...that there is not a racial IQ gap. There is a racial consciousness gap. Ancient humans had a mode of thinking that would be considered schizophrenic today. The subconscious mind would literally speak to them as auditory and visual hallucinations and the un-conscious mind and body would follow the instructions without question. No introspection, no self-awareness, no sentience; and not for the vast majority of human history. Only with the introduction of writing, and thus the effect of reading different perspectives made by other writers, was the conscious mind finally allowed to "awaken" and realize its own internal thought process as something distinct from the environment. These people, the first conscious humans, would have an incredible advantage over the unconscious in reproductive fitness and thus by the time of Christ the majority of the population in Europe, North Africa, the Middle East, India, and eventually East Asia would be conscious; even if they were not actually majority literate.
Where does the IQ gap fit into this? Most of Africa, the Americas, Siberia, and Oceania were, until fairly recently (
Interesting but stupid. White Cromagnons invented symbolism and thus were already aware of the inner-voice to an extent 30,000yrs ago
Africans can read and NPCs are aware of their inner-voice, they just don't reason with it. It doesn't help the situation. It doesn't change the drives of human population as Indo-Europeans were the only ones to create higher ideals and natural philosophies until (((Yeshua))) Christ destroyed this impulse with Dualistic thinking and anti-nature, anti-life thoughts that we see today even in Communism/Leftist Gnostic NWO clown world.
>Interesting but stupid. White Cromagnons invented symbolism and thus were already aware of the inner-voice to an extent 30,000yrs ago Consciousness has likely been lost and regained multiple times during the history of man.
>Consciousness has likely been lost and regained multiple times during the history of man. Yeah that's probably true. Yeshua was not aware of his inner-voice and called it a Holy Spirit (separate mind of EL)
Why was his inner voice so much more pure, virtuous and insightful than others?
Anthony Johnson
Negro magical thinking, the impulse to "live out loud" and the general infantilization of the last two generations is not only tolerated but encouraged. The mildly schizophrenic underclass is a goal especially now that the functioning industrial society is ending.
Cameron Morales
>Why was his inner voice so much more pure, virtuous and insightful than others? It's a good question. But there seems to be multiple inner-voices. The reasonable dominate seems to be connected to survival and maintaning the other personas we have >work persona >family persona >friends persona >romantic persona >alone persona and so on...
It's the voice that yells and me all the time to stop doing stupid shit.
what's your evidence for any of this totally not-bullshit?
William Ramirez
I've largely learned to silence such voices and personas. These days my thoughts exist as abstract pre-forms and only take verbal shape when it is absolutely necessary. It rarely is, since the full understanding of the thought is already gained by the time the form of the thought first appears. Verbalizing beyond a certain level of consciousness can become a hindrance.
Owen Hughes
>White Cromagnons invented symbolism and thus were already aware of the inner-voice
Symbolism doesn't imply self-awareness. There is no reason to believe that early man painted cave walls in an attempt to communicate a meaning with other conscious individuals. They could have simply done so because it felt good and the voices in their head said it was good; not to mention the men that stayed in the cave painting with the women could have had higher reproductive fitness than those that hunted or gathered exclusively.
>Indo-Europeans were the only ones to create higher ideals and natural philosophies until (((Yeshua))) Christ destroyed this impulse with Dualistic thinking
Could you expand on "higher ideals and natural philosophies"?
>These days my thoughts exist as abstract pre-forms and only take verbal shape when it is absolutely necessary. It rarely is, since the full understanding of the thought is already gained by the time the form of the thought first appears. Verbalizing beyond a certain level of consciousness can become a hindrance. hmm.
I talk to myself all the time and have long conversations discussing issues, telling stories, debating. It forms my verbal abilities and makes them sharper. I've been doing this since I was a kid, going on talk shows and discussing anything just to learn how to pinpoint, extract, and get to the point faster. And when I was a kid we'd create entire wars out of our action figures, and I would end up narrating all the conflicts, or spend days by myself on the same storyline with dialog. I don't know why I do this.
>There is no reason to believe that early man painted cave walls in an attempt to communicate a meaning with other conscious individuals. These same symbols are found all over Europe and Eastern Europe for 10K years. So I doubt it.
>Could you expand on "higher ideals and natural philosophies"? Animism... becomes... wisdom worship... becomes... idealism/form/beauty/construction... to later philosophy that studied natural phenomenon as an abstract and is the basis for advanced science saved
>Oldfag here since before /new/, this was not a common meme. You're not a true oldfag unless you left to 8ch for 3yrs during 2014 when this place became facebook level censorship. And it was a common thread there
Lucas Reyes
Excellent picture beautifully explained.
Chase Jenkins
I really liked that book and was super-disappointed when I found out that Westworld TV show brought it into the normie mainstream.
Jacob Bell
>I don't know why I do this. Sounds pretty fun tbqbh
Austin Ward
consciousness is awareness which is IQ
Angel Cook
> Intelligent Quotient was created by a kike > It was carefully crafted to measure one's craftiness in kikery which is why kikes score high on the index > It is an invalid measure of intelligence The rest of your elongated pseudo-intellectual bullshit is invalid. Try again retard.
Sebastian Clark
>Where does the IQ gap fit into this? >Most of Africa, the Americas, Siberia, and Oceania were, until fairly recently (. Imagine trying to organize a nation of tens of millions of schizophrenics; this is the reality of Africa.
most modern africans speak language you stupid fuck, so according to your theory they shouldnt be seeing their inner dialogue as a foreign entity
holy fuck you sound more racist and dumb than the average redneck but you're here saying races are all equal lmao
Consciousness is not awareness. You become aware of consciousness. This is awareness. Self-awareness and awareness point to the the same thing in the context of human experience. Of course without the self (the 'you') there would be only awareness, no self-awareness.
Oliver Russell
Can confirm. Most Australians do not have a conscious mind.
Gavin Torres
This is the best pic to sum it up, saved and will be using, cheers.
Christian Lee
What do you think of the logos-Christ-verbal thinking connection? Christ is said to be Logos by some. Logos is greek and means: "I arrange". What does the conscious mind arrange? Words/symbols. Is being christlike equal to embracing verbal thought? Is being anti-christlike rejecting verbal thought?
Then consider this: mantra meditation is a hugely transformative spiritual practice. Transcendetal meditation for example is a famous mantra meditation technique in the west. What is mantra meditation based on? On mentally looping a single syllable or vocal as long as you can without getting distracted. This is scientifically studied to make the brain hemispheres work together and shut down other areas of the brain that are usually active. Isn't this kind of super-charging the logos? What do you make of all this?
Animism arose out of the auditory and visual hallucinations of early humans, which in and of itself is probably a survival strategy for hunter gatherers. Animism keeps the group together and cohesive and gives structure to the hallucinations. It is abandoned as a result of gaining consciousness and halt of the hallucinations, eventually evolving into organized polytheism as rituals are created to bring back the "old times" when the Gods very plainly spoke to man. This is why the concept of the "fall of man" or "the deluge" are so common in religions, its an attempt by early conscious man to explain the inexplicable (and terrible!) change that has occurred.
Ultimately, natural law and science comes from the rejection of the base impulses that drive animism, not because of them.
>most modern africans speak language you stupid fuck
I'm talking about written language not spoken language, faggot. Humans for tens of thousands of years and perhaps longer had spoken language. Sub-Saharan Africa has no indigenous written language.
even if there were evidence for this, it wouldn't preclude the possibility that niggers are genetically stupid in addition to being genetic NPCs desu.
Cameron Brooks
>What do you think of the logos-Christ-verbal thinking connection? Christ is said to be Logos by some. Logos is greek and means: "I arrange". What does the conscious mind arrange? Words/symbols. Is being christlike equal to embracing verbal thought? Is being anti-christlike rejecting verbal thought? No what's happening is Jow Forums made Stoic threads back in 2014 and the Christians lost their shit. It was the first time they were challenged. Update to 2016 and Christians are screaming "Jesus is the Logos!". This lead to the youtubers using the meme and pushing the agenda, including Michael E. Jones.
In the gospels the term logos is translated properly to "word". It's not, "The Word" but word. And the term 'word of El or YHWH' is a very important thing going back to Genisis, "El said let there be light". It's literally WORD (not discourse, not logic, not reason).
Logos from Heraclitus also means word but he used it because he didn't have a term for the phenominon of reason which arranges all things in the Universe. He specifically didn't say it was a God. Stoics later took up the term. By the later days of Stoicism some were comparing it to Zues and his lightening, but that's when it starts to break down.
Rabbi Yeshua lived in a time when Jews were trying to appeal to their masters the Romans (and Greek previously). Philo of Alexandria during 5AD was the first Jewish writer to push for Stoicism in Judiasm
Neo-Stoicism was another attempt in the 1800s to paganize Christianity. This has all been done before. Of course all the occult/templars/masons/esoteric/hermetics come out of the Gnostic Alexanderian Jew traditions. Paul wrote 1st Corinthians challenging them because they were fucking their kids and running a church money scheme
Point being, no Logos has NOTHING to do with Christianity. And Yeshau was clearly and NPC talking to a Holy ghost. The original Heraclitian use of the term had no voice, no positions, it was an early idea of CAUSE AND EFFECT
>Animism arose out of the auditory and visual hallucinations of early humans, which in and of itself is probably a survival strategy for hunter gatherers. Animism keeps the group together and cohesive and gives structure to the hallucinations. It is abandoned as a result of gaining consciousness and halt of the hallucinations, eventually evolving into organized polytheism as rituals are created to bring back the "old times" when the Gods very plainly spoke to man. This is why the concept of the "fall of man" or "the deluge" are so common in religions The deluge isn't even common in the bible. It's a mistranslation of the word "erets" which mean land. The land was flooded. It wasn't a global thing. Jews are pushing this because they want Noahide laws and global warming propaganda.
Animism simple states that all things, every rock, tree, river, animal...all have an essence, a breath (spirit) that keeps them formed as they are, in their behaviors. This is the first form of natural studies. Polytheism was the real psychosis that came out of tribal warlord propaganda needing a priesthood to control their military generals and keep them from killing their offspring and replacing them. The ancestral gods were directly related to the founders and the leadership. The priesthood protects the power stucture.
Also, I admire your country for her wrestlers and Oly lifters with aesthetic skulls
Joshua Murphy
I had a loving touch on the noggin from the Almighty recently. Now I think it was schizophrenia. Was I wrong? How can I know Jesus is real?
Aaron Bailey
That's what Schopenhauer thought. Intelligence is basically sensitivity. But he says genius is more aesthetic than intellectual
Cooper Hall
>I had a loving touch on the noggin from the Almighty recently. Now I think it was schizophrenia. Was I wrong? no. get a brain scan or lay off the drugs
David Perez
This hypothesis runs counter to what we now know about human domestication, namely that people who are more domesticated are more schizophrenic and people who are less domesticated are more autistic.
Zachary Scott
I think it had a lot to do with the dudeweed, which I quit ~a year ago. Gradually slid into psychosis that peaked 6mo ago
Cameron Hughes
>Gradually slid into psychosis that peaked 6mo ago It usually takes 6mnths to fully perge
>The deluge isn't even common in the bible. It's a mistranslation of the word "erets" which mean land. The land was flooded. It wasn't a global thing. Jews are pushing this because they want Noahide laws and global warming propaganda.
I get your point but the big catastrophe is a big part of the bible AND is present in other (even older) cultures all over the world, the big catastrophe from the bible is sourced from the sumerians and the atlantis tale from plato also speaks of a big "event"...
it better to say straight away that you are atheist or pagan and you don't want to see nothing remotely connected to the bible... instead of just throwing it all away. I agree with you about global warming hysteria but that's another subject.
>the big catastrophe Propaganda. There are natural floods all the fucking time.
Jaxson Torres
>you don't want to see nothing remotely connected to the bible Also that's a mistranslation = you don't want to be "connected to the bible". You want propaganda and Noahide laws
Kayden Morales
Thanks
Oliver Hughes
>This hypothesis runs counter to what we now know about human domestication, namely that people who are more domesticated are more schizophrenic and people who are less domesticated are more autistic. To be fair Janyes characterized modern schizophrenia as a pathological reaction to crisis, not as normal healthy behavior. And it would be expected exactly in those cases where someone who isn't well equipped to deal with the modern domesticated world reacts badly to it. In the idea of ancient people similarly it wasn't that they were constantly acting like modern schizophrenics. Most of the time they wouldn't hear voices because most of the time they wouldn't be dealing with crises. The voices would only intervene when they were confronted with something they didn't have a straightforward autopilot way of handling. So he mostly agreed with what you're talking about. It's complex and uncertain situations that provoke schizotypal behavior and it was ultimately the extreme and pervasive encountering of these situations that led to the whole bicameral structure from breaking down altogether and getting superseded by a new mode of thinking with the needed flexibility of full blown introspection and self-awareness.
Ian Allen
>symbolism >and thus were already aware of the inner-voice to an extent You can have symbolism and NOT be consciously aware about it. This is an explicit argument Jaynes made in the original book: youtube.com/watch?v=ddWVpk4CTTo
Ryder Young
>You can have symbolism and NOT be consciously aware about it. I doubt it. Give summary
Jordan Ross
Page 21 starting with "The Extensiveness of Consciousness" is where he goes into everything consciousness is not: s-f-walker.org.uk/pubsebooks/pdfs/Julian_Jaynes_The_Origin_of_Consciousness.pdf tl;dr "Consciousness" is a word that gets abused for all sorts of different shit. Jaynes went to great lengths to identify everything it wasn't, and what he means specifically with that word is something more like "awareness." And he points out how even today we actually spend lots of time unaware of what we're doing. This isn't really something you can easily tl;dr though. What you're asking about is basically the subject matter for the entire first section of the book.
>people arguing about a book they haven't read Definitely not detecting any subjective metaconsciousness in this thread
Zachary Harris
one who is neither beast or man is simply chattel
Christopher Rogers
Anyone / anything in particular you want to correct? I do personally think people who didn't read the book tend to assume "consciousness" means all the stuff Jaynes made a point of differentiating from his own use of the term "consciousness." Not sure if that's what you're thinking of though.
Blake Miller
my inner voice should be shot
Xavier Diaz
thanks >That's what Schopenhauer thought. Intelligence is basically sensitivity. But he says genius is more aesthetic than intellectual
James Gray
>my inner voice should be shot If you're schizophrenic and hearing a voice you don't identify with then you'll want to aim for your right hemisphere. If instead you're talking about an internal monologue you do identify as coming from yourself then gun for the left hemisphere.
Josiah Bell
Well you've clearly actually read it but I don't think anyone else here has I don't think it's the kind of thing that merits a thread except to tell people to read it. It's a very controversial hypothesis and there's a reason he needed like 400+ pages to defend it. Except for that fucking introduction he doesn't really waste a word
Jack Taylor
I let you know my man, I've read this book and it was a fun read. Very fun indeed. May it live eternally in the minds of the cyber
Juan Sullivan
But yes /po/ has fallen quite deep in this crater. /pol at one time actually was inhabited by intelligent people believe it or not. But now it is a shell of it's former self. All these dumb faggot ass newfags and kike shils responding to bait gets really old.
Jason Fisher
The forbidden fruit of the tree of knowledge. Abbos win in the end.
Jace Parker
>there's a reason he needed like 400+ pages to defend it Yeah, my favorite part is that first section because of how painstakingly thorough he is in going through all the different cognitive functions and explaining why they neither are "consciousness" nor do they require consciousness to happen. Even if he never made the claim everyone knows him for about consciousness emerging much later and after anatomically modern man had already been around for a long time his take on what consciousness isn't would have still made it a great book standing on its own. The most frustrating thing about seeing people argue about "conscoiusness" is how almost nobody else bothers to take that approach Jaynes did where you actually go through your terms and clearly define what you do and don't mean.
Easton Robinson
I like the part when he talks about people with severed brains.
Cameron Hernandez
Hey quick question my dudes, but am I NPC? When I'm alone I constantly have an inner monologue, really any time I'm not talking to someone. BUT when I am talking to someone my brain seems to switch to a automatic response no thinking type consciousness, just immediate instinct. I've always found this strange and I feel like perhaps I was suppose to be NPC, but I broke through and I have left over artifacts of my old mind. It's hard to think before I talk.
Jace Gray
i liked this book and its an interesting idea...but its basically unprovable
Jackson Watson
Yeah that's all bullshit.
Jace Jones
Towards the end of the book, there's a very interesting passage about primitive Jews, the kibiru/gikuyu. Read it again.
i also read it. ive fought with my bro a lot about it because he's becoming sperg-like obsessed with that book. i think the problem is that once you throw away so many things we normally consider "consciousness" his definition becomes frankly much less interesting to discuss than broad-term "consciousnes" in the way most people in the thread are gonna use it. still a thought-provoking book though
also his arguments about the iliad are completely unconvincing to me
Evan Jones
So where do Jews fit into this theory?
Jordan Powell
Comparing racial IQ is just illogical. Ccomparing pic related who will literally walk up to a pack of lions and steal their lunch,not out of bravery but out of experience, to an incel whining about weekly anime.
Incel IQ is 140 but he's probably a hikki NEET who literally creeps people out. If he has a job he's miserable because he's just slaving away for the kike overlords. If he has a family he's just a normie most likely engrossed in ignorance. If he's well read? Okay... what's he doing about it? Probably nothing. Big brains reap what exactly? A high paying job? Okay and? If you're really smart you know money doesn't bring happiness.
African IQ is like gorilla tier but his culture that is tens of thousands of years old has made him an apex predator who is nothing but comfortable with his life. Full of spirituality, capability, and his heart is full of natural emotions.
Western culture is misery, hedonism, or a dedicated and taught practice of pure ignorance. Jow Forums's popular culture is worshipping irrelevant IQs and hating cultures that they don't understand. If a catastrophy does come the tribal nigger is going to shrug while we're all starving like idiots. The worst of us will be trying to eat his neighbour. Really sad how dense some of you are.
Jews and white men have utterly degenerated cultures world wide. Money is not necessary for culture or even civillization and having everything revolve around it cheapens life and humanity. It gets more specific what they've done, but that's the jist of it.
Is the push for mass immigration and racemixing to raise consciousness for the lower races, or lower consciousness for the higher races?
Gabriel Martinez
They say they're doing that to keep the economy going since boomers didn't have children, which is logical. Conspiratorial outlook says they're doing that to wipe out the white race but that will take longer than we'll ever know. As for your question it would be to lower consciousness for everyone, but they've been trying to do that for longer than this immigration push.
White men went into every country in the world to destabalize and destroy the culture so he could conform more worker bees. A modern example is what they did down under. >invade and kill the warriors >relocate people to seperate them >force kids to go to school instead of learning how to just live naturally like their parents >abuse the children who use their native languages >all the while destroy the history and culture whenever possible >create stigmas against the natives and vices It's inspiring that some of the pacific islanders didn't get fucked over as bad, but Hawaii for instance was a sad tale no one hears about.
You just watch Westworld for the first time or something? Pretty sure this has been widely debunked.
Also consider whether the experience of consciousness is imbued with any degree of agency, or if it is an abstracted perception of involuntary chemical processes. Not to detract from personal responsibility or suggest we're devoid of free will, but to suggest that the experience of agency may be extremely different from the fact of it.
Blake Evans
I don't really understand what you're saying but the ((low IQ)) person doesn't feel anxious being naked around people no matter what they're doing, and can comfortably sing and dance for hours on end with his extended family. Every day. When he's in a conflict with another man he knows his life is on the line and yet he's not afraid, he's living like a man even if he doesn't lift every day.
We ((big brain)) people rarely if ever experience that kind of comfort and happiness. Our culture is meant to cripple out brains that have been conditioned strictly to produce and consume, to keep us ignorant and child like. Hardly as natural as the ape man you all like to make fun of.
Personall I like nature TV rather than reality TV.
>That's what Schopenhauer thought. Intelligence is basically sensitivity. But he says genius is more aesthetic than intellectual
Julian Lewis
>Comparing racial IQ is just illogical. Ccomparing pic related who will literally walk up to a pack of lions and steal their lunch,not out of bravery but out of experience Africans get their kids stolen. European curly haired lions died out a long time ago and it wasn't the weather, it was the dominance
oh fuck off with that shit and just go back to posting your dumb bear memes
Andrew Miller
Deep.
Everyone gets their kids stolen and destroying your environment might be good in your eye but...
Josiah Barnes
Hitler had a "voice" too.
Benjamin Hughes
Is this what meditation is getting at. The yoga sutras of Patanjali talk about suppressing the conscious, so that you can intuitively gain knowledge from the subconscious.
Henry Johnson
So they're fucking retarded but you used wall of text instead of two numbers saying the same, good job.
Xavier Gray
>Hitler had a "voice" too. Jew meme >Everyone gets their kids stolen No you fucking leaf, animals dominated africans
the premise of the book is retarded. first, the schizos were always with us, and we hear about the extraordinary more than the ordinary; a man hearing voices is extraordinary, but it does not mean the masses back then heard voices. but what is even worse, we haven't encountered any people who were still in the stage of hearing voices and thinking those voices are external, whereas Jaynes claims this was the norm 3000 years ago. so was it some sort of miracle that flipped all mankind since then, tasmanian aboriginals, inuits, all the various polynesians, ainus, pygmies in the Congo basin and the indians living at the far end of South America? after 75000 years of modern human existence such a change took place all of a sudden all over the planet? Jaynes is living in a very small mental world.
Jace Lewis
This is one of the most important books I have ever read.
