality is that each person is a PERSON, capable of thinking and making their own decisions.

I promise you, you are the only person responsible for your aloneness. Grow the fuck up or accept it and continue being alone. This idealism for your entire society is childlike, borderline retarded, and I hope sincerely that one day you get over it, because you're in for a rough life if you don't, man.

I'm really not trying to shit on you, I'm trying to help you out right now. Treating life, and people, like there's an objective best way to do things is a great way to make everyone who isn't you fucking despise you.

Because at the end of the day, people want different shit out of life. The internet has been statistically proven to be the downfall of age 16-30 men in terms of happiness.

Should we ban the internet, or bully people into not using it? I'm guessing you like the internet because you're on Jow Forums. Know that if you never used it, statistics say you would be leading a happier life.

I'm not going to tell you that you can't use the internet, you don't know what's best for yourself, etc. Simply because i'm not an authoritarian dick.

You just met him haven't you?

Yeah, I don't frequent this board. Is he known for being like this? I legitimately feel bad for someone with those views. Literally setting himself up for disappointment, failure and loneliness in life.

>reddit spacing
Why am I not surprised
>Everyone as a whole person is fringe.
A fat load of shit. Very few people have entrenched convictions, at best they think they do because of social conditioning. Your supposed endgame would be a society of total atomization, and seeing as humans are social animals, it would be one of total misery as well. That's exactly where our society is headed, and it won't change so long as degenerates keep pushing for unconditional acceptance of their ways.
>For an actual soul.mste of a partner, you and I have the same odds.
The idea of a "soulmate" is just silly, there are people you are compatible with and people you aren't. Part of the reason sexual degeneracy has so much prevalence is the persistence of this delusion, hence people repeatedly try to "upgrade" rather than be content with what they have.
And we don't have the same odds when you allow every single person to choose for themselves how to define right and wrong. If you do that, morality ends up meaning "whatever benefits me first", and people leech off of society by exploiting it for personal gain. It's a tragedy of the commons, essentially, where everyone uses the same resource without giving a damn about its health.
>"I probably share a lot of your views".
And that doesn't translate at all into personality. It's not views which matter per se, but actions, and having no moral standards affects the latter.

>sexual frustration
That would imply I want sex before marriage, which I don't.
>social rejection
I've always been introverted, but I have never been ostracized. Try again. I'm bitter because people are complete shit, and moreover they're usually proud of it.

You can't talk sense into him. Set his trip on filter and move on. He's a waste of time.

>There is more complicated reasoning behind why people with more partners are more likely to divorce.and it isn't dooming themselves to failed relationships. It's less fear of leaving shitty ones.
Absolutely false. Divorce rates had been more or less steady from the early 20th century, until they exploded from the 60s onward. What changed? Sexual behavior. Here are some sources.

onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1741-3737.2012.00996.x/abstract
>Bivariate results suggested that delaying sexual involvement was associated with higher relationship quality across several dimensions. The multivariate results indicated that the speed of entry into sexual relationships was negatively associated with marital quality, but only among women."

onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1741-3737.2003.00444.x/abstract
>"I find that premarital sex or premarital cohabitation that is limited to a woman's husband is not associated with an elevated risk of marital disruption. However, women who have more than one intimate premarital relationship have an increased risk of marital dissolution."

psycnet.apa.org/record/2010-25811-011
>"Both structural equation and group comparison analyses demonstrated that sexual restraint was associated with better relationship outcomes, even when controlling for education, the number of sexual partners, religiosity, and relationship length."

>Yeah, I don't frequent this board. Is he known for being like this?
He shows up and spergs out about executing degenerates or some shit for a few weeks at a time, gets banned and then comes back and does it all over again. He's a cancer here that we've all begrudgingly learned to live with. Filtering his trip is the only way to browse this board with any kind of civility. So yeah, don't even start with him.

>when in self doubt and playing a losing field, yell reddit.

>very few people have entrenched convictions
So what you're saying is that you're better than everyone, your convictions are true, and people should listen to you.

I will say without a doubt right now. You're not alone because of the current culture in the western world. You're alone because of your extreme narcissism that borders on mental disorder and delusion.

>>psycheward

Ah shit, i'm out then.

I started to pick up on that I was arguing with someone who was too far gone to reason with, but yeah.. if it's that bad, peace yo.

>borders on mental disorder and delusion.
he's long past the border, friend

why not just try it for a little while and see if it works for you

you have nothing to lose really

>You can go ahead and talk about bringing back broad moral standards, but reality is unless everyone agrees with you naturally, then it'll happen, and if they don't, it wont.
Okay, then why do we have laws? I think we need to have everybody individually agree on every single law in the books, and if they don't, then they can do whatever they want. And plenty of these laws, mind you, DO NOT hurt anybody, so don't give me your NAP bullshit. They are rules which are put in place, and which people get no say in. Stop arguing as if freedom from any and all constraints is the ultimate ideal, you're just spouting platitudes.

>each person is capable of thinking and making their own decisions
And you call me childish.
> Treating life, and people, like there's an objective best way to do things is a great way to make everyone who isn't you fucking despise you
There literally is a best way to do things, given any set of conditions.
>The internet has been statistically proven to be the downfall of age 16-30 men in terms of happiness.
"In much wisdom is there much grief, and he that increaseth knowledge increaseth sorrow"

>i'm not an authoritarian dick.
You're a fucking serf and you don't care.
>implying I used reddit to discredit him
Brainlet.
>So what you're saying is that you're better than everyone, your convictions are true, and people should listen to you.
A good rule of thumb is that anything following "so what you're saying" is going to be a ridiculous strawman. In this case, people can hold foolish convictions, but the number of people who hold any convictions at all is low, and thus their behavior is largely set by societal norms that are initially created by those with will and conviction, or the lack thereof. I am arguing for my case through sources and logical constructions, you have nothing but name-calling.

bump

>I guaran-fucking-tee you, you will regret choosing to never start a family.
speak for yourself

untrue, this isnt happening in a vacuum
the more men that "go their own way" the more unstable society will become, there are very many people who care very much
especially the ones that yell incel

Attached: answer.jpg (1394x2048, 198K)

This shit autism and if you consider yourself right wing in anyway you should avoid it. You are not traditional in any sense if you think women have no role in bringing up a child, you're just a neet trying to compensate. Women are trash now but there are still good ones you just have to put yourself into the position to find them.

>Millions of adopted kids are cared by single fathers every day,
Well that's not true at all.

I'm just going to say this right out I have a biased when it comes to this issue because every romantic relationship, I have been in has stressed me out to the point of sickness and a lot of the benefits people list of having romantic Partners I can only remember when the relationship was good witch the say the least was only when they started. So for me I think relationships are attest of responsibility almost as much as reason to kid and my life is displayed to me that I'm just not good enough for it or any of the partners I've had.

I think the Unabomber was right when he talked about how technology was going to artificially isolate us and make us incapable of normal social interaction every relationship since I was 17 involved social media it was the social drama slander and Men trying to attract my social partners and romantic interests into adultery, That made me give up on dating for years.

I'm not going to lie and say it doesn't get lonely ivory made my accounts on dating websites over and over again and trying to get back into relationships but every time the same problems come up and any end up doing a cost-benefit analysis and withdrawing from the relationship within a certain time span never lasting more than 3 months, honestly I do want to have children because my father has five older sisters and so if I don't have kids my father's lineage will end unless my Dad's cousin as a son.

To sum everything up I would have a child via surrogacy or test tube baby but if I can't raise it on my own I will have to live with family members to help me in the process most likely mom and stepdad.

>unga bunga everyone should keep shitting out 3 kids each, what a great idea
You're even worse than MGTOWs

>MGTOW is really just a repackaging of incel bullshit.

No it's not. I have had plenty of pussy and girlfriends and I have just decided that American women are trash and not worth the time. Not true of all women, just the whores here. But until I can get out of here I'm not fucking around with any of the whores around here. I certainly wouldn't marry one and set myself up to be divorce raped.

So I'm not incel. As a matter of fact I've got two or three possible fucks right now - but I don't want them because I don't want the baggage that comes with these cunts.

>I disagree. Millions of adopted kids are cared by single fathers every day, it's not different if that kid has your genes, in fact, it's actually better

Really? It's better? Fuck you. That's the dumbest thing anyone has said on Jow Forums in the last hour

No, it's garbage.

What are they even about? Going their own way? Isn't that what every living being does by default? Why make a cult out of it?

I can get MRA people, but not this MGTOW thing.

a long story short: im a lot older than you so i know stuff

one of my friends lives the MGTOW life.
he has been divorced twice, and has grown kids owns his own house and does his own thing.

when i go to visit, its all about the women are shit and nothing but money hungry sluts, if you want sex get a prostitute etc etc
over and over again like a broken CD.

unless you have been raised in a single person household you dont understand what it like for the child to miss the parent they dont have whether it be mother or father.

No, you shouldn't. Telling a young man to go MGTOW is one of the worst possible advice you could give him. Absolutely horrible.

A partner is one of the most basic needs you have as a human being. Right below eating and sleeping. Why do you think culture always put such a huge impact on it throughout history? Why do you think every movie you see, every story you read has a romance subplot? It's because we need it and we crave it. And when you're young it will not be obvious. You just kind of want that. But, sooner or later you're going to hit a point where the lack of meaningful connections with the opposite sex (or same, if you're gay I guess) is going to drive you fucking insane. It's going to make your life feel meaningless and worthless. This is something that usually starts happening in mid-late 20s for people who haven't had relationships for a long time. And if you lived through your early and mid twentys with this MGTOW worldview it's going to be a hell of a fight with yourself to get out of that shitty mentality.

MGTOW is the easy way out. Acting like you don't really want something you seem not to be able to get. And I'm not talking about fucking here, you can fuck all you want, it won't satisfy your emotional needs. I know now it's cool to pretend that doesn't exist, that you're somehow beyond that, but it is something that's very much real. And not satisfying that need will crush you in one way or another. Results are always different, but almost never pretty. There are exceptions, as with everything, but that's all they are, exceptions. If you go through life thinking you're going to be the exceptions on this kind of matters you're most likely going to end up depressed and suicidal by the time you're 30.

(cont)

Go look at the proponents of this theory. Really study them. And then come back and tell me they're not bitter, sad and unhappy if you can. Tell me that's the kind of life you want to live. I'm not trying to bash on them, many of them had terrible life and terrible experiences with relationships. But theirs is not a life you want to have. And don't give me the "there are no good women here". That's a a lie and an excuse. If you think that it's because you never got your head out of your ass and went looking for them. Or you just simply assumed they're all trashy whores and didn't even try to learn the first thing about them. Yeah, there's also a lot of shitty ones too. Marriages and relationships can fail. But it's not something that just happens, you have a lot of control over your relationship. When a long relationship goes sour it's almost always because of both partners to certain extents. There's almost always something either of the partners could've done to save it.

And about the child part, good luck raising a kid alone. I don't care how rich you are, how experienced, how much free time you have. Raising a kid in this society takes a lot of effort and sacrifice even as a couple. Doing that alone? It's going to be hell. A meaningful hell, but a hell nonetheless. I know a relationships won't solve all your problems and won't automatically make you happy. I know it comes with a lot of problems and headaches. I know finding a good one in the first place is a challenge. But the alternative is so, so much worse. If you live your life with this kind of "women are trash, I don't need them, I can be happy on my own" mentality you're almost always going to end up in a world of hurt. And it will come to one point where you won't be able to crawl out of that hole you made for yourself.

>Why do you think culture always put such a huge impact on it throughout history? Why do you think every movie you see, every story you read has a romance subplot?

To convince you that:
>A partner is one of the most basic needs you have as a human being.

KEKSIMUS

Yeah, it's certainly not the other way around. Someone decided a long time ago to trick everybody into having relationships and (((they))) just kept the charade for thousands of years.

It's certainly not like reproduction is a biologic imperative and you need to have a relationship with a member of the opposite sex for that.

Attached: pepe (2).jpg (251x242, 24K)

>to trick everybody into having relationships
Like what you are doing right now? It's a namefag & he has an agenda that he's pushing. What a surprise.

You're goddamn right I'm trying to "trick" everybody into having relationships. Because I strongly believe that there are very few things in life that can give you more happiness than a good relationship. And that trying to find that is worth any kind of loss, hardship and sorrow you could experience as a result of your efforts.

Seriously, what do you think I have to gain from you having a relationship? Why would I be pushing this agenda?

The kind of men who choose MGTOW tend to be the kind of people who make terrible partners anyway. They're always bitter, angry individuals who resort to denying themselves any potential happiness with another human being, often due to anecdotes they've read on the internet.

If you choose your partner well, and you have enough positive traits to offer another person, there's no reason why you'd need to deal with the shit that you often read about in unequal relationships.

I think the movement is ridiculous, although I can see why it appeals to men who have had negative experiences with women.

>Because I strongly believe
It's very rude to push your beliefs onto others, even if you have good intention.

But that's what literally everyone is doing all the time. That's what the MGTOW movement is doing.

without population growth in the west the value in equities you hold, homes you own, and social security pension you receive quickly becomes worthless simply because there's no one left to sell it all to
no one will be there to populate the services you depend on or drive demand for the same goods that you need, let alone fill positions of higher level work that can't be automated
even more immediate, women are largely the drivers of the consumer economy, if they don't have a large source of income to draw from in marriage, the status symbols we depend on to be sold won't be, and men won't be forced into work to fulfill the incurred debts, killing off both the consumer economy and productivity in the labor market
so it's not a surprise people like you try to spook people away from this kind of thinking, and I would say it's much more likely that is the case than some tripfag actually being concerned for another's happiness
also I would expect someone who goes their own way that's even remotely an intelligent person would not advertise his line of thinking to anyone else because his own success depends on everyone else reproducing exactly for the reasons I outlined

and please don't do the muh biology thing
it's a "biological imperative" to reproduce, not for the male to spend life with the female or to raise the children
no animals do this, it's entirely a social construct (the one that society depends on most)

>No, you shouldn't. Telling a young man to go MGTOW is one of the worst possible advice you could give him. Absolutely horrible.

Yeah it probably is. Young men need to go out and get laid, but DO NOT get married to one of these whores.

Marriage is suicide for men in this culture. If you absolutely have to get married, you need to leave America. Learn Spanish and go live in Mexico, Central America, or South America. Or go to Asia.

I know it's hard to do that, but if you want to raise children and not get divorced that's what you need to do.

I'm a lot older than most of you. I had plenty of American women when I was younger but I'll NEVER have anything to with another one. I'll stick with Asian or Central American women. And if I decide to get married, I'll move to one of those places and stay there.

>It's very rude to push your beliefs onto others, even if you have good intention.

And we are supposed to give a fuck in you think it is rude?

>Young men need to go out and get laid
How do you talk to women in college without wanting to kill yourself?

>The kind of men who choose MGTOW tend to be the kind of people who make terrible partners anyway. They're always bitter, angry individuals who resort to denying themselves any potential happiness with another human being, often due to anecdotes they've read on the internet.

Another expert who knows it all. Pay attention to this advice from a guy who has opinions!

This shit again.

Listen, don't give up on women, you fucks. But don't settle for a shit woman either. Don't judge her based on looks or similar interests, instead go through some really rough shit together on both sides to see how she acts and how you act.

A good man and woman have each others backs through good times and bad, through poor and rich, sick and healthy.

They are rare though. So be prepared for that. Odds are high they will not be above a 6 in terms of appearance when you meet, but as time goes on you will not think anyone else is attractive.

>without population growth in the west the value in equities you hold, homes you own, and social security pension you receive quickly becomes worthless simply because there's no one left to sell it all to
>no one will be there to populate the services you depend on or drive demand for the same goods that you need, let alone fill positions of higher level work that can't be automated
>even more immediate,

Somebody took them some economics, didn't they? Well congratulations niggerfaggot. But you forgot something didn't you? Where does population growth come from? Two sources. Births and IMMIGRATION.

Now, niggerfaggot, have you noticed that immigration seems to be kind of popular right now?

Something else you missed niggerfaggot. How many people does it take to make a baby. Two, right? OK. How many people does it take to HAVE a baby. ONE niggerfaggot. Can you say single mothers?

Did you know that 80% of black babies are born to single mothers? About 40% of white babies are born to single mothers.

Don't need no daddies niggerfaggot. Just somebody to supply the sperm.

Or alternatively, just some Central Amercians to cross the border

So you think I'm on Jow Forums shilling for relationships because I'm scared that my house is going to drop in value or that the consumer economy is going to die off? That seems like more of a reasonable explanation than me just wanting to give heartfelt advice? I mean, to me this sounds like insanity, but if you really think like that I guess there's no way I can convince you of anything.

>no animals do this
Except those that do
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monogamy_in_animals
And cmon, you don't need to be an expert in biology to know we're wired to raise children as couples. It's why both men and women have strong emotions for the children and for their partner after birth. That's the most obvious imperative you can find. If we were not wired to stick around for the kids we wouldn't give a shit about them. I'm not arguing that it's in our biological nature to spend the entire life with the female, that's certainly debatable. But you are biologically driven to stick around to raise the kid up to a certain age.

I've never been to USA so I can't talk from experience, but I think you're exaggerating. There are people who don't share the mainstream views and practices everywhere, so even if the general population in USA is mostly made up of cheating, selfish backstabbing thots there should be some good girls out there. But there's nothing wrong with trying your chances somewhere you may have a higher chance of success.

Relationships provide nothing of value to a rational man. Women take vastly more than they give. The equation was fairly balanced 70 years ago or so, but women grew more and more worthless since then.

If you want to fuck, there are plenty of options without getting too involved with a female.

MGTOW is doing whatever you want. If you want to be noble and give some random woman more than you reveive, this still counts as your own way. Just be aware of what you are doing.

>women are largely the drivers of the consumer economy, if they don't have a large source of income to draw from in marriage, the status symbols we depend on to be sold won't be, and men won't be forced into work to fulfill the incurred debts, killing off both the consumer economy and productivity in the labor market

Say what? Took a econ class and brain curdled up. Women work bitch, in case you aint't noticed. The ones who don't get all kinds of transfer payments. They don't need marriage. They just pump out the babies and get that good govt money printed on demand. Or get money from the sperm donors.

And I have no idea how you dragged productivity in this.

>Relationships provide nothing of value to a rational man. Women take vastly more than they give. The equation was fairly balanced 70 years ago or so, but women grew more and more worthless since then.

You left out an important word there.

AMERICAN women take vastly more than they give

>That seems like more of a reasonable explanation than me just wanting to give heartfelt advice?
>this much strawman and crocodile tears in one post
picrelated.jpg.png
come on
we both know if the goyim don't make babies that the hordes of third worlders won't be enough to sustain our institutions

>Except those that do
3% of mammals, except nothing in that wiki indicates that homo sapiens are part of that 3% for biological reasons
>But you are biologically driven to stick around to raise the kid up to a certain age.
except for the fathers that don't?
you evolutionary people are a hoot, you seriously think it's fundamental to the organism rather than intense social conditioning? At what point in civilization did social monogamy even become the most common arrangement? You can't even claim that modern humans engage in the other forms of monogamy.

who funds the welfare state single mothers depend on? will single mothers and their children take over when marriage and birthrates continue to plummet?

Attached: 1435448056218.jpg (662x724, 181K)

>How do you talk to women in college without wanting to kill yourself?

Probably by talking to women who are not in college.

>who funds the welfare state single mothers depend on? will single mothers and their children take over when marriage and birthrates continue to plummet?

Will they take over? You haven't been paying attention have you? They ALREADY TOOK OVER Holmes.

Who funds it? YOU DO for now. But of course we run about $1 trillion a year deficit now annually, so depending on how you want to divvy it up among the various spending categories you could say that the WORLD is paying for it

>The kind of men who choose MGTOW tend to be (,,,) always bitter, angry individuals
Well then, no problem with anyone choosing it, right?

>I've never been to USA so I can't talk from experience, but I think you're exaggerating.

I'm generalizing. Most of the young marriage-aged women in the US are useless whores or latent useless whores. It's not really their fault. The culture and the political climate is engineered to create them, and it works. And it gets WORSE, year after year. This is no accident. This is the feminist/leftist agenda in action and it is working.

Now, not all eligible women are like that. There are places, primarily in the south, that are more traditional and relatively religious where you can find decent women. You can find decent women anywhere in the US, but there are more of them in these areas. Why? CULTURE & TRADITION still prevail in these areas. It's all about the culture, which is all about the political agenda being pushed out of the major liberal population centers by the elites.

>>The kind of men who choose MGTOW tend to be (,,,) always bitter, angry individuals

Not always. Some guys get some experience with women from other countries and realize that what they are getting here is a screw job.

>>Young men need to go out and get laid
>How do you talk to women in college without wanting to kill yourself?

If you're college age start planning how you can get out of here. You're going to have to learn Spanish anyway if you stay in the US. Why not go south for a while and live down there? Learn Spanish. There are ways to do this.

They you don't have to deal with the college sluts.

Really, there are two ways to go MGTOW or MGADW (men going a different way)

>Really, there are two ways to go MGTOW or MGADW (men going a different way)

or MGTFO (men getting the fuck out)

>This is the feminist/leftist agenda in action
oh fuck off
you fucking hillbillies and your traditional gender roles can kiss my ass

I go my own way because "useless" whore means they are poor, in debt, have no skills, and do nothing but consume, the only difference from before is the debt

the "whore" part is just that they can fuck around now before finding their betabux atm in shining armor

you fucking morons think the way to fix that is to wind the clock back and make them homekeepers and sit with the kids all day again, rather than actual equals to men

the shit you peddle is just as cancerous as the tumblerina flower-power berniebro SJW cunts that killed liberalism

Attached: 658746548.png (371x382, 264K)

>men
>women
>equal
lmao the fuck are you smoking

>you fucking morons think the way to fix that is to wind the clock back and make them homekeepers and sit with the kids all day again, rather than actual equals to men

No I actually don't think that user. I am merely reporting what I have seen. I'm not a christian and I don't really like living in a dream world so I'm not into these women.

And fuck you. I'm glad you're stuck beating your meat and going your own way you loser.

At least the traditional guys get girls and create lives however backward they might appear to you.

You sit around and beat off and worry about whether girls have debt or not. Sounds like a happy life!

>>men
>>women
>>equal
>lmao the fuck are you smoking

Why user will sit around beating off for the rest of his life - when he's not getting cucked by his equal

>the shit you peddle is just as cancerous as the tumblerina flower-power berniebro SJW cunts that killed liberalism

You silly little goose! What did you think liberalism was you big dummy?

Women and men are not supposed to be equal, ya dingus.

Women are naturally better at some things and men are naturally better at some things. Playing off the general strengths of each other made us work well as a species.

Trying to make us equal is fucking it up.

Women and men are more unhappy and suicidal in western countries than ever before.