Hello Comrades. This general is for the discussion of Marxism-Leninism, the ideology of revolutionary socialism and communism.
Communism is the next stage of humanity following the capitalist stage and the socialist stage.
What exactly is communism according to Marxist-Leninists:
>Communism is a stage of society in which the productive infrastructure is socially owned, and goods are produced not in order to sell for profit, but in order to meet a social need. >Communism in it's full form is a stateless, classless society that follows the maxim "From each according to their ability, to each according to their need." >To achieve such a society Marxism-Leninism teaches us that we must replace the capitalist state, which is controlled by the capitalist class, by a socialist state, which is controlled by the working class. Then, a period of class struggle follows in which the capitalist class is liquidated by the working class. When the capitalist class has been completely vanquished, there will be only one class, the working class, and eventually the functions of the state will become indistinguishable from the functions of the society as a whole, and the state as such will 'wither away' as Marx said. marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1847/11/prin-com.htm marxists.org/archive/marx/works/1848/communist-manifesto/
Communism is predicated upon two beliefs. One that value and effort are some how equal and two that man is a morally just being.
Both beliefs are false and out right destroy communisms so called "merit" The value of something is not dictated by the effort put into it. An unskilled man can build you a house but no matter how hard he trys he will produce a run down shack void of value. Conversely a master commenter may place the same effort into building a house and produce a well built sturdy house. The communist believes these two structures to be equal as the effort put into them are the same.
>If I dig a hole in my backyard and then fill it in I used labor but made no value! Commies BTFO!
Marx clarified (unlike adam smith) that only socially necessary labor (labor used to produce a commodity with use value) creates value. This is also the case if you spend 1000 years making a bed.
>Nature can create value as well. If an apple falls from a tree then value is created without labor
Marx also noted nature could create value.
>if labor determines price why is coca cola cheaper than bottled water?
Labor doesn't determine price. It determines value (not exchange value or use value) and correlates with the equilibrium price.
Machines cannot create value. If I make a machine that makes diamonds out of thin air then the value of a diamond falls below that of bricks now that they can be aquired with no work what so ever. Price might not fall because you can still manipulate supply and demand but value certainly does.
Some definitions.
Use value = How useful an object is. Exchange value = Market value of a commodity. Different from use value. You can sell a beanie baby for 200$ but it is almost completely useless. Value = the amount of congealed labor withing a commodity.
Don't you have some third world rice farmers to get raped by?
Wyatt Bell
Hello gomrades! XDDDD Dis general is for disgussion of margsism-lebonnism, da ideology of revolutionary socialism and gommunism.
Gommunism is da next stage of guckery following real society.
Wat exagtly is gommunism according to gommies:
>Gommunism is a stage of guckery in which the produgtive infrustrugture runs away from gommie country, and no goods are produced and beeple starve. XDDDD >Gommunism in full form is obressive, statist society dat follows maxim "gib gib gib!" :DDDD >To achieve gommunism we must replace broduction with murderous obressive rulers liek me, fug working glass beeple. XDDDD Struggle while I liquidate you all lol. When capitalists run away we win and I kill you all. Eventually the functions of state cease and state becomes murderous and indistinguishable from other gommies. Da state withers away liek da people. gommies.gom/fug/ gommies.gom/starve/
If you helped them out you'd win , granted only if they weren't in the desert and you switched sides
Julian Murphy
ahhh waited for this exact response based and redpilled
Juan Richardson
Second that man is a moral being capable of placing the greater good above himself at any and all opportunitys if only the society would let him.
This is false and blatantly so. Simply look into the numerous atrocities committed by mankind, look to the homeless suffering in the streets who no one feeds and to the leaches in there mites. Look to even yourself and you will find amorality not imposed on you by society, capitalism or fate; but by simple animalistic human nature.
Do you truly have faith in humanity to not steal, cheat, and slander at a moment notice.
Zachary Carter
This is the only reason I ever click on these threads
Nolan Cook
Sure user, I'm my country and those soldiers, you are truly hurting my feelings right now Please, stop
It's a very romantic idea, but it's never worked. Every effort to achieve a class-less utopia has been side-lined and dragged into an authoritarian hellscape of murder and starvation.
....How do you safe-guard against abusive leadership?
A single-party system just doesn't work. Throw in a little bit of money and even China has regressed to a president-for-life who murders anyone calling him Winnie Pooh-bear.
Glorious! Based and redpilled. Also unironically accurate.
Jason Gutierrez
Not surprising communism is jewish
Robert Perez
The ten Planks of Communist manifesto: #8 "Equal obligation of all to work. Establishment of Industrial armies, especially for agriculture." > Equal obligation How can a stateless and non-hierarchical society enforce this? > Your work-time is equivalent to everybody else's work-time Am I forced to sit and drawn hentai for as long as others work in factory, if I don't want to do manual labour as an artist? Will my hentai comics have high labour value the longer I sketch it? How is an artist's LTV defined? If "... each according to his needs", what stops me claiming to acquire 70% of goods to suffice my 120kg fat ass' needs? How can anyone else define how my needs are sufficed? How can a collective deny me coming over demand 70% of goods that others have gathered through hard manual labour, while I can provide them only hentai sketches? We are living in non hierarchical society after all, right? How is Theft defined in cummunist world, when there's no property in non-hierarchical society you can steal from others?
Joshua Martinez
> only socially necessary labor (labor used to produce a commodity with use value) creates value > Use value = How useful an object is. who has authority to define this value in a community without hierarchies?
>Labor doesn't determine price. It determines value (not exchange value or use value
You've redefined "value". What you're actually describing, the "amount of congealed labot within a commodity" is...... waste. Effort. make-work. How bitchy it was to produce a thing. It's bullshit. You JUST SAID that only socially necessary labor creates value. So the amount of labor put into a thing IS NOT a measurement of a things value. You can't just talk out both sides of your head.
"Machines cannot create {value}"? Lines like this are delusional. It traces back to your redefinition of "value".
>now that they can be aquired with no work what so ever. Except "work" in this case is only man-hours. Which nobody actually gives a fuck about.
If you have a billion slaves hand-carve a bed, that's the same output as one machine spitting out a bed in an hour. It's utter bullshit. Laughably wrong.
You are absolutely right that dumb fucks wrongly price stuff all the time. The idea/hope/faith of capitalism is that, on average, people will set a price that's close enough to the real value of a thing. And if they don't, well we take their money and don't put them in charge of anything.
Carter Robinson
>Communism in it's full form is a stateless, classless society that follows the maxim "From each according to their ability, to each according to their need." Pretty shit idea. When you create a stateless society you are giving power to whoever has the will to take it, which is why you can never get to the stateless aspect of Communism. As for classes, that's in total defiance of human nature. Even if we all do the same job for the same pay, some will rise above others and be considered to be of higher class. Also if everyone is "working class" won't automation force classes of "those who can repair robots/program robots" and "those who can't do shit"? National Socialism>Communism by leagues. Even Jew run capitalism sounds better than this garbage.
Ayden Long
A great American, before class-traitors started to be honored
>wants to convince people of marxism >starts out defending the shittiest theory that has been bitchslapped by economic reality the hardest for over a century
If you wanted to make an anti-communist thread you could have said so.
Chase Myers
kill yourself commie bastard, democracy will never be defeated
Dominic Diaz
Aren’t you that unemployed Russian?
David Morgan
Why was everyone's peepee so small in ancient greece? Are olives the original onions?
Samuel Sullivan
Weird alchemy=debt based currency consensually accepted by poorfags. >Be mine owner who finds gold, sell it to a company for currency. >Company then pays currency in exchange for labor to have gold extracted, transported and milled. WHAT STRANGE ALCHEMY! This is why Jewish created systems can never work, the Jew is allergic to truth.
Elijah Russell
>77 checked based Bulgarian
Aaron Young
communism is a true democracy
Eli Taylor
It was considered attractive. Big dicks were considered vulgar.
How are decisions made in cummunist utopia? By majority vote? That sounds hierarchical desu. How do you force the majority's resolution on minority in a society without a hierarchy or authority? How can you stop minority from implementing their own solutions?
>one party state >true democracy ahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
Only weak people want communism bc they can't survive in a competitive society.
Jayden Richardson
>put everyone who disagrees with government in labor camps or just kill them sure seems democratic to me turn off that memeflag btw
Connor Scott
>Communism Remember that Communism is a COLLECTIVIST ideology. By it's very nature this ideology is incompatible with basic human freedoms - freedom of speech, freedom if religion etc. If you grew up in a democratic Western country, you HAVE NO FREAKING IDEA how it feels to live with those basic freedoms removed or drastically restricted...
You will not survive a week in a communist society.... You are not at the top in this free capitalist society, what makes you think you will be the one at the top in the brutal collectivist world? People like you usually get cleaned first...
Isaiah Evans
>Remember that Communism is a COLLECTIVIST ideology What does "collectivist ideology" even mean numbnuts? Communism has more individualism because you're not tied to wage slavery. And depending on where you work you have more individualism because of workplace democracy. Basically as an expert in your field you have more say and don't have to be ruled over by a capitalist and subjected to the iron boot of capitalism. But it's also collectivist because there is more cooperation and people aren't backstabbing each other to try to get ahead.
Communism is for the Aryan; Capitalism is for the mutt
Gonsider: VVoman in da stat of modern vvestern zoziety are da burger-geese, holding da mono-poly bower ovver da destribution of da benis in virginia XD, a gummodity nut (XDDDD) just fore mental health vut in-deed da bery gontinued existense of da humens. Da gontrol of da specifecs of destribution is regally entranced in eberry industrialized gountry vvith massibe benalties for beaching it, and even da stats by da moist vvild-eyed serbers of da burger-geese shovvs that it is upheld in ober of 99% of all gonnecting of benis/virginia (fugg DDDX). Da sexual prole-tarots, darefore, scratches just da tip XD of its yavvning need (XDDDDDD) by gonforming to da e-dicts XD by da VVall Streets and Catty-brians of da movements. Da e-dicts XD are encreasingly arbitary, historigally unprecidented and unknoun in da state of nurture – zexual egality, nonbiolence, monogamey, and gonsent. And eben dese merely scratch da surfface; dere are also nubelous, gontradic(XD)tory and eber-shifting gonsiderations of vvealth, stateus, material brocesions, so-sail marketebility, bersonality garacteristics, fashyions, and arbitary ma-tri-art-cal definitions of beuaty degreed from on high, literall barigades ta entry XD. All da burger-geese mono-polies seek to brotect deir powa vase by attacking dose vvho vvould undergut da source of deir powa, and hear to vve see da expegded result. Strippers XD, porn stars XDDD and brostitutes XDDDDDDD are all de-rided by da reaction-airy mouth-peaces and it es demand dat da State but dem out o bizzyness. And vvhy nut (xD)? Dey are seen as da scabs or da bootleggers, responding to demand by distributing deir broducts of gomparable value for a car lesser gost, outside da traditional bizzyness model (this es be seen in da glaim that dese brofessions are "debasing" to vvomans, e.i. it riterally rowers da balue of deir sailable gommodity.)
Da rabist, derefore, gommits a rebolutionary act, retaking some bower from da oli-archy that in a goup d'etater gained quite liberal gontrol of da means of broduction, not of just da ultimite gommodities but da labour-powa itself.
Nathan Ortiz
I hate commies so goddamn much, their existence is apersonal insult to me
Like I said - you HAVE NO FUCKING IDEA what it is. Your philosophizing is especially funny because in a collectivist society people like you are harmed the most.
Hello gomrades! XDDDD Dis general is for disgussion of margsism-lebonnism, da ideology of revolutionary socialism and gommunism.
Gommunism is da next stage of guckery following real society.
Wat exagtly is gommunism according to gommies:
>Gommunism is a stage of guckery in which the produgtive infrustrugture runs away from gommie country, and no goods are produced and beeple starve. XDDDD >Gommunism in full form is obressive, statist society dat follows maxim "gib gib gib!" :DDDD >To achieve gommunism we must replace broduction with murderous obressive rulers liek me, fug working glass beeple. XDDDD Struggle while I liquidate you all lol. When capitalists run away we win and I kill you all. Eventually the functions of state cease and state becomes murderous and indistinguishable from other gommies. Da state withers away liek da people. gommies.gom/fug/ gommies.gom/starve/
>Sdage one Bourgers aren't allowed to vode :DDD but otherwise da system is digtadorshib of gommies. Everything is stole by digtadors and digtadors rule all.
>Sdade two Withering All beeple who aren't digtador glass starve. XDDD Once glass disabears and we steal everything more beeple wither away. Bolice begome unnecessary as beeple are dead lol :DDDDD Central blanning begomes unnecessary begause sgarcity caused starving. Money is all ours.
>Sdage three Gommunism. No beeple. No food. My money. Much benis.
Imagine living in Soviet Russia, coming to school and playing this song in your class. How do you think your friends would react? Would they kick you in the head before they deep you in a toilet or after?
Kids HATED these communists songs.
Daniel Morris
While I might personally seriously disagree with communism, the Soviets made some serious bangers. youtube.com/watch?v=H6wl-EyhXl0
Jason Harris
>the entirety of WWII deaths are solely Nazi Germany's fault >including the Pacific Theater >but Soviet atrocities are exaggerated Communiggers really are fucking retards.
they think body and mind should be perfectly balance a big dick was sinonimous of lust so they picture thier gods with small pp beacuse they were wise and not barbaric
Nolan Reed
What the heck is with all these class cucked Italians shitting up my thread.
>and eventually the functions of the state will become indistinguishable from the functions of the society as a whole, and the state as such will 'wither away' This is a delusion In truth, if any "socialist" states are any indication, the ruling elite is simply replaced with a different ruling elite, and the society functions as "state capitalism".
No, what we're better off doing is utilize the available electoral systems to strive for a social democracy in which all needs, such as education, healthcare, and housing, are provided for by the society/state/government. We don't really need to get rid of corporations to do that. We just need to tax and regulate the hell out of them.
ABSOLUTELY FUCKING BASED. On 3 yr studies now - constantly beating the shit out of marxists kikefags proudly talking about some shit like (((proletarian))) ideology or some other nonsense. Gommunists will be hanging from trees in nearby future, i sense it - you disgusting subhumans.
Fuck that, lmao. Eastern Europe and USSR should not be used as a model for anything ever. Neither should any of the "socialist" states. It's about time we caught up with Western and Northern Europe in terms of universal healthcare and education though.
Zachary Smith
Universal anything only works if you're not absorbing millions of foreigners. Take it from us.
Gavin Jones
If absolute power corrupts absolutely how do you prevent Communist governments from becoming absolutely corrupt? They control absolutely all means of production and all monetary supply for the entire nation. They have complete control of every facet of life and will inevitably lead to mass corruption. How do Communist proposed to limit government power and provide checks and balances against corruption?
