so, apart from STEM and literal backbreaking manual labor, what's the best career path a single, broke, childless, debtless 18 year old should take in south FL with the objective of making as much money as possible and leaving florida? vocational? HVAC? welding? community college? registered nurse? forklift operator? pipe insulator? physical therapist assistant? occupational therapy assistant? mechanical installer?
where should i go? idaho? fargo ND? vermont? colorado? DFW? vermont?
If you just care about money then go into the finance sector.
that's not extremely vague and broad at all
can you think of a specific job title?
all require 4+ year bachelors and 5-10 years of experience minimum
Pipe fitter,industrial maintenance mechanic or industrial electrician.
Move to Michigan, best place in the country for skilled trades
>Pipe fitter,industrial maintenance mechanic or industrial electrician.
ok, can someone with 0 natural talent, experience or personality for handyman-ness get a job like that with a vocational degree?
The most money potential will always be found doing your own business.
Yeah, you don't even need to go to vocational school. They're so in demand in Michigan they'll hire and train you. You'll make 70k a year within 3 years. It's not back breaking work eirher. I was a college student making almost 80k a year .
>The most money potential will always be found doing your own business.
biggest meme
nobody cares about your stupid business or service startup, you won't even get a client, let alone if you're literally just some fucking nobody kid that doesn't even have some massive tech breakthrough ready for the patenting
multibillion dollar corporations and actual established successful businesses have already monopolized every sector of every industry, the only way is to create an entirely new industry, get lucky, be one of those A.I robotics programming tech-whatever the hell prodigy kids (which i'm not one of) and or have access to leveraging large amounts of capital, and even then you face the glorious 75% failure rate
75% of actual, venture-backed startups fail, leaving 25% to those that don't not fail, how many within that percentage do you think are successful, and how many within that percentage of that percentage don't eventually have something make the business go bankrupt?
yeah lmao, not in 2018, everything's already been done
maybe if i existed in an actual time where anything was possible and everyone could afford everything and everything was new and all it took was a firm handshake, some hard work and a good smile, like the 70s or if i got in on some boom like the dot com, literally just rake in millions for copy pasting some hypertext and dropshipping fucking hemorrhoid cream
>Yeah, you don't even need to go to vocational school. They're so in demand in Michigan they'll hire and train you. You'll make 70k a year within 3 years. It's not back breaking work eirher. I was a college student making almost 80k a year .
sounds too good to be true but even mainstream media is spreading shit like this so might as well give it a try i guess
i just need to make as much as i can as quick as i can before the next bubble bursts and the economy tanks big time, maybe buy a mobile home or something
what year was this in? when did you get in on that?
oh yeah and what city? ann arbor? lansing? dare i say detroit?
yep, that sounds about right. Nobody will trust someone without a formal education and experience with their money
You realize I'm giving you first hand advice, right? I am in the skilled trades and I make that kind of money. I get job offers all the time.
>yep, that sounds about right. Nobody will trust someone without a formal education and experience with their money
except now the work force is heavily saturated and everybody has a formal education and experience, and the only reason why you get hired is if you went to an ivy, got lucky, you're 50 years old and have been using the same job title for 20+ years, cronyism, nepotism, and of course the biggest taker: you have a vagina
are you...do you even realize any of this? i find it hard to believe you don't actually already know this, specially if you're over the age of say, 14, or well i mean, it may very well be possible that you're a literal boomer
>You realize I'm giving you first hand advice, right?
did i come across as being hostile or sarcastic? or do you feel like i'm not praising you enough or...something? little bit of both?
i was literally just asking you what city i should go to
what city / area should i go to? what city / area are you in?
>I am in the skilled trades and I make that kind of money.
indeed
>I get job offers all the time.
good for you, i would also like to get job offers all the time, so please help me out by answering my questions so i can get there with a clear plan and understanding in my head?
what's your job title and how many years have you held it for btw?
oh yeah and what are your thoughts on indiana / wisconsin? is michigan better?
Oh sorry, I thought you were the same person as the posts below yours as well.
Check out Grand Rapids, very nice place, low cost of living and skilled trades pay well and very high demand. All the smart people went to college, so there's a huge shortage of smart people there right now.
Any trade you go into is good. I'd recommend industrial electricity and them moving your way into learning PLC programming. Automation is taking over everywhere and it pays 40+ an hour. If you don't mind school, it might not hurt to take some industrial electricity classes and PLC programming classes. If you just wanna get a job, look for an entry level apprenteship job. It took me about 3 years to double my wage, but I was aggresive in changing jobs for better wages.
I no longer am in Michigan or skilled trades, I left about 3 months ago for Silicon Valley. Went back to school while I worked, however it's still a good career and something you can do the rest of your life or start your own business.
>Oh sorry, I thought you were the same person as the posts below yours as well.
ok
>Check out Grand Rapids, very nice place, low cost of living and skilled trades pay well and very high demand. All the smart people went to college, so there's a huge shortage of smart people there right now.
noted
what year was this in? when was the last time you heard of the status of it? is it current?
>I'd recommend industrial electricity and them moving your way into learning PLC programming
just to let you know i am a shit handyman literally don't even know how to fix a toilet to save my own life and blue collar work probably isn't for me because i'm mildly autistic and do well with complex abstract non-STEM related things as opposed to simple repetition which frustrates me because it's too simple, and i am literally braindead and hopeless when it comes to anything that involves geometry but anything that's below or around algebra is fine
do you still think i would be able to handle industrial electricity > PVC?
>if you don't mind school, it might not hurt to take some industrial electricity classes and PLC programming classes
no i don't, it's just the things i'll have to do in school, will i be utilizing geometry, calculus and or advanced math (above algebra)?
how much is school? how long do i have to go?
>If you just wanna get a job, look for an entry level apprenteship job.
yeah i see them they're everywhere and start at $15-17/hr
>It took me about 3 years to double my wage, but I was aggresive in changing jobs for better wages.
sounds like you're a real blue collar type
>left about 3 months ago for Silicon Valley
oh fuck, even if i had the opportunity to do that i wouldn't, i hate rat races, you must be making at least 6 figures if you're moving there though, what's your job title there?
>rest of your life or start your own business.
if i just so happen to spot a business opportunity then i'll do that but otherwise the only reason i'm in is materialism
>what year was this in? when was the last time you heard of the status of it? is it current?
It's current information
>just to let you know i am a shit handyman literally don't even know how to fix a toilet to save my own life and blue collar work probably isn't for me because i'm mildly autistic and do well with complex abstract non-STEM related things as opposed to simple repetition which frustrates me because it's too simple, and i am literally braindead and hopeless when it comes to anything that involves geometry but anything that's below or around algebra is fine
Skilled trades are not simple repetition. You have to use your mind every day and it's always a different problem. A skilled trade is not your average assembly line worker. I think you'd surprise yourself how quickly you catch on to being good at a job if you work at it.
>how much is school? how long do i have to go?
3 or 4 classes at a community college should be able to land you an entry level job. You'd probably start at around 16-19 bucks an hour and would be able to move up quickly if you learn.
>sounds like you're a real blue collar type
No not really, I just needed a way to make money. Just did my best to learn.
>oh fuck, even if i had the opportunity to do that i wouldn't, i hate rat races, you must be making at least 6 figures if you're moving there though, what's your job title there?
Software Engineer. Not for everyone. I'm anti rat race, I just do what I can to have money to allow me to have free time.
>if i just so happen to spot a business opportunity then i'll do that but otherwise the only reason i'm in is materialism
I just mean you can give yourself the opporunity to start a business if you make a career out of the skilled trades. A business isn't for everyone, but it can also give you financial freedom. It can also make you go broke. Most people go broke.
>3 or 4 classes at a community college should be able to land you an entry level job.
ah, college? there's no vocational / certification course or technical school or something i can do instead that's shorter?
i feel like it's a daunting decision to put myself through college before absolutely knowing what i want to commit the next half a decade of my life studying and rest of my life waving around since it shapes our entire being in this day and age, which sounds hypocritical specially given my intentions but it's different than just working since i can actually separate that from my life and can quit and change jobs at my leisure without sacrificing much
since apprenticeships and paid training require no experience, wouldn't an apprenticeship be all i need to land an entry level?
can i just pay the shit, take 5 courses to get the job, then drop out or will i get fired?
55k a year after taxes is my personal "financial freedom" number, what level of electrical would i need to achieve this?
>Software Engineer
god damnit, i don't know if it was the combination of being abused for not being able to understand math topics in textbooks, being forced to bring home nothing but A's and B+'s and not answering questions fast enough or entitlement or low IQ or maybe just a little of everything but i fucking wish i was born the STEM type and i'm jealous reeee
i tried so hard to learn to program, spent so many hours going through tutorials and shit studying syntax and reading forums for months but my stupid fucking reee
i find it hard to believe you're not in a rat race and super stressed out, pressured, overworked and constantly surging with adrenaline in a place like silicon valley but i mean i guess if it's chill and you can do it then good for u i guess
>Most people go broke.
this is so true and why i'm very hesitant when it comes to le entrepreneurship meme, it's literally like glorified gambling and the 75%+ odds even if you establish yourself are not in your favor
>ah, college? there's no vocational / certification course or technical school or something i can do instead that's shorter?
Not that I'm aware of but maybe. I never did it. I just went to a recruiting agency and said what I was looking for. This was in 2013. It's just as easy to find a job, there's no one out there. My former workplace has been trying to find someone for 6 months now.
A lot of it really depends workplace to workplace. Some require an actual apprenticeship and some will hire you as an entry level employee. You don't necessarily need the classes, but it doesn't always hurt to have a few under your belt to give you a little better chance at getting the job.
Many apprenticeships will actually pay for you to take classes. You don't actually have to get a degree or anything. It's just about taking some courses for knowledge of the job. You do have to actually finish the classes you sign up for though!
>55k a year after taxes is my personal "financial freedom" number, what level of electrical would i need to achieve this?
You could make 55k a year within a few years on the job. I don't know any electricians or mechanics making less than 25 an hour. That's basically the minimum after you gained experience.
With electrical knowledge you can also work with PLC programming, which is basically programming robots. It's different than software engineering and programming you might know, but it pays well and that job isn't going anywhere. One guy I know is making 140k a year doing that, no college degree, self taught with a couple community college classes. It's something you might not get to right away, but a few years working as an industrial mechanic or industrial electrician might get you in to one of those jobs (albeit you won't be making that much on your first gig).
>i find it hard to believe you're not in a rat race and super stressed out, pressured
Maybe a little bit.. lol
>You don't necessarily need the classes, but it doesn't always hurt to have a few under your belt to give you a little better chance at getting the job.
ah, interesting you say that given the blue-collar craze and the state of desperation companies are in just to find people
in that regard, maybe the blue collar shortage applies more towards entry-level / apprenticeship and grunt-esque positions?
>Many apprenticeships will actually pay for you to take classes. You don't actually have to get a degree or anything. It's just about taking some courses for knowledge of the job. You do have to actually finish the classes you sign up for though!
of course i'd finish the classes, but the question is whether or not all i would have to do is the initial 3-5 courses / classes and then dropout so i can get that entry level industrial electrical job you were talking about without getting fired
if they pay for it and i'm not sacrificing anything then why not i guess
>You could make 55k a year within a few years on the job
ah fuck, i was hoping for less than or around a year to hit 50k take home pay because i can just go wild and have an immense feeling of financial security at that number but whatever, 25 an hour is way better than most college jobs anyways
>With electrical knowledge you can also work with PLC programming, which is basically programming robots. It's different than software engineering and programming you might know, but it pays well and that job isn't going anywhere. One guy I know is making 140k a year doing that, no college degree, self taught with a couple community college classes. It's something you might not get to right away, but a few years working a
doesn't sound like something i could handle, i feel like my limit would be industrial electrical
>Maybe a little bit.. lol
KEK you uh, you sure about it being a "little" bit?
you...don't happen to be on a "little bit" of nootropics and or encapsulated meth aka adderall and or coke do you?
>ah, interesting you say that given the blue-collar craze and the state of desperation companies are in just to find people
Trade jobs have never been jobs you have to go to college to get. You learn them on the job. There's a shortage right now, and people still aren't going in to them, but they're getting more attention from political talking heads. The anti-college/trade jobs rhetoric sometimes makes me wonder if it's just politicians trying to connect with non-college grads? Regardless, there's a demand.
>in that regard, maybe the blue collar shortage applies more towards entry-level / apprenticeship and grunt-esque positions?
The shortage applies to more experienced people. However due to the fact that there's a shortage of experienced people, they're willing to take on people to train and teach the job because they can't find anyone. The only thing I knew on my first day of the job was basically tightening and loosening bolts.
Also, you wouldn't be "dropping out", you'd just sign up for some classes and learn information. There's no degree you're working towards to drop out of. Don't look at it like that, look at it like you're getting information.
Personally I'd look into recruiting agencies and tell them you're interested in entry level maintenance mechanic and maintenance electrician positions. Taking classes might not hurt, but it also might not be necessary.
>ah fuck, i was hoping for less than or around a year to hit 50k
I don't think I explained very clearly, sorry about that. My first job I made about 40k, changed jobs after 1 year and made 55k and 1 year later changed jobs and was making between 70 and 80k a year. You can too. Your first job, expect to make between 16 and 19 an hour. Work a few saturdays here and there it's easily 50k.
>doesn't sound like something i could handle,
It'd be something you work your way into over time with more experience. Never tell you can't handle something. You can.
>Also, you wouldn't be "dropping out", you'd just sign up for some classes and learn information. There's no degree you're working towards to drop out of. Don't look at it like that, look at it like you're getting information.
except there is, you are getting a piece of paper which signifies the completion of a certain set of accomplishments, and if you drop out, meaning you no longer meet the threshold for the level of accomplishments required to receive the piece of paper, you don't get it
also i would have to be dishonest with myself to do that, you are effectively committing to a 4-year program, not a joke considering how short our life spans are and how much that piece of paper shapes us in our society, around 1460+ days out of an average of around 25,915, which is roughly 5.63% of our lives, meaning by the time it would take to get another degree and switch you'll have used up almost a decade or 10+%
>I don't think I explained very clearly, sorry about that. My first job I made about 40k, changed jobs after 1 year and made 55k and 1 year later changed jobs and was making between 70 and 80k a year. You can too. Your first job, expect to make between 16 and 19 an hour. Work a few saturdays here and there it's easily 50k.
this is reassuring, i can easily work 7 days of the week
>It'd be something you work your way into over time with more experience. Never tell you can't handle something. You can.
just gotta b myself xD
oh if only i had that outlook
maybe if i reap some rewards i'll be able to get on that level of reality
>except there is, you are getting a piece of paper which signifies the completion of a certain set of accomplishments, and if you drop out, meaning you no longer meet the threshold for the level of accomplishments required to receive the piece of paper, you don't get it
For skilled trades you don't go to college. Community colleges don't even have 4 year degree programs. By signing up for classes you're not working towards a degree, you're gaining knowledge from a few classes. If you want a 4 year degree, then you wouldn't go into a skilled trade afterwards. The point of a skilled trade is that you can learn a skill and not have to get a college degree to do so. That's why you see so much shit talking from people between skilled trades vs college students (which i think is asinine btw).
Is that making a little more sense? I wasn't telling you to enroll in a 4 year university to get these jobs, it's 100% unnecessary and defeats the purpose of actually going in to a skilled trade. Taking a few classes would just give you some information you could use to get smarter. Nothing more nothing less.
>if only i had that outlook
work on it, and you will
>For skilled trades you don't go to college. Community colleges don't even have 4 year degree programs. By signing up for classes you're not working towards a degree, you're gaining knowledge from a few classes. If you want a 4 year degree, then you wouldn't go into a skilled trade afterwards. The point of a skilled trade is that you can learn a skill and not have to get a college degree to do so. That's why you see so much shit talking from people between skilled trades vs college students (which i think is asinine btw).
Is that making a little more sense? I wasn't telling you to enroll in a 4 year university to get these jobs, it's 100% unnecessary and defeats the purpose of actually going in to a skilled trade. Taking a few classes would just give you some information you could use to get smarter. Nothing more nothing less.
ah ok, well then yes, if it's just a few classes which are already paid for then why not
you *were* implying / suggesting that i had to actually go to college as opposed to taking a few classes if you look at what you previously said though
how long are these classes btw? and which specifically by name do you recommend i take?
i didn't know you could just show up and take a few classes without having to shell out cash for a year's worth of tuition or commit to an actual 2-4 year degree and then drop out or something, that's why i kept talking about dropping about, because i assumed you were saying i had to study for a degree and were just trying to add some new-age b urself pizzazz to me not wanting to do that by "looking at it differently" or something
how much do they cost btw? for all the classes you think i need for industrial electrical
>work on it, and you will
it's a byproduct of material wealth so i guess
oh yeah for sure, you only pay for the class. At a community college a class is about 300 dollars. They run for a semester which is September to December and January to May.
Some classes to look for would be something like industrial electricity, electrical schematics and diagrams, a welding class might not hurt either.
You can talk to an adviser at the community college as well, but watch out they usually try to push you to take more classes than you realistically need.
You have 2 routes, you apply to jobs and then they might send you to school to take the classes. They would pay for that.
You can take a few classes before you get the job. You'd have to pay that out of pocket.. HOWEVER, if you fill out your FAFSA you will probably get pell grants and not have to pay either way.
>i didn't know you could just show up and take a few classes without having to shell out cash for a year's worth of tuition or commit to an actual 2-4 year degree and then drop out or something, that's why i kept talking about dropping about, because i assumed you were saying i had to study for a degree and were just trying to add some new-age b urself pizzazz to me not wanting to do that by "looking at it differently" or something
hahaha that's really funny! nope no new age bullshit from me, just trying to let you know your options.
What I'd recommend is first trying to get a job before taking classes. Call up some recruiters and see if they can help you find a job (it's free). A popular one is Aerotek. For the most part they're all annoying cucks, but since you don't have experience, it could be a huge help.
>oh yeah for sure, you only pay for the class. At a community college a class is about 300 dollars. They run for a semester which is September to December and January to May.
Some classes to look for would be something like industrial electricity, electrical schematics and diagrams, a welding class might not hurt either.
You can talk to an adviser at the community college as well, but watch out they usually try to push you to take more classes than you realistically need.
You have 2 routes, you apply to jobs and then they might send you to school to take the classes. They would pay for that.
ok, i actually never knew you could just pay for individual classes like that
interesting, i wonder how many other jobs i could get just paying for individual classes...
i wonder if this would go as far as to suggest that the "bachelors degree required" job requirement is in fact a meme and they just want you to have taken certain classes...
>watch basic electrical theory videos
>oh ok
>yeah that sounds about right, don't i remember some of this from middle school?
>progress through playllist
>w- hold on *google*
>ah i see
>about a quarter way through
>what the fuck
>google
>still don't understand
>what
>suddenly i can't grasp this for some reason
>panic
>watch real life journeyman electrician videos doing actual hands-on work
>literally just pushing wires through walls and shit replacing panel breakers and shit tying wires and whatever
>suddenly reassured
i'm still not sure if this electrical thing is for me i feel like i might have to end up doing welding but i mean if i actually get to see the actual hands-on day-to-day required work done with an apprenticeship and another human being in real life then i guess i can learn pretty quick monkey see monkey do esque
fuck it i'm gonna do it it doesn't look thAt hard...but fuck me if a journeyman let alone industrial isn't my limit...maybe, if i spent a long time going through each thing one by one