/ETM/ Earth to Mars - Radiation Hardened Edition

I already have a business plan when I get access to Phobos.

We need to start 10,000 new space companies to make this really happen.

Spill some of the beans?

Get cancer.

Nice Larp fagot

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>The Lunar Base Handbook
I've got a copy from 1999 or so. But it's terrible to digitize. Have to try it though.
> space economics
1st I haven't read, 2nd I glanced over (looks okayish)

"Above and Beyond: Exploring the Business of Space" (2018)
b-ok.cc/book/3649475/6dd528

"Fundamentals of Space Business and Economics" (2013)
b-ok.cc/book/2216002/3be33a

I've a couple more that I need to review. More specialized.

>Phobos
>Not Islamophobos
Rename it.

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i have a question if someone absorbed some chernobyl radiation say 32 years ago, and then flew to mars and back... and that person didnt have any iodine tablets since those moments up until the present day, would it be worth taking some potassium iodide now?

Here's one with a focus on the legal frameworks.

"Handbook for New Actors in Space" (2017)
swfound.org/handbook/

Weather's to nice today, everyone's outside playing.
>>

I'll give away a free business idea. Nitrogen.
It's going to be needed, in large quantity, as soon as people start building big anywhere in space. We need a source of nitrogen and a way to harvest it. Atmospheric skimming and separation in LEO is one approach, the advantage being that it's relatively pure, easy to separate and delivered directly to LEO. Another possible source is ammonia.
This is going to be big business when large space stations become a thing. Commercial stations will want an atmosphere close to Earth standard. Mega-scale habitats and capping craters will require more.

web.wpi.edu/Pubs/E-project/Available/E-project-042313-162241/unrestricted/PROFACPHARO-IQP.pdf

>who pays for it
- science: gov
- tourism, mining: VCs
Though the commercial stuff could be kickstarted or co-financed by gov contracts.

VC timelines tend to be really short. Other financing options include pay-to-develop for other organizations and self-financed companies, ie. able to make money somehow early to help pay. In the US we have SBIR and STTR grants for small-medium business.

kys, worthless autistic faggots

Hello, glowfren

>pay-to-develop for other organizations
Creating infrastructure, equipment, services.

>self-financed companies
Though that'll be rare. Startup costs are still high, time until profitability is rather long. Not everybody has the required wealth or connection to the affluent or a BigCorp to spin out from at hand.

The GLXP teams tried to team up with sponsors. But the more companies do that, the lower is the attention value. They did the right things though, starting small and cheap and seeing how far they get.

>VC timelines
I noticed that there are two groups.

Long term VCs who know that space requires at least 10-15 years until there's something to show for, esp. when it's something bigger. Often there are several funding rounds and they can, depending on the terms, de-invest with the next funding round, so the time horizon of the company isn't necessarily the same of the VC.

And short term for more "next step" stuff like a supplier or service that's profitable rather soon but has usually limited growth potential through fast-follower competition and a small market.

thnx m8. i was busy. back on track next week

bump

>Creating infrastructure, equipment, services.
Yes, a couple of the people who've brought this up at conferences suggest building a company that does something unique enough that others pay you to build devices for them.
>the lower is the attention value.
Media partnerships as funding sources has been space suicide so far. Everyone wants to make a Mars reality show but the funding cycles, returns and expectations all run counter.
Definitely means that you need exit points at B and C round investments for your early funders.

Howdy.

It's nice to see that it already collected some regulars.

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I really disagree with the ethnostate concept but you morons are some of the only people that are willing to have a relatively wide but focused discussion about space online.

How low Jow Forums has fallen that bait threads get 200+ replies in under 10 minutes and this struggles to get 10 posters.

>Media partnerships as funding sources has been space suicide so far.
Some of the GLXP teams had consumer companies as sponsors. Something they could put in their advertising or run campaigns with. But if that doesn't produce enough cash for engineering and a launch: no Moon shot, not much attention beyond the announcement and the occasional event.

>Definitely means that you need exit points at B and C round investments for your early funders.
And/or at later points. SpaceX has Round H or so.

>ethnostate
Not sure how serious that actually is. Guess most just don't want to have undesirable people and ideologies that screw everything up. That's probably the most common thing for Jow Forums "racists."

>discussion about space online.
There are several forums and mailing lists but most aren't worth a stay (the mailing lists are usually better, since more focused, serious, and somewhat intimate). What I'm missing is the political and business realism. Most are either nerding out about engineering aspects (very important, no question) or are more like clueless sci-fi fans. When aspects of politics or economics are touched, it's lacking. Falling for space agency and corporate propaganda, having reddit tier group think, conventional (business) wisdom. Little questioning, no killer instincts (if that's the right word here), no can do attitude (it's mostly commenting on what other people do), no startup and risk-taking spirit.

But how should we set up such a forum?

Sponsorship seems to only work for a little icing on the space cake. One group I was part of for a long time did some serious calculations trying to figure out how to make a Mars reality show. The funding cycles don't match at all and there is a real conflict between the openness of discovery and the licensing needs of the media entity.
>ethnostate
The Brit that started these threads originally was very clear on it. I will say that lazy people of all kinds will get sent home or fragged depending on situation.
>forums
nasaspaceflight.com, nasawatch and others are good but do to format they are highly topical and filled with specialists and fanboys. Facebook is useless for technical discussion, reddit is full of le science meme faggotry, these threads have some of the only balance between specialists and interested laymen anywhere.
>missing is the political and business realism. Most are either nerding out about engineering aspects (very important, no question) or are more like clueless sci-fi fans.
So much this.

>Mars reality show
So Mars One probably. I liked the idea, it was different and worth thinking about alternative ways of funding. The flaws in the concept and the sometimes fishy appearance were something that perhaps could be solved with the right support, but I think their main issue was that they pissed off the "serious Mars community" early on by doing something that didn't worked with NASA/ESA and asked for the community's approval. I heard from "Mars community" circles that they're a no-go and everybody who wants to keep his reputation shouldn't be close to it. That certainly kept people away.

>So Mars One probably.
Different group, kept the study internal because it doesn't work. We did it before Mars One, realized it could only ever be supplemental.
Mars One was a marketing scheme. It sucks, they got a tremendous amount of press over bullshit and smoke. The people behind it knew nothing about Mars, space, policy or financing. Their selection process for supposed astronaut candidates was who could pay and how popular they were online. No one I know in the field would go near them.

why not go to an actual realistically inhabitable but isolated place like Alaska, Western Canada, Eastern Siberia? You'd be living in total wilderness but you wouldn't need to worry about oxygen, water, irradiation etc.

Interesting, thanks.

Without defending my statement on Mars One but to follow up on my "community's approval," this is something I see all the time. And I guess it also played a role for Mars One. Not to be able to go near them deprived them of good people. I remember when I wanted to discuss the concept the week after they announced it I was met with hostility.
Similar to when I want to discuss private space. They're okay with the usual SME engineering shop. But startups, novel business models (of course many/most will fail), just doing things differently, that's not okay. Most work at agencies or academia or in said SMEs. The mindset is accordingly and is focused on "old space." The scientists and engineers are more open-minded, but many of those in a manager or political administrator position don't like it.

>Alaska, Western Canada, Eastern Siberia
Bears and elks? No thanks. Mars is safer.

>Mars is safer.
larp thread, into the trash it goes

>Alaska, Western Canada, Eastern Siberia
Long term, humans need to occupy the whole solar system. Earth's clock will get globally reset again, someday. If we are going to do 'space colonization' on Earth, seasteading is clearly the next step. It makes much more sense, because a real city with an economy can be made in a useful location - there are reasons Siberia and Alaska are sparsely developed.
>"community's approval,"
>Not to be able to go near them deprived them of good people.
>But startups, novel business models (of course many/most will fail), just doing things differently, that's not okay. Most work at agencies or academia or in said SMEs. The mindset is accordingly and is focused on "old space."
This is rapidly changing but private spaceflight is shaping up to be much different than old space.
>scientists
>engineers
>manager
>administrator
Some of those people handle large budgets half in secret. Of course they are super conservative with funding.

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Funny how that "debate" always tends to... Fall... Flat...

youtube.com/watch?v=JgY8zNZ35uw&list=PLmWeueTF8l82GItQhl7vTP_WM43B4ebNq

The primary function of the moon, I believe, would be a refueling stop.
But one should question the logic of dragging fuel to the moon instead of just expending it on the journey forwards...

>melt the ice caps
>it starts flowing as river
>land becomes fertile
>???
>Profit

Not for 5 billion more years and yes, there are reasons, those reasons are that it's harder to survive there because of extreme temperatures during a few winter months. Mars will be extremely harsh conditions at all times, with the current technology you'll always be a minor human error away from dying on the spot.

>Melt the ice caps
>Climate zones shift
>Forced to live in caves for 1000 years again
>Hopefully the jews die in the flood
>Retake control of our world
>Profit

Eh I was talking about the Martian ice caps but okay

I really want to understand how much is science fiction and how much is fact in Martian exploration. Can anybody point to some scholarly articles about how the science and fiction relate?

I experience how much people still resent the private space industry.
>Of course they are super conservative with funding.
Not denying that. And I know that space knowledge is hard won and any deviation/proposed improvement needs to be treated carefully. I also know that the majority of new space company proposals are full of garbage. It's just that I see how much the establishment in industry and politics is blocking change. No surprise, of course. Add to it that most in academia and administration are risk-averse people with an incentive to validate the status quo and it becomes obvious what a hell of a job a successful new space company is.
Some such environments are more open than others and we won't get those 10,000 new companies in most places on Earth. It's a thing of the US and perhaps East Asia mainly.

>Not for 5 billion more years and yes
A comet coming in on a polar trajectory could hit us tomorrow and we wouldn't know until it impacted. A Carrington Event or Tuba type eruption could set society back or wipe it out, again, basically tomorrow.
I'm the guy in these threads who argues endlessly for space habitats in orbit. Mars is just a thing to get people talking. The real action is going to be at L1, Mars orbit, near Earth asteroids.
>Moon
>refueling stop
This argument always ignores orbital dynamics. You can't just swing by the Moon for a six pack and some gas, that costs delta-V

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esquire.com/uk/latest-news/a22599155/elon-musks-plan-to-turn-mars-into-a-new-earth-by-nuking-it-wont-work-says-nasa/

arstechnica.com/science/2018/07/sorry-elon-nuking-mars-icecaps-wont-geoengineer-it/

Not sure if true, but I assume it probably is.

>10,000 new companies
I mean 10,000 companies in the US. Euros and Asians have some catching up to do already.

It's mainly the US. China's stuff is unaccessible for us, state-controlled, and used in competition against the West. East Asia (JP, SK) is still very hierarchical and dislikes disruption, but they're technophiles and sometimes push things forward. Europe is a dead end, some good talents and tech, but too much oriented toward the state and a pessimistic culture.

Mars is much more useful in its current state than terraformed. It may have life which means humans might not be allowed to land for decades. That biota will be tremendously valuable for both scientific understanding and biomedical technology. Preserving that life for study is important, that may mean no humans on the surface or only at containment facilities. No one wants to talk about this because it feels like pissing on the parade.
Then there is the potential issue of archeological sites being destroyed by terraforming.
Following up again, this baby is going to erupt and take out the entire Atlantic basin at some point soon. Vulcanologists say sometime in the next 100 years.

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>A comet coming could hit us tomorrow
Or Mars. In fact we're better positioned behind Jupiter so Kuiper belt debris don't crash here full force.

We got this.
Hey, walking the dog. Will check back in a bit.

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>pic
Kek, there go my proposed Canary Islands and Cocoa Beach homes.

>No one wants to talk about this
I talk all the times about planetary protection issues. But you're right, people just turn away and treat it as a non-issue and I often feel that I'm either uninformed or mad. The Chinese won't give a damn, only US+EU are concerned. And they intend to reform it with a focus on human presence on Mars.
spacepolicyonline.com/news/stern-to-chair-nasa-planetary-protection-review-board/

Do you have any suggestions for early astrobio experiments you'd love to see?

Checked. Good doggo.

Why are they hiding if they're so powerful

There is no such thing as outer space.

>pic
coolinterestingstuff.com/phobos-2-the-strange-russian-space-incident

For those who want to know. As usual, I don't have any opinions on such.

So if we build a space colony what kind of government should pol make?

>Mars
>not building up Luna with based Bezos first

>based Bezos
Explain.

Jeff Bezos wants to start Moon mining in preparation for building fucking O'Neill cylinders
he had a presentation the other day

People may have threat overload, but there are much more certain, much more damaging events than climate change.
They are watching us, possibly experimenting or harvesting us. They know how clever and destructive we can be.
This is why it is utterly foolish to send unarmed humans to Mars. They fuck with our aircraft carriers, you can be assured they will fuck with Elon in Starship. Insisting that space is somehow peaceful ignores the reality staring back at us.
None, it's going to be an armed worker owned corporation incorporated in Luxembourg or Delaware.
>>not building up Luna with based Bezos first
For what purpose?

>They are watching us
So you think it's a credible thing? Not judging, just asking. I'm aware of some of the ideas/reports out there, but since I have no means to check them for accuracy, I've no opinion yet. Hints, links, references?

>incorporated in Luxembourg or Delaware
Kek, but probably not wrong. Checking LU currently. Other EU jurisdictions/govs are mostly hostile. Perhaps UK will have some potential too.
DE is the gold standard for the US, so yes. But still looking for a good place for the (actual) HQ in the US. Suggestions for places that are productive, close to the thing, safe, and cozy?

>the xeno menace
Something is real and using our seas and skies as it sees fit. It is the single biggest national security threat we face because of the unknowns.
We have regular, quality exopolitics threads here. Look up Gimbal, Nimitz, Chilean military videos for starters. We had soft disclosure and everyone just shrugged.
The thing that seems to have woken space folks up was o’muamua.

>o’muamua
Yeah, that was in one of my groups as well. Though they focus more on space energy systems. Perhaps you know 'em?

>exopolitics threads
On Jow Forums?

Though I've to add that searching for exopolitics gives me tons of pic related. I know that stuff from the 1990s. It hasn't changed since then. Do the threads on Jow Forums (or is it /x/) deliver more?

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I’ve been around long enough to know a lot of people. A lot of folks freaked out when we got buzzed like that.
What type of space energy? Satellite PV, beamed power, something else?
Yes, there are ufo threads on here often. I’m trying to get people to concentrate on making type identifications.

Oh yes.

Solar power sats mostly.

Then I'll check them out. They appear randomly or are there times when I should look?

Mars gravity is too low so it would not make a good place for a White homeland. Future generations born on Mars would be too weak if they ever came back to Earth

Who are you sir?

I do the needful.

Power satellites are freakin cool.
There’s one almost every day. We should make an /xpg/ exopolitics general

Nice. Okay, I'll see to attend one of the next expolitics threads. Is that usually the keyword to search for?

>gravity
This is why custom space habitats are so compelling.

Anyone have resources or info about terraforming Venus?

>nasaspaceflight.com
Salla and Goode are a joke. They take any kernel of information, multiply it by 300x of bullshit and force feed it into their cult.
This met with an untimely AI response form a long dormant Mars defense system. The handshaking of Old Mars wasn't compatible with resent day Russia, and KAPUT, Comrade.

Question - What would be the best firearm to bring to Mars?

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Crossbow.

Until we don't have an space elevator we won't be able to colonize Mars.

Details on AI and Phobos incident?
All of them.

Never mind, I'll just go ask Jow Forums

this guy's channel is actually one of the better resources
youtube.com/watch?v=BI-old7YI4I
there was a very speculative paper about deploying sun shades but I think it was written years ago

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Nice start with the gravity well.

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>a japanese flag

cmon

The Japanese did nothing wrong.

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M4 and Barrett .50.

Post the astronaut with the M4. Also, wouldn't it best to keep the firearm dry (No Lube)? Sorta like when operating inna dessert

Can we also talk about a space elevator?

Yes, go on. Tell us about it user.

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Sure. Anything specific? Tether is AFAIK still too weak for Earth, but on the Moon we could build one. Any new developments in that regard?

reminder

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That or run silicone lubricants. Probably a liquid cooling sleeve.

Doesn't really matter as long as it's rugged and reliable.
Shotguns in particular would be really effective, because with low air resistance even small shot would be effective at long ranges, and all you'd need to do is puncture the enemy's pressure suit to kill them.

>liquid cooling sleeve
That'd get heavy plus the logistics for the liquid coolant would be a bitch and it's just another thing on the rifle to break. For cooling your best bet would most likely to be a system based on how the lewis gun cools itself.

Shotguns with flechette loads would be a bitch against thin suits.

Splendid, we're far away from creating the first habitats, but we already know how to kill each other. First things first obviously.

Humans are tribalistic and war is a fact of humanity. Never hurts to be prepared plus we need to have the best equipment for fighting the ayyyyys if they're around.

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