Why marxism can´t work

Marxism works perfectly.
Its goal is to put all the power in the hands of a few elite, while the rest of the country is too hungry, disconnected and ill-informed to stop them.

>what are the main errors?
Human nature

Anyone have a link to that article some editor publish and hid whole family was murdered the next day? I can't remember what he had published. Might've been on CNBC or something.

i should deal with the dialectic of hegel and german idealism ... thank you

is there a short summary?

>Advocates society of equal individuals
>Equal and individual are mutually exclusive states of being
>This isn't a problem

without the ability to have private property everything goes downhill. also overqualified people and no reason to work hard

people are inherently are not equal.If you mean the whole classless society "marxism"Define it

Trying to impose a whole ideology on a group of people is totalitarianism. So is SJW, facism, and so forth. If a group of people wanted to set up a commune, or a white neighbourhood, then that's a different matter, that's a choice.

>Atheist state
>sucess

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You can never eliminate the class systems or currency because people are allowed to have personal property. Personal property can become a form of capital used to be exchanged for other goods and services. A smart person could accrue a lot of capital in the form of personal property over time and use it to trade for anything they wanted, thus being basically a rich person. Marxism is an ideology, while capitalism is just basic economics using supply and demand to accrue capital. Its how the real world works. Not how one wishes it would work.

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Not really, although perhaps ironically the German Wikipedia's article on "Dialektik" manages a good overview. This article also recaps certain key aspects of the philosophy for beginners: counter-currents.com/2017/03/trump-will-complete-the-system-of-german-idealism/

It’s a system whose main pillars of support are based on how good a person is, because all it takes are some assholes in administrative roles to crumble the entire system into yet another failed state.

Unreliable in what sense

It doesn't work because it's polar extreme of centralization of power and ownership. It's a lie to claim that the people own the means of production. The state does.
And what happens with extreme centralization of power? Corruption.
Also, you have zero intensive to give a shit and work hard if you don't own the fruits of your labor.
Also, the the state must force people to adhere to this cancerous ideology, which always ends up in brutal oppression and murder.
Also, look at that ridiculous beard. This guy's definitely a terrorist.

Communism is the ideology of equality. That's what class warfare is all about. Creating a society of social, political and economic equality across the board. No more fat cats and poor little guys. Everyone is equal

The problem with this ideology is, by defintion, individuality and equality are mutually exclusive states of being, hence the oxymoron 'equal individuals'. You and I are individuals, unique from our point of view to our dna, one of a kind, not equal to anything. To be an individual is to be in a constant state on inequality.

The equality Marx is wanting is philosophically impossible to achieve. We are a planet on 7.5b individuals. We can't be equals. The reason communsim fails is because it's try to force a world of individuals to live the lie of equality. We all know happens when we try to live lies.

>This guy's definitely a terrorist.
kek

your point are logic, but I do not understand where the huge attraction comes from
"Thus, for example, the cure for the West’s radical feminism is for the feminist to recognize that the biological conditions that make her a woman – with a woman’s mind, emotions, and drives – cannot be denied and are not an oppressive “other.” They are the parameters within which she can realize who she is and seek satisfaction in life. No one can be free of some set of parameters or other; life is about realizing ourselves and our potentials within those parameters."

good read user

That sounds like a fake religion

>trusting a few dudes with total, centralized power, on the hopes that it will be temporal
>thinking a few dudes can handle a country's economy better than a decentralized market working as a distributed brain
>philosophical implications of the individual submitting to the Collective (controled by a few individuals)

And now you know why people call the marxists, cultists.

Jesus fuck I thought we had all moved past this, but no, we're still at the very basics of politics where we discuss fucking Marx and his shitty jewish dystopia

And don't forget that modern day egalitarianism is the same ideology by a different name.
They talk about equality being one of the founding principles of western democracy, but those who founded western democracy owned slaves. The lie of equality has pumped hard into the heads of the masses for a reason.

>it sounds very comfy
ye im sure it was very comfy for those russians 100 y ago

unable to be completely programmed without error

Marxism can never work because the (((they))) will always undermine it.

I'm glad you like. I recommend to work through the philosophers in the listed order when you can find the time; researching these matters and the surrounding history has legitimately helped me make sense of all problems I had in life.

imagine living in a society where you cannot improve your life through your own means
you cannot work extra hours and invest that income. you cannot network to attain favorable connections. your home, your food, and your job where given to you by the state.
imagine trying to convince a decadent bearuocrat that you need more resources for your sick children. imagine being reduced to begging for everything
imagine living in a society where the one with the least personal dignity is the one who prospers

because people dont like to be fucked around with by government.

ask 40 million people who died in gulags in soviet russia.

tell me , how bad was it in Poland really ?
I will ,
i wonder more and more how all these ideologies radicalize themselves like Feminism, veganism etc ... the core component of the revolutionary movements always seems to be the same

The three main problems are as follows:

>Socialist Calcus Problem
Without pricing economic decisions become arbitrary and the ensuing exchanges must lead to chaos.

>Incentitive Problem
Without the ability to acquire private property the creation of wealth is prohibited as no participant in the economy will have a reason to work, as he won't be able to reap the fruits of his labor.

>Command Economy Problem
As the market is a thousands of years old structure created from the bottom up by individual participants, it is futile to believe that any centralization or piloting of this process can be implimented afterwards.

>Marxism can never work because the (((they))) will always undermine it.

they invented it to undermine it XD

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It's based on a materialist philosophy and therefor will inevitably fail

ergo, materialism must be replaced by idealism and idealism is transported in the form of a religion

Lack of self-awareness for the most part is my theory. Basically anything that catches on attracts hangers-on who are in it for reasons other than being true believers; "useful idiots" in Soviet parlance. They absorb the tenets as a means of being popular or successful or w/e and suddenly have all their social capital riding on sticking to tenets they don't understand without being able to stand for them, what with having been insecure/insincere from the start. The ones least confident in their ability to thrive without the "correct" label then hole up with similar types as the trend moves on and double down on the aspects they do know to the exclusion of all further discussion or development that might endanger their newfound placebo of social standing or moral firmity or even just enjoyment.

It's good to know about how cults work when you are on Jow Forums. There are a lot of Bauernfänger types around here nowadays.

Scratch the Jow Forums bit. It's useful to know this anywhere.

The problem is, you need to study to understand something like capitalism.

However, Marxism has lower entry requeriments, becuase it "sounds good" at a very basic, emotional way of thinking

>why is world bad (empathy)
>people suffer and shit (empathy)
>look at these rich assholes (envy)
>they must be guilty (hatred)
>lets tear it down and bring about the utopia (desire for justice)
>it makes sense that everyone is equal (desire to subdue envy, also cognitive simplicity)
>everyone should have what they need (simplistic justice, empathy)
>lets make it happen, we'll organize society (desire for control, neuroticism)

I'm pretty much immune to that (bauernfängerei) and yes i already understand what the basics in the cult business are,i only wonder if the hunger of these brainlets is ever satisfied, and what happens when the wind turns

>Implying all individuals are equal

See it requires living in a dream world. The fat ass 40 year old McDonald's manager and a 40 year old brain surgeon are not of equal value to society.

Karl Marx was a jew and marxism is designed to oppress and create an artificial defacto elite maintained by a totalitarian state that elite was meant to be jewish. The eternal enslaved non paid worker the goy used and discarded like beef.

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false, Communiosm is the Talmud

you mean the jews colonized us like we africa, installed there rules and laws

Do you really believe that anyone here has read Marx?
Of course it can work. Basically any system could work, and in many ways the Soviet system was superior to capitalism.
But whether that functioning is right or not is an entirely different question. None of the modern systems seem to uphold real traditional values, which is the main problem, they all just undermine in different ways.

Not necessarily. Just the understanding that
1) consciousness is not contained within the body and that it will continue to exist after the body dies.
2) That this consciousness is bound by certain laws that transcend space and time.

Denying these truths leads to nihilism. Which leads to chaos.

Not replaced but made part of religion since you cant ignore materialism as a physical entity that gives conciousness its existence. Unfortunately we only have this one planet (so far)

>Do you really believe that anyone here has read Marx?

Ask an American college student, if he read "Das Kapital". You would be surprised how many of them are assigned this, even over a variety of courses at times.

you can ignore the materialist philosophy. It's nonsense.

you still live in your children, your thoughts form the education, and something stays forever as long as you do your job properly as a parent
is this not a form of living on?

but is that not already built in christianity? (seven virtues / seven sins)

Thats why we'll use computers

As in assigned tiny sections of a nearly 3000 page work, yeah, I'm surprised whenever someone tells me they have read it. Unless you have a few semesters handy to entirely dedicate to it, you aren't reading them anywhere near their entirety.

>you can ignore the materialist philosophy. It's nonsense.

says the ever more hungry ontario shitposter with an empty belly due to inflation

I often ask myself what is actually the exponential technical development in general, we are nonstop busy with technological development and at the same time we lose more and more of our human side

Why are tulips so expensive? Because supply and demand I guess - 1636
Labour theory of value is not perfect but it isn't nearly as contrarian as capitalism.

lol im doing alright

>but is that not already built in christianity? (seven virtues / seven sins)

Yes.

External influence of capitalist countries is the cause of 90% of errors. The other 10% is incompetent rulers.

I mean you can't build communism in a world of capitalism. It just impossible for communism to survive in this conditions. But if the whole world will be communism it's almost guarantee will work.

>Transition from Socialism to Communism is impossible because humans are unreliable
Yeah and also this. You'll need an AI to rule over them or at least a really good leader.

1: Marx, when writing his ideology, had no understanding of the people on which it is all predicated (Working Class peoples, specifically Europeans). The greatest opposition to Marxism came not from the Bourgeoisie, nor the Petit-bourgiousie, but from Nationalist Working Class individuals. He saw things in purely materialistic terms, most working people did not. They had strong connections beyond economics, and their tribal identities, and when Marxists (who are inherently internationalists) came along and wanted to tear down everything, they met with backlash.

Most people talk about the failures of Marxism in the 20th century (particularly the Eastern Bloc European countries and third world South American, Asian and African countries), but none of these countries actually followed Marxist doctrines. The key thing to note is that none (literally 0) of the countries controlled by Communist Parties were Capitalist when the Marxists took power. Their attempts to implement Marxist-Socialism had nothing to do with Marx, who specifically wrote that Capitalism had to develop the neccesary productive forces before Socialism could be achieved. Russia, China, etc. They were all barely industrialized Feudal countries, not capitalist ones.

Sadly nobody takes notice of the fact that just about everyone (Both the Communists and the Anti-Communists) are all strawmanning each other and themselves and are totally incorrect.

>tulips

Did your college professor give you that example?

>is not perfect

I always laugh when you retards parrot "it's not perfect". It's completely retarded.

I do not doubt you there, but I still warn you to not underestimate how cunning some of those fucks can be. Remember that old adage about how "All that it takes for Evil to succeed is for the Good men to do nothing"? It means that the most effective Evil will loudly and proudly advertise useless activities as Good deeds. Say you're opposed to mass immigration; you likely wouldn't go shoot up a refugee shelter because someone on Jow Forums suggested it. But you might join a protest against immigration to "make your voice heard" and end up spending your energy on empty symbolism.

Now the brainlets are rather more helpless than men of discernment. Their lives are ruled by wanting acceptance and fearing rejection, and many dysfunctional social policies are in fact implemented for no other reason than to instill those traits in the population, e.g. by inventing some freakish disease that just so happens to have (insert undesired personality type's regular behavior) for its early symptoms.

At every step you're undermined and undercut and even where one of your virtues is praised it may be that another would be the more relevant one, and the other guy knows it. When the wind turns and the revelation of how badly they've been used reaches even the simple ones, there's rage. Immense rage. (Think pogroms courtesy of people debt-ridden through usury.) To anticipate this and channel it toward a scapegoat target is the art and attempt of shills or controlled opposition. To accelerate it and fan the storm up is how you may force the hard reset before too many are lured into making their "change" irreversible.

With luck, one can think independently and speak eloquently and move stealthily enough to immunise many in the same way you are immunised yourself. That would be my hope for you if you indeed adopt our Idealism.

Why did Marx promote the eorks of Freudrich List until he moved to Lindon and joined the spook agencies operating out of the British Library? Why did he go from Lists ideas on Tariffs and Alexander Hamiltons ideas, to Britsh Free Trade and openly promoting Ricardo?
If you want to learn economics, forget Marx, and read Alexander Hamiltons work - it is the reason America became a superpower.

God damn typos from phone posting.

Socialism according to Marx exists only to bridge the gap between the necessary evil of capitalism and the inevitable 'utopia' of communism
Under communism, the means of production are owned, by definition, by the state.
Under communism there exists no free market as the state sets prices.
Without subtracting the input from the output, one cannot do cost accounting. It cannot be determined if production is more efficient under communism than under capitalism, or if production is more efficient than last week, or if it is even profitable at all, as "profits" are illegal.

You use your money to buy flour, yeast, rent an oven for a day, ect. Why do you do this? To bake bread. Why? Because you have determined and bet that there is a market for bread. You invest $50 and bake 50 loaves. So $1/loaf is your input cost. Your research says people will pay $2 or more for good bread every day, but they'll only pay $0.50/loaf for shitty bread. So, if you bake shitty bread you'll only be able to sell it for $25, half of the cost of production, a loss. But, if you are reasonably sure you can bake great bread, you may invest the time and money to bake 50 loaves and sell them for $100. It cost you $50 to make so your profit is $50, you have doubled your money, pretty good.

But under socialistic conditions, there can never be any cost accounting. That's why there is always bread lines and famines in communist countries, even in breadbaskets like Ukraine and Rhodesia/Zimbabwe. Communism is genocide. Socialism and democracy must be opposed as a moral imperative.

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scale

is not it strange? capitalism is needed to keep socialism alive, and socialism is vital to capitalism.

It sounds like an unnecessary division to me

The "surplus labor is exploited by the greedy capitalist" meme was considered by Marx to be his lifes greatest achievement. It is a disgusting jewish freemason trick.

All employers act as a bank, giving credit to employees in the form of wages. If someone worked on an apple orchid, they would have to wait months or years to be able to sell the fruit grown by the labor for profit, to pay the workers salaries. So, the employer gives a loan to the worker by paying him every Friday instead of once a year. Like all loans, it must be taken with interest, otherwise the bank would go bankrupt. The interest is the profit the capitalist employer keeps. Why would he willingly give it away? Its his farm, hes cared for it for years, manages it efficiently, why should some drifter bum who does dumb labor like a mule for 8 hours get an owners share of the profit?
The workers salary is an agreed upon condition set at the beginning of employment. They have no right to complain about it.

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Marx misunderstood the nature of value.

All sorts of things have value that Marx didnt think of like... ideas and motivation.

scale is always the problem of ALL utopian ideologies
it's why genocide is the logical & inevitable conclusion to all of them

No more than a search online for market failures will provide you with that. Also, if one did, is it a problem?
Remarkable levels of hand waving, that's why you used the meme to explain it right?

too meme-able

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>To accelerate it and fan the storm up is how you may force the hard reset
That's exactly how I think, how can you help an alcoholic? by letting him land on the floor and then he must make a decision, live or die.
>but I still warn you to not underestimate how cunning some of those fucks can be
I have noticed that most ideologies often fail because of reality

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who programs the computers? And we're back to Stalinism and food shortages as those who have the power succumb to greed, like every other time this has been attempted

because if I work 10 hours a day to get a better life and my lazy neighbor doesn't do shit but the state gives him my money, I will lose all interest in doing something of value for the society

Why does the united states and Canada throw out nearly 80 percent of its produce via grocery stores? Is the only possible response in the world 80% food wastage or food shortage?

Seriously, believing that Marxism doesn't account for "laziness" is the most supreme form of academic laziness on your part. Pat yourself on the back for that one.

>80%
This is the most retarded thing I've heard from a leaf, holy shit.
If they threw out 80% they'd have to price the produce at least 5x for the suppliers price to just break even (without accounting for all the other operational costs)

Underated post

The universe throws many paradoxes at you. It might be to our humanity to want to have a right / wrong or black/white determination, allthough it is a spectrum in which we act in. I think lobster man is right when he says that the underlying principle is the elevation off from suffering in Life that is forming this determenism.

right, and if we let the communists have their way we'll have no food to waste

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Is this what people do on here? Talk about things they know nothing about and self-congratulate each other for also knowing nothing about it but holding the same convictions? It's like your cucking yourselves out of genuinely learning something, instead watching other people learn and getting mad at them for doing it. "Why am I getting cucked? It must be some jewish/Marxist conspiracy. Anything but my own indolence, that's for sure." Conveniently placed within reach is this place, the perfect safe space for such a person.

Do some research. Obviously you haven't.

>Seize the means of production
>Means of production = land
>People now own means of production rather than the 1%
>Distribute land based on needs via central planning
We've all been over this, it's not our fault you're a brainlet who's late to the party

No, we have the capability to produce food on mass levels currently, compared to the agricultural studies of 1917 in Russia the differences are enormous, magnitudes of difference. Ii don't understand this fetishization of food lines happening once so it must be the same right? False equivalency and foolishness in face of some of the largest agricultural productive shifts in the history of mankind happening over the last hundred years.

provide good evidence of your commie bullshit working literally anywhere other than tiny villages 60-100 years ago. I actually studied poli-sci and had to read das kapital and the communist manifesto and had legitimate commie professors unlike you, some armchair-academic, internet fag leaf. Communism does not work and it is regarded as an intellectual backwater in IR and PS for a fucking reason.

So you're standing by the 80% statistic? Sounds like you've literally done no research whatsoever.

Fair point. But that's another minus for Marx's ideology then, when I apply the dogma of the Marxist historians complaining about the Church making it impossible to read the scripture for example. Marx needs the double the amount of text than the Bible does.

But you could also read the communist manifesto.

wise words, i grant you that, life is suffering the only thing we can take with us is the deeper understanding of being.
youtube.com/watch?v=vmHz6fF8GuA

Statistics were one of the many banned studies under marxism, they banned the math that is used to predict and keep track of basic information. Now ask yourself why would this study of numerical figures be outlawed.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suppressed_research_in_the_Soviet_Union#Statistics

Explain to me why farmers markets don't rake in cash selling the majority of their stock at

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