Why do women hate shy men so much?

LAZY? I don’t get it, is it supposed to be hard work? Did everyone had to work hard to “get off the couch”? Everyone was just born without “social laziness”. You didn’t have to fight your laziness either. I don’t understand you ppl, and your interpretation of us. My goal was to match your understanding of myself with mine, so we’re on the same track.

And yes I do have a problem of being shy. And I don’t think it’s being “lazy”, I just don’t have the courage to push through. It’s not “lazy”.

I wouldn't call it hate, general dislike is more appropriate.
Women tend to be quite lazy socially and more reactive. Shy people are the same, so when you get two reactive people together none does anything because they're both waiting for the other one to move things.

Quiet guy who is hot: "He must be really intelligent and thoughtful"
Quiet guy who is unattractive: "He is a bit creepy"
Being shy barely matters - looks are more important
t. lifelong social outcast with multiple ex-girlfriends

This
Qualities aren't hated or loved.
If a attractive person does it, its loved. Even if a attractive guys is silent and brooding, he's just being mysterious and probably a deep thinker.
Someone unattractive does it, he's a weirdo creep.
That's how this universe works, and people are very visual oriented.
Look at women and how they love to shop and display their shoes and clothes etc. Everything is visuals.

This. I didn’t have friends since highschool but I had a cute gf for 3 years in college.

Can confirm.
I'm fit, white, 6'2 with 'triad eyes' and considered attractive.
I'm 22 and have been hit on by all kinds of women from ages 16-50.
My personality is shit but people don't really care, many of them just want to be associated with someone they think is attractive, or other people find attractive, so they themselves will be considered of higher social value (which is BS ofcourse).
Once they figure out I'm not the agressive killer 'chad' they tought me to be, they usually drop me like a bag of stones.
It's really not all that fun, because it's very hard seperating those people from people who actually like me.
Also I'm still a virgin, despite having had more than enough opportunities to get laid or whatever.
It's very hard for me to open up to people because of several childhood traumas to which most people will just have an extremely hard time relating.
Fact is that life is very fair in its unfairness.
If anyone has any questions please shoot, I'll answer to the best of my abilities.

>many of them just want to be associated with someone they think is attractive
This sickens me sometimes. Everytime I see my coworker just cling to the good looking hipsterey guys I just want to vomit. Everyone would feel good about themselves when they are seen walking with attractive people. I’m not ugly myself but everyone already labeled me as that weird guy and I can feel that a lot of them avoid walking with me. But then again, I work in a digital agency where everyone is young and hipster and toxic. It’s one of those environment where we go to work wearing casual outfits (hell, even shorts).

where do I find a girl looking for a guy like me?
I'm decently attractive, but I have the polar opposite of the classic stated personality traits most desirable to women.

Meaning what? You are an angry insecure whiner?

don't think they hate shy men
it's just, that women still wants that men takes the initiative (feminism is for the ass)

Have you ever had or tried to havea conversation with a person who looks completely disinterested in it? Have you met someone who answers all questions with "yes/no/okay/I see" and then procedes to stay silent for the next hour until you try again? It's annoying, user. Social people aren't magical beings who just like the act itself of emiting sounds from their mouths, they want to be engaged in conversation and actually get somewhere.
I say this as a shy person myself: shy people are really annoying and hard to deal with. They tend to abruptly end conversations, feel like they're never into it and would rather be somewhere else, and at times act like you're being a pest every time you open your mouth. yes, it's not on purpose, but it's really not somebody else's job to get your act straight, it's your job. Instead of blaming others for not putting in the effort for you, put the fucking effort.

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this right here

this bullshit makes me sick.. women have this "male social popularity" and "confidence" shoved so far up their fucking ass, they don't see men for anything else. why not look at him for his virtues, his intentions? what if he persons going through something? like you said trauma, or what if the person is depressed?

this is why girls are fucking retarded. they constantly want doctor perfect at all times.

Someone sure is bitter that girls are dumb and don't understand what a great guy he is.

That's more being disinterested than being shy.
Shy people do have things to say and can be fun to be around. They're also very mindful of not being nuisances which is why they usually don't start conversations.

If someone responds with only monosyllables most likely the person just doesn't care about the conversation.

they are social creatures
being antisocial is like being a jobless hippie to a man

I dont think it is hate. And i thin men dont awfully like shy girls either.

I tried to get involved with a few shy girls, the main problem i encountered was i just didnt if they werent interested or just reserved. So either you push further ahead essentially hoping it is because they are shy and not because they are not interested.

Shy men on the other hand will be just left alone and never pursued in general, there are exceptions even in this thread. Shame really, so many people in the world just alone..

Because we're social creatures that are meant to live in tribes.

If you can't socialize and be favored by the tribe, your living standards and your odds of survival will be lower.

Niqqa hold up. If you're upset that women are labeling you before they even know you, why would you do the same thing to them in return? Making generalizations and putting people in categories is poisonous, lazy thinking, and I suggest that you try to break the habit.

Women love jobless hippys

Can confirm, I am atractive and shy

Because in general women do dislike shy men, especially in a romantic sense?

Because they like active men

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You're still stereotyping and generalizing.

>They're also very mindful of not being nuisances which is why they usually don't start conversations.
Why is this forgotten by most people? This is a good virtue. I’m self aware that I might bring discomfort to everyone, that’s why I stay away from them.

Making a general assumption is not necessarily stereotyping

Are there women who maybe even like shy men? Sure, humanity is very diverse. Do women, on average, significantly prefer outgoing men? This is also true.

Why would anyone want to talk to you in the first place?

You can’t blame jobless hippies for being themselves. They weren’t raised by your parents, therefore it would take like 15 years to change what’s fixed.

I’m not saying that everyone should be blamed for not conforming to our mental situation, it’s just that we hope people would stop pointing fingers at us for “not trying hard enough”. Living in this condition is hard enough, let alone spending 10 fucking years powering through our fear and anxiety. It’s just not worth it. I feel like I’m out of energy, I have no drive to power through all these things.

It sucks. I do wish I was more like other people though, I wish my parents weren’t overprotective, I wish my dad wasn’t scary and short tempered, I wish I could feel my mom’s affection, I wish I was born with better genes, more height, bigger penis, better hair, more testosterone, more hair, etc etc.

You don’t know what anxiety is, it’s not the same as phobia.

Idk, why would they? I’m fine with them not wanting to talk to me. I’m not fine with them disliking me for it.

If you don’t try to change you’ll be like this forever and ever. A real long time and it never gets easier. Don’t rationalize an excuse, that should be incentive enough

For the simple fact that uncertainty in men is off-putting biologically.

Would a woman see you as a protector if you are uncertain? No, she wants a person thats strong and masculine.

I thought you were complaining. Well it’s because they don’t know you’re being mindful or whatever, how’re they supposed to know?

Being shy isn't your problem.
Being a fat ugly waste of oxygen with absolutely nothing going for him, no personality except a vague sense of depression, no hobbies except internet posting and vidya, and having an insufferable way of speaking, acting, and living is your problem.
You brush it off by pretending you're just "shy" and are therefore categorically excluded from dating so you never have to encounter the mental suffering of facing up to your own reality.

Plenty of attractive, interesting, actually-shy boys get girlfriends. Possibly because they aren't obese 2/10 gaymers living in their mothers' basements with a crippling porn addiction.

Damn user, who hurt you? The level of projection is insane.

You have to rationalize everything. Everything has to seem rational in life. We are logical creatures and I do try to be rational all the time. Being emotional disgusts me. I’m effeminate already, I’m not gonna make it worse.

How do I tell them? Do I just tell them even without them asking? That’s just weird. It’s like I’m trying to get their sympathy so they would approach me all the time. People would think negatively about me.

How do you even fix ugly? Ugly is “x 0”, you can have 3 points for personality, 2 points for hobby, etc etc but anything times 0 is 0. Being ugly and confident is either delusional, low IQ or blind.

Quiet girl who is attractive: she must be a snob/think she is better than everyone else
Quiet girl who is unattractive: she is weird or awww

>How do you even fix ugly
sudoku
Ugly people just shouldn't breed. why does an ugly guy even feel entitled to a cute gf to begin with?

You want sympathy without having to ask them for it you dumb fuck. If you were really being mindful you wouldn’t worry about it. And you know what people mean when they say rationalizing you girly fuck

>How do you even fix ugly? Ugly is “x 0”, you can have 3 points for personality, 2 points for hobby, etc etc but anything times 0 is 0. Being ugly and confident is either delusional, low IQ or blind.
The bar is much, much lower for ugly, when it comes to men.
Rather, you have to be ugly in a certain, pathetic way in order to be physically unattractive as a man. I know a bald guy with one eye and a beard, his face is gnarly and grizzled, his missing eye is fucked up and scarred, and he's more than a little goofy-looking/acting. Chicks probably like him.
Now, a droopy-faced sissy with a slouch, potbelly, and skinny arms? THAT isn't going to drop any panties.

Ok I’m not that guy but I don’t really care about girls. I’ve been single for 5 years and I’m not hungry for romantic relationship.

Ugly people will feel less than the average and attractive ones. And that will make them not want to socialize with them. I’m talking about friends, screw girls, I have a small dick, a gf is out of consideration.

I’m asking for a better understanding that’s all. Most ppl don’t understand us. They think we hate them and quietness is a bad virtue or something.

Being ugly means your competition is tougher, that’s all actually. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not ugly, I’m just trying to rationalize it. If you’re ugly, then MOST people are better looking than you. And most people like good looking people. If your gf loves for the way you are, how would they feel if they see other guys who are better looking than us? The competition is tough. Not just when we’re trying to get them, but also to retain them in the relationship, to make them see us as the only one who can turn them on, etc.

you don't get analogies do you

Ugly guys and average guys just want a gf, but girls have more value than men, so they're fucked.

All the ugly and average guys with gfs would disagree with you.

Yeah, but I'm trying to tell you that there are different kinds of ugly for men, and that It's almost preferable to be ugly in a manly way than it is to be a gap model with no body hair and that stereotypical "pouty-lipped blond" look.

Well ok I’m just gonna tell you that there are ugly ppl with no body hair and no facial hair. Definitely no big dick as well.

Put some muscle on and put some rogaine on your face.

I'm not kidding about that second part, either. If you have trouble growing facial hair, rogaine can help.

Becauz women have no interest in a second pussy

Stop fucking saying "beta". It's not as simple as an alpha beta dichotomy. What you're thinking of is omega. If being beta meant being a weak male than that would mean the majority of men are alpha males which make no sense. Alpha males are a certain type of male.

Good luck to everyone and I hope that you all have a good day. It's human nature to at times be quite and observing and if you feel that way then that's fine and don't let anyone make you feel bad about being yourself. Women are lovely and I hope they bear no Ill will. I'm surprised to find this forum in the advice section. It's more like group conversation with a big mix.

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Calm down there, Elliot.

they only hate shy ugly men you silly.
Actually they just hate ugly guys

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dumb frogposter

>what if he persons going through something? like you said trauma, or what if the person is depressed?
That's not their problem to deal with. Why would anyone want to date someone that has mental problems? Get your own house in order first.

They don't have the confidence to support and defend a woman let alone themselves, women want to date men and not manchildren.

Shy girls are really cute though, just about everyone finds them worth dating because of how feminine shyness is.

Being shy is not a masculine trait.

I dont fucking care anymore, if there's one thing wrong with a dude then everything about him is wrong.
I dont fucking care about what you think about me anymore for the most part and I am more than willing to bash your fucking skull in if you want to challenge me

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fpbp

I was shy as shit in highschool and college, and I had girls hitting me up all the time. Other shit matters why more than being shy.
I was:
>captain of the track and field team
>started taking senior AP classes sophomore year
>Got write in votes for student body president and homecoming king

See

no, I am the opposite of embodying a man who is flirtatious, sexually confident, or most importantly, displaying an aloof, detached nature that shows a lack of need to be in the situation, and disregard for her opinion of him, because he has options.
I am first of all, I am sincere with my feelings, most definitely sexually reserved, and am eager for making happy anybody who might become a friend, and definitely if they might become a girlfriend.
I have actively avoided becoming the dreaded "nice guy" but I think I hold the same position of being disdained as they do.

this

Guy I know who has had the highest quality and quantity of girlfriends is a jobless hippy

>quiet girls who think they're better than everyone else
Make my dick diamonds

>Quiet girl who is attractive: she must be a snob/think she is better than everyone else
>Quiet girl who is unattractive: who?

fixed

they don't

it's just more convenient to get a girl when you aren't shy
a shy guy and girl are like two magnets of the same polarity they aren't going next to each other.
and an active girl is probably going after an active guy who she can have fun with.

>confidence

this.. this right here

this very thing. girls have this delusion that follows them. they have "social popularity" and "confidence" shoved so far up their fucking ass, they dont see men for anything else. why not look at him for his virtues.. his intentions.

if they change for a normal guy she can get far. and they can finally avoid the famous phrase "where are all the good men?" and these girls will eventually go out with men like him, I fucking promise.

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Females hate men who don't worship them and don't give them attention.

So what can you do as a shy guy? Shy girls get with confident men who can get them to open up, confident girls get with confident men too. Is the only way to get a partner as a man being outgoing?

>So what can you do as a shy guy?
wait for a girl that wants you enough to ask you out? they exists they are just uncommon
or just put your shyness away long enough to ask someone out

it's just when being passive you have to put yourselves on the whims of others and if their whims is "leave you to be alone" that's where you go (same with women)
>but women can get a guy
but even with a genderbent form of that might end up with someone that treats you like complete shit (like those shy girls) and end up worse than if you were alone

It's the sad truth..

`women have this illusion of confidence shoved so far up their ass, they don't see him for anything else

it's why so many girls go for the top 20% and stay single

There's one I really like. I think it's so cute

Tell more about him

Shy men are basically walking around their whole life asking "do I have everyone's permission to be here? To be myself? To make noise? Is it okay to talk to this person?"

I don't wanna fuck a guy when I feel like I have to hold his hand through every social engagement. Or a guy who, when another man gives him a hard look or word, he turns red and apologizes. Nut up if you wanna nut me up.

it's ok to be shey.
it's not ok to be a pussy.

Confidence and charisma are generally better indicators of success than intelligence or sensitivity. You don't get to lead the pack by being an always agreeable, go with the flow, head down in his work guy who always says "o-oh... okay... I'll work late..."

At least learn stop avoiding conflict. Conflict is not the end of a relationship.

They don't. Your fixation on the things you don't like about yourself has caused you to project that insecurity onto the people around you. Women merely act as avatars for the fears and anxieties that already exist inside of you. If you woke up tomorrow and every other person on the planet had disappeared the things you dislike about yourself would still be there. Stop focusing on other people and focus on yourself. That's where you problem is.

I don't know much about him yet. I'd like to but I really don't know how to approach him. I'm shy myself but I think he's way more. He doesn't talk much, but he would always make me laugh. He's nerdy, tall, funny, quiet. I love it. It's weird because I feel like he's the male version of myself. But I have yet to find some time to tell him. How do I approach him? Wouldn't he just freak out and not know what to say/do? I've never been more intrigued by someone before. Shyness makes things interesting but also a bit complicated. But I'm enjoying it so far..

He might be unsure about your feelings toward him. Maybe make it clearer that you like him and you won’t reject him.

how the fuck do I overcome being a shy feminine man? im 22, its not getting any better. i was shy as a kid, didnt like sports when almost all the boys did, etc. I can so clearly see my normie female friends being slightly disgusted or condescending with me when I demonstrate my shyness. I have gone to parties and done social things but my overall temperament doesnt really change.

Despite being tall and having a skinny twink-ish body, my face is like 5/10, verging on "below average" looks so I get no attention. I have always been this way, and even my body is feminine. I don't mind being this way except that girls don't like it at all. I know its an excuse to an extent but I really feel like biology fucked me.

Problem is, I've been told he doesn't want to date anyone. So I don't want to bother him. If he's changed his mind why can't he tell me? He just seems interested and I don't know what to make of it other than wonder and wish I knew what else to do.

Sauce?

Shoot your shot

Worst that happens is that he says no

Best is that you get a walking dildo

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Pic? Sounds like your real issue is severe confidence issues.

t. A girl who really loves Twink boys.

lol...

im not sure if i wanna post a pic desu but you're definitely at least partially right about the confidence. i had severe acne in high school and into most of college as well so I had no confidence to ever flirt. i never had a chance to get any experience. i have some scars now but its nowhere near as bad.

ive been trying tinder but I get very few matches and even when I do they usually dont respond

Otto Weininger

Fellow potential twink here . I share your experience besides the acne. There are definitely girls that like guys like us out there but they seem to be rare. I think if we could just be more confident we wouldn't have issues with women. But hard to overcome shit like that. Also post a picture.

thats fair for both sexes really.

I like shy, quiet men, but I'm wary of them because I'm not the best-looking girl and I don't know if their behavior implies whether they want me around or not.

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Why you shy mean make it so easy to hate?