I'm a 22 year old girl. I am virgin, and never had a boyfriend.
Over the last 6 months, I've been going out with a guy. He is 27, and slept around quite a bit when he was in college (between 20 and 25 partners). After he graduated, he had a girlfriend for 3 years, but she cheated on him. After her, he hasn't slept with anyone.
He is an amazing man, I never clicked with anyone as well as I did with him and I do truly adore him. We quickly became best friends, and he wants the same things I want in life. We spend every day together, talk a lot. He looks great, too.
The only thing that is holding me back is his sexual history. I'm very nervous about being with someone who slept around a lot and already had a lot of dating experience too.
Can a man who had a lot of casual partners be happy in a relationship with a woman who knows nothing? Can such a big difference in dating experience influence us negatively?
Dating experienced guy as virgin girl
To be quite honest, you're a unicorn in the dating world. Absolutely no one is going to be upset with your lack of experience as most guys want that powerful feeling of taking a girl's first time.
If you ask him to show you things and say it's your first time, he'll be so hyped on pride of taking a girl's first time that he won't even mind teaching you.
Also expect every Jow Forumsirgin to message you trying to get with you in this thread
Is this bait for incels or something? Utterly stupid thing to worry about as a girl anyway. As long as you have a working hole he's happy enough.
Yes because it will make him miss the sluts he used to date who have probably had a book of skills. Find someone better than him, unless getting pumped and dumped is your goal.
I know he won't be upset about being my first, obviously.
I'm mostly worrying about being enough in the long term, and about how I don't know anything about dating really while he has experience both when it comes to relationships and sex.
We've been hanging out together every day for 6 months, without going further than kissing. I doubt he wants to "pump and dump" me.
Bump.
Deep throat him
>I'm mostly worrying about being enough in the long term
Just be enthusiastic about learning new things with him? I just had a girl give me her first handjob yesterday and we went from shy tugging under the blankets to two handed porn star wanking and balls fondling in like 10 minutes just from me guiding her.
>Can a man who had a lot of casual partners be happy in a relationship with a woman who knows nothing?
Yes. If it was the other way around, statistics would be against you. But when a male has a higher bed count it doesnt hurt your chances in a relationship STATISTICALLY. He might still be a fuckboy but if you two agreed on a relationship and became exclusive, then his bed count shouldn't directly affect the relationship.
FYI women with high partner count reported more incidents of depression, divorce, general marriage dissatisfaction... you get the point, buy roles reversed it didn't change much.
can i fuk u, pliz
The main issue with girls who hasn't had much experience is they tend to be possessive and controlling.
It's something I've seen a few times in my online groups where there were a few girls who started dating for the first time when they were in their early 20s.
Things like getting angry when he doesn't respond to texts. Or if he talks to other girls, she gets uppity about.
It's not going to be your inexperience that'll be a problem. Especially if he has what it takes to steer the relationship.
The main thing is you need to know your boundaries and trust him.
But that doesn't mean you can just enjoy the ride, you still have to put in your effort to grow the relationship
I'm scared I'll fuck up and ridicule myself.
I'm excited to try, but I don't know how I will be or if I'll ever get good.
He doesn't talk to other girls (as I don't talk to other guys) and he seems pretty enthusiastic about talking to me.
I can see it being a problem if things changed, it'd make me feel insecure if he was around other girls constantly or wasn't enthusiastic about talking to me.
>22 year old virgin dating a 27 year old man
>never had a boyfriend before, but speaks with certainty about "never clicked with anyone as well as I did with him" and "he wants the same things I want in life"
>knows the guy was a player in the past
I could make fun of you for being a walking stereotype but who even cares. There's only one way for you to learn. Would it kill you to give someone your age a chance. Do you think a 27 year old is going to be any less opportunistic/immoral than someone 22?
If you think women are illogical creatures then you shouldn't be so fucking butthurt when they act in accordance with that.
>never had a boyfriend before, but speaks with certainty about "never clicked with anyone as well as I did with him"
He's not the first guy I date. I went out with other men before him, I've been dating since I was 17 or so. I dated maybe 5 or 6 other guys, nothing developed further than 3-4 dates because I never felt much for any of the guys I dated.
I do feel strongly about him.
>Would it kill you to give someone your age a chance.
I wouldn't have any issue dating a man my age or a little younger. It's the first time I date someone significantly older than me.
>Do you think a 27 year old is going to be any less opportunistic/immoral than someone 22?
Not necessarily.
>Can a man who had a lot of casual partners be happy in a relationship with a woman who knows nothing? Can such a big difference in dating experience influence us negatively?
Shouldn't be a problem really, most fresh relationships are a bit awkward in bed, irregardless of the experience of either of the two (or more). You'll get more comfortable with each other over time and as long as you both enjoy each others company it'll work out.
Tbh, a guy doesn't learn a lot from most girls, for two reasons: most girls (younger ones) don't have a lot of experience so most activities remain rather amateurish either way, plus the fact that the guy does most of the work in those cases as well and secondly, every girl is different (physically and psychologically). It's fucking roulette, you never know how she's gonna like or dislike something, you just gotta try.
Finally, if he's interested in you, you already qualified. Be a good person, try to be honest and direct, play the romance game a bit (creating desire, yadda yadda) and enjoy it. And don't overthink.
Maybe she's just desperate to get it over with. Nothing wrong with that.
t. 23 year old virgin who has ghosted lots of fuckbois and players
I'm not desperate. If I wanted to lose my virginity, I would have lost it at 16.
I genuinely like the guy.
We've been dating for 6 months and I hang out with him every day, for several hours. I never enjoyed spending time with someone as much as I do with him.
I know he'll gladly guide me, but I don't want him to feel like he's missing out.
>Be a good person, try to be honest and direct, play the romance game a bit (creating desire, yadda yadda) and enjoy it. And don't overthink.
Kek. I feel like the last part is going to be the hardest.
>but I don't want him to feel like he's missing out.
As long as there's true desire involved, satisfaction should be a given, both romantically and sexually. Every question of detail can be resolved by trying out stuff. Hardly any person has tried everything and since people have different tastes and interests, there's a lot of potential in each new relationship, if it's based on authentic interest.
As for the overthinking part, it's natural and you'll see how funny it is once you progress through this experience. It's like with any new things, your expectations are blowing up fears and insecurities way beyond the reality of the issue. The only real way I ever saw partners fail each other is with dishonesty and infidelity, plus their derivatives (playing games at each other). As long as you don't go that route, you should be solid with practically every guy.
Don't take this the wrong way but your impression of the situation is going to be slanted, and I can't trust your word for it. Especially on a topic that you are so heavily invested in emotionally. Based on what you've told us there is a real risk that he's some sort of "cherry hunter" or whatever that's called, and that it will be an assymetrical relationship.
That being said, you've invested so much that you might as well go ahead with it. I don't buy either. Whatever happens you'll come out a more experienced person. If it does work out, let it be known that you are extra grateful. The odds are against you, though, so don't be surprised if things end up in flames.
I was in a similar situation when I was 22. I met a 29 year old man, who had some previous partners (maybe around 5 or less?).
I decided to go with it, lost my virginity to him and now engaged.
He really is amazing, perfect partner material and will be a perfect father. Perhaps a symptom of me being naive with relationships and inexperienced, is that I'm very very attached to him. I've become kind of controlling (indirectly, encouraging him to stop drinking/smoking/etc) and have very high standards for him. Also I'm extremely insecure and luckily he gives me little reason to worry. I have breakdowns because my love and neediness is so intense, that I get upset with him over little things like him speaking to me in an angry tone AT ALL.
So I'd say go for it, but careful to rein in your intensity. Also keep an eye on him, don't go the opposite way and overlook him spending time with other women etc.
>your impression of the situation is going to be slanted
I haven't given any impression on the situation beside the way I feel about him: I do like him a lot, we have a great time together and, from our talks, it seems like we want the same things for the future.
Everything in the post you replied to is fairly factual, there's not much of an impression. I dated a few guys before but never felt anything with them. They were around my age. I don't think that he's awesome because he's 27.
I'm not desperate to lose my virginity. I never had issues finding guys willing to date me, much less guys willing to fuck me.
If I was desperate to lose my virginity, I wouldn't be virgin.
Thanks user, you're very kind. I appreciate your words.
That's sweet, anonette! Congrats.
I'm a little worried about getting too insecure and needy. I'm not very insecure normally, but I have so many expectations and so little knowledge about relationships and it stresses me out. I might go see a therapist over it if I feel like I'm becoming overbearing.
No problem. It's good to see that people still talk to each other in an open fashion. Men and women have been having issues since antiquity, probably the dawn of mankind, but recently it all seems to have been become even worse. Your approach is a welcome change from the drama one is drowned in every day and I hope you find the happiness you're looking for. :)
I was in a similar place. I'm dating a guy who is much, much more experienced than I. I was a virgin when I met him and he was indifferent about me being a virgin. In fact he thought it was annoying at first because I was too tight. I gave him my virginity and our fifth anniversary is this July. If he actually cares about you, he won't care that you're not as experienced as him.
>chad deflowers yet another girl while I remain a 27yo khg
I really need to accept my place in life without feeling this irritation
ask him to teach you in the bedroom, he will love it and you will learn
bruh you just need to give up on a virgin gf.
I'm not looking for a virgin gf. It'd be nice but not necessary.
Fuck OP, there is no place for happiness here. Dump him and be a mserable virgin like the rest of us.
Yet another girl worried about being good enough to be plowed by Chad. Fuck you.
Things like this make me GET TO THE BOILING POINT.
Let me get this straght. This guy has the oportunity of being your first, and you are worried you are not enough for him? AND HE FUCKED 25 GIRLS.
Thats it, I give up on life, thats bullshit.
HERE WE HAVE EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE OF HOW DEREGULATED THE DATING MARKET IS.
22 yo virgin girl problems: I dunno if chad will like me :(
25 yo virgin dude: women are literally disgusted and repulsed by unexperienced men, and every year that passes is another nail in the coffin of your love life.
Dont worry op, you will do just fine.
preach
Bait
Be careful not to get hurt op, but honestly seems like you don't need to worry that much.
Why do incels think creating meme diagrams of their cuck fantasies makes them reality?
This thread proves the hypergamy theory is correct. She is in love with this guy that had 25 partners, meaning really high smv. She could settle for another virgin, but like said before, women are repulsed by inexperienced men. So she makes up stuff like "we clicked", to feel better about being #26. The truth being: she went after the highest smv in her life like any other female mamal.
And you wonder, talking like that, that your sex life is frustrating or non-existant. Lel
This thread only proves incels are extremely dumb. If that guy had been a virgin she would have fallen for him just the same. Girls are not repulsed by you because you are a virgin, but because you are a repulsive person.
Classic ad personam, it is easier to insult me than seeing the truth.
If if if, but that is not the case my dear user. She fell for a guy with high smv. And there is nothing that proves your hipotesis, there is just reality.
They are not? There is plenty evidence showing the opposite user, just google it.
There is literally zero evidence for any of the incel beliefs. It's a belief system built on pseudoscience, memes, and deliberate misunderstanding of facts.
The guy has high smv sure. But he could have remained a virgin because of morals or something.
Youtube.com/watch?v=tEuCa01iKZg
I'm OP. If he was exactly the same person, but virgin, I would have liked him more.
His sexual history is the thing that worries me more about him.
He could, but he didn't. If he chose not to, he would date inside a community that shared said morals, with other virgins as well, still with the high smv.
I'm sorry this thread turned into a shitshow as if having sex with him was some sort of political position I'm taking.
I'll reply to some posts.
Thanks. You're very sweet, I wish you all the best.
Why should the dating market be regulated? Lol.
Thank you.
Why should it be regulated?
To prevent injustices like 26 partners to one guy and zero to the other 25 guys.
I don't like the fact that he slept around a lot. It makes me insecure. That's the very reason why I opened the thread.
If he was exactly the same person but virgin, I'd be happier. Why do you think I wouldn't like him?
Good thing such things do not exist outside incel fantasies. Everyone can get sex if he/she wants.
>arguing "scientifically" by referring to logical fallacies
>arguing with "truth", an inherently unscientific concept
Ignoring that, I was making the point that only frustrated people complain about social dynamics in sexual relationships. People who enjoy their (sex) life don't. Seeing you complaining, it is obvious, or rather probable, that you are frustrated and your sex life is lacking. Since you ALSO take that as a personal insult, rather than a neutral observation, further indicates that I was right.
Because attraction is not a logical behavior. If he wasn't experienced he would not have the behavior you find attractive today. Sure, you would be friends, you would really like him, but never to a sexual level, and you wouldn't know exactly why.
As long as he has no history of cheating you should be fine. I say this as a guy in a similar position as your bf. I've had a rather high amount of sexual partners but am now in a relationship with a girl who has only one previous bf. It did bother her a bit at first but we are fully committed to each other now and the past is no issue, we only have each other.
Have you been official these 6 months? Because that's an awfully long time to not have sex. Hopefully you will be ready to have sex with him soon because if you make him wait too long he will start to think about leaving you.
Yes, if he was a different person I wouldn't be as attracted to him. If he was the same person, just virgin, it wouldn't change a thing for me.
It's not virginity or the number of sexual partners itself, is who he is.
If I was you, I'd just come to terms with it and accept that things can suck in life. Then, find a solution. It's literally as easy as going out and approaching people, there really is no need to be all upset about it or start a fight over it on here.
You wouldn't see him the same, that is the point. His confidence and social skills were built by his experience. He would be your best friend, but that is it. Think about the moves he made on you and how confident he is, now take that away.
I doubt that the girls he slept with never slept with anyone else before or after him, so it makes no sense to assume that the other 25 guys aren't getting laid at all.
I understand it can be unpleasant to know someone is successful sexually when you aren't, but regulating sexual attraction is silly.
He was cheated on but never cheated, at least that I know. My friends who know him told me that he was devastated after his ex cheated on him, too, so I'm fairly sure he wouldn't do that to me. He really seems to be very into me.
Thank you!
We've been exclusive but not official. I am very nervous about being official.
He's alright waiting for me to be ready, we talked about this.
I'm not saying that he isn't who he is because of his experience, but I'm not attracted to his experience but to who he is. If he was the way he was, but virgin, I'd find it ideal.
I don't hate virgins, it'd be stupid.
He hasn't done any special moves on me. We spend most of our time cuddling, making out and talking. He's very romantic, but it's not a skill you learn by sleeping with girls in college I guess.
Sure the other girls have been with other guys, other experienced guys, just like your dear bf.
People have sex. What a revelation.
>exclusive but not official
What does this mean?
>I'm not saying that he isn't who he is because of his experience, but I'm not attracted to his experience but to who he is.
If he's personality is a consequence of his experience then one does not exist without the other. He wouldn't be the same without learning how to interact with girls, even college flings. I'm not saying you hate virgins, but a man less experienced than you just wouldn't be attractive, likable, sure.
We've been exclusive since after the fourth date. But I'm nervous about calling him my boyfriend, so he's waiting for me to stop being a lunatic.
Some people*
I think you're simplifying it to ridiculous extents.
I don't doubt that part of who he is now is due to his experience, but it's not like everything I like about him is because he is experienced. He'd still be very attractive. He'd still be extremely intelligent and witty He'd still be kind, romantic and sweet. We'd still want to live a similar life, have the same hobbies, etc. We'd still have similar life experiences.
I understand he'd be a little less charming, maybe, but I don't like him solely because he's charming.
Exactly, you don't LIKE him just because he is charming, but you are ATTRACTED to him because he's charming. There is no relationship without lust, only a friendship.
People who want to have sex*
I doubt he wouldn't be charming at all if he didn't sleep around, or the fact that he's very physically attractive has absolutely no impact.
You're overly simplifying.
here
>Exactly, you don't LIKE him just because he is charming, but you are ATTRACTED to him because he's charming. There is no relationship without lust, only a friendship.
This is true. If he wasn't confident you'd not see him the way you do now. I know you mean no insult or dishonesty by seeing it maybe differently, but as a guy who is a guy and has seen hundreds of guys go through those motions, I can attest this does hold up universally.
>all these whores and whore-mongers in this thread
Listen babe a virgin for us guys is like a rich dude for women
>hard to find but the best thing ever
universally = my universe of experience, lel
Virgin fetishists are the lowest tier of garbage males. You disregard all the important traits of women and focus instead on one irrelevant thing.
I've been in a position of clicking like that with a girl. But she didn't find me attractive, so it didn't matter, we remained friends.
I understand that, and I agree. But I don't think that the only way to gain confidence is by sleeping with women. I find it silly to assume that a man who hasn't slept around is necessarily a super anxious mess who can't look at me in the eyes.
>Virgin fetishists
lol fucking sex crazed maniac, I like the idea of my woman not being fucked and ruined by other men, a clean slate is nice.
Not about sleeping around, but being less experienced than you. That would make him undesirable by you.
No man is less experienced than me, user. I'm virgin and never had a relationship.
Ha, you haven't met me clearly
How many guys have you kissed?
Three. And I wouldn't care at all about being a guy's first kiss, don't even try to start with that shit.
You'll be surprised at how much of a big deal we dudes would make about our first kiss
>t. 21 and never even kissed a girl
cont.
I think it comes down that attraction is not really a choice actually. Sure, you choose what you do, but how confident you are is rather a result of those experiences, who you ARE. Over time you become more confident, naturally.
>But I don't think that the only way to gain confidence is by sleeping with women.
Oh no I didn't say that. Though for the most part, practically speaking, going out meeting women is the most direct way at becoming comfortable ("good with") around them, which in turn shapes the character in a man you seek, even if you don't want him to be promiscous.
> I find it silly to assume that a man who hasn't slept around is necessarily a super anxious mess who can't look at me in the eyes.
True, but this brings problems. In my world view, we're currently in an age of decline, the Hindus call it Kali Yuga. Everything rotates around materialism, in science, economics, personal life, etc. Add to this existential angst and fear of death and you get people into a craze of superficial desires that never satisfy.
Simply put, someone who's aware of his actual self/non-self (Hindus and Buddhists haven't worked out that question yet) is surely looking through the facade of social pressure and will face any insecurity with a more euphoric and playful attitude than someone who reacts to such fears. So even a "virgin nerd incel" whatever, having self-realization, will be capable of acting confidently in a new and conditioned situation.
Then again, in our age only very few people seek self-realization, thus most people are attached to conventional concepts of ego and only seek sense gratification. That never satifies (leads to sattva = serenity or even "enlightenment", i.e. full realization of existence as it is, thus also confidence and calmness).
So yes, theoretically I'd say someone inexperienced could be confident, realistically tho that person is really rare to find.
So we have the same experience.
I'm really not trying to be a dick op, but think about if I were in you shoes. Do you honestly believed a awesome girl with 20+ partners would be slightly attracted to me? I really don't think so, because of how women see experience and confidence as attractive. Insecure men are not attractive, you boyfriend loves you even though your lack of experience. And the pressure for you to lead romantic situations is almost non existent.
Also, there's situational confidence. Take any manager of the world, in his work place he's the confident boss. Take him out of that environment and he will most likely have much less confidence. In the personal protection industry they say "train as you fight, fight as you train" and a certain person once said [under stress] "You will NOT rise to the occasion. You will NOT default to your level of training. You will only default to the level of training you have MASTERED." - generally, those observations hold true, that's why variations of them have been adapted by each army, general and author on the subject.
But this is rather philosophical now, your base question is answered I think, no there's no need to worry, this is just indulging in the social dynamics of romantic relationships for the fun of it :P
I don't, it was a huge deal to me too. But really it's not the end of the world.
I don't even think that sex is the biggest deal, to be honest; mostly experience in terms of relationship. A guy who is as inexperienced as me would be fine by me.
I agree with you.
I was mostly saying that confidence is a spectrum and there's more than "experienced confident chad" and "inexperienced not confident virgin". You could gain confidence and lose it, and fall anywhere on the spectrum, despite how many girls you've slept it.
I also think that it is reductive to say that attraction is 100% confidence, hence experience.
Maybe. Read the answer above, for the rest.
I like to think he likes who I am because there's a lot to like. Same reason why I like him. I think you're making your life worse by thinking that there's nothing to like about you because you lack some completely subjective thing.
Be confident enough to show who you are, people will be attracted to that more than they will be by you being depressed and self loathing.
Okay, one last piece of practical philosophy. Memento mori, remember you're gonna die. Whatever fear and insecurity you feel right now, it should absolutely fade when faced with the realization that you are not gonna be around forever. Crudely put, all of us are sentenced to death already. In Hinduism, even the Devas (heavenly ones), the denizens of all the lokas (planets) in the cosmos, though possessing lifespans of billions of years, are ultimately facing extinction by time.
>Among all kinds of killers, time is the ultimate because time kills everything. Bhagavad Gita 10.33
Because the fear of death creates an untainted appreciation of life and the current moment. Being in this current moment, appreciating it no matter what and enjoying it, you will gain a so intense sense for life that the fear again will start to fade. It's a bit of a roller coaster and not permanent for the most part I can describe, but remembering my mortality always helps me drowning out all the ego bullshit very quickly.
True, hardly anything is black and white. But remember where we are here, lol. As I already said, experience leads to confidence, due to realization. Realization can happen more quickly tho. I talked with a nerdy dude wearing a fedora in a bar once for maybe 20 minutes, giving him the tl;dr on what you'd call "pick up", seeing how his eyes started to sparkle. I went to the bathroom. Coming back, he was arm in arm with a girl making out. In Buddhism we think the other way around, i.e. our true self being covered in Ego, once that is removed, you act authentically. That can happen very quickly, even if just temporarily.
There is no pressure for you to be confident and lead romantic situations, experience won't matter to him at all, that's what I'm saying. There are many people that like me. Being likable is not related to being attractive.
Virgin fetishists are often homos in denial. Look at you, you can only think of the cocks and cum of other men.
I understand that, due to gender roles, there's not as much pressure.
But you can gain confidence in various way, not only by sleeping with girls. And you can gain experience whenever.
You're acting as if since you're not experienced now, you're doomed to die alone, which is sad.
You are lucky op, just appreciate what you have.
I've made my peace with it.
Especially since pressure does not generate confidence, but insecurity. A low level of nervousness is always there with new stuff. Someone once said "fear is a misuse of imagination", it's very simply "cured" by just going through with it.
In the end it comes down to action and how you handle yourself internally. In Eastern schools the thoughts and emotions that arise in your psychology are not treated as YOU, as they are in the West for the most part. They are more like the weather, somewhat mysterious, external and arbitrary. Most importantly, it's taught not to attach oneself to them, as this creates suffering. So just let it pass like any weather phenomenon and don't get upset.
Humans are generally very young, our short lifespan allows us to barely go into puberty before we die. We have very little knowledge of the cosmos, scientifically and spiritually speaking. We have no real clue what all this here is, what consciousness is, where thoughts and emotions come from, what matter and energy truly are. All we do is describing how stuff behaves on a base of axioms (basic assumptions we never question or prove) and go from there. Yes, we can observe, describe and even predict relationships and effects, but ultimately our knowledge of life as a whole is ridiculously insignificant.
... thus, don't expect too much performance from yourself. A master has failed more times than the apprentice has even tried. Given that you are an adult for just a decade, there's no way in the world that you already figured everything out and feel confident with every situation. If you had thousands or millions of years under your belt, you could expect a "godlike" demeanor of yourself, but even the Devas literally had astronomical time spans to attain their qualities.