How do you escape from the Incel trap?

Wrong. A scientist cannot be an incel. An incel is someone of low intelligence, with a dead end minimum wage job or a NEET.

Women are VERY picky about a man's looks. They don't even find 80% of men physically attractive. Obviously there's only so many chads to go around, so they fall back on guys with status/money. E.g. "this guy looks fun because he travels" = "this guy could pay for me to go on holiday"

Yes because that's evolution

You are wrong. Women care less about looks than men. You see ugly guys with hot girls all the time. You see good-looking men who are virgins because they are turbospergs.

Ask yourself: are you a closeted homosexual? If no, you are not an incel.

Huh

>You see ugly guys with hot girls all the time
Yeah if that guy's got money or status. They won't be with an below-average guy on personality.
Studies have shown that men are far less judgemental when it comes to looks, whereas women think the vast majority of guys are unattractive.

All kinds of guys will bonk chubbos, even hawt guys aren't that fussy. How often will you see a babe getting it on with a fatass?

Look at Hollywood wives. The fatties always have beautiful wives, whereas Chad will bone a fatty to get his rocks off but will rarely marry a fatty.

Irl, a good looking chick who is dumb or lazy will marry a rich dork, dweeb, or fatty so as not to have to work and is too lazy to care about sex anyway

That's my point. When it comes to physical attraction, men don't really discriminate all that much. Women on the other hand, only want sex with the hottest guys. But they will GIVE sex to a guy as payment for subsidising her lifestyle.

If women are picky about looks then that proves the point: they will routinely be with a guy they don't find physically attractive. Meaning women care less about looks than men. You just proved it with your own words.

Would you quit it with the incel lies already? Everything you said is false.

...uhm...maybe for boning itself but not for marriage/dating

The real redpill is that looks barely matter for getting a girlfriend, it's all confidence.
And the idea that you can do things to "improve your confidence" is a meme, all you're doing is pretending to be more confident, even if you've convinced yourself otherwise.

If you aren't naturally confident then you'll eventually find that acting constantly confident around the women you're interested in is incredibly tiring and either quit or resign yourself to a life of constantly making an effort to be someone you aren't.

It’s not just a trap it’s a death cult.
When they’re so detached from reality they start suggesting legalizing rape, it’s a wrap.

They call women roasties, but haven’t read about or visually studied female anatomy outside of porn. Porn that’s filled with people who modify their bodies for the camera.
Not all vaginas are the same uniform shape that fall apart like a baseball glove. They’re all different and they’re built to expand and retract naturally. Tightness depends on the guys dick size, and if she’s had kids or some kind of vaginal surgery. The discriptions these virgins make sound impossible,
unless she’s gauging her pussy open with giant dildos for a gaping porn video. The point is it’s not going to just stay that size forever like it’s air dry clay. For people who haven’t had any sex, they sure do think they know how it all works.

What makes you not want to earn confidence the hard way?
Faking it until you make it is for teenagers. Adults can’t pull that shit with other experienced adults.

I knew a guy like you, he wanted to be liked so bad but nobody wanted to be around him. Mainly because he’s not relaxed in his own skin, it’s hard to relax around someone constantly trying to socially dominate conversation without the mental tools to be interesting.
Instead of trying to me someone you’re not, be the best version of yourself. What that means to your outward behavior is on you. Being funny is better than being a cocky bullshitter.

For some people the "best version of yourself" is someone that does not attract girls or is in a position to attract girls at all.
When I talk about people having confidence, I dont mean that they are literally Chad, I mean that they have natural social skills, enjoy being around other people most of the time, and have socially accepted hobbies that they are genuinely passionate about.

Either way women are incredibly shallow. They either want a guy who's insanely good-looking, or they want someone with money/status.

Oh the horror, not being interested in low quality men, so shallow! Women are almost as shallow as incels.

That just says a lot about you if you judge someone on their genetics and bank balance

How are genetics and bank balance related to this?

You turn away from reproduction and set your eyes on self-actualization.

just find another dorky girl, there's plenty and they don't like chad types so that's where you come in, just bee your dorky self

You said women don't want low quality men (i.e. men who aren't goodlooking, rich or high-status). Most attractive people have their genetics to thank, and the majority of rich people have their family to thank for their wealth/privilege.

being chad at sex still counts?

To stop being an incel, leave incel online communities behind and never go back. Stop being perpetually angry. Stop wanting to rape and murder women.

You're mixing apples and oranges. A low quality man means someone who is a failure in life, with no job, no friends, and who rages on the internet all day long about how rape should be legal. I.e. an incel. A low quality male.

Hating women is the only thing that keeps me going. If I try to give them the benefit of the doubt it leaves me open to more disappointment and rejection.

Don't you have things like a job, friends, hobbies?

>job
Yes
>friends
Kinda. they all live outta town
>hobbies
Nah, it's all solo shit

I mostly see ugly/average girls with good looking guys

You might need to check your attractiveness detector calibration. Guys on the average are less physically attractive because they spend less time and effort on their appearance than girls do.

Or you live in a place with lots of ugly girls. In which case, move.

No, an incel is someone who craves for a relationship, but can't have one beyond paid sexual intercourse.
Schopenhauer was an incel.

>No, an incel is someone who craves for a relationship, but can't have one beyond paid sexual intercourse.
Yeah, that's me. Literally unfuckable & undateable unless she's a hooker

Why can't he? That's literally impossible. Schopenhauer was no incel, he did not rage all day long about wanting to rape and murder women.

An incel is someone who doesn't want sex or a relationship but lies about it.

He also had incredible DSLs that would have made him very popular in prison.

>But he still couldn't find a girlfriend because he was a narcissistic entitled manchild shithead.
Fixed that for you.

Oh yeah, because women never fall for narcissistic assholes, do they? It's basically every badboy ever

>An incel is someone who doesn't want sex or a relationship but lies about it.
Uh-huh. Sure. Ok, genius, so you think incels could find gfs if they wanted one? How's that gonna work? They gonna have a personality transplant and better genes?

Then why didn't Elliot get a girlfriend? He was a total jerk and asshole. By your logic he should have got lots of girls.

They could start by leaving their toxic community behind and becoming less of an angry violent psychopath.

He was shy and socially awkward with a small, underdeveloped frame. Girls don't mind narcissistic assholes if they ooze charisma and machismo.

>he did not rage all day long about wanting to rape and murder women.
Most incels don't either. Those are just the worst of us, fallen from suffering into pure hatred.
Contrary to the robot, the incel suffers from his virginity/lack of sex life. That's it.

Then what? They're still lonely and sexless. What can they realistically do to find a girlfriend?

Incels aren't created in a vacuum. There are many reasons for the onset of this phenomenon. The sexual revolution, the destruction of the family unit, the nanny state, feminism, dating apps, and social media. Women don't need men anymore to provide for them. They can get a lot of validation and money from whoring themselves on social media. Therefore, when they do enter into relationships they are incredibly picky and only go for the chads, badboys or beta providers.

If they are charismatic and confident but also have a kind side to them. Elliot had none of those characteristics.

They can start actually looking for girls. Instead of spending all their time and effort on sperging on the internet, they can spend it on things that result in them meeting girls.

If they were reasonable you wouldn't be having this conversation, remember

Girls don't want them. That is why they are incels.

Dude, the "blackpill" or whatever you want to call it mostly only applies to highschool.

Past highschool, your social rank and social potential within society as a whole matters a lot more (at least when it comes to women who are not brain dead). Good looks might help you gain social status, but intelligence, agreeableness, conscientiousness, and a bit of competitivity to spark things up are far more important.

And that's why they can now shift their efforts to stop being incels. Then girls will want them.

And how do they do that? I'm seeing a lot of rhetoric but no real answers here.

Part of being an incel is being stuck in a high school mentality.

Spoiler, women dont need men to be physically attractive to find them romantically and sexually attractive

Shut the fuck.up

Everyone is different. Generally speaking you take what's unattractive about you and work on improving it. Like, if you are fat, lose weight. If you are a NEET then get a job. And if you like throwing coffee at girls, then stop throwing coffee at girls.

Men don't care if a girl is a little chubby (a lot of guys love it) or if she's got a crummy job or she's a little insecure. However, these are all major turn offs for women. Women are judgemental and hypocritical as fuck. They accuse men of objectifying them when they are the worst offenders. Pure projection.

It is a hierarchy but not the only hierarchy mate. You can find sth you are top 20% of. Or literally create the field.

If I was dating a girl who was a barista and didn't like her job, I'd support her and wouldn't think "pfft this bitch got no future". But it doesn't work both ways. The only time women don't judge guys like this is when they're dating badboys, because they got dem daddy issues.

Who taught you what you know about women?

What studies are those?

L I F E

Then you clearly weren't paying attention when life was attempting to teach you.

gwern.net/docs/psychology/okcupid/yourlooksandyourinbox.html
>Our chart shows how men have rated women, on a scale from 0 to 5. The curve is symmetric and surprisingly charitable: a woman is as likely to be considered extremely ugly as extremely beautiful, and the majority of women have been rated about “medium.” The chart looks normalized, even though it’s just the unfiltered opinions of our male users.

>As you can see from the gray line, women rate an incredible 80% of guys as worse-looking than medium. Very harsh. On the other hand, when it comes to actual messaging, women shift their expectations only just slightly ahead of the curve, which is a healthier pattern than guys’ pursuing the all-but-unattainable. But with the basic ratings so out-of-whack, the two curves together suggest some strange possibilities for the female thought process, the most salient of which is that the average-looking woman has convinced herself that the vast majority of males aren’t good enough for her, but she then goes right out and messages them anyway.

You sound like an insufferable asshole.

That actually says that looks don't matter since women will date guys they don't consider physically attractive.

Yeah, yeah, you all say this shit but none of you back it up with anything.
It's all fucking luck. Looks, upbringing, status. They all contribute heavily to your chances of attracting a mate. If you were born ugly, raised poorly, and from a low class, you will struggle to find someone worthwhile.

It says that women have impossibly high standards of physical attraction. They don't feel a thing for 80% of the men on there, whereas men are far more equitable.
They message the guys they think have money/status.

It says women care less about physical attraction than men.

This is a random internet article about dating website statistics
This isn't a journal article or a proper study, it's not scientific at all and it doesn't affirm your argument
>They won't be with a below-average guy on personality
This statement is just false

Read it again. Comprehend.
Women were asked to rate the attractiveness of men on the site. They only found 20% of them attractive. If they didn't care they would have scored less harshly

Ok, then where's the data to disprove these statistics? Other than anecdotal shit "Duuuuuude I know lots of fat dudes with babes"

Burden of proof man
Also just go outside, there are guys who aren't good looking or rich with attractive girls

Read again. Comprehend.
Women ended up messaging guys that were not in the 20% they considered attractive.

>less than 1% of men and women die virgins
>over 50% of men and women get married

How do you know their financial situation? Women want eyecandy, badboys or beta providers. Most men will fit into one of those brackets.
That's because there's only so many chads to go around, so they try to wheedle out who has the money/status within the 80%

Women want to fuck guys who are physically attractive OR hypermasculine (badboys). These are the ones they actually want to spread their legs for. Now if he's rich as well, that's a massive bonus but it's always possible to marry the two. A lot of badboys are shiftless bums, but she's dumb, got daddy issues and falls for all that superficial charm.
She doesn't want to fuck the beta provider. He does nothing for her sexually. He's not good-looking enough or macho enough to affect her sex-brain, but she'll put out for him periodically as part of the deal.

Why do you keep spreading lies?

>but it's always possible to marry the two
*not always

If I'm lying it should be easy to disprove.

Ahhh that sweet deafening silence

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Because some of them are my friends.

Girls are very emotional creatures, some average looking guys are really good at that stuff which lands them hot girls. The fact you lack the social awareness might make this impossible for you but don't pretend you understand society because you're clearly out of touch with it.

How many of your friends have gfs?

>The fact you lack the social awareness might make this impossible for you
Hah! Then you admit incels exist
One. The good looking one

Obviously some people are too extremely lacking in social awareness to get a gf, but from the posts I've seen here "incels" blame everybody but themselves. This is what makes them annoying, because nobody likes someone who blames the world for their problems.

And once again the idea that girls will not date someone who is average looks, or will only date them if they have money, is bullshit.
Make more friends, meet new people and this will become obvious to you.

Most guys who fuck a lot of girls are not like you describe. Plenty of guys who are not super attractive fuck lots of girls. And hypermasculine men rarely fuck girls because girls are usually disgusted by that type, and those kinds of guys are usually gay anyway.

You seem to be obsessed with badboys and masculinity. Maybe you need to consider it might be because of your sexual orientation that you keep repressed.

How can you expect help when you have solidified yourself some truths?
You’re like fat people who say they can’t lose weight, but won’t fucking listen.

Most normies don't understand the underpinnings of their relationships. They've no reason to question it. A beta provider will not want to accept the truth, so they engage in cognitive dissonance.

No one can debunk these truths. They just spout meaningless anecdotes.

There is ton of proof if you just google it, there has been studies about this. But you don’t know, and don’t care and won’t read about it or watch a dumbed down video about it or listen to a podcast about it. We don’t stop at every dummy in the street that believes in flat earth either. We simply scoff at their stupidity and move on with our day. It keeps everyone happy, more or less.
Now, why don’t you tell me some facts to these truths instead?

Meanwhile, a manchild who has never been on a date and spends his days in his parents' basement are experts on relationships.