How does one avoid becoming a nihilist or an antinatalist...

Or Judge Death.

Listening to this really helped me out
youtu.be/gcMq_oZIiVE
It’s a bit long but maybe giving it a listen could help you out too.

Because you don't consent to existence. It's impossible and existence itself is uncertain. And putting people into uncertain scenarios (with a strong likelihood for pain) without their consent is immoral.

why is that immoral?

Because there is the probability of undeserved pain and misery. Same reasons why rape, theft, and murder/assault are immoral, it's undue misery. Also, just because you too came into this world without consent and enjoy it doesn't make it any less immoral. Some find themselves enjoying being brutalized but that doesn't negate the immorality of brutalization. Some also come into this world miserable and in a horrid decrepit scenario, all without consent, which is why antinatalism makes sense. If you never brought them into this world, would they have to suffer without consent. Giving birth because you want others to experience life is pure selfishness, the only reason you force life without consent is to satisfy your own desires.

Why is undue misery immoral?

Consent is a liberal concept
Individualism is cancer
Stop being a white liberal

To secure a future...

Read schopenhaur then backwards to kant, then modern pessimists

And actually read Nietzsche

Those are some nice tits

This post more of them

Shut it christkike kill yourself for your death cult

>becone ubermensch
Nietzsche inspiring af desu.

>Consent
Fuck off liberal

youtu.be/ltqG6Zkp42Y
>when nehilism is btfo by a meme video with pigs

jesus those milkers how can one resist

Fuck off collectivist piece of shit

Why is pain or uncertainty bad? Just because you are not enjoying it doesnt mean billions of others are finding they do. You are being selfish for not bringing life into this world because of a stupid sideways argument that is extremely narrow.

name of the girl please

can't answer that one huh

Because it causes negative emotions and consequences nobody wants or should feel, you are robbing them of peace they can enjoy. Are you going to actually engage with what I say or play 20 questions like anyone can do?

Another self driven desire.

negative emotions define you. Grief lets you know what is important. Anger lets you express how you feel. Sorrow is pretty self explanatory. Desire. Ambition.

Only utopia pursuing retards believe happiness is the only acceptable emotion or worse, the ultimate goal.

Based and christpilled

Okay so it's just your opinion? It's not objectively bad to feel pain. You're not giving an objective moral standard. What if someone likes pain? Why are they objectively wrong?

Uncertain pain is bad because it's unnecessary. How am I being selfish when I am not doing anything to anyone but myself? How am I selfish by saving potential humans from probable pain and misery? How am I selfish by not forcing my desires onto the unborn for them to carry as a burden? Explain how there is selfishness in any of that, for antinatalism is perhaps the most unselfish ideology in existence.

> (You)
>negative emotions define you. Grief lets you know what is important. Anger lets you express how you feel. Sorrow is pretty self explanatory. Desire. Ambition.
> Only utopia pursuing retards believe happiness is the only acceptable emotion or worse, the ultimate goal.
Thanks for justifying rape, murder, and theft. How moral of you.

>Kierkegaard
Based

All because someone is manipulated to enjoy abuse doesn't make it good. And by playing the relativist muh that's just your opinion card, you are making a point for criminals to seek what they desire. And I can throw it right back in your face by saying that's just YOUR opinion. Now we're even. Bravo Jow Forums.

The difference is I'm not proclaiming moral oughts or shoulds or saying things are bad or good. I never claimed pain was good. If you're trying to make a truth claim about morality to say something is bad or good you need an objective standard to base that on or it's nothing more than your opinion.

You don't respond to shit fucking bait like this. No bump.

Also anyone who replies is a fucking faggot. Have at it you fucking incel pieces of shit.

take 5-meo-dmt

>How does one avoid becoming a nihilist or an antinatalist?
You accomplish good things for yourself at first. It gives you a sense of control as now you control your own life. As your accomplishments grow, so does the scope and it begins to affect other people. So if you do good for yourself and others, it spreads slowly but surely.

Growing alone never works in a large scale, and the help can get squandered, so you give your good stewardship to those who won't shun it or drag you down. They need a guiding hand and you might be the right person and not even know it.

The goal that Jow Forumsacks seem to embody is the revival of a sense of community and collective pride in a better future, rather than wallowing in the slow but steady demise of the people who can save it all. It really starts with each individual and as they are good to others, others will be good to them and the other people they interact with. Today's wealth and kindness is sharing of knowledge and wisdom. It's not immediately evident though, so expecting to see results isn't the right way to go about it. It's in subtle ways that these things happen.

It's kind of like planting a seed. For a long time nothing seems to happen. A lot of seeds die too so you need to plant a lot of them. Some sprout but it's not noticeable. As it grows, you'll see its progress, and as time passes and you move on with your life, you come back and there's a bunch of trees bearing fruit, and other saplings as the seeds have spread and have been sown naturally by others you've never come to witness.

But all of that won't happen if you're waiting for it to happen. Everyone is waiting for it to happen. Someone has to start and it can be you.

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All morals are just opinions. And while they are opinions, not all opinions are of equal value. But you can get pretty damn close to the truth. And there is no happiness in pain, pain outweighs happiness in life, so why make someone deal with pain when they don't have to exist and not feel horrid or partake in the unneccessarily brutal? Pain is the result of misery, and misery is only considered good by the deluded to cope with their scenario. Nobody wants or deserves it.

Oh look two wordy faggots who don't know how to avoid bait.

You have cancer now.

Fuck you, enjoy your death.

cool story bro

Kaho Shibuya

All morals are just opinions but some are closer to the objective truth? So what's your objective standard?

Kaho Shibuya

Oh look, more shills bumping trash.

Die you fucking faggots.

if that passes for justification you should consider finishing highschool and then take some college classes.

I'm not going to try to understand the mental gymnastics of "These emotions exist" and "Justification of rape and morality"

Existence is hardly a qualifier for justification and I never made any sort of argument that rape was moral. I'm simply trying to say your framework is working in absolutes while being vary narrow and im starting to see why. xD

Shut. The. Fuck. Up.

Go post elsewhere. Stop bumping trash you fucking moron.

>How does one avoid becoming a nihilist or an antinatalist?
you shouldnt, you should kys as fast as you can

Oh look, more subhumans from non-countries doing what they do best - being fucking retarded drags on the greater good.

Nice job proving that your flag is worthless shit. Keep posting to bait you fucking moron.

Like morals there is no objective standards, just some standards being better than others. That is what's absolute in life. We will never know everything but can always learn something. The best standards are the ones the consistently correspond to observable reality the best.

why should i care what a mutt thinks, cry more bitch nigga lmao

Anti-natalism is an existential contradiction in the living. Presumably anyone who actually finds life intolerable has already offed themselves. If you're alive, it's hypocritical to deny others the opportunity to experience an existence that your actions indicate you value over nonexistence. I suppose one could be noncommittal or undecided without the hypocrisy.

Just become Buddhist since that's apparently already your belief.
>1,51m
I fucking love Japan.

Blah blah blah blah we're here to VPN in and bump trash for money.

We're here to fuck up Pol. That's the job.

Too obvious bumping trash fucking threads with trash fucking comments.

Ignore and move on. Lol. Enjoy the useless bumps you fucking niggers.

So "some standards are better than others" is just your subjective opinion then, right? It's not objectively correct.

this guy getting irrationally angry over literally nothing makes me want to bump. Consider this thread derailed.

You seem awfully mad at anyone arguing against nihilism and anti-natalism.

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Blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah. Keep bumping trash like a good little VPN faggot. Thread is dead now. Lol. Move on to the next trash heap. I'm already there.

You'll reply on a they this buried if I'm right. Lol. Keep trying to save it you fucking third world dipshits.

No, that much is observational truth. You cannot say, "the moon is the size of a basketball" and expect your opinion to be equal to those who know how big it actually is. NOTHING is objectively 100% true, but approximations to truth are far closer than to falsehoods. It's like a rounded number of something, which while not 100% true (thus technically subjective), it is true enough compared to other numbers to make it useful for humans to interact and form useful conclusions from.

Also, you're not arguing about anti natalism in particular anymore, you're arguing about objectivism vs subjectivity, which is beyond the scope of antinatalism and encapsulates literally everything about existence. I just so happen to believe anti natalism is the truth, while you're attacking the very notion of truth without realizing that by extension, you're attacking any other opinion anyone can hold in addition to mine and yours. I could've been arguing for or against anything else and you could still shift the subject to this anyways, so it's cheap and irrelevant to the topic. Going by your logic, arguing is futile and you're not accomplishing anything from it. You're moving the goalpost. This discussion is about antinatalism, not basic critical thinking.

Okay, so there's an objective standard now for morality? What is it?

That's literally the opposite of what I said. What's better than what depends on the the quantifiable strength of the arguments. And being subjective =/= having equal value. THAT much about life is true. Now stop strawmanning and goalpost changing and actually argue/contradict/refute my arguments for their merits, you keep playing 20 questions while adding nothing to the discussion. Anyone can bring up subjectivity and objectivity regardless of topic, so its a total non argument that is not useful for the topic at hand.

learn to stop worrying and love the bomb

It's important to recognize that we are pretty insignificant specks of glop wrapped in skin. While our thoughts on existential subjects seem profound to us, we are incompetent and sophomoric. Our ability to grasp our lives and purpose is meager.
It's all we have, and since we are unable to concieve of being more intelligent than we are, we are convinced our feeble thoughts are the ultimate truth. All that is necessary to be delivered from despair is humility.
We don't - can't - understand the inconceivably vast amount of knowledge that exists, and we should not expect our little minds to. Know that much is unknowable, and accept that what exists is our challenge to surmount and understand as we are capable to do so. Strive to be the best you can be, and accept you are not more than that.

>rape, theft, and murder/assault are immoral, it's undue misery.

You misunderstand misery. Those things do not cause misery. It is our own expectations being unfulfilled that cause misery. This is the concept of Samsara. It can set you free from misery, and allow you to discover joy in any circumstance.

You create negative emotions, not your circumstances. Wrap your head around that.

im 14 and this is deep

How are you not forcing your desires on your children by not allowing them to live?

Just kick back and enjoy the ride faggot. Be good or evil. Drink from the fountain of life and crash like a wave

youre starting to see the truth. dont lose yourself and keep going

Claiming happiness is the only moral object of existence is the source of your misery.

>pain outweighs happiness in life
Where on Earth did you get this idea? You should carefully consider such beliefs, and the sources of them, because they are trapping you into your present dilemma.

It's just completely false. You will realize that if you actually try to justify that belief, because you will not be able to do so with reason.

Define trash.

We exist in a world that is heavily overpopulated but it's best to forget the big thoughts involving the communion as a whole and focus on your own life and people that hold importance there. We exist forever minus the point in times where we don't exist so expend your waking efforts into those you love and care about. That is the point of life... you'll experience it always from birth to death but don't get bogged down with thoughts higher than your own current experiences at the time that they matter.